Got myself in big trouble last night. Out with a couple couples,

[mr_hat]

the husbands of which are unquestioning repubs. I usually -- no, I've always in the past -- managed to remain civil.

Last night for some reason, though, I was loaded for elephant. I got real ugly and real insistant. The war, the economy, the press, labor, the fundies, the environment, social security, our global reputation, fascism...

One of the guys has made a killing in shorting the dollar against the euro. When I got on him for that, that was it. The whole thing blew up.

I'm embarrassed to have ruined what should have been a pleasant evening out. But damn... It's all RIGHT THERE though; right up in my craw. It's come down to us vs. them at the friendship, even family level.

So here I sit, feeling guilty and ashamed. Thank you, Dubya, for being a uniter.

[BrklynLiberal]

1. You did the right thing! He's getting rich on the failing US economy!!

Nice patriotism!!!! Hypocrite!!!

"One of the guys has made a killing in shorting the dollar against the euro. When I got on him for that, that was it. The whole thing blew up."

[seabeyond]

2. i am with you, i am like htat mr hat

just a normal gal, living a normal life, and i am not fit to be in public. my husband understand., but i am just not............

and those that cant be empathitic, fuck it. this is simply where i am right now

so huggin to you in the guilt you feel, give yourself a break. enjoy this bee u tee full day

[alittlelark]

3. I've done something similar.....

In a few days or weeks you will have lost any regrets you are now feeling (99% anyway).:evilgrin:

[MuseRider]

4. Sometimes you just have to blow.

I jumped the piccolo player in our symphony recently, on stage right before a concert. Man did I feel like a jerk but she hates Bush** but voted for him because she just does not trust the Democrats. Why? She does not know why. I apologized to her the next rehearsal. It was the second time I have totally lost my cool. I hate when that happens.

[1monster]

12. It's got to be some kind of mind control. I have a neighbor who hates

what is going on in this country and can even talk about it almost intellgently in years there are no elections. But bring on an election year and she votes republican even though she hates Jebbie Bush and doesn't much care for Georgie.

It's like that blind Pepsi/Coke taste test where people choose Pepsi when they don't know which is which, but choose Coke when they can see the label...

:shrug:

[MuseRider]

18. I tend to agree with that.

Often it just makes no sense. I have another friend in the orchestra, a good and kind woman, who was stunned when she found out that I not only did not like but loathed "her Georgie." :puke: She offered to take me to lunch and educate me on the ways that he was the perfect President and a glorious human being (her words). I declined and she pressed me, almost like she was "witnessing". :scared: It was scary.

[bluestateguy]

5. Hm

It is getting harder to maintain friendships accross the aisle. Not impossible, but harder. Also, I find it increasingly harder to watch movies and TV shows that star Republican actors. Also, when I was looking for a new apartment to move into, I actually looked to see how that precinct voted in the last election. I just would rather live somewhere where the people share my values.

[Upfront]

20. My God

I thought I was along. Ahhhhhh

[medeak]

6. well at least share with us

how he made a killing shorting the dollar..

I have no loyalties anymore

[mr_hat]

9. He sits at home and trades stocks and currency futures. Also his wife, >

(much more moderate than he) sold her company to an English company.

Part of the purchase price was in stock. She took far more stock than dollars, and because the stock is valued in euros, it's increased, what? Close to 50% in the past year?

[medeak]

11. you've just given me a brilliant idea

thanks for the light bulb moment!

[skygazer]

7. Sucks, doesn't it?

The choices all seem to be wrong - to keep one's mouth shut seems to be condoning all this crap and yet it seems wrong to disrupt a social engagement by stating one's opinion.

I remember when I was a kid growing up during the Vietnam war. My father was and is a staunch conservative, one of his sisters was more of a liberal Dem, another sister was a card carrying Communist and his other sister and his mother were sort of middle of the road - conservative on some issues but against the war.

Family gatherings were full of heated political discussions BUT they never degenerated the way I see them doing so now. They all disagreed but they still respected each other's opinions. No more. My oldest daughter, a Bush supporter, has not spoken to me since Christmas - I'm not sure why but I think because of my politics. My father and I struggle to maintain a relationship while still holding onto our views. I've severed friendships because of Bush.

It's sad and it's frustrating. I have no easy answers and wonder how long these divisions will be there and how badly they will fracture this country and the people in it. :cry:

[fluffernutter]

8. stuff like that makes friendships hard.

how are you expected to keep it inside every time you see them?

sorry your evening was ruined though.

[mahina]

16. It seems like it's tougher the closer we are to them.

My neighbors on one side are fundie Christians but not hypocritical- they are really kind, really good people who are just deluded and decieved.
I truly believe that when they come around and they eventually will, the backlash against the right will be permanent. They have been lied to and no one likes that once they get over the shame.

You did what we all have to do. If we do it right we will change the country, but it is a decentralized action. We CANNOT wait for the election, wait for the party, wait for the change to happen through the media. Conversations like the one you had, held daily in all our lives, conducted with compassion and the unwavering intent to bring them across eventually, will change the country.

If the country is 50/50 we each have to bring one R over to our way of thinking.

Asking questions is helpful. People who identify themselves as conservatives and think about it for one second would have a hell of a time explaining how the idiot king's actions match up with their ideas. ("How exactly is he conservative? How does taking the country into 5 trillion dollars in debt from a 5 trillion dollar surplus, not counting the war, fit with your beliefs? etc")

I read a quote in the Nation , sorry can't remember who said it, about Henry Waxman. He said if you want to argue with him you'd better bring your lunch because he will not let you go. Our new model!

You did the right thing, though it will get easier with time to be persuasive. Never give up!

[DS1]

10. I almost got into a fist fight with a British guy at my favorite Chinese

place. Bush came on tv, I said something, he said something back, I said something else about Bush fucking everything up, he said something which implied that the President is really a weak position and if I'd pay attention I'd realize that it's Congress that does all the policy making, then I blamed everything on the last 8 years of a Republican Congress fucking everything up - and in doing so - absolving Clinton of any form of guilt - at which point he flew into a such a rage his wife had to take him home. Probably to be tied up and spanked with a leather riding crop.

[hickman1937]

13. Maybe you did it on purpose.

How pleasant can an evening be when your required to put your values and beliefs in limbo to get along. Did these people have real value to you, or were they wasting your time?

[mr_hat]

15. You know, I feel a strong friendship with one of the four. >

One of the wives (a liberal, of course). But I am thankful to have social contacts at all. Out kids are all roughly the same ages, and we do share similar hopes and concerns for them.

I value friendship and social interaction. I especially like to maintain it across divides: the more challenging, the more rewarding, I've found.

But I am finding myself becoming that dichotomous entity that the right-wing echo chamber so loves to throw out there: the intollerant liberal.

I don't like it, Sam I Am.

[Salviati]

22. Who says we have to be tolerant?

I for one am sick of being told that I need to be tolerant of the willfully ignorant. I refuse to tolerate lies and hatred, and these days that means that I refuse to tolerate Republicans. You hear me, all you hateful, lying, intellectually lazy republicans out there! I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore! Fuck the republicans and their "Liberals have to be tolerant of all positions" bullshit, it's just as harmful as the "liberal media" crap they try and pull. I'm not going to be tolerant of your ideas, because they're in general wrong, and often times have already been shown not to work. If you want a group thats been "divorced from reality" all you need to do is take a visit to your local GOP headquarters, I can guarantee it's full of people who are either lying or deluded, and I'm putting these pinheads on notice, I'm not taking their guff anymore!

[stepnw1f]

14. I Understand It's Hard

I live with my brother who voted for Bush. I now can not look him in the eye. He tries talking to me, but it's going to make a difference. His stance on people around him is: "Everyone for himself".

Families, nevermind friendships, do not exist because of that atitude.

[WorseBeforeBetter]

17. Don't beat yourself up...you know they aren't.

I've lost a couple of friendships over the past year because of politics. One gf in particular was actually proud when I half-jokingly referred to her as a fascist. "Just like my old man" she replied. She was bragging about family members living in gated communities, and when I warned that "gates come down," she was speechless. I laid into her when she said that one good thing about the war is that her sister's business is doing well. That's not something you say to someone (me) whose brother has been to the desert twice and whose sister-in-law's brother is in Baghdad now. When I asked about her 12-year old and whether he'd pursue a career in the military ("they need all the warm bodies they can get"), that was pretty much the final nail in the coffin. It stuck in my craw for a while too, but good riddance I say...

[Upfront]

19. Screw Um!!!!1111

I lost a brother over this stuff. You did well!

[khashka]

21. Don't be ashamed

They can say what they think but you can't? Maybe the only way things will change is if people like you and me do speak up.

So don't feel guilty or ashamed: sometimes things need to be said.

Khash.

[Walt Starr]

23. I simply cannot be friendly with Republicans

Once I know a person's politics, the relationship must change. I don't bring up politics ever when in a social setting. Oncec I find out somebody supports the evil Busheviks, I can no longer respect them nor can I be their friend. They automatically become an enemy for life.