FahrenHYPE 9/11 ??

[nostamj]

just saw an ad for this on MSNBC... with dear doddering old Ed Koch quoted at the end... calling the real F911 'a lie'

but, it seemed that the beginning was all quotes about Moore's movie, or, was it some slick ad FOR Moore's movie...

I'm confused

[Luminous Animal]

1. It is real.

One of the wingnuts that visits my board posted a review here:

http://www.upsizethis.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15866

[KansDem]

7. View the trailer here...

Usual cast of suspects:

http://www.fahrenhype911.com/

Ed Koch, Ann Coulter(?), and a couple of other Bush weenies that are not identified...

And I agree with the one person's assessment; MM's movie IS based on lies: the lies of the Bush/Cheney regime!

[southlandshari]

18. watched the trailer

I wasn't at all worried about the potential impact of "FahrenHYPE 9/11" to begin with - watching the trailer more than validated my lack of concern!

I recommend everyone watch this for a laugh. It looks pitiful.

Thanks for the link!

[kerryin2004]

2. The beginning of Fascism is great is it not?

Anyone that speaks out against your king is discredited as quickly as possible.. All truth is considered a lie..How many times have they tried to slime the reputation of men? Paul o Neill, Richard Clarke, General Anthony(cant remember last name), and the list goes on and on.. Anytime something comes out unfavorable, rather then address it, they simply go to discredit the messenger or the message even without ever viewing it..I watched F-911 again yesterday, and what I saw were interviews and video footage from news sources..I am not sure what the lie is in th movie.. There are those that express their opinion.. From the FBI agent to the author of The House of Saud, to the senators that are interviewed, but to say the movie is full of lies is simply asinine.

[Luminous Animal]

5. The beginning of Fascism is great is it not?

They can't prove anything of the facts are lies, so they attack Mike for his artistry and and claim his opinion is wrong and call it lies.

[slappypan]

3. Ed Koch

Now there's a credible spokesman.

[KansDem]

4. Check out this "buyback" program for MM's "F911"

http://www.worldaheadpublishing.com/f911/index.php

"F9/11"--lists for $28.95

"Thank You, President Bush"--lists for $24.99

HAHAHAHAHA--only a "moran" would buy something for $28.95 to trade for a $24.99 item, resulting in a loss of $3.96!!!

[Dark Jedi]

22. Fear of god is Greater

Hey why would they mind the loss? Afterall, some of these folks, despite having very low income, voluntarily gave a lot of it to Bush & Co. throughout the last several years through campaign donations, etc. (because apparently, god told them to). What is a few dollars now?

[Ezlivin]

6. The pot calls the kettle black...news at eleven

The ones who claim that F911 is hype are the very ones who use the events of 9/11 to hype their skewed viewpoint.

[Radius]

8. Free Speech

Everyone should be able to express an opinion about film.

I enjoyed it but recognize it for what it is. Propaganda. It is not a documentary, like The Blue Planet, etc. It has a political agenda, plain and simple. This is neither good or bad.

I've taken Film classes my old man went to NYU's Film school. We agree, good movie. But its mechanics and methods make it political propaganda like Leni Riefenstahl's work. Take out the Nazi aspects of the work and look at the mechanics and you see pattern.

Omissions
Contextualization
Ingroup/Outgroup Manipulations
Cynicism
Traps
Manipulating Cause & Effect
Modeling the Convert Communicator
Pacing and Distraction
Associations
Numeric Deceptions
"Shutting Down the Opposition"

http://www.workingpsychology.com/download_folder/Propaganda_And_Fahrenheit.pdf

[Bridget Burke]

9. It's a documentary.

From Oscar.com, here are the first Academy Awards for Documentaries (beginning at the bottom):

1949 22nd Academy Awards
DAYBREAK IN UDI - Crown Film Unit

1948 21st Academy Awards
THE SECRET LAND - Orville O. Dull

1947 20th Academy Awards
DESIGN FOR DEATH - Sid Rogell, Theron Warth, Richard O. Fleischer

1946 19th Academy Awards
no winner for this category

1945 18th Academy Awards
THE TRUE GLORY - The Governments of Great Britain and the United States of America

1944 17th Academy Awards
THE FIGHTING LADY - United States Navy

1943 16th Academy Awards
DESERT VICTORY - British Ministry of Information

www.oscar.com/legacy/pastwinners/doc_feat6.html

The first films to win were definitely propaganda--although for a good cause. Even after the war, some winners still espoused opinions.

You attended film school--did you achieve a career in films?

[Radius]

13. No

But love the art very much. I took lots of film classes but did not attend film school. My father did and passed his enjoyment of film on to me. He worked in the industry.

To be clear I am not attacking the film, or its ideology.

No film of any type should be above reproach.

[DrWeird]

26. "I am not attacking the film"

"it is not a documentary, it is propaganda."

[Luminous Animal]

10. Sure...

It is propaganda as defined by the dictionary. It is not propaganda as defined by the general use of the word. That being, information controlled and disseminated by the powerful elite. Leni Riefenstahl was promoting the interests of the state in an atmosphere in which opposing views were severely quashed.

And there is no rule and there has never been a rule that documentaries need not have a point of view. If we were to follow you and your dad's thinking then the following would be propaganda ala Leni...

The Fog of War
Outfoxed
The Corporation
Hijacking Catastrophe

[Radius]

15. You are correct

My point is that there is a sub class in documentary film, or at least should be.

There is a difference in a film that details the live of a blue fin tuna and F9/11. A big difference.

It is not about propaganda( a word that has negative connotations) as much as it is about the mechanics in putting together a film.

[Luminous Animal]

19. RE: You are correct

Why should there be a subclass? It is already labelled a political documentary and certainly that distiquishes it from a nature documentary. Similarly, there are different categories of comedy... slapstick, dry, dark, stupid... and yet they all fall under the the label "comedy".

I feel that your suggestion to highlight the differences (by category only) between political documentaries and nature documentaries or historical documentares would serve to ghettoize the political.

[Radius]

20. I see your point

Not the intent. I am just uncomfortable with the term documentary applied to f9/11. Mixed feelings here, but not about the film, just about what to categorize it as. Think of it in reverse, a film being applied in to a democratic candidate, and it makes you wonder about the categories.

Not a complaint but a curious point. Interesting times..

[thebigidea]

21. So, er - who said there shouldn't be free speech or opinions?

Did anyone here actually say you shouldn't put out some knockoff ripoff work like this, or are you just reflexively defending every right wing piece of swill that works its way into this forum?

Maybe you could cover the 1st ammendment rights of "The Weekly Standard" next.

[DrWeird]

24. Ayup. Everybody has a right to a stupid, misinformed opinion.

Thanks for the demonstration.

[bobbyboucher]

25. Geez, I haven't heard squaaaaawwking like that for a while.

Talk about parroting the rabid right. Nice job. And I'm assuming with a straight face.

[Beacho]

11. You may be a film student

But you're not a political science student. By definition, 'propaganda' is information put out by the government.

Moore never claimed 'impartiality', documentaries are not defined as history textbooks using moving pictures, and even histories are colored by bias and opinion.

[Radius]

12. Corporations?

They use propaganda all the time, no?

It depends on how you want to classify and qualify the act of using media to influence people to form political conclusions.

Like I said, a great movie, but not a documentary in the sense of The Blue Planet or The Civil War series.

Political Documentary, maybe. Different design and methodology than the above listed films.

It is designed to create a political opinion. Like I said, this is neither good nor bad.

[Luminous Animal]

14. RE: Corporations?

Sure corporations use propaganda and they certainly are the powerful elite.

You say that F9/11 is designed to create political opinion but I counter that F9/11 was designed to trigger political thought. No doubt that most of us who post on liberal / left political boards were aware of the information contained within but we are but a small part of the population. F9/11 was designed to give the population information that the political and corporate elite suppress.

[Radius]

17. All films, well at least the vast majority

are distributed by huge multi national corporations worth billions. They are corporate elite. MPAA and RIAA are their minions. Profit is their purpose for existence.

It is designed to trigger a certain type of focused political thought. Like I said this is not good or bad but a mechanical function of the film.

[cheezus]

16. saw it at WorstBuy when I was picking up f911

nobody seemed to be buying it, though

[goddess40]

23. Ed Koch high voice sound like Zell

when he was losing it at the RNC

[ObaMania]

27. yeah, the idiots at Best Buy...

.. placed it right next to F911 when it came out on Tuesday. A friend that was with me picked it up and said "what is this?" and I said- in front of many people- "Total dogshit. Some Repuke trying to disprove the truth."

Raised a few eyebrows with that one.

I'd like to check it out though, to see what bullshit they are trying to pull.

[geomon666]

28. blech

I'm sorry I even looked at the site.

[Luminous Animal]

29. RE: blech

It is true, "hype" is pretty much crap. It is also true that Bush supporters will believe it and are pushing this movie all over the internet, even without seeing it. For that reason, I might watch it or (hopefully) some industious lefty blogger will see it and rip it apart. Factual ammunition is our best defense.

[DemonFighterLives]

30. I'd like to get in here

I'm not a film student, but my take is that the BFEE is providing the propaganda and MM has tried to provide everyone with a glimpse of the truth.
Now I may not have all of my facts correct, but the broohaha over MM speaking at the U of MN is really starting to stink. I heard that some private funding was being put up to pay Mike 35,000 to speak. Also heard on the radio that they were going to play that hype BS at the Capitol to counteract Mikes speech. I've got to call some lame brains and see how playing that BS to our lawmakers can do any good at all and also that F911 should also be played there for equal time or whatever. Bloody Bassturds!

[killbotfactory]

31. Nothing says objectivity like "Ann Coulter"

From the trailer it sounds like a bunch of republicans attacking a strawman.