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2 Dems help stonewall WHIG investigation. Lost 23-25 :-(

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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 08:54 PM
Original message
2 Dems help stonewall WHIG investigation. Lost 23-25 :-(
Edited on Wed Nov-23-05 09:28 PM by katinmn
Just heard this from the "Backbone Campaign." http://backbonecampaign.org/blog.cfm?id=108

H. Res. 505, a Resolution of Inquiry into the White House Iraq Group (WHIG), was stonewalled in committee, losing 23 to 25. This bill, introduced by Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) and vigorously supported by Rep. Adam Smith (D-WA) who sits on the reviewing House International Relations Committee, was defeated by two votes.

Representatives Howard Berman (D-CA, 28th) and Eni Faleomavaega (American Samoa) both failed to attend today's meeting and vote. Rep. Berman's office made clear that he would not attend and did not support the resolution. This begs the question: What kind of Democrat would stifle investigation into this corrupt administration and deny the American people the opportunity to wrench the writing of history away from these traitorous ideologues? At least allow us to confirm or deny whether that label is appropriate. As for Rep. Faleomavaega, what is his office hiding by not being willing to even confirm or deny that he is in D.C. or not?

Republicans Jim Leach (R-IA) and Ron Paul (R-TX) supported the resolution.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Isn't it just disgusting that a few individuals (435 in the House and 100 in the Senate) who represent so many of us (300 million!) can get away with this? Why do we let them? Oh yeah. They're "REPRESENTATIVES."

The traitors and cowardly "no shows:"

Berman, Howard (California, 28th)
California-28th, Democrat
2221 Rayburn HOB
Washington, DC 20515-0528
Phone: (202) 225-4695

Faleomavaega, Eni (American Samoa, Delegate)
American Samoa-Delegate, Democrat
2422 Rayburn HOB
Washington, DC 20515-5201
Phone: (202) 225-8577




edit: Changed Democrats to Representatives. Our lives are in all of their hands.
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NJCher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 08:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. some kick-ass letters are on their way tonight



Cher
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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. There are a lot of upset people over this. We really worked hard:
national groups, individual activists, and the staffs of Kucinich and Smith. Lots of people.

WHY would they do this?

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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:07 AM
Original message
Maybe we should support Dem candidates that will replace them?
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
27. self-deleted
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 10:08 AM by The Backlash Cometh
Sorry! My book fell on the enter key!
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:07 AM
Original message
self-deleted, again
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 10:09 AM by The Backlash Cometh
sorry again.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
28. eom
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 10:09 AM by The Backlash Cometh
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
29. eom
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 10:09 AM by The Backlash Cometh
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Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #3
32. Maybe these two traitors are just, in fact...
... two true neocons in disguise.

What else could they be?? :shrug:

:mad: :mad:
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 08:59 PM
Response to Original message
2. They should be thrown out or office/impeached
:grr:
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Talismom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:04 PM
Response to Original message
4. Oh man! I can't believe it! Stinking bastards! n/t
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. American Samoa has representatives and DC doesn't?????
Not that I think American Samoa shouldn't be represented, but c'mon, 70,000 US Nationals get a representative and 550,000 US Citizen's don't?
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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Yes, that's crazy, too. Has never made sense.
I noticed DC license plates all say:

"No taxation without representation" on them or something similar. I'm sure I will be corrected if I'm wrong.
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. "Taxation Without Representation"
On all the city vehicles too - police cars, ambulances, etc. Firetrucks don't have license plates.
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Idioteque Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. American Samoa gets a Delegate, just like DC
They can vote in committee but not on the floor. Sort of stupid really.
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Patsy Stone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. No
From the Wiki:

DC is a federal district: "Federal districts are subdivisions of a federal system of government. Often, these districts are not one of the countries' component subdivisions, and should not be confused with them, but are rather separate entities under the direct control of the federal government. The seat of the federal government is often located in a Federal District, so that no single individual component can exercise undue influence over federal affairs."

It has a delegate, but not a Representative. She has no vote, thus the Taxation Without Representation license plates.

American Samoa is a territory: Puerto Rico, Guam, the U.S. Virgin Islands, and American Samoa each has a Delegate in the U.S. House of Representatives.9 The Delegate has the right to speak on the floor of the House of Representatives, but does not have a vote. Delegates sit on legislative committees and, in the past, were permitted to vote in the committee, although they are not permitted to do so in the current Congress. The National Government pays the salaries and expenses of the Delegates.

No votes.






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sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. No votes any longer.
Edited on Wed Nov-23-05 10:43 PM by sofa king
For awhile back in the good old days, House rules permitted delegates to have floor votes. The first thing Newt Gingrich did when he swept into power with the Contract on America was change the rules to deny delegates floor votes. They still retain committee votes and the power to introduce legislation, which is why Del. Fallaeomavaega's non-vote in committee is an issue here.

On edit: should the Democrats ever reclaim a majority in the House, you can bet that the first thing they're going to do is restore floor voting privileges to the delegates, as they are almost always Democrats. That will instantly add some padding to their majority and will cancel out some potential DINO and Dixiecrat dissenters.
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 02:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
19. Really!
Isn't it just amazing. D.C. has no rep, but Samoa does. They've been trying though. What's up with that, I wonder!
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
8. Kick....to "Out" the TWO TRAITORS!!!!!
:puke:
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
9. Cut the line and let the bastards drop into the crevasse.
Who needs 'em.
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Idioteque Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
12. Even if they both voted yes, it would have failed 25-25.
It's good to see Jim Leach on our side. He is the chairman of the committee so he might be able to swing a few more Repubs. These two vichy dems should be booted from the committee.
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sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. A possible clue.
I don't wish to impugn Delegate Falaeomavaega's character, but it has not escaped my attention that both American Samoa and the Commonwealth of the Northern Marianas Islands are managed by the Department of the Interior, via the Office of Insular Affairs.

CNMI was a particularly lucrative client for our old friend Mr. Jack Abramoff, and Mr. Abramoff's influence with the Department of the Interior, including the use of Secretary of the Interior Gale Norton's former "astroturf" organization CREA, is now well known. Similarly, Tom Delay's shilling for CNMI is also well recorded.

To some extent, CNMI and AS share similar interests, in particular the minimum wage in those territories.

One of the ways the Bush Administration secured total control of the Department of the Interior is by not nominating high-level appointees, which must be approved by the Senate. Instead, right-leaning career employees hold acting positions with the same responsibilities, without all the fuss and muss of Senate confirmation. The Office of Insular Affairs is a particularly good example, with three out of the four slots requiring Senate approval being held by acting directors.

The OIA is run by a (Senate confirmed) gentleman named David B. Cohen. Prior to holding that position, Mr. Cohen was recommended by Del. Falaeomavaega to sit on Special Industry Committee #24, the body which determined what a fair minimum wage would be for American Samoa.

As you may recall, Jack Abramoff lobbied heavily against raising the minimum wage for the CNMI, so that "Made in America" tags could be put on clothing made at sweatshop wages.

Mr. Cohen was also a member of the President's Advisory Commission on Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders. When Jack Abramoff's former aide, Susan Ralston, became too radioactive for Karl Rove to keep her as his personal assistant, Ralston went on to become an aide to the President's Advisory Commission on Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders (nice photo of Susan Ralston and Shrub together on that page).

Falaeomavaega recommended Mr. Cohen to Elaine Chao, the Secretary of Labor. Ms. Chao is a regular attendee of functions by the group Americans for Tax Reform, headed up by Jack Abramoff's good pal, Grover Norquist.

Elaine Chao is also the wife of Senator Mitch McConnell.

Now, let me be the first to point out that most of these connections are for the most part above board. Mr. Cohen is of American Samoan descent, and he has qualifications which recommend him to the job he now has. Grover Norquist's group is closely tied to the Heritage Foundation, from whence a great many Bush appointees came, including Elaine Chao. Susan Ralston, a Filipino-American, also has close ties to the Pacific Islands going back to her days as Abramoff's personal assistant. And none of the above relationships directly indicate any sort of improper relationship between Del. Fallaeomavaega and anyone else.

But they definitely all know each other, or know of each other.

Mr. Fallaeomavaega is also unquestionably a friend of American Indian tribes, as I personally witnessed, and he has expressed outrage at Mr. Abramoff's taking advantage of tribes on numerous occasions.

But nevertheless, the world gets a lot smaller when it comes to the Pacific territories. What does it mean? Hell if I know. But there it is for your consideration.
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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Lots of good clues there!
Thanks.

The fascists leave no stone unturned when it comes to wringing the last penny out of poor people.

And it seems we are almost an oligarchy now! It's just a revolving door with these criminals.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. Thanks for the info!
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 02:28 AM by Marie26
That helps add a few more pieces to the puzzle. I wonder if Abramoff & the sweatshops gave some hefty contributions to Mr. Fallaeomavaega's campaign?

ETA: The National Indian Gambling Assn. contributed to Rep. Fallaeomavaega's campaign in 2001, 2002, 2003 & 2004. Isn't this the same organization Abramoff was representing (and bilking) to open more casinos? Why would this organization care so much about a non-voting delegate? Abramoff is also being indicted in Guam, another US territory, for money laundering & illegal contributions. This stinks.

http://www.citizensforethics.org/activities/campaign.php?view=63
http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.asp?CID=N00007632&cycle=2004
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sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #17
23. Fallaeomavaega is a good friend of tribes.
Abramoff undoubtedly had some sort of relationship with NIGA, as it is the association which represents and tries to coordinate all tribal gambling interests.

In that sense, I have to admit that I myself have "worked with" Abramoff via NIGA. I worked with a couple of Indian affairs law firms which competed against Abramoff's firm (Greenberg Traurig), and I recall GT lobbyists and lawyers (but not Jack himself) being present at their regular meetings, just as I represented my own firm at those meetings on occasion. We coordinated our efforts on matters which we could agree on.

NIGA gives donations to many "friendly" Members of Congress, and as I said above, Del. Fallaeomavaega is a good friend of tribes and other Native American entities such as Native Hawaiians. Fallaeomavaega has introduced many pieces of legislation designed to help Native Americans.

For example, he preemptively introduced legislation to reform the process by which Indian tribes are recognized by the federal government, a process which the Connecticut delegation has been desperately trying to undermine ("hate" is not too strong a word to use for the non-Indian reaction to tribes in that state). He has also been a strong supporter of limited sovereignty for Native Hawaiians. I've often thought that he may have some interest in conferring a similar status upon American Samoans.

Fallaeomavaega also sits on the House Resources Committee, which has jurisdiction over Native Americans (I'm using that term in the broader sense: Indians, Native Alaskans, Native Hawaiians, and possibly American Samoans, each of which has different status and rights). His staff provides valuable intelligence to pro-tribal interests, because he is privy to closed-door meetings and draft legislation. There's always some evil bastard in Congress who wants to terminate Indian tribes and steal the rest of their land--I wish I were kidding about that--and Fallaeomavaega's office has been very good about warning what sort of hijinks are in the works that session.

To a certain extent, sympathy for tribal sovereignty crosses party lines, and I have no doubt that the Abramoff scandals will eventually bleed across the aisle as well. For example, John McCain and J.D. Hayworth are both strong Republican supporters of tribal rights. Richard Pombo hasn't been all bad, either, for a Republican. It's known that Hayworth and Pombo have taken large donations from Abramoff. So has Harry Reid, who used to sit on the Senate Committee on Indian Affairs. McCain probably has, too, but I don't know that for sure.

So I would not be surprised if the Abramoff scandals were to somehow exert some sort of leverage over Fallaeomavaega, which in turn might influence his disposition toward investigating the White House Iraq Group. (Simple connection there, in case anyone's missed it: Karl Rove and Jack Abramoff shared the same personal assistant, Susan Ralston. Rove chairs WHIG.)

But having written all of the above, I'm starting to feel bad about it, because in the balance Del. Fallaeomavaega has, I think, honestly acted for the betterment of Native Americans, and I like him.

And now one other thing occurs to me, a much simpler explanation for the Delegate's absence this week: American Samoa is quite a pain in the butt to get to. He may simply have had to leave early so he could be home in time to celebrate Thanksgiving at home. If that's the case, I will feel very bad for having questioned the character of a fellow whom I know has his heart in the right place.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-25-05 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #23
38. He was in DC - why didn't he vote?
Edited on Fri Nov-25-05 05:08 PM by Marie26
I also feel a little bad about implying he was involved in something shady, I actually almost deleted that post. It's pretty serious to be implying that a politician is corrupt or influenced by lobbyists, especially when that lobbyist is as scuzzy as Abramoff. If the Rep. is a supporter of Indian rights, that would explain why the NISA has supported him. There could be a perfectly innocent explanation for these donations & actions, without needing to look for hidden reasons. (Disclaimer over)

That said, there are too many connections & coincidences for my liking. Rep. Faleomavaega WAS in Washington on the day of the WHIG vote (Nov. 9), in fact, he actually was in the House of Representatives! He supported a bill to help veterans, and also gave a rousing speech on the House floor. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r109:1:./temp/~r109v2YvFP:e68647: Yet he couldn't find the time to mosey over and vote for this resolution? I don't buy it. I think it was politically unpopular for him to vote against it, but he had other interests that wouldn't be happy if he voted for it. So he disappeared.

Abramoff & DeLay have both been heavily involved in the effort to keep US territories from having a minimum wage, as you point out. This allows sweatshops to use the "Made In USA" label while paying workers pennies an hour. Abramoff poured tons of money, influence & power into the Mariana Islands to make sure the islands stayed regulation-free (racking up fees along the way). http://www.alternet.org/story/13140 - "Delay's Pacific Paradise" Some of these shops were in Samoa. According to the U.S. Department of Labor, workers on American Samoa “were beaten…and provided food so inadequate that some were walking skeletons…” while producing clothes for major U.S. retailers such as Wal-Mart, J.C. Penney, Sears, and Target. The Rep. called the exposure of these factories "a lesson for Samoa". http://www.pacificislands.cc/pm42001/pmdefault.php?urlarticleid=0015 The Samoa News has also called for an investigation into the Rep's. lobbyist-paid trips to Asia. http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/as00_faleomavaega/enikoreatrip.html

With all the money they were pouring into this issue, it almost seems probable the Samoan Rep. would have some involvement. Rep. Feleomavaega's position makes him an ideal target for Abramoff on both the Indian casino & sweatshop issues. He's also in a position to benefit from Abramoff's paid junkets. I don't know, something's fishy. Why didn't he show up for the vote? Given all the money & influence Abramoff has exerted on these issues, I can see how easy it would be for a Congressman, even one with good intentions, to get mixed up in all of this. Then again, even if it's true, I wonder how much is just how business is done in Washington.
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #13
25. Good stuff! Excellent post!
That's the sort of stuff that makes DU a great source. :toast: Thanks.

Julie
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The Witch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-23-05 10:49 PM
Response to Original message
15. Wait. One. Second.
American Samoa gets a vote in committee?

Does the District get a vote in committee? I know they don't get one on the floor.
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dxstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 02:40 AM
Response to Reply #15
21. Posters upthread seemed to think they don't get to vote...
I'm still confused somewhat on that issue myself...
But as to the larger issue, it's like so many other questions...
Why did the Dems back NAFTA? Why did they let themselves be led like foolish lambs to the slaughter of Bush's new endless wars against us all? Why do they put up with all these endless lies? Why did the freakin' Dems throw Clinton to the WOLVES--over a freakin' middle-aged romantic tryst, or a blowjob, if you prefer, or whatever you want to call it but NO ONE was hurt, NO CHILDREN WERE SET AFIRE, AH DEAR GOD, HOW LONG CAN THIS MADNESS GO ON???
We HAVE to GET RID of the OBVIOUS PAID AGENTS OF THE ENEMY who populate this party AT EVERY LEVEL...
Or maybe it would be easier to throw the whole thing out; boycott BOTH parties... such a populist movement could be very near in ALL our futures...
Again and again, the Dems build us up, only to let us down...
Sad. Just really, really sad.
d


President Evil Online
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sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #15
26. Yes, the District has a vote in Committee.
Edited on Thu Nov-24-05 09:07 AM by sofa king
Norton has a seat on, and can vote in, the Committees on Government Reform and Homeland Security, and many Subcommittees within those two.

However, Norton does not have a seat on the House Appropriations Committee, which is the most important Committee for the District of Columbia. The House Appropriations Subcommittee on Transportation, Treasury, and Housing and Urban Development, The Judiciary, District of Columbia is stacked heavily in favor of the Republicans (9-6). That Subcommittee is the group which formulates DC's annual budget. Holmes is locked out of it, because the Republicans are scum.

As I said before, Delegates are not guaranteed legislative votes, or "floor votes," but they are not prohibited by statute, either. In the past, the House Rules have been changed to allow for Delegate floor votes, but Republicans being the scum that they are, they've effectively disenfranchised all our territories' Delegates in Congress outside of Committees, and of course they choose which Committees the Delegates sit on, which is how Norton got screwed out of Appropriations.

The Republicans argue that because Delegates are not guaranteed floor votes, they should not have been given the right to cancel out the votes of Representatives in the first place. I'm sure they don't want to talk about the appropriations process, as they greedily guard the money for themselves.

As I suggested above, one of the first tactical moves a Democratic House will try to make will be to restore that privilege, because it will provide four extra votes for the Dem's side. There is talk about adding a delegate for the Marianas as well.

http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/48C16.txt
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texpatriot2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 02:16 AM
Response to Original message
18. Is this the 2nd time these two people have failed to show up? nm
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 02:33 AM
Response to Original message
20. Thanks Marie26 -bumping reply
That helps add a few more pieces to the puzzle. I wonder if Abramoff & the sweatshops gave some hefty contributions to Mr. Fallaeomavaega's campaign?

ETA: The National Indian Gambling Assn. contributed to Rep. Fallaeomavaega's campaign in 2001, 2002, 2003 & 2004. Isn't this the same organization Abramoff was representing (and bilking) to open more casinos? Why would this organization care so much about a non-voting delegate? Abramoff is also being indicted in Guam, another US territory, for money laundering & illegal contributions. This stinks.

http://www.citizensforethics.org/activities/campaign.ph...
http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.asp?CID=...
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 07:51 AM
Response to Original message
22. kick
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
24. kati: if you want to sponsor an action to write to these two
MAJOR @ssholes, I will help with it.

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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
30. It does make me wonder
Now why in the world would this rep do that? Maybe someone should look into him!
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
31. Not to defend them, but me thinks GOP-ers maneuvered it so
Should they have been there, some of them would have voted differently.
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MaggieSwanson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. Agreed. Jim Leach, for one
would have voted along (r) party lines if his vote would have made the difference.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. Even if that's so- make them go on record
and stop playing their beltway games and making life easy for the Republicans who want to have "conscience votes" to take back to their districts come next election.

As to Berman- he's been in Congress way too long. The guy's liberal enough when it suits him- but otherwise he's just a corporate stooge for the RIAA and does their bidding pretty much at will in return for big campaign money.

Just as corrupt as a Republican in that regard.

http://www.boycott-riaa.com/rogues/hberman
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Lochloosa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
34. To Adam Smith...thanks...Cliff...you know who I am
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 11:02 PM
Response to Original message
35. Sons a bitches!
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-05 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
36. Typical
How many times does this have to happen before the Dem "leadership" starts taking some action to get its membership in line?

This is why I have very little hope for 2006. I don't think as a party the Dems are up to the challenge or have what it takes to become relevant again- much less take over as a majority party.

I really hope they'll prove me wrong in the first few months of next year, but aside from some big talk- there isn't even a slice of substantive evidence that, as a party- they can or will pull together when push comes to shove and block ANYTHING that the far right wants.

So far, they're batting 0.00%
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TheCentepedeShoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-25-05 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
39. All this is very informative.
Thank you (everyone) for posting.
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