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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:32 PM
Original message
Energy-saving advice?
Edited on Fri May-13-05 06:38 PM by funflower
I've been impressed with the level of technical knowledge on this forum. Can some of you engineering types give me some guidance as to the best ways to do something about my very annoying electric bill? What really sucks the stuff? Should I fuss at the kids about leaving lights on, buy a clothesline, spend less time on the computer? What's most effective when it comes to cutting the kilowatt hours?

Our heat comes from natural gas. Everything else is electric.
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Goldom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. can try replacing your incandescent light bulbs
with the mini florescent ones. We did that here.. dunno what effect it's had, but they certainly work fine, and I know they use less energy.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. Do the fluorescents feel like you're in an office?
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Goldom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
27. nope
They go in just like normal bulbs, they aren't the long bars or anything. If the socket has a cover on it, you won't even see any difference. They take a second or two to turn on when you flip the switch, and they don't get fully bright for about a minute, but otherwise, no noticable difference.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #27
47. Triple-phosphor CFLs have a natural, broad spectrum of light
You are not stuck choosing "warm white/pink" or "cool white/blue". You get a lighting effect like natural sunlight. These CFLs are actually more realistic than incandescent bulbs, so when you match clothes they will look good in daylight or office light.
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. replace the light bulbs with compact flourescents...
double the insulation in your attic.
put insulation under the floor (if it's a pier and beam house)

those three things would cost a few hundred and would cut a lot of usage.
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. and then put tint on the south and west windows
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
16. I don't understand this....
Is this an effort to save on AC in hot places? We are in cloudy, temperate western Oregon and we don't have AC. We're more worried about warming up the house in the winter than cooling it off in the summer.
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. If your in a cooler climate, don't tint your windows.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Thanks! Good to get clear on that!
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Spinzonner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
4. The major drains are rather insensitive to manual efficienies

Like refrigerators, air conditioners and other appliances.

When you wash and dry, don't do small loads. Save it up.

Check with your utility for rebates, etc. for upgrading to more energy efficient ones and see if anticipated savings make it cost effective.

Are solar panels in the cards for you given climate, location, regulations, etc. Does the utility have a cogeneration arrangement ?



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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. I've always been interested in solar but don't know much about it.
I'm in cloudy Oregon, but some people do make a stab at generating some solar energy. Not sure how how financially realistic that is here. Is cogeneration where you can potentially sell energy back to the grid?
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #14
24. It's easier to conserve than to generate electricity.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. Hmmm.... That's where I'll definitely focus, at least at first.
Still have those off-the-grid dreams, though.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Co-gen is where you sell back to the utility. Cloudy? Not an issue
Photovoltaic cells work on ultra violet (has to do the with "solid state physics"-"device physics" of photovoltaic cells). Ultra violet gets through clouds. Not 100% - but more then visible light.
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #32
39. I hear that clouds are about 50% power, and rain about 20%.
Of course those are generalised. It really depends on much clouds and how much rain.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. Generally right.
Rain and clouds pass more UV, and progressively less as you go from ultra violet through violet -> indigo -> blue -> green -> yellow -> red -> infra red (Remember "ROY G. BIV" from high school science - the colors of the rain bow).
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #41
42. You had a better high school science teacher than I did.
I vaguely remember there is something called the Periodic Table of Elements....

:shrug:
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #42
46. My chemistry teacher made us memorize every damn element on it.
Edited on Sat May-14-05 06:54 AM by Massacure
Plus it's atomc number and molecular weight to the nearest tenth.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #4
31. If your utility gives a discount - wash and dry during discount hours
Has to do with utility generator loads. Some utilities give you a discount for doing the heavy load items after 11PM.
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dweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. water heater timer
you can set it to heat only at certain times, has an override button in case you need hot water at off times. Can turn it off during vacations, etc.

also wrap it in an insulating blanket made for water heaters. The water stays hot for longer periods of time when it's off.

i'm currently heating only 4hr segments, twice a day (6-10am/pm) and noticed a savings on power immed.
Never had a cold shower...unintentionally that is...

dp
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Isn't that what caused Legionnaire's Disease?
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dweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. huh?
Edited on Fri May-13-05 07:48 PM by dweller
is that a joke?

dp

edit: Legionnaire's disease is cause by the bacteria Legionella pneumophila. The bacterium responsible for Legionnaires' disease belongs to the genus Legionella. There are approximately 35 Legionella species known to produce the
disease. Legionella species are commonly found in any aquatic environment.
They can survive for several months in a wet environment and multiply in the
presence of algae and organic matter.
The transmission of Legionnaires' disease is not completely understood. The
normal presence of Legionella in such environmental sites as water and soil is not
automatically associated with an outbreak of the disease. It appears that the
Legionella microbe, in order to produce the disease, must reach the lungs.
Inhalation of small particles of contaminated water (aerosols) or soil seems to be
the key. Drinking contaminated water, as opposed to breathing in contaminated
aerosols, has not been associated with Legionnaires' disease. However, this
possibility should not be entirely excluded.

Evidence of person-to-person transmission has not been found. Therefore,
attention has focused on the spread of Legionella by building ventilation
systems. Legionella can thrive in warm stagnant water. When the circulated air
picks up droplets of contaminated water, the bacteria can be transported
throughout a building. If the droplets are small enough, they can be inhaled, thus
providing a way for the bacteria to enter the lung.
Cooling towers are part of large modern air-conditioning systems. They are used
to cool water and dissipate unwanted heat to the atmosphere through water
evaporation. Warm water flows into the top of the cooling tower through spray
nozzles (as shown in the schematic Figure 1). While the water passes through
the nozzles, tiny airborne droplets are formed, providing maximum contact
between the water and the air moved through the tower by fans. To prevent
droplets from fusing into larger ones, splash bars are placed below the nozzles.
snip
http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/diseases/legion.html

so, the answer to your question is no.
dp
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. I'm no expert, but I'd be cautious.
http://www.legionella.org/general_info.htm#n2

Temperature is a critical determinant for Legionella proliferation. Colonization of hot water tanks is more likely if tank temperatures are between 40 and 50oC (104 to 122o F).


http://archives.foodsafetynetwork.ca/fsnet/2004/11-2004/fsnet_nov_2.htm#story1

Officials are seeking source of Legionnaire's disease at high-rise
November 2, 2004
New York Times
John Holl
FORT LEE, N.J. - State and local health officials are, according to this story, awaiting test results from a high-rise apartment building here to determine the source and strain of the Legionnaire's disease that sickened two elderly residents and has led to the shutdown of the building's water system.
Stephen Wielkocz, Fort Lee's chief health officer, was cited as saying on Monday that a 78-year-old woman with lung cancer who lives in the co-op building, the Colony, was found to be infected with the airborne bacterium last week, and the disease was diagnosed in another resident, described as an elderly man, in June.
Mr. Wielkocz was further cited as saying that both residents have recovered, but a preliminary test on Friday found Legionella pneumophilia, the bacterium that causes the disease, inside one of the building's water heaters, prompting health officials to shut off tap water in the building.
Final test results are expected within 24 hours, and the water could remain off for up to two weeks while the water system is decontaminated, health officials said.
The approximately 1,000 residents who live in the building are using bottled water to drink and bathe. Toilets are operational.
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dweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. you've no point
Edited on Fri May-13-05 09:38 PM by dweller
proliferation would be at a temp constant, and then only after the introduction of bacteria. I'm not advocating lowering your water heater temp to a lower temp and maintaining it there.

water heater timers do not cause Legionnaire's disease. Your complaint is about water heaters.
So don't use one.

dp
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #25
37. You're right
I never heard of water heater timers before,
they're perfectly safe.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #5
17. Ha!
:rofl:
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #5
33. Detroit Edison gave a discount for off-peak water heating -
worked if you had a well insulated, big, storage water heater.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
50. is this availble for gas heaters?
or only for electric?
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #50
53. only electric n/t
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pk_du Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:53 PM
Response to Original message
6. Agree on the Refridgerator comment....turn it down a notch or two
same with air-conditioner.
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Zan_of_Texas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
7. I do little stuff.
During seasons of heating or cooling, I try to keep the closet doors shut -- that way, I'm not paying to heat or cool those small storage areas.

I also usually close one room during the summer -- I don't use it that much, and don't want to pay to cool it. (Hey, it's hot here!)

Right now, it cools off below 70 degrees at night here. That means open the windows, keep the fans running, instead of the AC. Close the shades on the sunny west side.

The freezer in the refrigerator is more efficient when mostly full. If you run yours mostly empty, buy some of those blue ice things, or just freeze some water bottles in there. The fridge is also more efficient when the coils at the back are clean. Same is true of the filters for AC. Dirt in the filters makes the motor work harder.

Turn off unneeded lights, especially in rooms you're trying to cool -- they heat the place up.
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Zan_of_Texas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
23. One more.
Use the toaster oven whenever possible instead of heating up the entire oven. Especially in summer.
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pk_du Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
8. For what its worth ...your friendly Dept of Energy has a useful (?)
looking webite that might be worth checkingout...

http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumerinfo/energy_savers/

( just scanned a few pages quickly so cant vouch for its content)
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
9. Use lower watt bulbs wherever you can, set AC temp to highest
...you and family are comfortable with. Any empty room with the lights on and the fans going is a total waste of electricity, so train the family to watch the waste. Contact your local power company and get an energy audit to see where else you can save.
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
10. Check the website of your electric company
SDG&E has a "Lighting Turn-In Program" where they will
exchange 5 incandescants with flourescents, for free.
The "Home Energy Efficiency Survey" will help you figure out
where your energy is being used.
http://sdge.com/residential/res_energy_efficiency.shtml
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jpak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
13. Energy Star appliances are your best bet
Start with replacing your fridge - other than an electric hot water heater, it's the biggest energy hog in your home.

Replacing a '70's model fridge (1,500- 2,000 kwh per year) with a new Energy Star fridge (~400 kwh per year), will save you a bundle.

The newer washing machines and driers are much more efficient than older models, and new efficiency standards go into effect in 2007(?) and 2012 - check with a (knowledgeable) appliance dealer what the best value is today.

Replacing an older electric hot water heater with new (high R-value) insulated one can save you 20-30% or more on your hot water bill. An insulating blanket ($15) can save you some cash as well.

Replacing a CRT computer monitor with a flat screen monitor is a good bet too.

And, compact fluorescent light bulbs everywhere, using low-flow showerheads and washing in cold water are cheap and easy things to do as well.

Good luck!!!



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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. Thanks for the fridge idea.
Ours is pretty old. And I've been wanting an excuse to buy a flat screen. Does it help a lot?
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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
19. well I can try
I don't conserve nearly as much as I would like, but I run two sun servers with 4 processors and 20 hard drives each and several other computers, so it makes it hard :)

Change your light bulbs as some here have suggested, same with turning down fridge. Energy star, also a good bet. The best thig to me is:

1. Take a walk around your place and see what all is electric and is it on, what does it do, and is there a better model which uses less electric?

2. Sit down, make a list of every electric thing in the house. From lights to alarm clocks, tv, radio, computer, microwave, cable box, etc.

3. See if you can find how much each item uses, knowledge is power. Put it all in a spreadsheet if you need to in order to better analyze.

4. Consider at times batteries or other things - let me explain this. I listen to the radio a lot. I use batteries and am investing in hand crank radios. My flashlights are mostly battery operated though I have one I can plug in. I charge my cell phone at work when I can too. The batteries in my radio last forever, and I can get em cheap at dollar store.

5. Add mirrors to help reflect light and brighten a room.

In general, take stock, analyze, and see what you can do.

Hope this helps a little bit.
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
21. Power bars help a lot.
Appliances like TVs, Stereos, VCRs, DVD players, etc... all suck up a couple kilowatts of power per day. You would be surprised how much they suck up all together though.

Also you say you get everything from electricity with the exception of heating. Are you water heater and dryer electric? If so replace those first. If you have a top loading clothes washer and dryer, replace them with a side loading one. Make sure they are energy star.

Florescent light bulbs help a lot too. Every time an incandescent bulb burns out, replace it with a florescent.

Make sure you seal cracks in your house. Adding insulation helps too. Especially when added to hot water pipes. Hot water pipes in the basement and attic shed heat to spaces that aren't occupied. Make sure your water heater has a heat blanket or is built with insulation.

If your ever looking for more room in your house, finish off the basement. The basement is 50-55 degrees year round. It costs less to heat in the winter, and doesn't need to be cooled in the summer.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. LOL! Thought you were talking about these snacks I take hiking!
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. lol. Not those power bars. :p
Anyways I should clarify that when I say kilowatts per day, I mean all of them combined. That point in my last post wasn't well written.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #21
51. we have a finished basement, but
we have to run an air conditioner in the summer to deal with the humidity. it has a fireplace, and the only heat it gets in the winter is wood, when there are people actually in it.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
30. Bunch of little things
1. From the 2000 California Brown Outs

    a) Switch your computer monitor to a flat panel display - flat panel displays use only about 2%-3% of the power of a conventional CRT display.
    b) Switch your tv to a flat panel tv - like flat panel displays, flat panel tvs use only about 2%-3% of the power of a conventional CRT tv.
    c) Use photovoltaic cells to recharge the ubiquitous AA and AAA rechargeable batteries (I live between the Hayward-Calderas Fault and the San Andreas fault - I expect to lose power and to rely on batteries).
    d) Air conditioning - get used to it being a little hotter in the summer; heating - get used to it being a little cooler in the winter.
    e) If your electric company or Public Utilities Commission gives you a break-- do the big load things after 11PM - dishwashers, laundromat, drier (recharging your car if you have an electric car).


2. From my too many years in the Great Lakes Snow Belts

    a) Use more "room temperature" foods - don't require refrigeration or cooking.


3. From the current gasoline price issue

    a) Consolidate and plan trips.
    b) Use transit.
    c) WALK, BICYCLE WHEN FEASIBLE


4. Overall

    a) Give thought to moving into a transit friendly, pedestrian friendly, urban area; close to work, shopping, school, amenities, etc.

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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:04 PM
Response to Original message
34. Windows and LCDs
Windows are a terrible waste of heat, a good insulated replacement window can be had for about $100 and will pay for itself in a year (Provided you are replacing old fashion wooden single pane windows).

Another area are LCDs. These are even more efficient than Fluorescent lighting (Through poor at projecting light). While fluorescent are best for light to see by, if you have light fixtures that are to be seen (i.e EXIT signs etc), LCDs are the best choice. On older Exit signs you can go from 40 watts per sign to 2 watts per sing. A tremendous savings (Exit signs are on 24 hours a day 365 days a year so you can SAVE a lot of money if you go to LCDs).

I am working on an old hotel/bar and am replacing the above and I have seen a drop in the electric bill, not much but significant.

One more factor if you have a furnace over 20 years old, look into replacing it with an energy efficient one. Even if the furnace is still raining, do both to its age AND design of more modern high efficient furnaces, you can save a lot of energy (Yes I am looking into replacing an every old furnace at $2-3000). It would pay for itself in no more than 5 years (and may pay for itself in one year depending on the price of Natural Gas next winter).
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
35. Follow your mother's advice
TURN THE LIGHTS AND TV ETC. OFF WHEN YOU LEAVE THE ROOM -- YOU THINK I OWN THE ELECTRIC COMPANY
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dweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. or my dad's
WE'RE NOT HEATING (COOLING) THE GREAT OUTDOORS

ie, shut the door.

dp
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. That was my father-in-law's line and my wife's line. NT
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #40
43. How about "money doesn't grow on trees"?
My kids love that one.
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BamaGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 02:16 AM
Response to Reply #36
44. My line with my kids is
Don't let out my bought air. Got that from my Dad though, of course lol.
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BamaGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 02:29 AM
Response to Original message
45. I think everything we've done is mentioned
in various posts, but here goes.

We got rid of our wall to wall carpeting and replaced it with tile. During the winter the tile warms up nicely in the sun and the heat comes on a little later in the day (open drapes). Now the tile helps keep the house cooler (closed drapes).

We have all cf bulbs.

If something isn't being used, I unplug it.

We hang dry clothes weather permitting.

We have a hot water timer and an electric programmable thermostat for the ac/heat (heat pump). My a/c is set to 81 and heat to 70. I haven't run the a/c much yet. I get good cross ventilation in the house with the windows and run ceiling and floor fans. The a/c is by far the biggest energy sucker here and it pisses me off when I see that huge jump in the bill in the summer lol.

I have good heavy floor length drapes on all but my kitchen window. They help keep the cool or heat in.

These are all changes we've made over the last year or two. I saw the biggest difference in my electric bill installing the new thermostat. My next planned purchase is a solar attic fan or two, and hopefully sometime next year a pv system.
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Coastie for Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #45
49. If something isn't being used, I unplug it.
Extremely good advice.

Those little "AC/DC Converter-Transformers" - as long as they are plugged in they are drawing current.

ELECTRIC BLANKETS AND ELECTRIC HEATING PADS - EVEN IF TURNED "OFF" - THEY ARE DRAWING CURRENT - AND IF YOU LEAVE IT UNDER A SPREAD OR COMFORTER WHEN YOU LEAVE IN THE MORNING - THE HEATING FROM THAT LITTLE BIT OF CURRENT LEAKAGE CAN START A FIRE (PER MY NEIGHBOR THE FIRE BATTALION CHIEF)
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Viking12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
48. Lots of great tips. I'll add one I haven't seen mentioned.
String a clothes line. We have a clothes line in the basement (winter)and another in the backyard (summer)--- let nature do the drying and you don't have to pay for it. We still use the dryer sometimes but have reduced use a great deal.
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #48
54. Closeline
I saw, somewhere, a round clothes rack for drying. Basically a hoop with clips, and a central hangar. Idea being you could fit more clothes in a smaller place, like a covered porch, or even indoors - which might be useful to you in rainy Oregon.

A home garden can be quite addictive, and can potentially reduce the fuel spent to get a portion of your food from the farm to you. I recommend Square Foot Gardening and Sustainable Vegetable Garden. I've always wanted to try a miniature forest garden: dwarf / semi-dwarf fruit trees, hazlenut bushes, berry bushes, fruit vines, and fruit groundcover (strawberries. etc), herbs, and maybe asparagus. All pretty much perennial.
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BamaGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #54
56. Go for the dwarf fruit trees.
Mine are all potted. I have an orange, a lime, 2 lemons, and a key lime right now. I have had no luck with strawberries unfortunately, but I'm getting grapes and blueberries this summer and hopefully a dwarf apple and fig. SFG is wonderful too, and I've gotten pretty creative with where I throw a veggie bed lol. I have a small yard, so I'm trying to maximize it lol.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-15-05 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #48
57. I've been thinking of a clothes line.
It seems ridiculous to turn on the AC in the summer to cool the house down after the dryer has heated it up!
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
52. turn off your computer
we saved a lot when we started shutting them down every night. we used to leave themn running all the time. this is s.o.p. in business, and that was the hubby way. but especially as they got more and more powerful, they used more and more juice. we saw a big drop in the electric bills when we got in this habit.
also, a big one on my to-do-before-it-gets-hot-list- i am going to try to wire a computer case fan into the compresser circuit on my fridge and freezer, so the compressor is cooled. most commercial units have this, most home ones do not. makes the compressor more efficient, and eliminates waste heat entering the cooling compartments.
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
55. Natural gas
Before you bought PV cells, I'd buy a NG Hot water heater. Or a NG hot water heater and a solar water heater. Maybe also trim / cut the foliage on the south side of your house.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-15-05 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #55
58. Rats!
Just installed a new electric water heater!
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One_Life_To_Give Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
59. Non-Frost Free Fridge
The frost free function on your refridgerator can be a major waste. Replacing it with a high efficiency model can give significant savings.
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midnight armadillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
60. INSULATE!
I spent $20 on polyethylene foam pipe insulation this past winter. My mother-in-law's bathroom has its water piped passing through the unheated garage...I replaced the 20 year old decaying insulation on it, and then covered all the hot water pipes in the basement. The heat in her bathroom went from lukewarm to scalding. This stuff is so cheap, there's no reason not to use it. When I get around to it I will also add an extra layer of fiberglass insulation to the garage pipes.

In her sunroom, I recently went and caulked like crazy and filled in air leaks on every window (it's got windows all the way around, 3 sides), and the result was the morning temperature in the room (it's barely heated in the winter) went up ~20 degrees. Air infiltration is the biggest waste of heat energy in the home.

My next project is to add an extra 8" of blown cellulose to her attic, although that may not happen for a while.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #60
61. Can you put rolled insulation in the roof?
We debated blown in cellulose or shredded fiberglass. It was tricky to fit the rolls of fiberglass in, but I think it is much neater. I am thinking that going up there to fix stuff would be impossible with all that insulation to paw through.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. What you need to be careful about is not trapping moisture.
The typical tarpaper/shingle/nail roof may sometimes seep very slightly, which is one reason people like to ventilate attics (to keep them dry). Putting insulation right up against the roof plywood, may end up trapping moisture, encouraging insect infestation and rot.

My attic insulation is below the attic floor: air can circulate beside the roofing plywood itself.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-17-05 05:12 AM
Response to Reply #63
67. Putting insulation against the roof sheathing will broil the shingles
There may be some moisture consideration there, but the real need is to protect the shingles. You can do that with baffles that keep the insulation from touching the sheathing (plywood).
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #60
64. Double-glazed windows are worthwhile, too, in the long run.
They really cut down both heating and cooling costs.
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 06:28 PM
Response to Original message
62. Don't have kids.
Edited on Mon May-16-05 06:38 PM by Gregorian
I know, it's not very popular an idea. But it is the most effective one.

Recycling works. All of the things in this post work. However, since most people only respond to a crisis, the real solution is to use as much energy as possible so that it becomes obvious that we have to change.

And no I'm not out of my mind. I've just spent forty years thinking very carefully about this subject. My ideas don't work with most people too well. In fact, that last one strikes a freeper chord, I must admit. But I saved and saved, and commutted by bicycle for many years. And I realized that that was not going to get people's attention.

edit- There is another option. Sometimes I ask myself which is more important, the economy or the planet. I saw this on a bumper sticker. I think there is something about it that is sinister, and I just don't fully understand it. But one could simply kill themself and therefore save a bundle of energy.
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Nihil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-17-05 04:40 AM
Response to Reply #62
66. ... but if you do ...
... get the kids thinking the right way now rather than having to
overcome an established energy-hungry habit later.

Even the simple stuff can help: closing doors, switching off lights,
recycle, don't leave the TV on standby, use the water-butt for the
garden rather than the tap, ...

The best approach is education though, allow them to be inquisitive,
remove any fear of asking questions, get them involved with the practice
rather than just the theory, understand that real-world issues aren't
simply black or white (and to see things from the opposing point of
view rather than just the one you prefer).

Given that they will (hopefully) spend more time on this planet in
the future than their parents, it makes sense that they start working
on the solution as soon as possible.
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-16-05 11:38 PM
Response to Original message
65. Walk or bicycle for short errands.
This improves your health, reduces greenhouse gases, and gives you some pleasure.

Once, for about three years, I gave up cars completely in Los Angeles and bicycled everywhere. I felt great, but there were certain inconveniences and dangers. Even now I am inclined to walk to nearby stores whenever time and weather allow. It's wonderful. I recommend it highly.
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Oggy Donating Member (652 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-05 07:08 AM
Response to Original message
68. Link to a UK resource
Also happens to be who I work for.

http://www.est.org.uk/myhome/whatcan/

Some of the information is UK specific, but simple ways to save energy can be applied everywhere.
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NobleCynic Donating Member (991 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
69. Try a flash heater
In Europe and in Asia you often see flash water heaters instead of tank style water heaters. How they work is they heat water as you need so there is no need for a large water tank constantly bleeding heat. Much more efficient, but the installation can be a bit steep.

The biggest concerns are making sure that you have a large enough pipe to handle to load, because flash heaters tend to use natural gas more quickly, but only when you need it. Because you may have to reinstall a larger gasline to handle the higher peak natural gas draw, it could be pricey. Also, you have to make sure that you get a large enough flash heater to handle your peak load, i.e. every hot water drawing appliance and faucet in the house on at the same time, or you may find that heating quality drops significantly should multiple draws come online concurrently.

The flash heater I had in my apartment in China had that problem. It was too weak to handle a shower with the water turned half way up not to mention all the way up. Trust me, get a large enough heater to handle peak load even if you think you won't need it. Now that I'm stateside again, I'm going to refit my house with a flash heater, especially with natural gas prices headed upwards.

Regardless, if you use alot of hot water, the energy savings should pay for the upgrade in a few years. Heating a large tank of water all day and night bleeds alot of energy unnecessarily.

Here is a good site to explore flash heaters a little further:
<http://www.plumbingworld.com/index-tanklesswaterheaters.html>
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
70. Thermal curtains
and double-paned windows to keep warm air in. Also, I only run the heat in the living room and leave the bedrooms cold and get under the covers when it's time for sleep. I run the ceiling fan slowly in the living room when the heat's on so that warm air circulates better.

In the summer I leave the windows open all the time so cooler air can circulate and the house doesn't get too hot during the day, prompting the reaction of getting home and turning the cooler WAY up. Especially the upper windows. You can also hear the birds better with the windows open. Closing the shades on the south side keeps the sun from getting in and heating the place.

Only use the dryer for heavy things like jeans during the summer. Everything else dries in a few hours.

Keep the water heater turned down. Showers won't be lengthy, but after 20 mins you're as clean as you're going to get, and you can still take baths.

Keep the lights out in rooms you're not in.
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