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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-14-08 09:38 PM
Original message
This is complete fucking nonsense
Ok, I fucking hate this shit... the NDP has 20.49% of the vote share so far, and the BQ has 6.25, but the BQ has already won 28 seats, and the NDP only 20!

The way the riding's are set up in this country sets my fucking teeth on edge. The god damn Bloc Quebecois only run in ONE province, and represent a TINY portion of Canadians, their platform being entirely about Quebec, ONE province! But the stupid god damn riding's allow them to have more seats that national parties with NATIONAL AGENDAS, and those national parties have many times the support of them!

Stupid stupid stupid.

How can our elections possibly reflect the will of the people when 8% of the vote gets you more seats than 20%?


Grargh.
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Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-14-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. I had fun for a moment, trying to guess what your post would be about.
I hope the election goes in the favor of the Canadian people.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-14-08 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. I hope Stephen Harper
contracts a severe case of gonorrhea and has to drop out of politics forever.
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ghostsofgiants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-14-08 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Hello new favourite quote for my Facebook profile.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Score
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-14-08 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. Sounds like the caucuses.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 02:19 AM
Response to Original message
6. Hey, long time no see. But if the BQ is able to win those districts outright, why should these...
people not be represented as such? To restrict it to national percentage would mute the voices of people from areas that obviously stick out from the norm.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 02:45 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Mute their voices?
Dude, they've always had a stronger voice in Canadian politics than other provinces.

When you look at the BQ ridings, like Ahuntsic, they won by a little over a hundred votes. And the voices being muted are those of the people voting for parties that can't ever get enough seats because they carry provinces with fewer ridings. A percentage wouldn't mute those peoples voices, as they have higher population density, which is why they have more ridings in the first place, and as such would end up with more BQ elected than if, say, there was a Manitoba Party that only ran in MB.

The system means that, no matter how strongly Canadians as a whole make a choice about the party they want in charge, they can't get that party unless the ridings manage to work out in their favour. It means that small parties, like the Greens, Communists, etc never get a seat, even when they get more of the vote than a party like the BQ.

I think that allowing a party that runs in a single province to have a higher share of seats despite it's low vote count and meaninglessness nationally is hurting the voices of Canadian voters. I think the BQ has a right to exist, and I think people should vote for them if that's what they want to do, but I don't think that they should have a more prominent place in politics than parties who have more votes than they do and work for ALL of the country, some of which don't even get a single seat to represent their share of the Canadian political mind.

I also think it's silly that other parties, the Cons or the Libs, can scoop up huge numbers of seats in some elections despite not being that far ahead in the numbers, because that happens too. With proportional representation, my vote could actually mean something. On a national scale! My city has 8 ridings. The riding I'm in ALWAYS goes liberal. It wouldn't matter if I never voted, it's a liberal riding. That feels... depressing as hell.

To turn it around: If the NDP can gain 20% of the vote, shouldn't they at least have some more seats? To restrict it to ridings which are always in the favour of one or two provinces is restricting the vote of the rest of Canada, and also ensuring more majorities or heavy minorities for parties that don't deserve it.


In the 2006 federal election, more than 650,000 Green Party voters across the country elected no one. Meanwhile, fewer than a half-million Liberal voters in Atlantic Canada alone elected 20 MPs. In the prairie provinces, Conservatives won three times as many votes as the Liberals, but were given nearly ten times as many seats. But more than 400,000 Conservative voters in Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver couldn't elect a single MP. The NDP attracted a million more votes than the Bloc, but the voting system gave the Bloc 51 seats and the NDP 29.

The last election, the BQ won a seat for every 31000 votes cast. The NDP won a seat for every 111000 votes cast. The green party? They won ZERO seats and got 580000 votes. That is just *wrong*

It's wrong that we end up with governments that do not represent the votes of the Canadian people. We end up with governments that represent the riding distribution. http://www.fairvote.ca/en/about_fairvoting
Check it out. Your access to democracy should not depend on which part of the country you live in.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 02:50 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. If Quebec's voting pattern make things so difficult, perhaps they should be encouraged to secede.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 03:13 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. It isn't just them
They're just the most obvious, because of the BQ.

All over the country this problem is happening. However, I think the BQ benefits one of the most from it, as they seats they have are SO out of whack with the votes they get.

The problem is the entire system, which allows majority governments that don't reflect the majority of the people or their votes. The problem is wasted votes, nearly half of those who do vote aren't represented. The problem is that you have to MOVE if you want to be represented by someone who you believe in 9 times out of 10.

Our voter turnout is dropping dramatically. A party that gets twice the votes gets SEVEN TIMES the seats! That isn't fair, and it's discouraging, it doesn't represent the people of our country, and it isn't what democracy should be.

If we had a two party system, I'd STILL think it was crap, but maybe I'd think it was less crap, because at least then it would sort of maybe in a way kind of represent a part of a part of the majority. But with more than two points of view? You end up with a government that represents what, 1/4 of the population, and the rest feeling disenfranchised? Yuck.
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billyskank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
7. Hey
:hi:

Most countries usually find a way of flipping off the people when it comes to who forms the government.
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krispos42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 03:10 AM
Response to Original message
10. This is wonderful news for America...
...there's a more fucked-up system than the Electoral College!

:woohoo:We're number two! We're number two! :woohoo:
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Left Brain Donating Member (895 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-15-08 03:29 AM
Response to Original message
12. On the bright side
* he still doesn't have a majority gov
* NDP picked up (7?) seats
* You don't have the shitty electonic voting system we have here in the states.

Hang in there, we feel your pain.
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