Wellstone family attorneys' statement on assassination theories.

[geek tragedy]

"There has been no credible evidence to support any so-called conspiracy theory of the crash."

http://www.rkmc.com/firm_news.asp?newsId=169

The law firm is the legal representative and spokesperson for the family. The family would have had to sign off on this before it was issued.

[DBtv]

1. The family doesn't want any more "accidents".

Fairly understandable.

[geek tragedy]

2. Wellstones are braver than that.

True patriots. I believe the Wellstones.

[redsoxliberal]

4. I agree to a point

they may be leaking things as well...

But I tend to trust them to be bold.

[noiretextatique]

3. they settled the case

even if they suspected wrongdoing, they wouldn't say so because of the settlement.

[geek tragedy]

5. Would they lie?

"No credible evidence." An outright dismissal.

[noiretextatique]

6. no evidence

would be a straightforward statement. the qualifier "credible" still leaves the door open, doesn't it?

[geek tragedy]

7. Not really.

If evidence isn't credible, it isn't really evidence. Just noise.

[noiretextatique]

10. as you believe

it seems very important for you to believe that...be my guest.
i don't know if the evidence is credible or not, and this letter doesn't convince me it isn't.

[geek tragedy]

12. The point was that

the families reject the conspiracy theories. And they have the benefit of two investigations, including their own. Those who believe in the assassination theory like to tell other to pull their heads out of the sand. This should put an end to that.

[noiretextatique]

14. where in that letter do you see anything about what the families

believe?

[geek tragedy]

17. Ummm, the part about

"no credible evidence." That statement was issued in the name of the families by their legal representatives. They had to sign off on it.

[noiretextatique]

sign off...right

this is nonsense...and you know it. you have no idea what these families "believe."

[geek tragedy]

23. They said there was "no credible evidence."

Not sure how to explain that away. When someone's legal representative and spokesperson says something, it is very much the same as the person themselves saying it.

[geek tragedy]

32. I know what they in effect said, through their spokespersons.

They signed off on a statement that there was "no credible evidence" of an assassination. Good enough for me. :shrug:

[Minstrel Boy]

8. It's lawyerspeak for a $25 million dollar settlement.

Many 9/11 families took the government's settlement. Does that settle the questions of 9/11?

[geek tragedy]

9. So the Wellstone's silence was bought, according to you?

"No credible evidence." Their words. I choose to believe that they meant it.

Not gonna debate 9/11--that belongs in that other forum. Though, those 9/11 families didn't each conduct their own independent investigations either.

[T Town Jake]

13. Jeez Louise, it's already started...

...just as I predicted in #11, before I could even get the post in! :eyes:

[Minstrel Boy]

15. You know geek, I think you're dangerously close to exploiting the family

in order to buttress your argument, even if only through their lawyers' words to effect a settlement.

You said as much in the other thread that only aviation experts are qualified to speak to this. So why are the Wellstone family lawyers, who wanted to close a $25 million settlement?

It's an ugly tactic, and you're welcome to it.

[noiretextatique]

18. right...to claim that this letter speaks to what the families "believe"

is ridiculous. i don't even have a dog in this fight, but i know :hurts: when i see it.

[geek tragedy]

24. The attorneys are the voice of the families.

Not sure why people can't follow that.

[geek tragedy]

22. The families conducted their own independent investigation.

They found "no credible evidence" of an assassination. This isn't the NTSB--it's someone only answerable to the victims and their families.

[Minstrel Boy]

26. The investigation was the law firm's, not the family's.

Associated Press:

"In a news release, the firm said its investigation determined that pilot error brought down the twin-engine Beechcraft King Air A100 as it approached Eveleth-Virginia Municipal Airport en route to a funeral that Wellstone and his group were to attend."

With a $25 million payday in the balance, I can't say I'm surprised the law firm would find this.

[geek tragedy]

28. Same freaking thing.

The law firm is working FOR THE FAMILIES. They are their legal representatives and spokespersons.

ANYTHING THOSE ATTORNEYS DO OR SAY IN CONNECTION WITH THE CRASH OR LITIGATION IS ATTRIBUTABLE DIRECTLY TO THE FAMILIES.

Get it?

[T Town Jake]

11. It is a clear, unambiguous statement from...

...the family's chosen representatives rejecting the bizarre "conspiracy" theories regarding the tragic crash. Thank you for posting it. :thumbsup: It's high time these ghoulish speculations came to an end, and Senator Wellstone was allowed to rest in peace.

Doubt it'll do much to stem to tide of the tinfoiler's though - they'll either start parsing every ambiguous syllable looking for wiggle room to "prove" that the statement doesn't "really" mean what it plainly says, or they'll start casting subtle aspersions on the "motives" of the people who issued it. I've seen it over and over and over again with the conspiracy theorists: arguing with them over their pet "X-file" is like arguing with a Fundie over the loaves and the fishes.

[noiretextatique]

16. it's a letter from the attorneys who settled the families case

i really don't have an opinion about the conspiracy theories, but this letter doesn;'t necessarily disprove anything. it proves only that the attorneys settled the case and found no credible evidence of anything other than what they settled for. even if they had found credible evidence given the settlement, they wouldn't be able to say so.
this letter doesn't prove of disprove anything.

[T Town Jake]

19. Yeah...you go right on believing that if you wish...

...but in the meantime, back on planet Earth, I think I'll go with what the Wellstone family's chosen legal representatives had to say about the matter, if you don't mind.

[noiretextatique]

20. you do that

at least you aren't claiming you know what the families' believe like ms. cleo who started this thread :eyes: me...i think it's a letter written by the attorneys who settled a wrongful death case, earthman.

[geek tragedy]

27. Listen closely, I'll speak slowwwwllly.

The attorneys are speaking ON BEHALF OF THE FAMILIES. They are their LEGAL REPRESENTATIVES and SPOKESPERSONS. The families had to POSITIVELY APPROVE of that document.

Comprende? The families approved of that message, issued by their legal representatives and spokespersons and based on the investigation conducted by their own investigators.

Why is the concept of a spokesperson so alien to people?

[noiretextatique]

21. this is a statement about the settlement

with one line in it that mentions conspricy theories. even the title of your thread is misleading :eyes:

[geek tragedy]

25. They completely and utterly dismissed it.

They gave it only one line "No credible evidence" because that's all it merited.

Hopefully no one will talk about a "cover-up" again regarding this issue.

[Zan_of_Texas]

30. I talked with friends of the family about a year ago.

I myself believe the plane crash was not an accident, based on my own internet research and extensive internet research of someone who is familiar with small planes. At a minimum, it is unexplained, and the number of oddities is very high. And, the behavior of government officials seems more characteristic of trying to cover things up and reach conclusions immediately, than of entities trying to find truth.

The problem with proving wrong-doing if there was a governmental entity or off-the-books governmental cooperation in the wrong-doing is, they control the evidence. They control the crash scene. They control the autopsy. They control the investigation. They control the toxicology tests. They control the tests of what's left of the plane. Simply, the evidence available to the government is massive, and that available to non-official investigators is less, and what is fed to the public may be tainted or altered.

Okay -- back to the family. I discussed some of what I think about the crash about a year ago with the friends, who live in Minnesota.

They did not really want to hear it, even though they have very progressive politics.

They told me the family did not believe the crash was intentional.

So, let's explore that.

Imagine you lost your father, mother and sister in an awful plane crash. Imagine your father, and to some extent your mother, has been a public figure for many years, and you have shared them with their public lives.

Imagine your life changed immensely in a moment.

Now, imagine believing that someone -- especially someone with immense power like the CIA -- burned your family on purpose.

Frankly, in order to function, and try to put one foot in front of the other, it seems not so surprising that the survivors might believe, or want to believe, that the crash was an accident. That belief (if they have it, and I'm inclined to believe they may) enables them to live without looking over their shoulders all the time.

Or, even if they have doubts, if they take a public stance that it was an accident, it takes the pressure off them and gives them time to gather their thoughts and try to recover, without worrying that they too will be killed because they know too much.

So, hopefully the settlement money will go to good causes. And, hopefully the survivors will find ways to recover and honor their family's memory.

I wish them all the best, and I think their primary job is to take care of themselves emotionally. Not be forensic investigators. And, not be a football here.

[T Town Jake]

33. "And, not be a football here." - Like up in that...

...other thread floating around GD right now that's pimping a book filled with conspiratorial fantasies about the "truth"? :shrug:

[geek tragedy]

36. You mean that book

where two cranks exploit that tragedy to further their own personal political, ideological, and personal agendas?

[T Town Jake]

38. Yep...that'd be the one... n/t

[Minstrel Boy]

35. Thanks for the well-considered post, Zan.

Let's leave the family out of this.

[geek tragedy]

37. Let's just leave the whole damn thing alone.

If people are so concerned about the family, they'll stop writing books about his death and dragging the whole ghoulish subject up.

[Zan_of_Texas]

40. Hey geek

Paul Wellstone has been silenced. By accident. Or by plan.

If there is even a 5% chance that he was murdered, I would hope you would want his murderers caught and imprisoned where they could not repeat their actions against someone else.

That is not ghoulish. Why would you want to silence those seeking the truth?

[geek tragedy]

42. There isn't a 1% chance he was murdered.

This is just something that the extreme fringe of the progressive movement is going to kick around without it ever going anywhere. Fetzer is a complete quack and loon who links to Holocaust deniers on his website.

It's the left-wing version of "Klintoon killed Vince Foster." There's absolutely no evidence to support it--just people who "knew" he was murdered when they first heard about the crash. Just idiotic theories about electro-magnetic superweapons which can shoot a plane without electronics down on a cloudy night with no visual contact. Puh-leaze.

[Zan_of_Texas]

43. Is there some rational link between Vince Foster and Wellstone?

Shall we bring in The Earth is Flat/The Earth is Round discussion?

[Eloriel]

29. Oh, bless your heart

Just like a dog with a bone, you can't let go of this.

I agree with the others -- your "letter" proves nothing to me. But good for you if you find it solves something.

Even if it did, conclusively, represent the "family's beliefs" about this issue, families can be in denial too, so it wouldn't necessarily mean their pronouncement was in any way definitive.

Tell me, do you have any other interests, other subject about which you're passionate, or is it just the Wellstone crash that trips your triggers?

[geek tragedy]

34. Yes, 1700 posts on this subject alone.

But,as a former constituent and volunteer for Senator Wellstone, I do get outraged by people who can't let go of the absurd, completely unsubstantiated conspiracy fantasies. The man is dead, let him rest.

[T Town Jake]

31. Kick - for the truth

:kick:

[AlFrankenFan]

39. I almost choked completely when I saw how they priced their lives....

How the fuck, even in a lawsuit, can you possibly put a price on Paul, Sheila, Marcia's, Mary, Tom, and William's lives?!

I personally do not buy into the assassination theory. And I especially don't like it when people compare assassination attempts (literal and figurative) to Wellstone's death.

But I'm at least glad that they are getting the case over with and I hope they crack down hard on the people who let this happen. I can't believe it's almost been two years...its seemed like forever...

[kwolf68]

41. No question the death of Wellstone was a good thing for the right

In much the same way Bobby Kennedy and Dr. King were taken from us, Paul Wellstone had the undeniable ability to articulate progressive positions while appealing to non-Liberals.

My wife (far from Liberal) even admitted that Paul Wellstone was a man to be respected, because he really “seemed to care, seemed to want to enrich the world and not just himself.”

My reply was, “He didn’t seem it…He was it.”

Senator Wellstone was a man with amazing heart, passion, conviction…He truly came “up from the people.” He not only represented the best of our nation, but the best of humanity. It hardly seems fair he is no longer here.