November 22, 1963 - the day Democracy Died

[Taverner]

That day, Ford and Bush were in Dallas

That day, they say couldn't remember where they were.

That day, everyone I know who was alive then knew exactly where they were.

Ford was later to take part in a piece of fiction called the Warren Report. In it he changed the direction of the bullet that killed Kennedy. The cummulative effect was that Lee Harvey Oswaled was deemed the lone gunman.

IN all this talk about how great a man Ford was, remember this.

[PVnRT]

1. Uh...

Yes, democracy died with JFK. Sure. Yup.

Or is this an attempt at meta-humor? 'Cause it isn't very well done.

[Taverner]

2. Well...considering what happened post-JFK

It's a fairly apt conclusion.

We went from a country weaning off the Military Industrial Complex economy to one in which the complex was the center of our economy, the military budget never shrunk (and grew and grew), and companies like Lockheed Martin and Raytheon controlled our government.

The question to always ask is, quo bonum?

[Left Is Write]

6. "Lockheed Martin" as a company didn't even exist in 1963.

My dad, who retired from Lockheed Martin in 2002 after beginning with Sperry Rand in 1961 (and going through the many corporate hand-changing over those 41 years), would be surprised to learn they "controlled" the government.

[Taverner]

7. They did exist, but not in conglomorated form

At the time the biggies were Boeing, Bell Helicopter and a number of other Military Contractors.

They were all behind JFK's assasination, Nixon's CREEP and a number of other assaults on our democracy.

Basically the Miltary Contractors run our Government and have since 63

Besides, the companies Lockheed and Martin existed since the turn of the century and 61 respectively:

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/wms/findPage.do?dsp=fec&c...

"Lockheed Martin traces its roots back to the early days of flight. In 1909 aviation pioneer Glenn L. Martin organized a company around a modest airplane construction business and built it into a major airframe supplier to U.S. military and commercial customers. Martin Marietta was established in 1961 when the Glenn L. Martin Company merged with American-Marietta Corp., a leading supplier of building and road construction materials. In 1913, Allan and Malcolm Loughead (name later changed to Lockheed) flew the first Lockheed plane over San Francisco Bay. The modern Lockheed Corporation was formed in 1932 after the fledgling airplane company was reorganized."

[Left Is Write]

8. I don't disagree that Lockheed and Martin Marietta existed...

just that "Lockheed Martin" did. I worked for Sperry from 1985 to 1992, and at the time I began my work there, Sperry, Burroughs, Lockheed, and Martin Marietta were still all separate companies. Burroughs bought Sperry in 1986 or so to become Unisys, which eventually spun off its DoD divisions, which were subsequently absorbed by the Lockheed/Martin Marietta merger. Sperry grew out of Remington Rand, which developed UNIVAC.

I remember the times that in order to get to work, I had to walk around hordes of women carrying picket signs decrying Sperry as a "bomb-maker" and "baby killer." My dad spent 41 years raising his family on a job with a DoD contractor, and I spent seven years doing the same. We are not bad people. My dad was one of the people who developed, tested, and built the ABCCC units for first Gulf War.

[Taverner]

9. You, your father, the employees aren't "bad people"

You do what you have to do. I sell to public sector myself, which includes alot of Military Contractors. I don't blame the employees, or really even the current management.

I blame the cabal that got together in Houston right after the Bay of Pigs and plotted the assasination of an American President, and the subsequent power grab that took place right after. The cabal was made of of board members of many Military Contractors (Bell Helicopter's CEO for one), High Ranking Military officials, Congressmen and of course, the Bush Family.

[Karenina]

3. You need to educate yourself.

Perhaps you were not of cognizant age then.

[DeeDeeNY]

4. Mike Malloy was talking about these facts the other night

How Ford and Bush were the only ones who say they couldn't
remember where they were on that day, and how they were both in Dallas.
The part about Ford's changing the bullet location in the
Warren Report is especially disturbing. I haven't heard much mention of it anywhere else.
Whether one agrees or not that democracy died that day, it can
certainly be said that it was definitely weakened greatly that day.

[Taverner]

5. Malloy hit the nail on the head that day

I remember first hearing that information told by a bay area "conspiracy theorist" Dave Emory. At the time I thought it was just mudslinging so I checked it out, and yes, all of it is true.

Also Ford was present right before Jack Ruby was killed. He was one of the last people to talk to him. And Jack Ruby repeatedly said he couldn't tell the truth because Ford was in the room

As for Democracy dying that day, one only look at what happened afterwards. Since that day, we have been in a state of war. Whether Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Thailand (yes we had ongoing military activity there against the "Thai Dang". You just never hear about that in history books), El Salvador, Nicaragua, Grenada, Panama, Iraq (for the Iraqis the war started during Gulf War I and never stopped. We bombed the "no fly zone" continuously until Sadaam's removal.)

When we weren't at war, we still increased the military budget every year, with no end in sight. We always bought more missles, more weapons, etc.

We've been living on a wartime economy since 1963.