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2003- 54% of US Households had incomes under $50,000. Where are you?

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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:31 PM
Original message
Poll question: 2003- 54% of US Households had incomes under $50,000. Where are you?
You can get the Census tables here.

Do the numbers surprize you? Did you expect to see 83% of ALL US Households under $100,000?

Do you think that most people know that the incomes are slanted this way? That there are so many households living on less than $30,000/35%?

What does this do to your perception of what "Working Class" means? Anything?

Sorry, polls are turned off at Level 3.

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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
1. about $12000 a year
maybe closer to $13000, as I recently got a raise....
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Do you live alone?
The poll is by household of which there are about 112,000,000 in the US. That can be one person to a whole family.
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. No
my husband isn't working and has health problems. We have no children.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Ok. I was seeing if you marked "Household" instead of "Individual".
I'm sorry to hear about your husband.
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Maestro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
3. Between 70K and 100K
if you count our incomes as combined; other than that it is a different story. Currently, my wife is trying to make it through nursing school while teaching. It is very difficult and tuition is just insane but we don't qualify for any aid.
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KayLaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. Just to clarify
I voted $50 - $75, but it's just a bit over $50, and we're a family of four.
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SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:36 PM
Response to Original message
5. Irregular income, because we're self employed.
Edited on Sat Jan-08-05 04:37 PM by SmokingJacket
Kind of a family business. Averages out to about 40K or so, up to 80K, down to about 20K.

In good years, we save for lean years. In 80K years we feel like the fricking Howells. Usually I feel about average, and so those numbers seem about right. We're definitely far from poverty (though if we had health problems that would be a different story).

Frankly, I feel rich. We don't watch TV; I think TV paint ridiculous comfort and wealth as normal, which it isn't.

To edit: family of four
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #5
15. Very important point you're making about TV.
I think the biggest problem with TV and movies is they assign people jobs, and then give them a standard of living far beyond what that job's income would provide.
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RawMaterials Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #15
29. just look at the Friends show
There is no way that they could have lived in those apartments in new York with the jobs they held. not to mention there were never any other races on the show.
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #29
59. Just a lousy studio or 1B apartment in NYC is AT LEAST $1100 a month rent
At least, from what I saw in my searches.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #29
64. They had jobs?
I thought they were all "idle rich". They lived in those really nice apartments (as you pointed out) and I never saw them do anything except move back and forth between their cribs and that coffee shop and the Soup Nazi's place...
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RawMaterials Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #64
68. I'm ashamed that i know this but
Monica was a chef, joey actor, chandler businessman, Ross PhD professor, Phoebe masseuse, the last girl was in fashion exec. I'm quite a loser, ha ha
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #68
72. But what did Kramer do?
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 08:54 PM by BiggJawn
He was a CEO, right? :D

I HATED going to the laundro-mat on "friends" night!
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Nobody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #64
76. Time Porn
Because they might have jobs, but you rarely saw them working. And they seemed to have endless amount of time to do anything they wanted.

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Cobalt Violet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #29
75. And also have the new clothes and hair styles.
Those aren't cheap either.
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #15
60. What really kills me is their depiction of dorm rooms
It's not even close to reality. They show people in luxury apartments, when in fact the overwhelming majority of dorms are far more comparable to prison cells.
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Career Prole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. Between $30k and $40k...total of two incomes. n/t
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #7
44. that's where my family fits but one income
my husband is the sole provider
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Career Prole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #44
65. We were there a decade ago but then
globalism intervened. :(
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vpigrad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
9. 46% of families are wealthy? That can't be right!
If 54% make under 50k, then 46% make over 50k. There's no way 46% of the population of this country is that wealthy. I do hundreds of tax returns each year, and I only see one or two families that are that well-off. You posted some terrible repuke lies. I used to think the Census was non-partisan.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. First off, you think over 50k is "wealthy"?
Edited on Sat Jan-08-05 04:46 PM by JanMichael
In many parts of the world perhaps but not in North America it sure as hell isn't. It's Working Class for a family. As in they don't have a roof over their heads and food in their stomachs if that income ends. No work no eat.

Also it's "Household" income, not "Individual" in case that helps.

"You posted some terrible repuke lies. I used to think the Census was non-partisan."

Bull.
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blurp Donating Member (769 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #9
41. Duh. Income is not the same as wealth.
That's one way the rich avoid paying a lot of income tax.

THEY HAVE MUCH LESS INCOME THAN WEALTH.


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driver8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 01:37 AM
Response to Reply #9
43. I make well over 50K but I am not wealthy...
I live in Southern California and I consider us "middle class." Housing is unbelievably expensive here, and a lot of our money goes to the mortgage. We definitely live within our means -- our house is just a regular 3BR, 1 and a half bath house.
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:23 AM
Response to Reply #9
47. 50,000 doesn't go very far in New York compared to 25,000 in a small town.
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 08:23 AM by Massacure
Wealth is in the eye of the beholder.
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BurgherHoldtheLies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
10. I know that I am fortunate and believe in helping those less fortunate.
Edited on Sat Jan-08-05 04:50 PM by ModRepubinPA
And, no, I don't speak the standard Republican line of "via private donations". If private donations worked so damn well in history, how did the gilded age get its name? There are some things that the govt has a responsibility to do and relying on a variable like private donations removes the safety net that must exist in a civilized society.

What I resent more is wasteful pork spending like the use of taxpayer money for NASCAR funding!!!! That really gets me angry. (I believe the latest Omnibus bill included it)

:mad:
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
12. with the obsene amount of overtime
my wife and i will make over 50,000 this year. we will probaly average between us 24 hours of overtime per week in the shithole place we work at.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. That sort of OT is a anchor on one's "quality of life".
That freakin' bites man.
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Smirking_Chimp Donating Member (213 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. I don't even get overtime anymore.
Gone are the days of time and a half for overtime. If I work over 40 hours, I get straight time now. sucks. Thanks *, you really understand the plight of the common man.
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Nobody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. Working class is anyone who lives solely on earned income
And earned income is getting short shrift these days.

It's my opinion that unearned income should be taxed at a much higher rate if it makes up more than 50% of a person's total income.

I'm one of those people living on less than 35k / year before taxes. The less I make, the more I have to send the IRS in April. It's always been this way since I started working. When I'm struggling, I have to pay, when I was doing OK, I got money back. Always, I've claimed zero dependants on my W4s.
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #14
55. There are people who have earned income
well into the six figures. And there are people who live strictly on that kind of earned income, so would they still fit your definition of working class? I do think you are intending to label as working class those who only have earned income below some particular amount, and I'd agree with you on that.

I do agree that unearned income is not taxed as much as it should be. The idea behind it of course is to encourage savings, but the benefit is very much to those already wealthy. I like your suggestion that the taxes on unearned income should be contingent on what percentage of a person's total income it is. Especially once you go above a particular dollar threshold, such as 50k or 100k per year.
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Nobody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #55
78. When you get into six figures
the definitions aren't as pretty. When you get that much, you're probably at a level where bonuses are plentiful. I rarely see or hear of examples of minimum wage workers getting bonuses for a good quarter, yet you hear all the time about VP level people already making six figures getting twice their base pay for a bonus after several people get laid off.
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eg101 Donating Member (371 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
16. I think you are missing out on some major points
Edited on Sat Jan-08-05 05:08 PM by eg101
First, I have not looked at the tables you provided, but I certainly will later.

I have been following this issue for some time, and yes, you are correct: most think everyone else is rich, but them.

Your household figures are somewhat misleading. THe median household size is probably 2.X people. That means that a certain percentage of those census responders are counting 2 or even 3 incomes.

I have seen other figures from the IRS (sorry no links right now, but I have seen them posted previously here on DU), that indicate that for all tax returns in a recent year, half of those returns were under $35 adjusted gross income. And 1/3 of all tax returns were under $20K. This includes both single and joint filers.

But the real question is: how much are those real incomes (unadjusted gross) and what percent of those returns are joint?

If we knew those figures, we could get a rough estimate of what the percentiles for gross income in this country, e.g., what is the 25%tile, 33%tile, 50%tile, etc, numbers for gross income.

Isn't interesting that the media always seems to give the impression that most people are making big bucks, which always seems to imply that if you are not making big bucks, well, then that is just you....

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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Dude...I figured that people could decifer that "Household" was usually...
...more than one individual. It isn't rocket science.

Plus those are pre-tax, not net, so they're even lower than they look, especially on the low-end.

That said I still think it paints a picture of a horrible inequitable society in terms of economics.

$50,000 for a family of four is crap. Borderline poverty especially if one illness strikes. And the lower the incomes the less likely they have medical insurance.

Perhaps I underestimated what people thought was "rich" and not rich?
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eg101 Donating Member (371 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. my concern is disseminating the TRUTH about American incomes
Don't you find it funny that in this Information Age, no one seems to know what the percentiles of individual earner incomes are in this country?

And I cannot even find a source online telling me what those percentiles for individual earner incomes are.

Find those, and then spread the news far and wide. That is real truth, and something worth doing....

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kysrsoze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #16
81. An online poll is automatically skewed upward
People with low incomes have less access to computers and internet access.
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eg101 Donating Member (371 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 04:55 AM
Response to Reply #81
87. not a poll--info from IRS
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latteromden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
18. Around 50K. Down around 30K last year & we still can't pay for food often.
Edited on Sat Jan-08-05 05:13 PM by latteromden
Oh, the Bush economy.

Fuck them. That's all I have to say about that. Fuck them.

By the way, we are a family of three (one child), and some interesting circumstances which could technically qualify us as a family of four.
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karlrschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
19. No choice for us. Ours was $50,000.47
:evilgrin:
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Fokker!
Damn you people and your retentive complaints!
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Smirking_Chimp Donating Member (213 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
21. $25,000, I used to make more back in the '90s...
Closer to $60,000 but today demand is down and supply is up, I see my paycheck dwindling, the cost of everything is up. Time for a career change! I said if Kerry were elected I would stick it out, for I've been a Telecom Tech for 18 years, but he didn't so time to move on.
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leanin_green Donating Member (823 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
23. Around $22-24 K with two jobs and a disabled wife.
And I work for the State of Utah. Will be filling Chapter 7 this month. Welcome to Bushworld.
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
24. $70k when I had a job, before the bushworld order kicked in
Now my wife works instead, making about $24k.

On the bright side, at least we don't pay lots in taxes for Bush's monstrosities.
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purduejake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
25. No income.
I first felt good I am not alone, but then I realized how horrible it was to take comfort in other people's problems, lol. Oh well, welcome to the club ;)
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imax2268 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
26. under 30,000
I got laid off...by the US Government of all people...
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
28. Since I am not Armstrong Williams
I make a lot less than $240,000 a year.
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kcass1954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
30. We did ok in 03, but...
At the beginning of 04, my OT was cut out (lost $7K/yr) and in June they rolled us back to 35 hr weeks. My raise last year was 5%, but I increased my 401K contribution by 3%. This year I got 4%, and again I increased the 401K by 3%. Remind me again how good the economy's doing.
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
31. Shouldn't there be a catagory for under $20,000? n/t
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. I never did the math on that.
I'll try a c&p...



All Races White A.O.I.C. White alone 1/
Mean Mean Mean
Number Income Number Income Number Income

Income of Household
Total ................... 112,000 59,067 93,196 61,469 91,962 61,587
Under $2,500............... 2,535 203 1,758 105 1,732 122
$2,500 to $4,999........... 1,266 3,810 832 3,893 820 3,894
$5,000 to $7,499........... 2,717 6,394 1,802 6,392 1,784 6,392
$7,500 to $9,999........... 3,593 8,722 2,711 8,737 2,676 8,737
$10,000 to $12,499......... 4,032 11,174 3,192 11,193 3,135 11,193
$12,500 to $14,999......... 3,708 13,636 2,946 13,632 2,900 13,635
$15,000 to $17,499......... 3,933 16,104 3,160 16,122 3,108 16,124
$17,500 to $19,999......... 3,501 18,653 2,860 18,658 2,818 18,659
$20,000 to $22,499......... 3,888 21,073 3,165 21,098 3,116 21,101
$22,500 to $24,999......... 3,327 23,720 2,755 23,729 2,711 23,730
$25,000 to $27,499......... 3,683 26,067 3,047 26,096 3,012 26,098
$27,500 to $29,999......... 3,035 28,667 2,519 28,662 2,467 28,659
# HOUSEHOLDS UNDER $30,000 39,218 or 35%
$30,000 to $32,499......... 3,882 31,019 3,165 31,018 3,131 31,018
$32,500 to $34,999......... 2,677 33,655 2,312 33,663 2,281 33,664
$35,000 to $37,499......... 3,417 36,058 2,868 36,070 2,839 36,070
$37,500 to $39,999......... 2,607 38,643 2,151 38,629 2,115 38,632
# HOUSEHOLDS UNDER $40,000 51,801 or 46%
$40,000 to $42,499......... 3,420 41,009 2,818 41,024 2,781 41,024
$42,500 to $44,999......... 2,381 43,644 2,013 43,644 1,984 43,648
$45,000 to $47,499......... 2,721 46,024 2,291 46,038 2,258 46,038
$47,500 to $49,999......... 2,227 48,630 1,871 48,630
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. Yow, my head! My brain!
I did not mean to make my comment a criticism. I cannot fathom a math mind such as yours. I admire that because I am lacking on that part of my brain.
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Thtwudbeme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. It's my reality. Numbers. Percentages.
Sometimes it's easy to forget that those numbers are real people...

Seriously though you just take the numbers under an income level and divide it by 112,000,000.
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spinbaby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 06:50 PM
Response to Original message
33. We're on the high end
But we've got three working adults in our household.

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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 11:51 PM
Response to Original message
36. I have to remind myself every day I'm still better off than most on earth.
OTOH, I'm self-employed and it seems to get harder and harder to save money, especially when the not-so-great-house-to-begin-with begins to need desperate repairs and the property taxes go up and everyone here knows that prices on everything are rising.

Last week someone told me to start saving for my retirement because Social Security will be "poof!" by the time I'm 67.

I just looked at him and burst out laughing at the absurdity of it all. He's really out of touch. He makes about $60K to $70K annually and has apparently forgotten what it's like to struggle when you're at the low end of the economic totem pole.
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AwakeAtLast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-08-05 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
37. I'm in the 18% for 2003, but
our income went *down* in 2004. Way down. Way. Way. Down.

:(
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Bouncy Ball Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
38. It's interesting, though not surprising, to find that
Texas has the highest percentage of people without health insurance coverage. And by highest, I mean by a long shot the highest.

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ObaMania Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
39. Between 100,000 and 150k
Doesn't mean much though, I live in Northern VA one of the more expensive hell holes you could live. If we were anywhere else making less, it would probably be a wash. I lived in NH making 25-30k and was doing 100x better than I am now.

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ThoughtCriminal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:07 AM
Response to Original message
40. We're moving on down!
Tossing the corporate idiocy for self-employment. 90k+ last year, probably under 40k next year. Absolutely thrilled with the change.
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Glenda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #40
58. Don't you love self-employment?
It can be stressful. But it's so great to get out of the corporate world. DO you find that you are spending less money anyway?
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ThoughtCriminal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #58
63. We started cutting back a year before I left
To save up and re-adjust our lifestyle. We are also thinking about selling our house and moving to a cheaper community.

Less stressful - you bet. Dilbert's company would have been an upgrade.
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #58
86. I've been self-employed for most of my working life.
Yes, I really dislike the corporate world, but that's because I work best when I work alone.

Am I spending less money? If you have less, you spend less ;)

I am beginning to resent the sticker shock at the grocery store lately, though, needless to mention everywhere else but that one really gripes me because you can't really avoid buying food x(
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Bouncy Ball Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
42. Somewhere around 96K with two adults working and one child
and one adult works MONGO overtime to make his part of that. I'd give up the money and have him work fewer hours so we could see him more. :cry: But he's always worried about financial crises, has kind of a "survived the Great Depression and now saves dryer lint just in case he might need it" mindset even though he's in his 30s. It's weird. And sad.



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daleo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 03:43 AM
Response to Original message
45. Not actually American
But converted to U.S. funds and voted anyway.

I am not really surprised by this. During the Canadian election, the Conservative candidate (equivalent to Republican, more or less) was pushing a tax cut. I looked up his proposal and compared it to census data (taxfiler) and discovered, not surprisingly, that about 80% of the cut would have went to about 20% of the population (the richest, of course). Low to lower middle class would have gotten nothing or very little. But, most people don't realize these things.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 06:35 AM
Response to Original message
46. When we bought our first house it cost $39,900
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 06:37 AM by SoCalDem
and our realtor told us that the "rule of thumb" was twice your annual income was "average" for a "starter house". At the time we earned 24K, so we were sitting pretty with a house payment of $325 PITI..

Starter houses in our town are a bit cheaper than most in Southern California, but they START at $200K for really crappy ones and go UP UP and AWAY..

We are still in the house we bought in 1982, (for 81K)and if we sold it tomorrow we could make a bundle, but where would we move?? We could not afford to "buy" our own crappy house :(

Unless you are a "professional" or belong to a good union, a $15hr job is pretty good, so how on earth can people buy their fisrt house anymore?? Apartments are renting for $1,000 a month for a basic no-frills 2 BR...IF you can even find one..

and then there's gasoline.. In preparing our taxes, we discovered that just for work expenses, we spent almost $3K on gasoline for my husband's truck...

It just plain sucks to ALWAYS be behind the 9-ball :(
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Misunderestimator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #46
51. If you ever do decide to sell your house... let me know.
:) :hi:
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last1standing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
48. We've been pretty lucky. $120-135K.
But that's always in doubt when neither of us has a degree. My latest contract expired at the end of the year so I don't know what we'll make this year.

We're learning to live more within our means and to want less. I've found the best way to do that is to just turn off the TV.
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mhr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
49. Unemployed 55 Months - No Income
eom
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #49
61. I have a vengeful former employer, who suffers from paranoid schizophreni
and whose employment constituted the only serious full-time job I've ever had. So now my current reference list has been necessarily reduced to a part-time stint in retail and some volunteer work. Needless to say, I've had a hell of time getting any kind of work.
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mhr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. About The Same For Me And I Wonder If I Have Been "Blacklisted"
In some form or fashion.

However, I think the real problem is reflected in the following economic story.

Bush's Missing 10.2 Million Jobs
or
Employment Picture Still Dreary
Comstock Funds
January 06, 2005

Whatever the December payroll employment report shows tomorrow, it cant come close to making a dent in the serious jobs shortfall of the current economic expansion. Heres why. The NBER officially designated November 2001 as the bottom of the last recession, meaning that the November report marked the third anniversary of the upturn. During this 36-month period total non-farm payroll employment increased only 0.9%, a number that pales in comparison to past cycles. Over the last seven economic expansions the average rise for a comparable period was 8.7%. If that were the case on the current cycle there would have been 10.2 million more jobs than the total number reported for November, and the average monthly increase for the 36-month period would have been 316,000 per month. Instead the average monthly rise was a paltry 33,000, and even over the past 12 months when employment picked up somewhat, the average monthly increase came to only 171,000, a far cry from the typical cyclical increase. In fact only three months of the 36 showed increases of more than 300,000 jobs.

Snip ......

http://www.comstockfunds.com/screenprint.cfm?newsletter...
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
50. Just under 50K, household of One
for me. I looked for this job for two years, so I'l still playing catch up.

No the numbers don't surprise me. I've known something similar. It's not easy to find a career track that pays decently. Or not to rack up significant debt. It's damn scarey at times.
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HeeBGBz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
52. About $12,000 to $13,000
I work in a restaurant. My wage is 2.55 an hour plus tips.

When I started doing restaurant work 35 years ago, I made $1.10. That's an increase of $1.40 over three decades.

Incidentally, I also wrote and had a book published in 1997. That taught me that no matter how good the writing may be, success is in the selling. My heart is in being a writer, but I am a serving wench to pay the bills.
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Ferretherder Donating Member (991 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
53. Right under $30,000.
'I'm in the money!'
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Tracer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
54. I'm old enough to remember ...
... when I made $12,000 per year ... thinking that if I ONLY could make $17,000, I'd be really comfortable.

... when my husband and I looked for our first house, we decided that we couldn't afford the $27,000 house we liked, and bought a house for $24,000. That $3000 extra seemed insurmountable.

Now, many years later (and single), I count myself lucky. That (paid-off) $24,000 house is now worth $500,000. I owe nothing to anyone, not even on a car.

Yet, as a self-employed person, I rarely break the $30,000 mark. I live lean and mean, and forgo many "luxuries".

It's my (grown) children that I worry about. What does their future look like?
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bluedonkey Donating Member (644 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
56. Little over $12,000 per year
I live alone with my dogs and cats in a pretty run down house,but I'm grateful I have a roof over my head I can afford.I'm fixing it up,slowly and whenever I have a little extra $.
I work in a mental hospital and have health insurance.
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tjdee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
57. Yet Republicans STILL think they're in the top 1%!!
That boggles my mind, that they think they are paying for everything with their stupid...50K or whatever--or as your info suggests, their stupid 30K !!

I was so happy when Kerry explained that it was for people making over 200K, that's one thing I so appreciated.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
66. This year just under $30,000, down from around $50,000
My husband's bosses company went under and he has struggled to try to start his own business.
As for me, I am paid by the hour. This year, we had several unpaid days off due to slow business and I was also sick, which is unpaid time, several days this year. I also almost got no overtime. Even though I had gotten a 40 cent per hour raise last year, I still made less this year.
This drop in income has made us go from being able to pay our bills and buy little things that we want to being afraid to answer the phone because of bill collectors.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
67. Lot of households here that make 2, 3, 4X what mine does...
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 02:20 PM by BiggJawn
No wonder I get misunderstood and ignored a lot.
Yeah, I got a "thing" about it.

"How can a man who's warm understand a man who's cold?"-A. S.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #67
71. Just ignore people that don't "get it".
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 03:31 PM by JanMichael
That's what I do and it works splendedly.

Think of it this way, lower income people are likely to have less access to the internet, so they're really not well represented here.

Just look at the results of the poll:

Under $30,000 (35% of US Households) (62 votes,21%)

Between $30,001 and $40,000 (11% of US Households/46% total under) (23 votes, 8%)

Between $40,001 and $50,000 (8% of US Households/54% total under) (29 votes, 10%)

Between $50,001 and $75,000 (18% of US Households/72% total under) (57 votes, 19%)

Between $70,001 and $100,000 (11% of US Households/83% total under) (44 votes, 15%)

Between $100,001 and $150,000 (9% of US Households/92% total under) (45 votes, 15%)

Between $150,001 and $200,000 (3% of US Households/95% total under) (17 votes, 6%)

Between $200,001 and $250,000 (2% of US Households/97% total under) (5 votes, 2%)

Over $250,001? (3% of US Households) Mean Income $425,801. (4 votes, 1%)

No Income. (7 votes, 2%)



The under $30,000 is rather under-represented and the middle/upper middle incomes over-represented. So there's a loss of the lowest incomes and people to speak for them and their interests, no wonder you run into ideological walls when the latte Libs are dominent. Not that the DU poll is real scientific, it isn't, but for the most part it matched the Census numbers.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #71
74. Thanks for crunching the numbers, Jan...
Interesting poll. Thanks for coming up with the idea.
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last1standing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #67
85. "How can a man who's warm understand a man who's cold?"
Sometimes the man who's warm was once a man who was cold. I can only speak for myself here, but I grew up very poor - no food to eat so do without poor. I've been fortunate, but that doesn't erase my memories or the fear of not knowing what would happen to me. Then there's the shame one feels in this country for being so lazy and immoral for not having a job that pays enough to be more "presentable".

I remember not having gas for the stove and taking cold water showers. I remember my parents being afraid to answer the phone and then the phone not working. I understand your cold, and I bet many others here do as well.
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Ladyhawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
69. Exactly $9660 a year SSI Disability.
I'm finally saving some money by having subsidized housing, but things get really tight.
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Scooter24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
70. Between me and my boyfriend
We make just over $200,000/yr not including investments. We are both self-employed.

However, we have a roommate in our house, so if we add her salary, our household income would be close to $260,000 a year.
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C.C.D. Donating Member (101 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 08:54 PM
Response to Original message
73. Does not surprise me. We are under 30K...wayyyy under...
$6.50/hr is a good wage where I live.
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Greylyn58 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:03 PM
Response to Original message
77. Not currently employed
Been out of work since Oct 2003. Am almost finished with school and hope to rejoin the work force soon.

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SteveG Donating Member (833 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
79. That those making under $50,000
are in the majority doesn't surprise me, that so many of us who do make more than that does. I think this is a very good sign... many of those of us those that do "have" are on the same side as those that don't should be very encoureging to all of us. Both my wife and I have been on both sides of this divide, we do know how tough it can be and for those of you who are below the dived, please know we will not desert you. We do want you to be on our side of the divide, we are lucky, and we both realize it could change for us tomorrow (thankfully we are prepared if that happens but that is simply because we know that "this too, will end" and we know that tomorrow our fortune could evaporate).
Don't give up the fight.
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #79
84. I have had considerably more than I deserve
Edited on Sun Jan-09-05 11:05 PM by American Tragedy
My individual yearly income has technically been low, but I have to admit that it doesn't accurately reflect my living conditions, which remain comfortable.

If posts here are any indication, I may actually be fairly unwelcome here.

Yet ironically, I think it may have enhanced my perspective to some degree, at least in contrast to some of my friends who are paradoxically working-class and conservative. As somebody who has drawn a considerable amount of money from inheritance, I know just how arbitrarily wealth may be distributed. It often isn't remotely a reflection of one's work ethic or contribution to society. Public sector occupations that literally protect and sustain the entire country pay very little in proportion to the amount of effort and skill demanded, yet they are derided by the right-wing for being unable to save, unable to afford healthcare, for not having become CEOs instead! I wish that Dems would spell out the truth for the electorate, because many seem to overlook it.
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InvisibleBallots Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
80. To anyone making over 250k a year ...
Fuck 'em. I couldn't care less what they think.
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
82. Choice 1, but because I have chosen to be an at-home mom
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-09-05 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
83. my income has dropped by half since Bush took power n/t
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