Bill Would Allow Arrests For No Reason In Public Place

[BEYOND TREASON]

A bill on Gov. Bob Taft's desk right now is drawing a lot of criticism, NewsChannel5 reported.

One state representative said it resembles Gestapo-style tactics of government, and there could be changes coming on the streets of Ohio's small towns and big cities.

The Ohio Patriot Act has made it to the Taft's desk, and with the stroke of a pen, it would most likely become the toughest terrorism bill in the country. The lengthy piece of legislation would let police arrest people in public places who will not give their names, address and birth dates, even if they are not doing anything wrong.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/wews/3133362;_ylt=ArGReUW1ECq12DeewBwxK6gDW7oF;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

Has this been posted on here?

[babylonsister]

1. I saw it yesterday, but am sure not everyone did.

It's worth a repeat, especially for Ohioans who might not be aware of how 'concerned' Taft is.

[napi21]

2. Other than stupidity, WHY is Ohio doing this?

What has been happeneing in Ohio that prompted the legislators to want something like this?

With all laws, wether you agree with them or not, there's always something they're trying to fix.

[UrbScotty]

5. OHIO isn't doing this. Crazed zealots in the state government are.

Let's try not to make any sweeping generalizations.

[napi21]

12. OK, I didn't phrase that right. Why aare the crazed zealots in Ohio

doing this?

I wasn't blaming every resident of Ohio, and if that's what you understood, then I apologize.

As crazy as I think Shrub is, even HE claims to have some reason for asking for the spying, and the BS in the PA...weird as those reasons my be.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

79. Because they can.

[FighttheFuture]

47. Guess when the vote is fixed again in 2006/08, they will need...

this to quell the riots that are bound to start. At this point, only a kool-aid slurping, brain-dead pinhead would think the rethuglicans would win now! Yet, in Ohio, they for certain will. Hence, time to set in motion the "laws" allowing them to crack down.

I think the next bill will simply allow them to shoot citizens dead in the street, no questions asked! If you think I'm kidding... think again!

[UrbScotty]

3. If THIS isn't unconstitutional, WTF is?!?!?!?!?! (nt)

[C_U_L8R]

4. Clearly Unconstitutional

It's sponsors must be idiots... or nazis
...or both

I hate idiot nazis

[rpgamerd00d]

7. I thought it was "I hate Illinois Nazis" ?

Sorry, Blues Brothers reference.

:)

[C_U_L8R]

14. Illinois Nazis .. Ohio Nazis

White House Nazis

Hate em all



(yes it was BB riff :-)

[Tamarin]

6. How long will it be until they round up all the people with

arab-sounding names and put them in concentration camps?

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

9. How long will it take

for cops to "go deaf" during a peace demonstration and arrest everyone there?

[Pab Sungenis]

34. One way around that.

Protesters just wear T-Shirts with their name and birthdate on it, and hand out little slips of paper with all the information if the cops come near them.

Be handy to do as they gather to burn Bob Taft in effigy.

[insane_cratic_gal]

11. NM just arabs what about americans ?

People like us who don't agree with them.

[madeline_con]

19. Some Americans are also Arabs. eom

[insane_cratic_gal]

8. The only way the Recrooks

can retain power is by engaging in fascists behavior and actions, and they know it. Being drunk on power and willing to destroy the ideas of America to do it.

Pretty scary stuff

[Atmashine]

10. Verification?

What are they going to do, look you up in the phone book and hospital records to see if your fibbing?

[durablend]

13. Diebold records!

They'll rig the machines to record (D) votes as (R), and alert the police at the same time (to round up the obvious anti American terrorist scum)

[WhereThereIsFire]

29. This IS what happened

According to sources "in the know" you've hit the nail on the head with what happened in 2000 and 2004 in both FL and OH (both years) and in other states as well ... sources in TN say that the 2000 election was rigged this way in their state. It is a simple computer routine ... a computer savvy 6-year old could write it.

[wryter2000]

68. Welcome to DU

:hi:

[HereSince1628]

15. Insecurity...is it the cognative mother of social motivation and

actualization, and politics?

It is a part of the human condition, and we need to understand it.

When presented with something that you and I percieves as risky we try to bring that thing "under control" constrain it, or somehow reduce insecurity about it by providing a sense of management of the risk.

Everyone including the left has this aspect to their personality. Conservative personalities really do seem not only to be very sensitive to very different anxieties, but they also seem to rely on very different solutions for managing insecurity.

On a qualitative level we are different mostly in what we view as creating insecurity and the way we view the management techniques impact on insecurity.

The left sees pollution and global warming as a threat, we seek government and international protection from the polluting ways of industries, communities, and individuals.

The current flock of republicans fear people who don't believe as they do, look like them, people who think in complex and abstract rather than simple terms like them, or respect the same authorities as them. They construct things like the Patriot Act to manage their insecurity. They fear weakness and insist on global hegemony in military and economic domains as the means to be secure.

We fear the invocation of a police state, the loss of civil rights, we fear the Patriot Act, we want to manage that risk by having 16 provisions of the Act struck. We fear the role of empire and the inevitable conflicts maintaining hegemony must bring. They fear bad outcomes and use them to justify the bad means which we fear. They fear paying taxes for public institutions thus reducing their profits, we fear their profits stripping support from institutions we see as necessary.

What sort of difference does understanding politics as the management of insecurity mean to progressives?

We do not need to be _strong on the military_,we do not to be bullyingly tough on the world. What we need to do is to understand and apply solutions that reduce insecurity. As much as we reduce insecurity we gain support for the methods we propose for managing it.

[Voltaire99]

78. The task facing good Americans today...

...is not far from that facing good Germans in the early 20th century: how do you defuse appalling primal emotions when they become institutionalized throughout society and government?

As Claude Lanzmann demonstrated in Shoah, those emotions never really are eliminated. They remain to fester even when they no longer power the state. The best, perhaps, to be hoped for is to decouple those energies from the political apparatus that uses them as fuel. In other words, get a new government--one that resists, and even dares to try to improve, its population's worst instincts. Today we have the direct opposite in a state that feasts upon the worst in people, and this is why GOP-lite politics will make no improvement whatever in America's future. We need profound, positive change.

I believe your explanation--insecurity driving reactionary policies--is a good one, and useful as far as it goes.

Insecurity alone doesn't explain rising totalitarianism. Another powerful motivator is hatred and its tribal comforts. Religious intolerance, class animosities, even plain blood lust are manifest in the American right wing today, notably with the native vengeful puritanism that lies not far beneath the surface.

[sinkingfeeling]

16. I spent the first 29 years of my life in Ohio, but if this becomes law,

I will not return. My 40th. class reunion is in June, but I will not go there (even if the Buckeyes are going for another championship).

[PegDAC]

75. I have not seen

ANYthing in the Ohio newspapers I follow online about this. I just hope that sanity prevails. My 35th high school reunion is in 2006, and I want to be able to go home without fearing for my freedom. I will spread the word on this to my classmates.

[Lorien]

77. Spent the first 24 years in Columbus too-and I feel the same way

The Ohio of today doesn't resemble the state I grew up in-but neither does the America of today...

[Gronk Groks]

17. This can't be legal in the United States of America...

...however if we are now the American Empire, then anything is legal and we are nothing more than slaves.

Didn't we have a Civil War over slavery????

[pitohui]

54. of course it is legal, has been for years

i've never heard of it being enforced anywhere but nevada and not usually even there, but certainly it's legal

it is not that intrusive for you to be expected to know your own name and identity, if you don't have this information or don't care to share it, it seems reasonable that there's something hinky going on

i don't like it, but to compare a visit to vegas to a life trapped in slavery just makes us look ridiculous

[annabanana]

59. guilty until proven innocent... why of course

Why didn't I think of that?:sarcasm:

[Eric J in MN]

18. The Supreme Court ruled on this a few years ago. Anyone

remember what they said?

[madeline_con]

21. I found an article at CNN.....

Assessing the Supreme Court's ruling on giving ID to police
Michael C. Dorf
FindLaw Columnist
Special to CNN.com
Thursday, June 24, 2004 Posted: 3:57 PM EDT (



FindLaw) -- In Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the conviction of Larry Dudley Hiibel.

Hiibel had violated a Nevada statute that requires persons temporarily detained on "reasonable suspicion" of criminal activity to identify themselves to a police officer.

Hiibel -- who claimed he had done nothing wrong and was simply the victim of mistaken identity -- believed he had no obligation to tell the officer his name.

But the Court found that neither Hiibel's Fourth Amendment right against unreasonable searches and seizures, nor his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination, was violated. (The high court's ruling)

http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/06/24/dorf.police.id/

[Eric J in MN]

26. So the Supreme Court said if there is "reasonable suspicion"

of criminal activity then a person has to give identification.

They haven't said the police can demand identification whenever they want.

[lonestarnot]

52. resonable suspicion less lower standard than probable cause?

[Eric J in MN]

20. Pretty women will be the subject of cops demanding their addresses

and birthdates.

[bvar22]

22. Republican Party Operatives

Republican Party Operatives
Keeping the Homeland Secure in Ohio!








OOPS!
Wrong Pic.
My Bad.
Same difference.

[LunaC]

23. "Your papers please"

1930's Germany all over again. Frightening.

[Eric J in MN]

27. Does that expression come from the Nazis or the Soviets?

nt

[LunaC]

31. Nazis

Recently saw the old Michael Douglas movie "Shining Through" and there was a scene where the Nazi officer asked Melanie Griffith for her "papers". They were forged and she was freaking out over the scrutiny but passed muster and continued her espionage activities.

It's definitely a phrase from war-time Germany where weeding out the citizens was of great importance to the Gestapo.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

32. Reason #930,573,257 why the Nazis were more evil than the Soviets.

Unbeliavably, stating that fact makes some people angry.

[thefool_wa]

46. WAY worse than the soviets.

The holocaust alone gives them #1 with a bullet (sorry, bad taste, but I'm not going to edit it out)

Where can I find the other 930,573,256 reasons?

[Dunvegan]

24. This is bald-faced totalatarianism...

...we cannot allow this to stand.

[frazzledmom]

25. So now states are creating their own "Patriot Acts"

Unbelievable.

[Ezlivin]

28. Solution: Just stay in the government-provided detention centers

They have A/C and some great video games, mostly first-person shooters. And it's real easy to see through the chain link fence; you can even see the sun set on America.

[EC]

30. Couldn't you just act like a ditz and ask, "are you hitting on me?

why do you want my name and number? Then say you are going to report them for sexual harassment?"
:sarcasm:


It's unconstitutional, the people of Ohio should start filing suits against this...

[Eric J in MN]

39. In many cases, the cop WILL be hitting on the women he asks

for this information.

[EC]

58. Then I hope they are smart enough to sue or at least report them... n/t

[darkmaestro019]

61. or the men. (smirk) (nt)

[PegDAC]

76. OOOH!

Good idea!!

[derby378]

33. Burn, baby, burn

I think we should obtain copies of this Ohio "Patriot" Act and set them on fire at public gatherings across America.

Or at least run them through paper shredders.

[kath]

35. Read this:

Slouching Toward Kristallnacht
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/12/20/12819/467

(a DailyKos diary, from a thread in GD yesterday and the day before by "pirate smile" - don't know how to properly link to threads here)

[Higans]

81. Excelent

[Tiggeroshii]

36. So umm. How bout you all just start moving out of Ohio and come to Cali?

Wayy less corrupt government(though that doesn't take much), and much warmer here, too! :D

[EVDebs]

37. "Arrest the usual suspects", all Democrats and Greens of course

Is this what R's are all about ? Nonproductive morans.

[greiner3]

38. Screw my state of OH;

Damned robber barons and medival style government. I say 'Let 'em come. I'm ready for anything.'

[Rainscents]

40. Why haven't Ohioian people come out and protest against this?

If people sit back and do nothing, I blame part on people! People really do need to come out in full and demand they don't want this shit!

[madmom]

62. Why???

Because this is the first we've heard about it and we try to stay informed.

[ohtransplant]

41. I'll move when it's my decision.

We should stand and fight - import millions to Ohio to clog their municipal bldgs, courts and jails.

Hi agent Mike!:hi:

[Nothing Without Hope]

42. It's not TERRORISTS they want to round up, it's DISSIDENTS to their

fascist program. People like us who dare to show evidence of how they stole the election and break the law every day. They're just a bit ahead of the rest of the country in this Storm Trooper approach to non-Nazis, but not much, unfortunately.

Taft is one of the most corrupt people in the country, and that is saying something. How political leadership in Ohio, nice solid midwest Ohio, came to be like this baffles me. Yes, there are Bushie crazies and bigots everywhere, but not in the majority. I have to assume the people were looking the other way and it was a kind of creeping coup. I've read that Taft has an approval rating in the single digits by now. Of course, having one of the most efficient election-stealing setups in the country helped their criminal cause.

K & R - thanks for posting this very sad and awful news. Usually it's said that California leads trends in this country, but here the corrupt Ohio state leadership has stolen a march on what the Bushies want for all of us.

[Joe Chi Minh]

43. Thye've proved they can't be trusted not to use such

measures for the purposes of partisan intimidation. They are by nature partisan hoodlums (in a legal, not just a metaphorical sense).
The actions of their hoodlums during the presidential elections would have been scandalous in many a 3rd world country. An utter disgrace.

[donheld]

44. And the nazis cheer

:grr:

[LynneSin]

45. I hope he signs it!

He probably will. He's done in politics and if he signs it there will be a revolt in Ohio that'll oust every single fucking republican that supported this and bring Ohio back into the Blue.

Right now I hold no hope in Ohio voting out DeWine or not elected Blackwell as governor. They own the voting machines and the only way we can win is if the margin of victory is so wide that even diebold machines can't muster a win.

[H2O]

48. If he does

Then there will most likely not be any more elections. This would pave the way for the empire to rise.

"Once more, the Sith will rule the galaxy!" Emperor Palpatine

[abbiehoff]

64. The margin on the election reform vote was in the range

of 50 to 60 points on all four issues. Issue 2 was supposed to pass 65 Yes to 30 No. It in fact was defeated in approximately the same ratio 30 something Yes to 60 something No. The Diebold machines can create whatever outcome they want in spite of polls.

[ClintonTyree]

49. Looks like a little trip to Ohio is in order........

civil disobedience has always been a favorite of mine, dating back to the 60's. :hippie: I haven't been arrested in quite some time, maybe it's time to challenge a stupid, unconstitutional law like this? ;) This fucking law won't last past the first legal challenge. Even our current bunch of Conservative Supreme Court whores wouldn't uphold this shit. How fucking stupid. :eyes:

[PretzelWarrior]

50. "Four dead in O-HI-O" that state has had a mentality like that

for quite some time.

[lonestarnot]

51. Wouldn't federal law supersede here?

[Divine Discontent]

53. Good HEAVENS... what NEXT?

I'm in Ohio, and I never heard of this until I saw it on msnbc tonight. I pay attention to the news, and post often, it's just there's SO much going on constantly, no one can keep up with everything that these NAZI son of a bitches are up to. I will call the gov's office tomorrow.

Governor Bob Taft
30th Floor
77 South High Street
Columbus, Ohio 43215-6117

Phone [phone]

anyone can email him at this link:

http://governor.ohio.gov/contactinfopage.asp

[pitohui]

56. before you freak out

this has been law of the land in nevada for years & somehow people seem to feel fairly free, indeed i doubt anyone other than professional gamblers even read those notices abt how in nevada you must carry identification w. you at all times & be prepared to show it if asked by law enforcement

[Terre]

55. A bit late to the thread

and probably too late for you to edit, but shouldn't your title have said Bob would allow arrests, instead of Bill?

At first I thought the thread was going to be about what Bill Clinton would have allow(ed). I'm relieved that this isn't another rightwing lying spin.

[Divine Discontent]

57. cute!

but it's a bill that sits before the governor of our great state. I could see how it'd be confusing.

[Terre]

70. OH!!

DOH!  :rofl:

Do I feel like a numbnut.

It must be all this Holiday Smear from the WH that has my head spinning!

[Divine Discontent]

72. don't worry, his bullshit's got ALL our heads spinning! bless you N/T

[depakid]

60. As if Ohio is a terrorist target...

The state seems to be self-destructing quite well on its own.....

[DanCa]

63. You get what you voted for Ohio. (nt)

[abbiehoff]

65. Not necessarily

We get what Diebold wants us to have.

[DanCa]

67. My appologies to the democrats of ohio

However I do know far to many ohioians that voted for the chimp. The remark was aimed at them.

[rd_kent]

66. WOW! This is scary!!!

I'm sure the ACLU is all over this. The first person subjected to this travisty will take it all the way to the SCOTUS.

[Rocknrule]

69. Why don't they just rip up the Constitution and get it over with?

[stevietheman]

71. Ohio is clearly descending into fascism.

Luckily, I live in Kentucky with a nearly powerless governor, and I get to sit back and watch the scary goings-on in Ohio (while munching lots of popcorn, of course).

I am honestly unsure why the people of Ohio are not now up in arms over all this, plus all the election hijinks. I am amazed that violence against some of their politicians hasn't already commenced by now.

Ohio is falling apart. Hopefully, it is not a bellwether for the nation.

[Joey Liberal]

73. Republicans have declared war on America

The republicans want oil, money and a Theocracy. Everything and everyone else are mere distractions in their never ending war on America.

[PegDAC]

74. Vhere are your papers?

Ve must zee your papers. Carry your driver's license and birth certificate at all times. I was BORN in Ohio and am highly ashamed that the rethugs are pushing this. Welcome to Fascism.



}( :mad: :puke: :wtf: :argh: :grr: :nuke: :cry: :yoiks:

[sandyd921]

80. This and the establishment of a

theocracy in OH. This and taking away the people's right to free elections all fit with the the Christian Restoration Movement that Ken Blackwell is associated with and that is aiming to take the state of Ohio over. Talk about sliding toward facism! See this link at theocracywatch.org for a piece written by Bill Moyers: http://www.theocracywatch.org/ohio_patriot_pastors.htm

I don't live in Ohio, but I am very alarmed about the rapidity of the facist takeover there and what it portends for our country! We have to wake people up to what is happening!:scared:

[Maestro]

82. If they are not doing anything wrong,

but the authorities insist on asking them these questions, then this is some sort of racial profiling. How good is that? Might as well just bring out the brownshirts now! What a load of bovine excrement?