Are there any vets out there that can explain

[babylonsister]

this to me? I have 2 brothers and 1 husband, all retired vets. My brothers are rabid repugs and my husband is totally not. My bros attribute their opinions to their military background; I cannot for the life of me understand this. The only thing I can figure is they're brainwashed: "my country/leader, right or wrong," and have lost the whole concept of democracy. This doesn't apply to hub or many other vets out there; any perspectives?

[Spinzonner]

1. You're asking us

It's your DNA they share

:-)

[babylonsister]

8. I know...

that baffles me. My dad, age 77, is in agreement w/me. My brothers-NOT! Go figure. I have 2 sisters who support Kerry, one who is married to a VN Vet w/PTSD who also supports Kerry.

[Jon8503]

2. Are they fanatically religious or like guns?

[babylonsister]

6. Sorry, should have elaborated...

They're 50 & 52, respectively, retired from CG. One is religious (I would consider somewhat fanatic compared to how we were raised), the other is not, likes to party and/but is a cop.

[punpirate]

3. It's complicated...

... and ultimately, personal. But, here's a thought. The military is an artificial environment--everything is controlled by regimentation, regulation and discipline. It's more than a bit anal. Everything is laid out for one--what to do, when to do it, why to do it. Some people thrive in that environment, some bridle against it.

But, the characteristics that make a good soldier match pretty well with those identified by psychologists as those of a conservative personality. So, if one loves those parts of the military life above, they're likely to be conservative. Someone else, who may have stayed in the military for the early retirement, benefits, etc., but privately spends his or her career trying to shove screwdrivers in the more ridiculous parts of the machine, may not be.

Cheers.

[babylonsister]

7. Perfect!

The screwdriver scenario fits the hub, which perhaps is why he's not as conservative.

[friesianrider]

4. My father's a Vietnam Vet...

And a Democrat.

He thinks that it's all the brainwashing that goes on in the military (no offense to vets or military members here). But, oyu have to consider that there MUST be brainwashng in the military - how else do you get kids to go die in Iraq for some idiot from Texas who wants to reward his friends with no-bid contracts? You need the military personnel to be sheep to some extent; otherwise no one would go fight wars.

[alfredo]

14. they say that the adolescent brain doesn't have the ability to

understand mortality. They also lack the ability to think long term. When you are 18-19, you are going to live forever.

[bobbieinok]

5. in the Vietnam era, there was lots of talk abt mil needs young men

18 or 19 because they think they're invincible and are easier to convince to take the mil view.

There were several reports of older men (23-25) being drafted and not 'fitting in,' asking questions, etc.

[BamaGirl]

13. Really?

I'll have to ask my Dad about this. He was drafted when he was 25, and he has always been something of a maverick thinker lol.

~~BamaGirl

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

17. A WW II vet once told me the same thing

He said he was around 30 years old when he went in during the war, so they made him a medic. He said they knew the older ones would worry more about dying than the younger ones, so they put the younger ones into the front lines infantry.

[UTUSN]

9. Really, When You're IN the Military, There Isn't Talk abt "Politics"

First, as my hero Charlie RANGEL says, people who JOIN the military do so for ECONOMIC reasons.

2nd, once you're in there, you are just there, living day to day, doing your job, counting the days to get out. It ain't a college "discussion" group. You ain't watching CNN/Faux/MSRNC all day. There is a 4-yr BLANK in my life regarding cultural/pop knowledge.

3rd, once you get out, you get your college pay, and you get your job credits.

------What I HAVE heard : 1) from a combat vet who doesn't vote, "I credit BUSH because my benefits ($2,000/mo) started coming when HE was in office/power." Barf.

2) from VFW types, "We tend to do better (meaning, "cash"/benefits) under (Repukes)." Barf. And FALSE.

[jumpstart33]

10. I just lay it on stupidity and the inability to think critically.

Rich, cowardly, men have always been able to get others to fight their wars for them, wars to protect the wealth of the rich and cowardly men. They have been able to do this througout history by appealing to the mindless assertions that if you don't fight this war for us, you have everything to lose. It's been you will lose to the Indidans, the blacks (N-word), the Mexicans, the Communists, and now the Arabs. They make them believe that they are included in the privileged class because of their color usually, and hence these idiots can readily identify with the likes of Bush, although they have more in common with the black they work beside or the Hispanic how serves them at McDonalds. They just can't see it. Meanwhile, people like the millionaire Bush, Limbaughs, Cheney's etc., can convince these dolts that they are just like them.

[Kimber Scott]

11. Military people are just like everybody else,

some lean left, some lean right. No big mystery. If they all thought the same things, believed the same things, we'd be in trouble.

[BamaGirl]

12. Plenty of Dem Vets

This Vet is a Democrat. My Dad and his brothers' are Vets/Dems too. My husband (still in and an independant) doesn't even dare say the pug word around any of us lol. Most of the Vietnam Vets I know (Dad and his brothers etc) are Dems, and the ppl we know our age (30's) are about half and half. This younger generation is scary rw though, in our experience. It all comes down to religion with the ones I've talked to, and they weren't around for Clinton so don't realize the crap they hear about Dems being anit-military is exactly that...CRAP! I think it's a misconception that vets/military folks are all neo cons. It doesn't help that they really pander to that vote and the Dems don't.


~~BamaGirl

[greblc]

15. Guns, Pro War, Might is right

Not all Vets are Conservative. Many Vets feel betrayed by liberals because they do most or all of the anti war protesting. Many of them feel this undermines the Military. My Stepfather( A Vietnam Vet) will vote for Bush because of Kerry's protest activities. There is no talking him out of it. He is a well read , Intelligent man so It makes no sense to me.

I'm a Vet but I wasn't always a Liberal.

[rasputin1952]

16. OK...I'm a vet, and I can tell you, there are as many reasons as why...

people are in the service, as there are members in the service.

Let me start with Combat vets. Those that have served in combat, for the vast majority, do NOT want to go there again. But there is a sense of brotherhood for those that fought. As old as I am, I would not go into combat except for a) our nation was invaded or b) to aid those already in combat. I was a Medical Plt Sgt, and my thoughts on war differ from many others, I will spare you the gory details; suffice it to say, I would be there to save lives of my fellow soldiers.

As for those who hang out at the Am Legion and VFW, many of them were cooks, truck drivers, mechanics, electronics specialists, etc. I am NOT knocking these MOS's, but one out every 17 ever saw real combat. It is easy to be be pro-war, if you haven't hid under your helmet in a firefight.

I do not know what the MOS's of your relatives were/are, but I will tell you, when bullets fly inches past your head, or mortars or rockets/artillery are pounding your position, you have serious doubts as to the wisdom of your being in that position.

To be blunt, war sucks. There are moments of glory, but most of the time you are bored to death, and then spend half an hour of sheer terror.

I love my country dearly, and think that war should be the answer after ALL other options are exhausted. I also think that all of these 20-somethings that think war is great, should get down to the recruiter and sign up. Few things to me are more repulsive, than someone who advocates war, and has the capacity to serve, but just doesn't put their money where their mouth is.

Just my 2 cents from someone who has been there, and still wonders why...:)

[Hello_Kitty]

18. Attributing freeper ideology to your military background...

Is a lame cop-out. It's laziness and cowardice. Granted, I was a little hesitant to express my liberal views in that hotbed of conservatism and sometimes it could be downright detrimental to my career. But I was still able to form my own opinions based upon my own independent reading, research, and deductive reasoning. Many of my peers in the Navy would simply parrot the opinions fed to them by senior enlisted and officers. It's no different than people who hold onto beliefs because it's the way their parents raised them. It drives me crazy. Can't you consider the possibility that Mom and Dad may have been wrong?

[babylonsister]

19. Sure, except that they are/were

both Democrats. I can't figure out where/how these guys found this path!

[sr_pacifica]

20. Wait till they get older

A friend's brother who was in Vietnam used to believe and support every American military action. Somewhere along the line in his 40s he wised up became an anti-nuke activist and supporter of latin american leftist struggles. Have hope.

[The River]

21. Their World View

is rooted in the "mythic order" that is America (nation-state-church).
My country right or wrong. Don't ask questions. Someday they may
outgrow it and come to see the world in a rational/scientific way but only if they start asking questions about the myth that informs (in-forms) them. It's much easier to just believe the myth and cheer from the sidelines than to ever learn the truth.
They are not "brainwashed". They are just not yet conscious of
the larger, more complex reality that exists beyond what they have
experienced.