Advice Needed... How Can I Hate More?

[arwalden]

Obviously queers can't find equality in the courts or at the ballot box, so maybe we can just resolve to HATE the other side more than they hate us.

So... I'm trying to hate them more than they hate me and the rest of my queer brothers and sisters... but I just don't feel like I'm doing all I can do.

The solution is simple: I NEED MORE HATE. But, what can I do to hate them more?

Do they even care? Why is it that THEIR hatred can have the full force of the law, but my hatred seems to be impotent? I'm feeling it... but it has no effect on them. It makes no difference in my life or their life.

What must I do?? What must the level be for my hatred to hurt them in the same way that theirs hurts me?

-- Allen*

(*Who is still trying to figure out what it is about my legal rights that interferes with their happiness so much.)

[southernlad]

1. Don't hate more

Just show them more love. Show them the wrongness in their lives. Don't base your life on hating others, how horrible that must be. I couldn't imagine waking up every morning with my only goal being to spread hate (that's why I'm a Democrat).

[arwalden]

5. Nope... Can't Do That.

As long as I'm relegated to being a 2nd class citizen I can't show them more love. I only have a dozen cheeks to turn. The "wrongness" you and I perceive is their fucking RELIGION, it's all GOOD to them. It's ordained by their deity. I'm afraid that no amount of patience and education efforts will change their hatred.

-- Allen

[Misunderestimator]

14. Show them more love? *Ahem*

Nope... not gonna do it. How horrible it must be to give such advice without understanding the oppression. It's not about "basing life on hating others" it's about a lifetime and generations before us that have worked to get to where we were before yesterday. Today has brought us back to a place where we see THEIR hatred for US in the blazing light of day, no more hidden in the deep shadows... it is now condoned to hate us. How does one love in all that hate?

[arwalden]

17. Where Did The Extra 25% Come From?

Our own party... that's where.

We're returning to 1950's where men and women could be arrested for crimes against nature and indecency and sodomy.

-- Allen

[Misunderestimator]

22. The extra 25% came from those who were living in the shadows

before, pretending to accept us. Now they know that they are really part of the majority so they've come out of their hidey-holes to hate us freely.

Just like Democrats have used Afro-Americans for decades now to win political races, but do nothing for them after they are in power, Democrats have now turned their backs on us.

Mark my words... as soon as Bush can appoint another SC justice, it will be illegal in this country to be gay.

[Cyndee_Lou_Who]

2. Hang in there, Allen!!

You can't hate that way because you are a decent person... and they are not. Genetics. Don't try to hate. I am sympathetic to your cause and sickened by their hate. Just remember, you have friends and support.

[President Jesus]

3. work to dig up sex scandals on any puke

it's the ONLY thing that turns their culture waring base off. it's sleazy and muddy, but dammit, it does work. Ask Newt, Livingston, Jack Ryan, or any IL republican. Over the past 12 years, sex scndals are the only things that cause them to eat their own.


PS it's also why Rudy has NO future in today's political environment.

[NoSheep]

6. Let's start wearing those yellow LIVESTRONG bracelets blackened

with a sharpie as a protest and sign of Solidarity!!!!

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

4. Maybe we can run around with GOD HATES FRED PHELPS signs

and set a monument in a park when Jesse Helms dies stating he is still rotting in hell.

[Blue-Jay]

7. "rotting in hell"?

Shit, they probably gave that old bastard a job instead.

[NoSheep]

8. Can you help pass this idea along. I can't post a new thread yet

PLEEEEZE:kick:

The idea above about the LIVESTRONG bracelet

[kayell]

15. Sign me up! We don't have to look like the Phelps clan do we? Ewwww.

[Francesca]

9. I wish I could say something to make you feel better..

I am at a total loss... I knew this country had a large percentage of ignorant, hateful and backwards people but I never imagined till today how many of them their are..

[arwalden]

11. DO THE MATH!! Upwards Of 75% Supported ANTI-Gay Ballot Initiatives...

and about 50% of the country is Republican.

WHERE DO THE OTHER 25% COME FROM???????????????

-- Allen

P.S. Thanks, Francesca :hi:

[Maddy McCall]

27. Allen, I know it is little consolation...

but I am a Mississippian who voted NO on the Gay Marriage Initiative.

I was thinking of DUers like you, Dookus, and Rowdyboy--and NSMA and Misunderestimator, when I marked my ballot.

:loveya:

[arwalden]

28. Loveya Back!

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

31. thanks,J

:loveya:

[Maddy McCall]

37. You, too, sweetie.

I wish we could talk on the phone. I have Rowdy's phone number, too, and yours...but they are stuck in my PM folder, which I cannot access.

Hugs and kisses your way. Hope all is well. :loveya:

[w13rd0]

10. I'm doing pretty well with it...

...I'm in a position where I can shoot off my mouth without much fear of reprisal. If I know the person with whom I'm speaking is a Republican, I will speak to them with dripping sarcasm and obvious disdain. And then I'll let them know that I'm ganking them on my billing so I can afford to be a Repbulican. And they'll STFU and accept it.

[DELUSIONAL]

12. Be careful out there

I feel like we are going back in time but this time the gays are the blacks and it might be open season on gays.

My dearest friends in the world have been together for over 20 years -- longer than most hetero marriages. I have seen the unreasonable and illogical hatred directed at them for no other reason than they are gay.

My friend says that cops have been very brutal and have over reacted in simple traffic stops (broken tail light) -- and this seems to be a common story from gays.

The world is a richer place because there are gays brave enough to acknowledge who they are.

[4morewars]

13. "Great men cultivate love,

only little men cherish a spirit of hatred."

bush* is a little man, A.R. Walden is not.

[arwalden]

16. Thanks For The Kind Words

... but the sentiment seems futile when put into practice.

Think of the noisy neighbors with the garage band who keep the little old lady awake at night. They are loud, but she is quiet. Shall she concentrate on being MORE QUIET in order to counter their loudness?

Whatever humanitarian love someone might choose to demonstrate for these knuckledraggers will never have the desired effect. They will always hate because their deity commands it.

-- Allen

[kayell]

18. I'm not sure it's possible, but we'll probably find out in the next few

years. Everytime I think they've reached the limit, I find out I'm wrong again.

[NoSheep]

19. Allen...I have hatred too. It has controlled the last 4 years of my life.

I can't let it anymore. It incapcitates me and makes me impotent. I have to get smarter...They are geniuses at their stupidity. Don't be stupid about your genius. Tap it. Use it for change. That's my plan. We are all so sad today. I'm numb to my hatred today.

[newsguyatl]

20. for the first time in my liffe

i don't feel "american" anymore.

i hate my country and everything it stands for.

my government doesn't represent me, nor does it protect me.

i no longer have any allegiance to america.

the question now, is where do i go from here? where do any of us go from here?

the first step is to face reality, and if last night wasn't a slap in the face to us, the only thing that would be is when they begin to come after us.

...and when they do, i fear few will be there to speak up.

[arwalden]

21. See Inside...

:hug:

[newsguyatl]

23. ?

[arwalden]

24. That's Just...

... a little hug icon for ya. Our feelings about being American or feeling like we even belong in this country are nearly identical. Thanks for checking in!!

-- Allen

[Sabriel]

29. "I fear my country AND I fear my government"

Kinda catchy, hey? It's my new bumpersticker, as soon as it arrives.

[starroute]

42. I feel more American than I ever have in my life

Because I know that people like us are the only remaining protectors of American values.

In the 50's and 60's, they called us un-American and we tended to agree they were right. We saw ourselves as part of a world community, valued peace more than patriotism and equality more than superiority, and harbored grave doubts about the worth of capitalism and the nuclear family. Much as we hated the war-mongering, racist bastards we were fighting, they did seem to have some sort of lock on Americanism that we didn't.

But they've abandoned all that. They're the traitors now, they're the ones who are undermining American values and the American family, they're the ones who are out to destroy democracy.

Meanwhile, we've become the last true Americans -- the heirs of Jefferson and Lincoln, of the stirring words of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, of the great American traditions of freedom and self-government.

It might even be time to haul out that sorely abused old word, "un-American," and apply it to all the enemies of democracy, the exponents of empire, the covert fascists, and the worms who crawl in the dark of government secrecy. Think about it -- wouldn't it feel ***good*** to be able to call Bush un-American in public?

[ze_dscherman]

25. Don't waste your energy on hating them

What about some well directed rage instead?

[arwalden]

26. I'm Afraid Of What I'm Capable Of

Back to the wall...
Cornered wounded animal...
Fear and rage...
You never know what someone else might do if pushed hard enough.

-- Allen

[ze_dscherman]

30. Take some time

Anger is so much energy, it can drive you to archieve amazing things, but also to make very stupid decisions. Like steam in some engine ...

[arwalden]

33. Some Of It Comes From A Sense Of BETRAYAL...

Betrayed by our very own! Numbers don't lie. How sick is that?

-- Allen

[ze_dscherman]

35. Would like to keep up the discussion ...

... but it's getting late in my timezone (UTC+1), and last night I slept too little, so I'm very, very tired.

Only thing I can tell is, although very distant from the U.S., I feel very angry and very dissapointed right now. Hard to imagine how it would feel to be in the middle of it.

Until another day, a hetero-homo :hug:

[sangh0]

32. Go to a NASCAR race in drag

and walk around asking everyone you see "So where's the starting line?"

[KinkyDem]

34. A little story

When I was 18, after spending a year on the streets, I was invited to a "Mens gathering" at a commune in Southern Va. There I met several hundred men, gathered together to help each other learn a little more about what exactly it means to be "A Man".

There, I met one of the most amazing people I have ever met, a man named Gabby. He lived and worked on The Short Mountain Sanctuary producing a magazine called The Radical Faerie Digest. He invited me to visit him and his friends at the sanctuary.

A week later I was on the road, hitch hiking my way to Tenesee. There, I spent ten days living and laughing with a great group of men, and even a few women. All of them were gay. I spent days helping with the goats, cleaning up, exploring the land and learning a little bit about what it means to be brave.

One afternoon, all of us headed down the mountain to a used clothes shop so "The Boys" could go shopping for new drag clothes. I wasn't in the market for womens clothes so I opted out and went and got a coke and sat outside and watched these men, some big burley, beardded men sifting thru a mound of old recycled clothing, all originaly womens. Sitting there, across the street, anonymouse to passers by, unatached to the mayhem going on in that small used clothing store in that small poe-dunk town in Tenesee, I wathced as these men giggled like little girls and played in the piles of dresses and gowns as the passers by scoffed, looked disgusted and jeered.

Not one of those men so much as looked up to notice. Not one of them made an ugly face at any of those people.

That day I learned what it means to be brave. To stand up and to be who and what you are regardless of those who stare and jeer and call ugly names. They all new, those men, that the towns people were out there, casting their judgment and ugly glances, but did not react, did not return the scorn, did not so much as acknowledge their existance.

I was never questioned. I was never confronted. I was never judged. I was not when I got there, but I was when I left, a straight man. When I got there, I was simply a boy.

I say this with all sinceriety, I was taught what it means to be a man by a group of gay men, living in the mountains of Tenessee that summer. Please. I know what you face. I've faced it too, if by nothing else by proxie.

Please, remember, that not all straight people hate you. There are many of us who are the walking wounded today, speachless and despondant tha so much hate exists in the world today. I have more friends than I can count who this effects.

Please, please I beg you, don't become wha they are.

[sangh0]

36. That was wonderful

thanks for that

[Pithlet]

38. I was not part of that 25%

I am still sickened and angered and ashamed of my country. We seem to be going back wards. I've already been told that my liberal ideals are considered obsolete, and that they aren't what the country wants, and Bush being elected is proof of that. It's not liberal ideals. It's about being decent. I feel hatred right now, too. Not just for the die hard conservative base, but for every "undecided" who stood at the voting machine and gave in to the fear mongering and "moral values", and threw away equal rights for others. For every idiot who voted against their own self interests in the process. I'm just disgusted.

[crispini]

39. Read this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=16930&mesg_id=16930

[Jack Schitt]

40. You wanna hate more?

Turn into a Republican. That's the only way you can gain pure hate.

[trof]

41. Chug a case of Tobasco.

Chase with a dozen habaneros.
Munch on 6 razor blades.
Floss with barbed wire
(or 'bob war', depending on your location)
Get some wounds.
Self-flagellate, whatever.
Rub salt into them.
Take your dic...no, nevermind.
That's TOO extreme.
HATE!

[HEyHEY]

43. Ask the experts

http://www.rnc.org/

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

44. Allen I'm still trying to figure out what it is about your

legal rights that interferes with their lives so much, too.

I say LET gays get married and be miserable like the rest of us, dammit!

As for hating more, I'm right there with you. Damn we've been on the same wavelength all day, you know that?

HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE

I HATE HOMOPHOBES AND I HATE FUNDIES AND I ESPECIALLY HATE HOMOPHOBIC FUNDIES.

GRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!

HATE MORE! HATE MORE! HATE MORE!

(They get people in office who share their hate and then they get to legislate it, that's the short answer to your first question.)

[Politicub]

45. Randi Rhodes gaves good advice today

Open your window or roll down the window of your car and yell, "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more!"

I don't know how you can hate more, but maybe you can channel your current level of anger into constructive action.

I'm queer too, and I was moaning and complaining all morning about Kerry's defeat and concession. But then someone posted a note from Howard Dean which said that more people voted AGAINST Bush than any sitting president.

That woke me up. And on the way home I listed to Randi Rhodes, and her call to action to shake depression and fear and replace it with being pissed.

So I don't know if I helped. But even with all of this, I worry about my partner. We depend on my domestic partner benefits for his health insurance The GOP, the establishment of today, wants nothing more to strip me of that right.

They can try, and may even succeed, but I refuse to go down without a fight.

:hug:

[samplegirl]

46. Maybe when Jeb runs

He'll claim to be out of the closet and they can use the Gay voters
for 4 more years!!!!!