Elvis fans: Why was Elvis considered so great?

[Taverner]

Not to knock Elvis, he was a good singer and could croon with the best of them...but why is he considered so seminial?

I would argue that Jerry Lee Lewis and Buddy Holly influenced Rock and Roll more than Elvis did - but maybe I'm wrong....


ON EDIT: I do hope Mistah Forrest weighs in here :)

[XemaSab]

1. .

[edbermac]

2. Sun Records Elvis was GREAT, Las Vegas Fat Elvis sucked.

John Lennon said it best when he heard of his demise..."Elvis died in the Army..."

[ForrestGump]

35. Beg to differ on the 'Las Vegas' Elvis, regardless of his

physical condition.

Have you actually heard anything from that period?

Always nice to see the 'fat' thing mentioned, too, albeit perhaps only as a knee-jerk (emphasis on 'jerk') reflex to thoughts of Elvis in the latter years of his foreshortened life. Leaving aside the whole topic of criticizing people based on physical appearance, or the reality of Elvis' physical condition in those last few years, I'll just say that Elvis was significantly overweight for only the last three years of his life (not even three years, actually, and within that period he did lose weight quickly before some tours)...for the rest of his life, he arguably looked more like a Greek god (David, to be exact) than you, me, or most of the people on DU.

I guess that's why it's not only okay but expected to drag out the 'fat' references. He betrayed us by being human, dammit.

[edbermac]

42. I SAW him at the MGM in Vegas in 75 or 76

Was way up in the balcony; they announced don't take pics of him; of course when he came out it looked like downton Baghdad on the first day's shelling with all the flashes going off...

[Taverner]

44. His versions of "Something" and "Bridge over Troubled Water" are sublime

And I NEVER use the word sublime!

ON EDIT: those were sung during the Vegas years...

[Ava]

3. elvis is the most over-rated artist of all time

MAYBE with the exception of Michael Jackson

[henslee]

7. Bullshit.

;)

[Taverner]

8. I dunno if I'd say overrated

I mean, he could sing.

But I wouldn't give him King of Rock status...

[Ava]

10. i didn't say he couldn't sing

[ghostsofgiants]

4. Costello > Presley

[ForrestGump]

36. In Costello's dreams, maybe

Except he wouldn't have such dreams because he knows better.

He's not bad, but he's not Elvis.



Buddy-Holly-looking-motherf***er... No...I'm not serious

[henslee]

5. He was white, had the pipes, the moves. the gospel roots and the

colonel behind him. He also blew up just when TV was blowing up.... he had timing.

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

18. Little Richard had a funny bit in Chuck Berry's "Hail, Hail Rock & Roll"..

He's sitting around with Bo Diddley and Chuck and talking about Pat Boone having hits off of his hits. He said that he wanted to go find Boone and kick his ass..."Here he is talkin' about Long Tall Sally and he ain't never BEEN back in the alley"...something to that effect...then he realized that his songs were being played on white radio. Boone's ass remained unkicked and Richard reluctantly understood what was going on.

Elvis definitely had "the pipes, the moves, the gospel roots"...AND the timing...but being white had a lot to do with it too. It opened doors. Whether that was fair or unfair or right or wrong, the fact remains that in the fifties being a white boy opened doors.

He got sold down the river by Colonel Tom...I'm sure MOST Elvis fans know the story of how Led Zeppelin offered to be his session band for an all-out rock album...a snarler like his 1968 "comeback" special...and how they were politely told "no thank you."

Shoulda coulda, woulda. Everyone should own the Sun singles...from that point forward it's a matter of taste and a roll of the dice.

:toast:

[henslee]

19. I just dl'd a track of Little Richard doing an add for a hair product....

A sample of it is on this. page...http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000000QO2/102-6987318-7372103?v=glance&n=5174

[dorkulon]

6. He was white.

And better-looking than Holly or Lewis

[ForrestGump]

38. When he first had his record played in Memphis

people didn't know what color he was. And being white was most definitely a bonus for the marketplace but it also was detrimental -- there're archival footage and also contemporary articles on how this evil white boy was bent on dragging America's white children to Hell with the 'coloreds'...being white and singing music that was strongly influenced by black musical forms was not a bed of roses. Neither was having long hair (for the day), wearing pink clothes, getting hair done at the beauty parlor, and wearing mascara -- not in crewcut 1950s Memphis.

[REDKING]

9. I personally loved the early stuff.....

He was white with a black mans voice..not my opinion but thats what a lot of people said to me when I was younger.

[NewJeffCT]

22. I've heard that, too

Plus, he had perfect timing with the rise of television and his made for television good looks and charisma, and his "outrageous" (for its time) dancing. It wasn't just his voice.

[Saboburns]

11. Two Words

Suspicious

Minds

[RandomKoolzip]

12. Shut down the computer, go to the bookstore, and buy "Mystery Train,"

by Greil Marcus. On your way home, go to Tower and pick up "The Sun Sessions" on CD. And just for shits and giggles, pick up just about any CD by any white pop star of the early 50's.

[eyepaddle]

13. Elvis was the shit, plain and simple here's an essay that sums

it up perfectly. I was never really a huge Elvis worshipper, but you just knew there was something...different, maybe even special about him.

Eightz lays it out for you: (it does get a little racy though, so be warned!)

From eightball magazine:

But there is another reason Elvis was the shit…one that often goes over looked.
He wasn't gay.
Hear me out.
Every blue moon, the Gods bestow upon a mere mortal a charisma that can't be defined in words.
Elvis had it.

snip

And what is most important is what Elvis did with that gift. He did what I would expect from any normal, heterosexual, red-blooded American boy who, with one twist of the hips, could have every woman in America believing that giving him head was both necessary and sufficient to validating their existence.
Elvis tried to oblige every single woman on the planet

http://www.8bm.com/diatribes/volume01/048/991.htm

[Bridget Burke]

14. Elvis did more than just croon.

Rock & roll had been percolating underground for some time. But Elvis was a sexbomb & could not be ignored. He made all the right people angry--including most of the parents of his fans.

His 1968 "Comeback" show proved he could still do it. But then he got lost again. However, many fans loved him until the end.



Buddy Holly was a great performer & also a great writer--his loss was tragic. Jerry Lee Lewis was a wild man but I don't know that he was more "influential."

And lots of the Rock Pioneers were black. Chuck Berry? Little Richard?

[johnnie]

15. I started writing as to why I think he is considered so great

But I kept writing and writing so I figured it's best that I don't put a book up here.

It's very hard to say exactly why he was so great in just a few words because Elvis is one person that goes beyond a few recordings that were played on the radio here and there. The guy came along at the right time and the fact that he looked the way he did and sang the way he did didn't hurt.

There are some people born into this world that have a talent that not many people have and when the time is just right, they take off. It's sort of like what were the chances that John, Paul George and Ringo met when they did? It just happened.

Elvis knew how to perform, he had personality, he could sing, he knew how to arrange music so it would sell, he treated people well and most importantly, Elvis was a little whacked out.

I'm sure Forrest will jump in here if he sees this thread, and will be able to write all this better than I can.

[Acebass]

16. Col. Parker!...n/t

[hholli11]

17. Perhaps a musician could help you...

but before Elvis came on the scene, the top songs in pop culture included "How Much is that Doggy in the Window" and "Take Me Out to the Ballgame". Elvis came on the scene with that look, that voice and that SWAGGER. Elvis Presley jirated all over God's creation. And his voice has a lot of velvet in it. Smooth, ya know?

There hasn't been a man who could command a stage like that since. In fact, I don't think we could name someone who could turn a crowd into what Elvis Presley did. In fact, it took FOUR MEN to even come close. (And by then, the king's prime was long behind him).

Now...as far as musical CONTRIBUTION goes...gravitas if you will...Buddy Holly tops your list, but mostly BECAUSE of Elvis Presley. I'll explain:

When Holly wanted on the scene, Elvis EXPLODED onto it. One does not need to be a rocket scientist to figure out which one the girls would swoon over, and a very smart Buddy Holly readily recognized that Presley had a better voice than his. So Buddy Holly began recording over his inital recording in order to make a fuller sound. (We probably shouldn't negate Phil Spector here, but I digress) That process, ovedubbing, is how most recording artists perfrom to this very day. It was invented by Buddy Holly as a way to stay in the game against a southern pretty boy who danced like he had ants in his pants.

I would argue that Jerry Lee Lewis did not necessarily have as big an impact as Elvis Presley...but Buddy Holly...he's in the same category as people like Jimi Hendrix as far as influence goes. (Anyone doubting the veracity of Hemdrix's influence should see the impact he had on guitar sales. Crazy. It's absolutely crazy).

Anyhoo, I hope that helps.

[GalleryGod]

20. Thank You. You saved me minutes upon minutes of typing.

I'm in your debt.

[henslee]

21. Excellent post. I just saw the Hendrix/Band of Gypsies doc on cable, wow.

[Oeditpus Rex]

23. Two points:

1. When Presley came on the scene, "How Much Is That Doggie in the Window" et al were the top songs in white, middle-class pop culture. But at the time, that's pretty much all there was. Most radio stations wouldn't even play "colored" music, and many of the "underground" stations that would also played the early Presley sides, thinking he was black.

2. Les Paul invented overdubbing. He even built a guitar with a built-in "studio" that could oversample, I believe, as many as eight tracks.

My own take: Presley was like Michael Jordan — not the best, but the most-hyped, and therefore perceived by many as the best.

:popcorn:

[hholli11]

27. you made our first point obsolete...

with the 'but..at the time that is all there was'. If that is all there was, that is INDEED all there was.

And Michael Jordan is INDEED one of the best basketball players ever to have walked the face of planet earth. (and a very nice man from my allbeit limited experience with him).

:)

[Oeditpus Rex]

33. Not obsolete

Relative.

I meant it's all there was for practical purposes. The cool white kids still snuck radios into bed with them to listen to the stations that did play "colored music." The kids got hip, but as long as those stations had to stay "underground," that music wasn't gonna catch on with the masses. Presley made it acceptable.

And, yes — Jordan was one of the best. But not the best.

[henslee]

45. Sorry, but Jordan was the best... and personally,I don't really like him.

But he was the best. No one better. Oscar Robertson comes close, damn close. No one who knows ball will dispute this.

[mvd]

24. The voice itself is seminal IMO

And he put it to a lot of great pop music. About the only thing he doesn't sing best is Christmas music.

[Nikia]

25. According to my prof in my music class for non majors

Elvis brought real American music to mainstream white American culture. Before that, real American music had been confined to blacks and poor whites. By real American music, he meant music that originated in American folk culture.

[DanCa]

31. True Elvis did introduced blues to main stream america.

Check out Big Mama Thorton's hound dog, than listen to Buddy Guy's Big Boss Man, than listen to Elvis sing these same songs. . I can understand why people like and adore Elvis now can someone please explain to me Toby Keith and Eminem?

[Left Is Write]

26. Because he was ELVIS! That's all you really need to know...

he had that certain indefinable something that made him larger than life and more than everyone and everything else. It was the Elvis Mystique.

[southlandshari]

28. You're kidding, right?

Ok, so that's not really Elvis. There are some pretty good impersonators out there like Bobby Joe - really good ones like Forrest, of course. Either way, I'm pretty sure you are only bashing Elvis - and Bobby Joe - because they are from the South. Damn blue state librul elitist.

:eyes:

























:P

[Taverner]

46. But Elvis wasn't from the South

He was from Hamtramack, MI - he told me himself!

[ForrestGump]

29. Already kinda said my bit on this a little while ago...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=105&topic_id=4665843#4666608

Jerry Lee, Buddy Holly, Little Richard, and the others were important but none had the influence that Elvis had...all influenced, for example, the Beatles, but Elvis was the one who influenced more than any other single performer. He also influenced Buddy Holly -- he provoked him to change from being a country singer to rock-pop -- by the way.

It's become fashionable to downplay (or totally dismiss) Elvis' impact, his musical legacy, and his talent as a (largely self-produced) performer. It's an erroneous trend. If you really want to get a visual sense of what he was like, by comparison to what was there before him, watch the entire second Milton Berle appearance of 1956...we're jaded today, but seeing the entire show (ads and all) really brings it home...his presence is electrifying.

Elvis hated the 'King' term, but he stands head and shoulders above all others in vying for it...people can say stupid stuff like "Johnny Cash is the true King of Rock 'n' Roll" if they want (and I knew and loved Johnny's music long before I even knew who Elvis was), but they should just realize that they're revealing an embarrassing lack of knowledge about what really happened in the '50s and after.

And those who maintain Elvis was no good for anything post-Sun, including John Lennon, don't know what they're talking about.

Elvis also, as Greil Marcus maintained, changed not just musical history, but world history.

All this apart from his rather phenomenal stage presence, vocal range, and eclectic musical influences and abilities...

[Taverner]

43. Do you have the Milton Berle show on tape?

I'd love to see it - ads anda ll

[DanCa]

30. Consider the time

plus he had a good sounding voice when he was younger. I still think that there are other singers who have more ability but I think you have to consider the complete package. PS I was at an actual Elvis concert. My mom has a picture of me at the concert with her when I was a baby. Is that why my middle name is just the intital E?

[RedG1]

32. easy answer...White Soul...

he took 'black' identified blues tunes and brought them into Pop/mainstream

[ForrestGump]

34. Not that easy, though

What he REALLY did was meld black blues, black gospel, white gospel, white country, and pop (especially the Dean Martin type and also Neapolitan opera-style influences like Lanza and Caruso) and turn out something different from all of the above. The result was also fundamentally different than those of his earliest peers, to a degree (typically more blues soulfulness and gospel than was present in most of his contemporaries' pioneering work -- Ray Charles is the only one I'd say started with basically the same ingredients). Some of his tremendous personal charisma -- ask anyone who knew him or met him about that, because it was as obvious and natural as his onstage charisma -- also managed to sneak into sound recordings.

[johnnie]

37. Hey dude

Have you seen "Elvis by the Presleys" yet? The full version. If you haven't you have to get it, it's pretty good.
The have some extra footage of the karate film they were making, plus a few other pretty cool things.

[ForrestGump]

39. Aloha, brah

I haven't seen the full version, but I'll have to remedy that, by the sound of it. I don't think much of Priscilla's editorializing (mostly 'cos some of it is plainly reinventing the truth yet again) or the slant of some of it, but -- in a world where any moderately interested person already has the footage promised in these "never-before-seen-footage" extravaganzas -- I was pretty nicely surprised by some of the cool home movies and stuff of Elvis.

Nice!

[johnnie]

40. Running time is over 4 hours

Also a great narrative by Jerry about the Nixon thingie.

[jus_the_facts]

41. In my opinion he was one of the most beautiful men to EVA walk the planet

...those looks...that talent...a complete and total package that just melted panties OFF!! :9 :9