More Assault Weapon Lies from the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence

[slackmaster]

From an article posted yesterday, Dems Push for Assault Rifle Ban:

"The semiautomatic weapons continue firing ammunition automatically once the user squeezes the trigger once and keeps it pressed down."

Utterly and completely untrue. Can anyone still deny that the anti-gun propagandists are promoting a myth that expiration of the federal "assault weapons" ban will make machineguns easier to obtain?

Anyone at all?

Hello?

Does this kind of hysterical nonsense help or hurt Democrats in general? I think it hurts us badly.

See http://www.csgv.org/news/headlines/cincipost5_7_04.cfm if you can stomach the lies. I couldn't read past the sentence quoted above because I was laughing too hard.

And here's another one promiting the "spray gunfire into a crowd" myth:

http://www.csgv.org/news/headlines/ap5_7_04.cfm

[kalian]

1. Complete and utter bs....

don't they understand what "semi-auto" means...? :eyes:
Oh well, just continues to give us liberals a bad name...

[OpSomBlood]

2. Not much in the article to work with.

The semiautomatic weapons continue firing ammunition automatically once the user squeezes the trigger once and keeps it pressed down.

Outright lie. Plain and simple.

Urban areas already are wracked by gun violence, and ending the ban would worsen the situation, the lawmakers said.

So are they saying that ten years of the AWB hasn't had an appreciable effect? Shouldn't gun violence be uncommon by now?

"These guns can't be used for hunting or any purpose like that," said Rocky Merz, a Crowley aide. "They're made for one reason and one reason only, and that's to use against people."

.223 Remington was developed as a hunting caliber. It is used widely and effectively for small-sized game. This is the ammunition used by the AR-15. 7.62x39 ammo is an excellent deer caliber, and this is what the AK-47 fires.

"It comes down to articulating the message about what the bill does. I am always an optimist. Even if the decks are stacked against me, I have to assume it will pass."

Funny how that message isn't articulated in the article. What does this bill do that isn't already done by the AWB?

Not much substance to the article.

[billbuckhead]

3. Having a gangster for your avatar says it all

Guns don't make peoples lives better.

[OpSomBlood]

4. Opinions judged by avatars.

What in-depth, critical analysis of the issue you've demonstrated.

[natasha1]

5. Perhaps so...

Guns don't make peoples lives better.

This could be arguably true.

But the fact is, there are people in the world who would use force against you to make you do things against your will.

If you can use guns to stop those kinds of people, then I would say guns can make people's lives better.

Nat

[billbuckhead]

6. It's an endless stupid arms race

your sacred gun won't stop my tank and my tank won't stop the next guys helicopter gunship. The gangster avatar is inappropriate for this site but certainly appropriate for a gun worshipper.

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

8. The way I see it...

Prohibition has NEVER worked, for anything. Guns will be no different. If you want one bad enough, you will be able to get one, regardless of what the laws state. The same as it is with drugs now and alcohol during Prohibition.

I also see personal security, ultimately, as an individual responsibility. By all means call 911, but keep in mind they may not get there in time, I truly hope they do but this is not the world we live in. If they are late, they may only be able to draw chalk outlines around you and your loved ones. You are the one responsible for your safety.

There are bad people out there who would do you and yours serious harm. Chances are you'll not run into one, but there is a chance you will. Me? I'll protect my family should chance not favor us. I'll use my firearms if necessary to do it. I don't dwell on it, I don't live in fear of being attacked, but I am ready to defend myself and my family.

Don't like using guns for protection? Then don't.

BTW, my gun doesn't have to be bigger than my opponent's, I just have to be better than my opponent.

[billbuckhead]

10. I don't like guns used for crime or intimidation

Most gun crime in this nation is against family members, neighbors and fellow workers. Where was the promicuous gun law crowd when the election was stolen? Oh, I forgot, getting ready to move into the Whiet House with the most facist Predident in American histoy. So much for the promiscuous gun law crowds respect for democracy.

As far as scum, it's hard to beat the NRA and GOA.

[RoeBear]

11. I on the other hand...

...must by implication be in favor of guns used for crime and intimidation. :puke:

[OpSomBlood]

12. Why are all gun owners lumped with the NRA?

Yes, we acknowledge that their political motives are scummy. But perhaps it's possible that we are not aligned with their tactics.

But judging by your Benchleyesque ad hominems, I doubt you're too willing to actually discuss the issue. You'd rather call us all Bushite traitors.

Perhaps if the Democrats would stop alienating gun owning members of their own party, they'd get more solidarity on election day.

[billbuckhead]

13. Gunners had your chance in the primary with Dean

and couldn't deliver him a single state.

[OpSomBlood]

14. Kerry is a "gunner" too.

And I have no idea what the fuck Howard Dean has to do with this discussion.

[billbuckhead]

15. Dean pandered to the NRA and Kerry denounces them.

The pro assault weapons crowd has little power in the Democratic party.

[OpSomBlood]

17. Dean supported AWB renewal, too.

So as far as I can tell, their views on gun control are identical.

Please document an instance where Dean "pandered to the NRA."

[RoeBear]

30. They have one power...

...they can stay home on election day. Is that your preference?

[7th_Sephiroth]

31. i'd call 911

but just tell em to bring a few bodybags,as i would call after emptying a few .50 cal. clips from my DE.50AE7

[OpSomBlood]

32. Someone breaks into my house, I gotta assume they're there to kill me.

Sorry if that's inhumane or whatever, but my and my family's safety comes long before a criminal's.

"I'd rather be judged by twelve of my peers than carried out by six."

[7th_Sephiroth]

33. i agree with you

i dont even let cops in without calling the pricent and confirming thier real cops, due to a rash of home invasions in the mid 90's where these guys impersonated police perfectly

[billbuckhead]

34. How do you know it's not a drunk or an Alzheimers sufferer

We all know what happens when one assumes. I'll always remember Clinton apologizing to the Japanese people for a Japanese college student going to costume party in Louisisana and going to the wrong house and being killed by a gun owner who assumed. BTW, Louisiana has one of the highest gunownership rates and one of the highest murder rates in the world. Someone who kills like that deserves to go to hell as much as any other murderer.

[FeebMaster]

36. Louisiana? Highest murder rates in the world?

I'd like to see that one documented. :eyes:



on edit: spelling

[OpSomBlood]

9. It's an image of Marlon Brando portraying a gangster.

It's ironic that Dianne Feinstein's "prop" (but not really) AK-47 doesn't need to be handled safely, yet Slackmaster's avatar of an actor is an "inappropriate gangster."

[slackmaster]

16. A mythical gangster at that

At least my avatar is a human being rather than a mindless machine.

A decent "progressive, liberal" Democrat in fact.

Bill, it would be nice if you would try to address the actual issues once in a while. The topic of this thread is how some people are willing to LIE to advance their agenda. Has it ever occurred to you that when someone repeats the same lie over and over and over that maybe, just MAYBE there is something fundamentally wrong with their position?

:hippie:

[billbuckhead]

19. The real issue is try to get US crime at least down to other

"advanced' nations level not some sick inside baseball horseshit about what exactly constitutes a assault rifle. No EU or commonwealth nation or Japan lets these weapons of mass destruction to sold. This sicko country with the highest incarceration rate and the most murders per capita is the only one.

[slackmaster]

20. I have to call a McFeeb's Law violation on that one

No small firearm qualifies as a "WMD".

And guess what, Bill: If you disregard ALL GUN CRIMES committed in the US we still have a much higher rate of criminal violence than most other economically and politically similar nations.

Could it be that the people have SOMETHING to do with our crime problem?

Has it escaped your notice that 10 years of the AWB haven't had a measurable effect on any meaningful measure of crime?

Is it possible that banning one type of gun or another isn't the answer?

[billbuckhead]

22. Guns escalate crime and better guns make bigger crimes

It obvious to anyone without lead poisoning. Once assault weapons are allowed, what's next RPG's?

[OpSomBlood]

24. "Assault weapons" have no technical definition.

And as for "allowing them"...they were allowed all along. You make it seem as though the expiration of the AWB is going to plunge America into anarchic chaos. These weapons existed long before the rash of gun crime we've witnessed in the last 25 years. Any critical analysis would prove that the mechanical function of the weapons used by the criminals has less to do with the crime than socioeconomic factors. Semi-auto rifles have existed for a very long time.

In 1994, legislators decided to radically alter the "assault weapon" nomenclature to include semi-automatic weapons. These rifles were around before, and they are around after...all the "ban" did was hijack the terminology.

And they are doing it again, with the newly-invented term "assault pistol."

[slackmaster]

27. I suppose it would be asking too much for you to provide some proof

Once assault weapons are allowed, what's next RPG's?

RPGs are heavily regulated, and I don't see anyone calling for them to become easier to obtain.

The problem with the "assault weapons" ban is that it doesn't address any real issues. There are plenty of firearms that are just as "good" as AWs in any respect you can name.

My point in this thread is that the whole AW ban is based on a deliberate deception, a blurring of the distinction between semiautomatic firearms and machineguns. It's all just propaganda, with no rational basis.

[solinvictus]

40. "No EU or commonwealth nation or Japan lets these weapons of mass destruct

Norway, Finland, and Switzerland allow individuals to own select fire military carbines, rifles, and sub-machine guns. I'd hardly call them backward as these nations have a higher standard of living than the USA with a much lower aggragate crime rate.

Japan? Sure, it's safe, unless you find yourself accused of a crime. Japan has no due process procedures in it's criminal law; meaning that an accused must prove their own innocence without benefit of guaranteed legal counsel. Additionally, authorities may deny food, water, sleep, and bathroom breaks to an accused to extract a confession. If you want a Japanese model state, fine, but count me out.

[Wcross]

18. What Gangster? That's Marlon Brando isn't it?

Typical mistake. He is an actor that portrayed a gangster in a Hollywood movie. By the way, the "gun violence in movies isn't real either.

BWAAAAAAA

[slackmaster]

21. An excellent book, made into a first-rate movie

A rare incident in Hollywood.

[billbuckhead]

23. it's Marlon Brando glamorizing a gangster

and glamorizing crime.

[OpSomBlood]

25. Holy shit.

That was possibly the saddest whimpering post I've ever seen.

I shudder to think of what your utopia looks like.

[slackmaster]

28. Have you ever read Mario Puzo's novel or seen the movie

The Godfather?

I can't recall ever getting the impression that the creators intended to glamorize the people or their crimes in any way.

The fictional Vito Corleone was the product of a tragic violent childhood in a sickeningly violent culture. He was tragic, his victims were tragic, all of his children and spouses and grandchildren and associates were tragic. There are no heroes in any of the Godfather movies. They're all horrifying and zero glorifying.

Maybe you're talking about some other work of fiction.

[OpSomBlood]

29. If you're into fiction, I recommend the CSGV.

They spin a hell of a yarn there.

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

7. What do you expect

from the scummy, anti gun-rights crowd? :P

Trying to blur the general public's distinction between Class III firearms and "assault weapons" is as old as the "assault weapon" debate itself.

Maybe I should take the author out groundhog hunting with my AR-15 and let him try to convice me that it is no good for hunting.

[billbuckhead]

35. What a challenge, shooting "whistle pigs"

Whistle and they stand up. That has to be the hunting version of self gratification. The other green meat.

[OpSomBlood]

37. You hunt them because they are a nuisance.

Not for self-gratification.

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

38. You are so right

Hitting something the size of a coke can at 300+ yards is just oh so easy.

Could you manage a 300+ yard hit on a coke can taking into account wind drift, bullet drop and mirage with a puny .22 caliber bullet? I don't mean 1 hit out of a box of ammunition either.

[billbuckhead]

39. A groundhog is the size of soda can? Are you shooting baby groundhogs?

[MrSandman]

26. More gun-control arguments based on...

lies, distortion, and sensationalism.