Question about the Christian Right

[ck4829]

There are some people who say we don't need to fear the Christian Right and that they just want to spread Compassionate Conservatism around the world.

I'm just wondering, what was the Christian Right's stance on Apartheid in South Africa?

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. I dunno.. not sure if they were cohesive and had a talking

point on that.

Best guess is you should research the top talking RW fundy heads of the day: Dobson, Falwell, Robertson, Bakker and so forth and see if their name plus apartheid googles anything.

[ck4829]

8. Here's what I've got so far

Liberal theologian Reverend Doctor John Shelby Spong has said that Falwell "was a race baiting segregationist to his core... (who) praised the apartheid regime in South Africa as a "bulwark for Christian civilization" before his rise to national prominence.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0MKY/is_15_28/ai_n6260702

"I think 'one man, one vote,' just unrestricted democracy, would not be wise. There needs to be some kind of protection for the minority which the white people represent now, a minority, and they need and have a right to demand a protection of their rights."
--Pat Robertson on Apartheid

[GreenPartyVoter]

11. Spong is so far left as to be considered a heretic by many, so he

is an interesting lens to view Falwell's actions through.

[Roland99]

2. A little FYI:

http://www.nndb.com/people/558/000022492/

Falwell

Born and raised in America's segregated South, Falwell preached that racial segregation was the Lord's will, but dropped such overt racism from his perspective when it became unpopular to say such things aloud. Still, from his pulpit Falwell supported South African apartheid, and opposed Nelson Mandela's release from prison.

Falwell
http://www.answers.com/topic/jerry-falwell

The time at which he gave up segregationism is disputed, as is the degree to which he has changed his views; "He was a race baiting segregationist to his core... praised the apartheid regime in South Africa as a 'bulwark for Christian civilization.'" before his rise to national prominence, says theologian John Shelby Spong

Robertson
http://www.ilga.info/Information/Legal_survey/europe/supporting%20files/bank_of_scotland_and_pat_roberts.htm

(talking about apartheid South Africa) "I think ‘one man, one vote,’ just unrestricted democracy, would not be wise. There needs to be some kind of protection for the minority which the white people represent now, a minority, and they need and have a right to demand a protection of

their rights."—Pat Robertson, "The 700 Club", 18/3/92

[Michael_UK]

7. Damn you for being so quick...

think you're smart, huh?

[Roland99]

14. Yeah....got a problem with that?

:P


Google rocks, eh?


:toast:

[XemaSab]

9. If you used a particle accelerator

and shot Bishop Spong at Jerry Falwell, they would both completely destroy each other.

Shame to waste Bishop Spong like that, though.

[ieoeja]

3. Moral Majority Opposed Boycott

Monday, Sep. 16, 1985

"If I was picking a panel of people who know most about the issue, even if it was 50 people on each side, I'm not sure I'd pick either man," admitted ABC's Ted Koppel.

Even so, the Revs. Jesse Jackson and Jerry Falwell starred on Nightline last week, locking horns over the subject of U.S. policy in South Africa. Falwell, founder of Moral Majority, argued that withdrawing U.S. investments from South Africa in an effort to coerce the country into abandoning apartheid would do more harm than good. Said he: "We can cut out the cancer without killing the patient."

Jackson, head of Operation Push, was less sanguine. "With increased investment in apartheid," he maintained, "the rope around the necks of the people appears to be getting tighter as opposed to looser."

The on-camera conversation was heated, but once the lights were off, piety and politics took over. Falwell said amen to most of Jackson's statements, and Jackson gave his opponent a big hand--on the top of his head in a gesture of blessing.

source: http://www.time.com/time/archive/printout/0,23657,959839,00.html

[RaleighNCDUer]

4. Can't say for sure, without research, but seeing as how the leader

of the resistance to apartheid was a black commie revolutionary, I'd bet they tended to support it.

[gratuitous]

5. Generally

If I recall correctly, it was that sanctions on the apartheid regime wouldn't work to coerce change in South Africa, that sanctions were hurting the oppressed populations far more than they were hurting the ruling class, that it wasn't the business of the United States to decide what was and what was not a legitimate form of government, that Nelson Mandela was a communist, and that the South African apartheid regime was a bulwark against communism spreading throughout the African continent.

Oh, and Pat Robertson wanted to be sure that the diamond trade kept flowing without interruption for some reason.

[Michael_UK]

6. well, here's something on Falwell - don't know.,..

how reliable it is

http://www.nndb.com/people/558/000022492/

"Born and raised in America's segregated South, Falwell preached that racial segregation was the Lord's will, but dropped such overt racism from his perspective when it became unpopular to say such things aloud. Still, from his pulpit Falwell supported South African apartheid, and opposed Nelson Mandela's release from prison."

Liberal theologian Reverend Doctor John Shelby Spong has said that Falwell "was a race baiting segregationist to his core... (who) praised the apartheid regime in South Africa as a 'bulwark for Christian civilization" - this was from wiki

Good old Pat Robertson

(talking about apartheid South Africa) "I think 'one man, one vote,' just unrestricted democracy, would not be wise. There needs to be some kind of protection for the minority which the white people represent now, a minority, and they need and have a right to demand a protection of their rights."--Pat Robertson, "The 700 Club," 3/18/92

http://www.proislam.com/target_quotes_pat_robertson.htm

But you kinda knew the RR would have supported Apartheid, as they supported segregation 50 years ago

[Sparkman]

10. Constructive engagement was U.S. policy, pre-revolution. This meant ...

there was a standard corporate policy toward companies doing business under the government of S.Africa. No compromises or special consideration for the abject poverty and racism, just like here in the U.S. until very recently. Isn't the def. of RW Christians indifference to the plight of those who can't help themselves, unless it's a corp. taking tax dollars?

[bicentennial_baby]

12. Disgusting Pat Buchanan quote on SA

And it is, I am persuaded, not some deep-seated love of the downtrodden Xhosa or Zulu that has caused America's press and clergy to insist upon the most severe of sanctions upon South Africa. (After all, Ndebele, Hutu, Tutsi, Ibo and countless tribal peoples have been massacred in far greater numbers in modern Africa, without a peep of protest from these same sources.)

The spirit driving the anti-apartheid coalition worldwide is not love at all; it is hatred, and not just hatred of apartheid, but hatred of the Boer, hatred of Botha, his party and people, hatred of the 19th century idea they embody - the idea that the Christian West, because of the superiority of its values and the civilization those values produced, has an inherent right to rule over other peoples.

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_PBuchanan.htm

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. Not sure, and you'd have to distinguish their public stance from what

they REALLY thought.

I know that a lot of conservatives, religious or secular, were fond of painting the African National Congress as a "Communist front," a stance that mirrored the South African government's own claims that they were "a bulwark against Communism."

Also, among the white population, the Afrikaners, the descendants of Dutch settlers who arrived in the 17th century, were more racist than the descendants of the English settlers, and their predominant religion, the Dutch Reformed Church, had racism as one of its doctrines. (I don't know how they handled the transition to majority rule.)

[Imagine My Surprise]

15. I think Pat Robertson's investments might answer your question

[BiggJawn]

16. Pat Robertson owns stock in Diamond Mines.

That should tell us something....

[Imagine My Surprise]

17. Because Diamonds are a raging hypocritical fundie's best friend!

[BiggJawn]

18. They don't call them "Blood Stones" for nothing...

I won't THINK of buying them. Fuck that marketing from DeBeers that says "If you don't spend all your money on pretty rocks because we SAY they're valuable, then you'll be sleeping on the couch..."

Reminds me of my ex-wife. Talk about SHALLOW...

[RethugAssKicker]

19. I remember exactly

The so-called Christian Right supported the apartheid regime completely. They said disinvestment in South Africa would hurt the black people more than help them... I also remember Falwell made a trip to South Africa, and when he came back he said that he could not find any black people there who opposed apartheid.

THAT SON OF A BITCH!!!...

I will never forget that time in AMERICA.. All the RW nuts supported apartheid.... and I Will never forgive "CHRISTIANS" for their stance either!!!