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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:27 PM
Original message
DU Parents: what would you do if your kid was gay?
For me - I would get him or her involved in some kind of Self-defense program ASAP!!!

Even though it is California, Laramie Project gets me crying every time I see it...and I would never ever want that to happen to one of my kids.

So if one of my kids finds out they are gay - self defense classes for the lot o'them...

& u?
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MissMillie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. What would there be to do?
If he's gay, he's gay.

(A self-defense course may be wise, but my son is already a Senior in high school, and has a lot of great friends who would most definitely have his back... er... so to speak. :silly:)
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Oeditpus Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #1
33. LOL!
:rofl:

:thumbsup:
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
2. positive associations are probably more important than
self defense -- unless your child is INTO self defense.

but your child would most definitely like to associate with other gay kids in a positive format.
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
3. Why would you do that?
You would be encouraging your child to treat homophobia with violence. Maybe that's necessary in some circumstances, but it certainly wouldn't have helped Matthew Shepard. Not unless he had made self-defense his main focus in life. And what would that teach anyone?

What I would do is to love the child and accept him/her for whatever and whoever they are and support them when and if they face discrimination. I wouldn't treat them any differently than a straight child who might face some adversity in life.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. True, but as a parent wouldn't you be worried?
There is ALOT of hate out there, and I love my kids too much.
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #5
17. I would worry if I was in Montana maybe... and yeah.. I would worry
as I will worry if a kid of mine is undersize or overly intelligent or overweight or "funny" looking or any number of things he could be that would cause other kids to be cruel to him. Matthew Shepard was an adult when he was murdered. Unless you live in a particularly violent area, I don't think you have to worry about that kind of thing. I WOULD however do your best to encourage your child to be open with you and let you know of any homophobic experiences.

The funny thing is... children will taunt other kids for being gay, whether or not they are... so teaching a gay child self-defense doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Teaching a child to accept other children with all their differences is much more important than warning your kid that he might get beat up some day by giving him self-defense classes simply because he's gay.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Yes, but if my kids learn self defense early, then they have a chance
There's too much fucking hate out there to count on the kindness of strangers...

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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #19
25. So, go ahead and teach them all self defense now before you know
whether they are gay or straight. Why only the gay kid? Why not the girls? They are more likely to encounter physical violence than gay men in their future.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. Well the oldest is 2 so its a bit young on all accounts
But yeah - I probably will have them both learn self defense...

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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #17
49. hey don't talk bad about Montana
we aren't all hateful hicks you know? :)
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. Yes, but that's where Matthew Shepard was murdered...
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 04:36 PM by Misunderestimator
that was why I mentioned it since his murder was referenced in the OP. :hi:
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #51
56. I thought that was Wyoming
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 04:38 PM by Wetzelbill
Oh I know, I just can never resist giving you a little hell, you know that. :) All out of love though. :)

edit for typo
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. Hmm... well damn. I stand corrected.
It was Wyoming indeed. Now you can tease me for not knowing the difference between Wyoming and Montana... I know you can drive really fast in one of them. :D
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #57
66. I won! I won!
:)

Yes, MT used to have no speed limit. Wild West. :)
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redwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #5
54. My guys aren't gay and I worry incessantly
It's what parents do. :-)
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Correct answer
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 03:00 PM by terrya
That's what I was going to tell Taverner...just be there for your kid. Love them...and tell them so.

Plus...if you were to have any questions or concerns, P-FLAG is a wonderful resource for parents of gay children.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #3
15. is self defense violence?
Obviously learning self defense won't help in all situations, but having the knowledge and techniques on how to protect yourself isn't a bad thing. :shrug:
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. A child being encouraged to learn self-defense simply because they
are gay would give the message that they may encounter violence from others and need to protect themselves. A kid with those abilities might likely react violently to ANY prejudice, simply because he has those skills and because he has been *warned* that he needs to protect himself. That's what I meant.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. thanks for the clarification
I see what you're saying, makes sense.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #20
32. Whats wrong with them acting violence when they encounter prejudice?
If the freepers end up with a broken arm for their stupidty, I think thats a good thing....
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. If they encounter VIOLENT prejudice fine... if they encounter ANY
prejudice... and they react violently... that's a VERY BIG problem. And one that will likely fuck them up for life. I wouldn't want that for my kids. You would encourage a kid to break someone's arm if they call them a fag?
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #36
41. Actually, if my son could handle himself in a fight
Giving another kid a shiner for being homophobic might make me a little proud...
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. Again, in a fight. That wasn't my question.
If someone called him a fag, would you encourage your kid to hit him? If you do, then you are setting him up for a lot of trouble, since that's pretty much discouraged, especially these days, in school.
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #43
93. Speaking as a self-defense instructor...
No reputable place will teach your kid to hit anyone for being called a name. We will teach your kid how to non-violently attempt to diffuse the situation and if the child is physically attacked, how to physically deal with that using an appropriate amount of force.

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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #15
47. I don't think so. MrG and I just got done with teaching James how to
defend himself against the local bully. If the school won't stand up for kids...we will.
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #47
50. That's different than teaching a child self-defense because he's gay..
You have a bully... and a reason to teach your son. Good for you for that. It's probably a good idea to teach all children self-defense. Not just because they're gay.
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. I don't think so. I think, taking all of the incidents of bashing in the
world, it would be an ounce of prevention...although it makes me sick to think about. :(
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. Totally agree. All children should learn self-defense.
Since any child can be beaten up for being assumed to be gay.
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #53
60. True, but I would be doubly precautious if it were known to be true.
I wouldn't want to regret something I could have prevented. But we're just talking in circles here.
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #60
62. Oh ok. I didn't think we were talking in circles.
Anyway... Lioness's post in this thread says what I meant to say so much better than I did.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=4987487&mesg_id=4988256
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #62
63. I guess I think we agree with each other to a point.
You expressed yourself just as well as she did.
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. Thanks.
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #3
91. Self-defense does not teach violence
It allows you to have the skills to confidently and successfully deal with an *unavoidable* situation where you are in *physical* danger. It teaches you to non-violently diffuse the situation first. I think everybody should learn self-defense.

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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #91
94. "I think everybody should learn self-defense." I agree.
I just don't think someone should ONLY be taught self defense because they are gay. It teaches them to fear homophobia instead of to deal with it. Learning self defense to protect oneself against ANY kind of aggression is very valuable and I am absolutely for it.
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #94
96. Exactly. Gay has nothing to do with it.
I'm gay, but I started unofficially learning self-defense when I was five. We lived in a rough neighborhood and my dad believed that you had to know how to fight. So he started teaching me, but I wasn't overly shielded like kids today. I got to play outside without constant supervision. I got to run around with the other kids on the block and play in the firehydrants. I got in a couple stupid kid fights but no one got hurt.

I officially started studying karate when I was 10. I earned my black belt at 17 and my 2nd degree black belt at 21. You realize that most people stepping into a martial arts school would be in a lot of trouble in something happened on the street. We just teach them what to do if the worst happens. Not only do they now have the skills, but they also have the confidence. Statistically, the more confident you appear, the less likely you are to be attacked.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
4. Good idea
I plan on enrolling my daughter in a self defense class regardless. It's empowering to know you can protect yourself.

Other than that, I would love and accept her 100% and hope she has good taste in women. I have no patience for anyone who wouldn't treat my daughter with the respect she deserves.

My husband might be a tiny bit disappointed only because he's looking forward to doing the 'psycho dad answering the door with a shot gun in hand' routine when she starts dating. I doubt he would do that if a young woman knocked on the door. Aside from that, he would be loving and accepting as well. ;)
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YankeyMCC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. Well I guess a self-defense class wouldn't be a bad idea
although in my case my son already takes Karate.

Yeah, I suppose I would have a hieghtened concern about his safety, although thankfully I don't think it would be heightened over much where we live. If I remember correctly our town high school was one of the first high schools to have a gay/straight alliance club (support group? whatever you call it)

Other than that I'd continue on as I am. Blunder around and try to do no harm and not be the reason he ends up crying on a psychiatrist couch when he's an adult. :)

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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
8. I'd worry about his future happiness, think all his boyfriends not
good enough for him, hope he'd be home at a reasonable hour. The same stuff I'd do if my kid were into girls.

The only practical difference would be to change the focus of "the talk" somewhat from reproduction and pregnancy protection to disease prevention.
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progmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. though all versions of "the talk" should include disease prevention
:)
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Cooties changed me forever
:cry:
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progmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. see?
Your parents were remiss, weren't they? :hug:
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
24. but of course
I'd just spend somewhat more time on that and less on the umpteen ways to prevent pregnancy (I'd discuss both in exaustive detail in any case, but I'm just an exhaustive detail kind of person.)
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progmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. excellent
:thumbsup:

And I loved your response. :hug:
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
9. I'd only forcibly enroll my kid in self-defense if he/she was an Oasis fan
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Also a correct answer
Some wise advice in this thread. :thumbsup:
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dolo amber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #9
27. I could kick your ass, fetus
:P
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Susang Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #9
29. I'd forcibly enroll my kid in therapy if he/she was an Oasis fan
}(
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Book Lover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
11. You mean I'd finally get to join PFLAG?!
And I'd get to march at Pride? Sign me up!

Seriously, though, I'd do nothing different.
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grace0418 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #11
102. You can already join PFLAG if you have any
Edited on Thu Apr-06-06 12:02 AM by grace0418
gay friends. Which most of us probably do. I know you were just kidding but I thought I'd mention that! :hi:
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auntAgonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. If my son told me he was gay..
I'd ask him what he wants for supper!


seriously, he's my son.. what's to do? I'd be proud of him for all he is and aspires to be.


I know that's the easy answer from someone who's son isn't gay. I am very sure that's how I'd react though.

aA
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. But wouldn't you worry for him or her?
That someone would try to harm them?

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auntAgonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #23
45. As a mother..
I have always worried for my child. He was never one to walk with the crowd, always did his own thing. He was adverserial in many ways and probably should have been a lawyer for his arguing ability.

I worry about him now, with all the stuff that goes on in cities. He travels by bus, doesn't own a car, walks many places when he has to.

But, yes, if he told me here were gay, there is so much we'd talk about. My point was that HE IS MY SON, being gay or straight doesn't enter into that part of it. I would caution him, we'd have the same talks we had about sex maybe with more emphasis on the safety issues, I don't know. I would caution him that the world has many people in it that would try to harm him. I'm not into violence but I do think that I might encourage him to take up some martial art or something similar as protection of his physical being. I'd be most concerned about protecting his mental well being too. As I do with my son now, I'd remind him constantly that he is loved! He's always going to be my son, I'll always be his mother. Mothers worry. I can't speak to the worry of the Mother of a child who is gay, I've never been there. Your question is thought provoking. Thank you for asking it.

aA
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #23
59. Taverner, you're overreacting
Much like parents of pretty white females overreact when they read about the Natalee whatever-her-name-in-Arubas of the world. Or the parents of small children when they hear about a small child abduction. Or the people who worry about terrorist when what they should realistically be worrying about are the mundane things like crossing the street or driving to the corner store.

We ALWAYS worry that someone will harm our kids. Because they're young, or female, or naive, or coming home late, or have a new driver's license, or are old enough to drink, or just went away to college, or joined the Army, or are pregnant with their first child, or are flying to Bankok.

To come out as gay does not necessarily mean that people are going to be lining up to beat you up. Maybe you'll encounter prejudice - should every black child learn ju-jitsu? Every kid who wears glasses?

Self defense classes are fine but when the only reason you're going is because you just told your dad you're gay sends a pretty strange message to a kid. Think about it.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #59
68. True, but now that I'm a parent
I watch movies like "The Laramie Project" and "The Summer of Hate" a bit differently.

Instead of just feeling sorry for Matthew Shephard - I also feel for the parents, and their friends.

And you gotta admit, the level of hate against gays is RISING, not waning....

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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #68
71. It's not easy to be a parent
Hardest, and most rewarding, job I've ever had. And I've found that it doesn't just end when the kids turn 18 and leave home. Uh uh - they're going to be my babies until the day I die. Makes me look at MY parents in a whole different light. :hug:

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SOteric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
18. I'm not a parent, but...I've had students come out to me,
I'm more concerned that young people who become aware that they are gay, find some sort of counseling and a support network of other gays and their families. Self-esteem issues and feelings of alienation are harder to deal with and leave more lasting scars than mild to moderate violence. If you want your children to be safe, healthy and happy, help them to process their emotions and make effective choices for themselves as to what manner and level of self-defense they feel is appropriate.



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Dolomite Donating Member (689 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
21. I'm not a parent, or gay for that matter - but I do know
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 03:09 PM by Dolomite
that 'self-defense' does not equal 'hate'.

But just like knowing how to start or put out a fire, how to change a tire, or how to find North without a compass - learning to take care of oneself is never a bad idea.

So if I were find myself in such a situation, I would kindly direct my kid to the following organization:

www.pinkpistols.org
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Midlodemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
22. Probably worry about his/her future the same way I do now
and I think they are all straight. I wouldn't do anything differently. I love them too much just as they are.


*Disclaimer: Although I do LOVE them, right now, I could kill all three of them with a smile on my face*.
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Iniquitous Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
31. Love my kid.
Support my kid. Kind of a non-issue for me in terms of life stuff and with all the kids and stepkids in my life, I wouldn't be too surprised if one was gay.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #31
84. Well said...
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 06:37 PM by GoddessOfGuinness
And in teaching our kids to be respectful of people of all races, beliefs and sexual orientations, I hope they'll never feel ashamed of who they are; and that they'll always know how dearly we love them.
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beyurslf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
34. The same thing I would do if he or she was straight.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
35. Would anyone consider moving to a more tolerant city?
I'm in Austin, TX right now and we're looking at moving to Toronto so I'm good to go when it comes to tolerant cities. What about DUers who aren't? Would you consider moving if you found out your child was gay if you lived in an intolerant area?
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bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #35
74. i wouldn't live anyplace intolerant, but shit happens everywhere......
especially where you might least expect it.
the only two places where i've seen violence almost occur were the west village in nyc, and cherry grove on fire island.
and they were the gayest neighborhoods in nyc and long island, respectively.
groups of kids looking to start fights go there specifically looking for trouble. and they always outnumber thir intended victim(s).
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Oeditpus Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
37. Buy him tickets to a Bette Midler show?
Or buy her a motorcycle?

:shrug:
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MissMillie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. I hear Liza is in town
but Cher's done touring right?
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Oeditpus Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #39
55. Dunno
But after meeting Jack, it's likely she is.



If I could turn back tiOOOMMM...
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dr.strangelove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
38. Love them, teach them, yell at them, hug them, coach them,
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 03:19 PM by dr.strangelove
be proud of them, be mad at them, be happy with them, buy them presents, refuse to buy them a car, not let them stay up late watching TV, throw them birthday parties, embarrass them as teenagers, screw up assembling their first bike, get angry the first time they pee on me when I am changing the diaper, then look at the smiling face and not be mad anymore, drive them to soccer, dancing, baseball, swimming, hockey, drama class, art class, the museum and many more places, worry about them late at night, let them cry on my shoulder when their heart is first broken, celebrate when they reach every milestone and be the proudest dad in the world when they do anything worth noting.

If it was a straight kid, I'd probably just ignore her.
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xmas74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
40. Love her no matter what?
I'd think that would be the right answer.

As to self defense classes-she'll get those whether she's a lesbian or hetero, just because she is female. Truthfully, I'd think she'd be more likely to need them if she is hetero. I remember more than a few dates in high school ending in violence. According to those guys, you were "uppity" if you didn't put out on the first date.
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khashka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. I don't disagree with you.... but.....
A lot of anti-gay violence is very sexualized. And results in rape.

The sort of "I'll show that dyke what a man is!" or "Faggot! If that's what he wants that's what he's gonna get!"

I can't speak to a heterosexual woman's experience, but I know from personal testimonies that it's often scary, often difficult. And that many women curtail their actions out of very justified fear.

Recent statitics show that assault against gay men and lesbians is more violent than other assaults.

Still, every man and every woman should know how to defend themselves and protect themselves. I'm glad you will give those skills to your daughter ( though I expect nothing less from you) and hope she will never have to use those skills.

Khash.




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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #44
69. Yes - I don't want my son or daughter afraid to be who they are
And if that takes a blackbelt in Tae Kwon Do, so be it.
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khashka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #69
80. Well Tav.... I'm having a hard time
I'm beginning to hate straight men. No, really, I am! And I know that's wrong, but it's true. If I go his path I will be no less a bigot than the men I detest for their bigotry. I know that. But it is so hard.

And one of the reasons I hang out here is so many straight guys who have no problems with gays and lesbians and transfolk and women.

Proves that my incipient bigotry is wrong. And I thank you for being one of those guys :)


Khash.



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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #80
81. Thanks
Not all us str8 dudes are bad :)

Personally I think pursuing merely "tolerance" isn't enough - purusing acceptance is much better for the str8 community to learn, but hey I'm one of those progressive radicals ;)
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #69
95. Not for self defense...
Tae Kwon Do teaches too many flashy techniques that won't help you on the street. You don't want high kicks and jumps, because it makes you vulnerable. For self-defense, look into non-flashy karate styles (isshinryu, goju-ryu, shorin-ryu, shotokan, kyokushin) or jujitsu, akido (uses your opponents energy against themselves), sambo, etc. Knowing some grappling will help, because you should know what to do if a fight goes to the ground. Learn how to defend against a knife and look for somebody that will tell you that you WILL get cut defending against a knife. If not they're a liar,
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xmas74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #44
82. Thank you.
Of course, I'm just speaking from my own personal experiences of living in a hick town and dating cornfed idiots. To them, any girl who wouldn't put out to them must be a "dyke" and must be dealt w/ accordingly. We won't get into the details of what happened but they were violent. And two instances were date rape.

I won't let that happen to my daughter and it doesn't matter if she is a lesbian or hetero. Supposedly "straight" male on gay male violence does seem to be the worse but I know of a number of women, lesbian or hetero, whom have had the phrase dyke thrown in their faces just because they wouldn't accept a man's advances. To them, if you don't want to jump their bones immediately then you must be a lesbian. If you are a lesbian then they need to "show" you what a young man like themselves can do for a woman.

Sometimes I think it is those experiences that has led me to my fascination w/ domination. I felt so out of control in high school through no fault of my own. And I never spoke about it.
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khashka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #82
87. Have you read "Macho Sluts"?
Not the whole thing, just the intro....


Pat Califia rocks, she tells how men and women are mistreated and there is no such thing as consent in everyday life. But those of us who choose domination or submission (given our natures) base it on consent. People like me and you are villfied. You dominate men, I submit to them (occasionally dominate them - fun isn't it?). And work, family, life is all built on domination. We rebel against that. And while what I do is not postable - I know how very vulnerable a human body is .. I've said it before: hurt but never harm.

People are a hell of a lot safer with me than a "normal" person.

But on another note. Do speak about your life. Tell the truth! You'll surprised.



Khash.




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xmas74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #87
99. That is a book that I need to look for sometime.
Neither of us are "normal" by any means. And most would be shocked about me if they had met me on a casual basis once or twice.

I couldn't tell at that time what had happened. Small town politics, boys w/ family names and connections-things were known to be covered up. And the late night phone calls filled with threats just helped me shut up.

My family still doesn't know to this day and I don't think they'd believe me if they did hear. My brother heard rumors-from their side-but he dismissed them upon hearing them. (He heard that I was sleeping around. He didn't believe that.)

I plan on doing my best to make sure that my daughter never goes through that. I just want her to have a decent life.
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Shine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
42. Love him, no matter what.
let him know that, on the home front at least, he is loved and accepted.

Other than that, I guess I'll just have to wait and see....

Love, above all.
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:28 PM
Response to Original message
46. I would be really disappointed in her/him...
for not calling everyday, for not stopping in after work, for all of the things that matter...The gay part would be just who he/she is. It's really that simple.
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Debbi801 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #46
97. Exactly my feeling, kinda like his/her eye color.....
It is part of what makes him/her the person that I love. I love me kids no matter what their religious or sexual preferences are. And I would hope that the people they fall in love with treat them the way they deserve to be treated.

:hi:
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
48. I would teach him or her jiu-jitsu, boxing, judo, wrestling
and some of my other "secret" MMA techniques.

Then put them in a program to augment the base I taught them. Other than that, just love them. Same as I would any other children I may have.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
58. sorry tav...gotta disagree with you there
firstly your kid is in california..and will probably not face homophobia in a physical way...


second, i dont think the first thing to do when you have a gay child is to teach them that the world will hate them..they will learn that in their own time...


pri
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #58
65. Well put.
That's sort of the point I was trying to make... but not so well, I guess.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #65
70. Look I understand where youse guys are coming from
but I don't want my kids ever afraid to be who they are - not even for a minute.

Being gay is a blessing in my eyes - a way to look at the world differently and to see other people differently.

If my kids are robbed of that even indirectly, I get mad...
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #70
73. Then you should definitely teach them self-defense.
Edited on Wed Apr-05-06 05:13 PM by Misunderestimator
Especially the girl. Girls are victims of violence, molestation and rape every day everywhere. Shit, if I had known self-defense as a child, I could have prevented my brother and father from beating me. That would have been nice. I was beaten up as a child for all sorts of things, and no one, including me, even knew I was gay.

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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #73
75. That sucks
:hug:

No one has a right to do that to you - not parents, brothers or anyone.

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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. Yeah... life is full of bad and good.
I've been fortunate that the adult part of my life has been blessed and that I didn't turn out so bad after the first part. Thanks for the hug. :hug:
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 09:21 AM
Response to Reply #58
107. wow nicely said
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
61. The same exact things I'd do if my kid wasn't.
However, understanding your point, I think that the way this country is at this stage, I would probably want him/her to know how to defend from bodily harm. I'd prefer nonviolently, of course. However, push does come to shove from time to time. If my kid was so inclined, I'd certainly support a self-defense teaching, preferring a Gracie/Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu style. I'd also hope my kid would take up my love for the gym. Hoping to pass my genetics along, I'd hope he'd not need to ever need to defend him/herself. Let's face it, if you LOOK like you can whip some ass, chances are reduced that you'll have to.
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
67. And what about HORSES ???? -
I ask not for the first time...

I love cats and dogs BUT I have two horses who are like my children... :cry: Nobody cares!

---------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #67
72. But are they gay?
:P

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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #72
76. No, definitely not. A stallion tried to love my gelding once -the stallion
payed dearly.

---------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #76
78. You know, this thread hijack is worthless without pictures
(I love horses)
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #78
79. ROFL
I just realized that I responded to the wrong thread - meant to put the answer in that newest kitten/dog pet thread.
:rofl:

---------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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ronnykmarshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
83. Teach him all about our great heros.
The Madonna, The Judy, The Diana, The Liza, The Barbra, The Bette.
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xmas74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #83
85. My friend Tim would demand that
The Cher be on that list.

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ronnykmarshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #85
92. Oh my god!!
How could I forget The Cher???
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xmas74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #92
98. Tim gave my daughter a framed picture of The Cher
when she was born. He says that The Cher should somehow be worked into the education of all children worldwide. He swears that if The Cher was studied by all we would have already obtained world peace.

He used to dress as The Cher.
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seemunkee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
86. lots of schools have gay/straight alliances
both my kids have been involved with it.
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Alleycat Donating Member (992 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:18 PM
Response to Original message
88. I really don't think it's a big deal.
Of course because they are my child I'd want to protect them but not any more so then if they were straight.

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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
89. We actually talked about that.
1. Love them.
2. Love the person who they love and welcome them into our home.
3. Love them.
4. If there are threats to their safety, the family moves to an area that is safer (if that is possible.)
5. Love them.
6. Join support organizations to keep aware of issues and the local area.
7. Love them.
8. Protect them from the anti-gay bigots in our extended family. Love my child or get the fuck out of my home and our lives. Period. No discussion.
9. Did I mention love them?

Basically, we would do anything to keep our kid safe from the crazies. Whatever it takes. However, where we live right now is pretty gay-friendly. There is a gay bar just around the corner!
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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #89
100. I agree with you.
Love, protection and support.
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KitchenWitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
90. Great idea
and I would love them...and tell them that no matter what, I am in their corner.
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av8rdave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
101. Love & support him/her
and continue to encourage him/her to take pride in who he/she is. In short, nothing different than I try to do with my kids now.
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grace0418 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 12:08 AM
Response to Original message
103. I guess I'd make extra sure to protect them from
my husband's extremely ignorant parents. Other than that, nothing different. My husband jokes that I would probably prefer a gay child. I told him that I'd rather a gay child be born to parents like us, who will love and nurture him/her no matter what, than have to deal with bigots for parents.
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fishnfla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
104. Same thing we tell all our kids
1. Don't swing at bad pitches
2. Don't get caught off base
3. Always keep the ball in front of you, or somone will be scoring runs behind your back






























softball season
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
105. be welcoming towards the boyfriend(s)
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Der Blaue Engel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 01:05 AM
Response to Original message
106. What would you do if your kid was female?
Or transgendered? Or a person of color? I don't see being gay as more dangerous than being anything else that sickos hate.

The reason I use "female" as my first example is that I wonder how I would have been able to handle it if my son had been a daughter instead. I think the fear of what might happen to her would eat me alive.
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tigereye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-06-06 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
108. nothing
I'd just support them and make sure they know about safe sex....( same as any kid, I suppose)
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