If Buddhism were a political party what would be its platform?

[sweetheart]

I've asked myself this question for this year i've been on DU rhetorically and i'm still not decided.

"Buddha Nature" is that all living beings have inside them enlightened awareness. This manifests in the world as dharma, or truth of the moment, essence of the moment essence of all things, truth of you, me, this computer and every blessed thing on earth. This truth, or "the highest dharma" is usually in buddhist scripture a series of very "good" things... like helping others who suffer in life, and treating all beings on earth as they were once your mother in 1000's of past lives innumerable to count.

That hightest dharma, the very ecstatic light of the liberation of all beings that can only be embodied in a living vessel, not in a book.... that buddha awakening is at various stages in all people who are themselves all in various stages of lifetime experience... The greatest love a human being ever experiences in its heart, multiplied to the scale of the sun next to a star. If you are an atheist, please simply suspend all divinity judgements and consider it a nice science fiction story for a moment.

I don't mean Bhutan. It is not America and never will be, but buddhists the world over are underrepresented CLEARLY by the very nature of AWOL and the democratic support of unnecessary war. Buddha nature does not have "unnecessary war". It does not have "war". It has the enlightenment and nurturing of all living beings. What is that, as a government. Libertarian social policy, and socialist (highly regulated) private capitalism. Taxes taken 15% transaction tax at the cash register, ATM, bank transaction of any sort including all treasury actions and wholesale finance transactions. Holding domestic interests to account for the public goods they exploit wrongly to the detriment of us all. To empty the prisons and yet have no crime. To end addiction through love. And to turn television and the internet in to the greateset global education and knowledge system evern conceived of. and no tax returns ever and no IRS... A buddhist would support a constitutional amendment to stop the executive from "starting" a war, merely waging one started by congress. Frankly i believe buddhists would start over with a new constitution based on this http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html (declaring those rights for all souls on this earth as buddha nature is universal, like cathox, the latin origin of catholic, i think), without the marriage penalty, and with a final article guaranteeing all beings the right to be and become enlightened.

Sorry for sounding jumbled and confused, as i also believe that buddhism finds all verbal knowledge and written constitutions unenforceable as true knowledge is living not verbal, or also verbal, but it is difficult to talk about without upsetting, as language "defines by its very nature" and pure consciousssness is undefined, an antenna recieving no signal. NOOP, undefinable magic beyond all intellectual comprehension, great love, emptiness, samadhi, god, nirvana, allah, tao, satori, samadhi, samsara, sahadhja, rama, krishna, muhammed, the force, the matrix, and no word suits exactly on its own, but between them a cultural collage... buddha nature.

Namaste.

[Mari333]

1. compassion

but Buddhism as a political party would be like herding cats.

[TahitiNut]

31. Do cats have Buddha Nature?

;-)

[maha]

82. Mu-eow!

:crazy:

[ontheMark]

2. simple platform

BE NICE.

[charlie]

5. Simpler

PAY ATTENTION

[TahitiNut]

33. "My religion is loving kindness."

:loveya:

[sweetheart]

37. That is beautiful.

:loveya:

[TahitiNut]

40. ... one ...

[roughsatori]

67. the idea attempting to "be nice" is an UN-Buddhist concept

just "be" would be a better formulation.

[Flubadubya]

83. "attempting" is the operative word...

In the state of enlightenment, one cannot be otherwise. No effort!

[sweetheart]

86. this is why i think conservatism is wise

The master is sitting with his novice. After a period of sublime silence, the novice asks the master. "Master, we could print a book of great wisdom and affect many lives with your great wisdom." The master just sits there. Ten years go by. "Yes"

A buddhist government clearly would be slow to act, as the governmental expression of "be" in politico-speak is IMO conservatism. This brings this buddhist to the political conundrum... of having conservative nature, libertarian socialist spirit, a love of equality and human rights... and realizing that these three conflict in nature. What is the natural state... and to determine that, surely silence speaks louder than words.

[Octafish]

3. Everybody Bodhisattva.

Universal enlightenment energy policy. Don't stop until there's a Buddha in every pot.

Please know I am not kidding: Yours is a fascinating idea, sweetheart.

[sweetheart]

77. its gotta be mayayana (great raft)

As the bodhisattva and the spirit of buddha that inspired me to learn it myself never would have lit the flame. Liberalism and evangelical spirit are part of "teaching buddha" and loving kindness towards all beings might be this in practice.

In mayayana, life is a lineage of great and funny teachers... Without the open teaching element to all comers, something core to the spirit of dharma is destroyed, and enlightened dharma cannot grow. When nation states go bad, they block the teaching dharma, much as the romans killed christ, whom i would call a "living bodhisattva."

[Terwilliger]

4. I think you answer your own question

it can't be a political party for its very nature would reject that

Let us all discover your truth... "that buddha awakening is at various stages in all people who are themselves all in various stages of lifetime experience" Maybe one day we'll show enough people where their core is, and we won't need political parties anymore.

[magnolia]

7. I agree with all of the above...it wouldn't be politcal...but

based on the teachings of Thich Nhat Hanh...it would be our civic responsibility to smile. :)

[belab13]

15. I love it.

eom

[Terwilliger]

24. that's a platform I would support

:hi:

[sangh0]

6. Another dishonest argument for

promoting right-wing, anti-govt, anti-tax policies.

Does anyone here (besides sweetheart) imagine that the Buddhist religions have a position on the marriage "penalty"?

[sweetheart]

10. i did not explain that well

The marriage penalty. I meant that in the universal declaration, i find it untrue that the natural state for all human beings is in couple relationships, rather alone living together with or without children. I do not like that the state even recognizes a religious thing: marriage and formal couple-dom. That is what is meant by that, if i read the delcaration wrong, my bad.

[sangh0]

18. More propoganda

The UN says nothing about the marriage penalty. You made that up.

[sweetheart]

20. good, i don't know where i got that

sorry, i saw a ghost. My point is that however the secularization of couplehood is not global under the law and should be.... as it is not, it is still worth mentioning.

[David__77]

8. I'm afraid it would be right-wing...

Not in "ideal" form, but in reality in the countries in which it is practiced by many or most it would be right-wing. For Hinduism, we have India's BJP party, a chauvinist right-wing force. I can't imagine anything different for Buddhism.

[plurality]

9. Buddhism is quite different from Hinduism so you're analogy doesn't fit

Buddhism is based on the equality of ALL living things, Hinduism relies on a strict brutal caste system, hence it's right wing nature. Buddhism would be politically anarcho-syndicalist.

[sangh0]

13. Not true

For one thing, Hinduism does NOT "rely" on any caste system. Many Hindus DO believe in and support the caste system, but many do not. Like other religions, Judaism for example, Hindus have no Pope. Therefore, there is no strict doctrine that determines what a Hindu *MUST* believe in order to be a Hindu. Gandhi was a Hindu, and he opposed the caste system.

Secondly, Buddhist governments have been known for heirarchy and authoritarianism.

[plurality]

42. well as we've seen religious governments of any sorts have those tendencie

that fact however has nothing to do with the religion itself as religious governments have nothing to do with actually following the religion and more to do with duping the people into following demgouges. The Buddha himself was a prince and set to be a king, but threw that away for enlightenment. Hence I stand by my statement that true Buddhism would be politically anarchical.

[sujan]

44. the structure of Buddhism itself is not anarchical

if you want anarchy, try taoism.

[TahitiNut]

51. Must anarchists cooperate? Can they?

:dunce:

[sujan]

52. why not?

when there's a need to do so...

[plurality]

65. granted the current structure is not, but I think...

the Buddha and Lao Tzu would have found much to agree upon. But I definitely agree with you that taoism is by far the most anarchic of religions. I even did a paper on it in my Eastern Philosophy class :)

[sujan]

66. Tao Teh Ching

The best poem book ever...

[sweetheart]

19. every religion has its sutras

In the study of religion, there is always a living enlightened person at the outset. Then the religion is formed by generations of followers and as time goes on, the magic eventually leaves the religion as it only allows one savior... whereas buddhism allows for infinite bodhisattvas...(living buddhas).

Too bad about people in early stages of life awakening getting confused and interpeting caste, race or sex as some sort of divine religion to prejudice. I find in the esoteric end of hinduism, that there is no caste system. Krishna recognizes no castes. Hare krishna.... the happiest religion i know. Geez i would find it a wonderful world to be ruled by the hare krishna's. Great vegetarian food, wonderful sex... :-)

Hare Rama Hare Rama
Rama Rama Hare Hare
Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna
Krisnha Krishna, Hare Hare

[TahitiNut]

35. "ruled by the hare krishna's"??

Oxymoron alert. :hippie:

[Robin Hood]

87. I have know conservative buddhists, and had to scratch my head.

I came to the conclusion that their practice was out of balance. They could have used some loving kindness meditation.

It is important to train with different practices in order to keep the mind agile and balanced. Vippassana may be the jewel, but if practiced exclusively, it can be a hindrance. The same for all the others.

We do not have a political party that fully represents the Buddhist mind and heart. However, The Democrats and Greens are the closest thing to adequate representation.

I

[sweetheart]

25. the anarchist conundrum

I agree that buddha nature is an absence almost more than it is a presence, and by making it its masculine "presence" aspect as an authority in a secular party, the imbalanced removal of the absence from the wholistic energy equation destabilizes the result... or at least that's my take on it.

By the very nature of "political party" there needs to be an authority in government or we get really bad shit.... realpolitick... i love anarchist theory, is like pure opium marxism, but really there must be an authority, and a buddhist authority is the most benign of all i can conceive of by its denial of intellectualism.... so buddhist awakening does not recoginize written twisting of truth, only in person representation. The tibetan government in exile comes to mind, the dalai lama is the secular leader of tibet by my mind, and if someone else think's hes the spiritual leader, that's their business. There IS an authority, and the tibetan buddhists learned that after being overrun by the chinese.. they were naive and should have been prepared to protect their way of life.

[sangh0]

27. Misrepresenting the Dalai Lama

Not a good sign of enlightenment. :-)

The tibetan government in exile comes to mind, the dalai lama is the secular leader of tibet by my mind, and if someone else think's hes the spiritual leader, that's their business.

Then it's the Dalai Lama's business, because DL thinks he's a spiritual leader, and denies that he is a secular leader.

[TahitiNut]

43. Like 7-up is the "uncola" ...

... Buddhism is the "untheocracy".

[sweetheart]

64. church and state

I don't care what the stupid tibetan governmetn is... they got run out of tibet for being incompetent at protecting tibet's people. I realize that there are a gazillion reasons and it is a human rights travesty... and all that aside morally... There are no borders in buddhism, and if he is a spiritual leader of the enlightened tibetan lineages, then he is global and universal as the enligthenment itself is. This is a spiritual fact of his job as spiritual leader. Tibet and its people's secular leader is for one people and not all people... and these 2 conflicts of interest beset the tibetan system IMO. A secular leader of the people of tibet is much more powerful in a democratic system. I support theocrasy not, as much as i find the dalai lama, the man a wholly honourable and divine spirit. Everything is buddha nature. But buddha nature is that there is separation of church and state. secular cannot be spiritual, it is undervalued wisdom these days, the lost holy grail of history.

[sangh0]

71. You are being incoherent

Try losing the catch-phrases that make it sound like you know about Buddhism, and just say what you mean. You're previous post is incomprehensible. For example:

Tibet and its people's secular leader

Tibet has no secular leader.

[sweetheart]

75. It has and always will have one

? as long as political power as we know it exists... dress secularism up in whatever clothes, and combine it with other relitious responsibilities i don't care, but if you asked in tibet before the invasion or of the government in exile, "take me to your leader", they would take you to someone, and that person surely would represent the secular leader.

I would never take you directly to a religious leader. It is bad ettiquette. There are some very enlightened lineages in the tibetan exile tribe and they generously teach the world over. And they refrain from directly influencing things, as disturbing the buddha is bad ettiquette, a buddhist government naturally belives in perfect honesty, ettiquette as SOMEBODY runs the place, in all organizations, and i was calling that the secular leader. I mean no confusion on grammar or definitions.

Maybe everything in life is not a scam? Obviously I am unethical for bringing this subject up when we could discuss some death, murder, corrpution or some utterly innane conspiracy theory invovling explosives... buddha nature could not be. I left out jesus i realized later. Sorry, no harm meant christian folks... perhaps buddha nature might be closer to holy spirit.

Sometimes the proof is in the pudding. I find religious love and intent to be utterly fulfilling in every way, the most healthy blood i've ever experienced anywhere... reflected in the best feeling's i've read in this thread... emotions and wit repressed by the eternal state of war. Life is what you make of it. Sorry if i did not communicate to your standards.

In all honesty sangha, i respect opposition and i actually write to challenge as the more writers on a thread is rather better. I love to be tested and bested in an argument and as i mean you no ill, no harm at all, truly in writing this, as by my covenant with enlightenment to bear no violence towards dharma. If you want to question my intent, my suggested path is to write a better composition that makes your views on the subject and expresses them that people have creative ideas and feel included themselves, that they feel good about themselves and we can laugh at how unreal this virtual database is, yet how it made me cry. That they feel good about what is real in their hearts when 99.9% of the written propaganda in this world is designed to do the opposite... of course we are popagandists... and i am one certainly... why is a thread on love threatening?... is it bloody obvious, and indeed the wheels of time turn slowly but they grind very fine. I am not running for office and don't have to be coherent to be a writer on DU, so excuse me for expressing myself as i feel. ?? I'm not really sorry for writing anything.

It is a hot press, molten lead plates newly formed running off thousands of pages, and as the molten lead of the DU writer is always liquid, though it appears to be captured in words. I reserve the writers perogative to be not be who i write. I am the molten printing press... and i only respect being slapped with good prose.

[TSElliott]

60. I would not say right wing...

but I believe it would be more conservative than the Democratic Party.

Although Buddhism teaches compassion the monks in the temple live a strict life of discipline.

[imhotep]

11. The closest political philosophy

is Communism. However, Americans can not be trusted in a system of altruism. Some say it is human nature to be greedy, which is a lie. Any behavior outside of the Buddha nature is conditioned. So, we need to teach children that they don't have to grow up to be selfish materialistic yuppie assholes like their parents. We have a long way to go, because Democrats do not plan on changing anything.

[sangh0]

17. There is no behavior outside of Buddha Nature

and all behavior is conditioned, according to Buddhism

[maggrwaggr]

21. obviously you don't have children

or you would have noticed that children are at their most basic greedy and jealous. They're also purely loving.

[cprise]

46. I agree with that

People have both innately selfish and altruistic instincts. A healthy culture can promote them in the right way to maximize well-being.

There will always be tension between the selfless and the selfish. But tension is what allows you to pull your mouth into a smile.

[TahitiNut]

53. Well, that must explain ...

... the happy acceptance of China in Tibet. :eyes:

[belab13]

12. provocative post.

I'm currently reading a book about Buddhism. My impression is that the very nature of the religion avoids arguments for advocacy and activism. Though, at the same time, buddhist leaders throughout history tend to be progressive, supporting civic works and avoiding war at all costs. The king of Siam comes to mind.

Don't get me wrong. I think Buddhism is a truly enlightened approach to living and clearly the world would be a much safer and enjoyable place for all the peoples of the world if more leaders had a bit of the buddha nature.

[rman]

38. how is Buddhism a religion?

..as some in this threat seem to assert.

Buddhism has no diety, no woreship, no holy book, no prayer.

I find "approach to living" or "philosophy" much more appropriate descriptions of Buddhism.

[htuttle]

39. Are those the requirements for a 'religion'?

A deity, worship, a holy book, and prayer?

Fascinating. I consider those things to be 'props'.

[roughsatori]

68. You are just wrong.

Buddhism is a Religion with prayers, worship, Holy Books and (in some sects_ a belief in Deity.

Some sects believe in a Deity, others do not. Some believe Buddha lives through his teachings and followers, others that Buddha is a Deity. There are Buddhist prayers and Scriptures and even offerings made to the Buddha.

You are using "Buddhism" as if it defines one way of thinking and approaching the teachings of Buddha. I practice Mahayana Buddhism, but have studied Theravada and Vagrayana.

Your statement: "I find "approach to living" or "philosophy" much more appropriate descriptions of Buddhism." Is one that many Buddhists would concur with.

If you would like to learn about Buddhism here is a link:
http://www.buddhanet.net/

[sweetheart]

79. that religion part

The awakening process is quite profound, and depending on the stage, can be emotional purification where one spends years practicing forgiveness. All fixations in consciousness are ultimately challenged on the path, and at times, the ego enflames like a raving loonatic in fear of its own demise...

The process of having no worship, no book and no prayer... that absence is not-doing. As in one is "being" and not "doing". I find it ultimately pragmatic, and very scientific in that omens of awakening remind one constantly of how limitless life is.

The 8 fold path involves samadhi, and as it is difficult to experience samadhi fresh out of a toxic world, most of people can benefit from sitting with someone who experiences profoundly deep samadhi. This is called "satsang" or "truth telling" and for the period of that teaching, egos are not recognized. Sometimes the truth that is told is simply silence, that peaceful absence of ocean surf under a full moon. The various traditions all have an ettiquette for getting "learners" time with the masters... usually, the baby pig that wants the milk, gets it. That kind of education is a great gift, for which most monastic disciplines ask the surrender of all earthly life posessions and relationships.

This depends on whether you are in short-path mahayana path or theravada... i am a mahayana as it is a teaching, evangelical path by the very nature of the name "big raft/boat/ferry" as in a huge ferryboat big enough to hold all sentient beings... and that this great raft is the truth of life... the tradition of the raft is to have compassion for those who suffer... and that compassion manifests as spreading the dharma. However you meet the buddhist teacher's you've met will be through their compassion.

Depending on the awakening level of the teacher, the apprentice period can involve a few physical meetings and mostly dreaming, or much more physical meeting, or none at all. The bhagavad gita talks eloquently about this, it is one of my favorites. Somewhere in there, you have to discover an aspiration for liberation within your own heart that you will give up anything for. The sincerity of heart of the awakener is critical, as it takes everything... and most "religious" practices awaken and purify this sincerity that it be total. Some people get to this directly without practice. Some children need more care.

In my meetings with my master involved 1000's of hours sitting in ecstatic meditation. So his western students would not feel uncomfortable, he used music (tangerine dream) that farting would not disturb. ;-) I felt my heart melted away in light those times, some of the greatest moment's i have ever known.

Surely some buddhists do not have masters... i should back up. There are 2 paths of awakening the masculine and feminine. The masculine is becoming very holy through spiritual behaviour, and the feminine is to dance ecstatic emptyness in the middle of life. The masculine path might involve like meditating for 10 hours per day for the next 10 years... that in taking the committment to be still, one awakens.

The feminine realizes that there is no self, and goes about her business. She is mutable forming an ice cube from her liquid for whatever occasion and then melting it again. In tantric buddhism, the left handed path (feminine) is called "short path" as it actually really works, whereas the long path never ends. Short path buddhists can be cult like, all depending on what protocol the teacher uses to transmit kundalini (energy of meditative bliss) to the devotee... and devotee is the fact. There is 100% goodwill in buddhism. 1% distrust destroys the light. All human beings are embraced... and this is the faith bit... it is a wholly positive psychological abstraction, if it is not real... ;-)

An advanced teacher may not even meet devotees, and certainly many awakeners do not need teaching. By teacher, i mean guru, "dispeller of darkness" but as in all education, this happens in spurts, and the guru can be many different people in life... certainly your mother is always your first guru. She makes warmth for you and keeps away the evil that might harm you. A good dharma yogi meditaties with his tribe the sublime dharma tantra, and for that they owe everything. That is not said, but it is the obligation of truth, as the biblical aphorism about rich men going through the eyes of a needle.

So yes indeed, the ettiquettes, schools and protocols of community are diverse... but they are 3 jewels. Community (sangha), Enlightenment (Buddha), Truth (Dharma)... and in accepting the 3 jewels totally... (called "taking refuge in the 3 jewels"), you are swept on to the great raft. You can, right now in your heart decide to take refuge in the 3 jewels. Refuge in the truth, refuge in enlightenment and the enlightenmentof all beings, and refuge in community. Depending on the person and circumstances, these jewels can manifest very differently in life.

[Doomsayer13]

14. The Buddha teaches compassion, strenght through introspection

passivity and a love for nature. I have no doubt that my religious views have influenced my political ones (I am a Buddhist) though I am considerably more conservative than the mainline theology. Buddhist teachings are much like the teachings of many religious prophets, preaching love, tolerance, and social justice. Buddhists are often encouraged to be compassionate, that indeed fate draws us to the lives we live and that those less fortunate must be helped instead of looked down upon.

Still, Buddhism, like any religion, can be twisted and turned to serve political needs. Jesus preached turning ones cheek but here Bush, self-appointed God's man on earth, struck first.

It's becuase of this I strongly believe that there should be separation between religious ideology and politics, not becuase religion will corrupt politics but instead the other way around.

[TahitiNut]

48. Hmmmm...

Funny. I don't see teachers. I only see students. I know I'm blind, so maybe I'm only listening? :silly:

[htuttle]

50. (WHACK!)

Just needed to show you a little Grandmotherly kindness for that one...

[htuttle]

16. It would follow the three tenets of Buddhism

Compassion
Frugality
Humility

The 'mission' of the party would simply be to reduce suffering, in every way.

[maggrwaggr]

22. wait ... that sounds like ... Jesus!

Alert the right-wingers! Jesus was a buddhist!

(actually I like the theory that he went to India, got enlightened, came back and preached his modified form of buddhism to the Jews. His "son of God" thing was a metaphor. What he meant was that we're all sons and daughters of God.

[Terwilliger]

26. I dont think he ever said that

I think others said that of him

I dont remember an example of Jesus saying he was the son of god.

[sangh0]

28. You might be right

but Jesus did speak of his Father.

[Terwilliger]

41. but?

the premise was that he claimed to be the son of god, which (I'm pretty sure) he never said, and it makes a HUGE difference

By the way sangha, god does live.

[TahitiNut]

45. "god does live"??

Sounds kinda bounded. :shrug: Transcend the "is" -- too tense. :hippie:

[Flubadubya]

85. "Zzzzzz

-en"

[bloom]

74. I think of it as a metaphor, also but ...

did a Google "jesus said I am the son of God"

...this was the most convincing. Most of the references are pretty vague.

Mark 14:61-62 But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer. Again the high priest asked him, "Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed One?" "I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~pballard/sonofgod.html

[alfredo]

23. The four Noble Truths would greatly

enhance our problem solving, but the trouble would begin when we try to decide what is 'right' in the Eight-Fold Path.


Eight-fold Path:



Right view, which leads to:


Right thought, which leads to:


Right speech, which leads to:


Right conduct, which leads to:


Right livelihood, which leads to:


Right effort, which leads to:


Right mindfulness, which leads to:


Right concentration.

[sweetheart]

32. The last spoke in the wheel

What you called "Right Concentration" is what i was taught is "samadhi". This is the pure liquid state of ecstatic being, like really good sex, getting a raise, finding out kucinich won the 2004 election all rolled up in to one. It is a state of sublime ecstatcy, an awakening, a stillness, and undescribable utterly. It is life without thought. Once in those reals, noninitiate explations simply cannot suffice... that is why in-person transmission of the meditative samadhi's is a good way but rare as it is not valued much on this earth... or very valued by a few.

I will diverge from my more formal buddhist leanings for disbelievers sake that you might truly taste buddha nature if your a hard ass and really think it a bunch of monkey sperm. Take 20 hawaiian baby woodrose seeds, grind them up and make a cup of tea. Drink the tea on an empty stomach in a place where there are no people, as it will really open you up artificially to a very primal state without any of the prepatory teachings... and this unnatural opening can be an inspiration... it was for me many years ago getting me inspired, as i was soooo borg-implanted out, sarcastic, toxic and generally hateful before i discovered that enlightenment is real.

In the cinema, in the film "the doors" they are doing acid in the desert... i highly recommend it... as those woodrose seeds have in them the same pre-cursors that make up lysergic acid dyethylamide except legal... take them in a safe desert, and a beanstalk will grow.... the giant is real... it is your ego... be careful of it.

[TahitiNut]

34. Been there, done that.

Indescribable.

Q: "How do you keep them down on the farm once they've seen Paris?"
A: Forgetfulness.

[charlie]

36. Scrape those seeds first

If you don't completely remove the fuzzy coat, you'll be one sick tripping puppy.

[sweetheart]

49. That explains the nausea

I forgot to say, in the role of advisor having made the recommendation that you check a website talking about these plants and read around a few search engine results. There are suppliers who paint neocon chemicals on the seeds... be aware.

I have used a tea vessel where the spout is below water line allowing me to not drink the oil of the seeds (which is on the surface) from the spout of the kettle. Thanks for the scraping idea i might try that one day. I ain't done that in years, but it is an inspiration in a bad time, sort of like how the tibetan oracle would go on drugs in to the cave for 4 days and come out with a profoud vision... i think the american indians call it a vision quest and depending on the lineage involves peyote in an underground desert chambre, "the womb" in that language <can't remember>.

Its most important also to not encounter any neocon energy while tripping.... really you want a very pure location... south side of mount ranier, northern vermont mountains, much of maine, montana, utah, northern arizona, eastern california like Kelso. Profound ecstacies in the desert are life changers, like a multi-year marriage whirlwind... dancing with the unknown can cause incinceivable effects in life... being very revolutionary to use personal thermonuclear weapons... PMD Persons of Mass Dissolution.

[tlcandie]

54. Kiva ..

:hi: Enjoying this thread a LOT :)

[sweetheart]

84. kiva indeed

There is a lovely one at the back of a 3 mile walk in bandalier national monument... authentic of indian mystic design 1000 years ago. It was a good place to trip. It was in that valley that the 2 legged bandersnatch walks between 2 and 4 AM in search of uneaten homo sapiens. Best ye be in doors as the bandersnatch gnashes its prey. If cornered by a bandersnatch, feed it jellybeans. :-)

[charlie]

56. Not to turn this thread into a pharma-fest

but the physiological "noise" of baby Hawaiian woodrose seeds is way too high. If you're easily prone to gastric distress you can wind up spending a few hours regretting you ate them. I think psylocibin mushrooms are much preferable, no nasty side effects, and none of the teeth-grinding edginess that can come with lysergic amides.

[sweetheart]

58. yes indeed

The lysergic amide is an intense animal. The shroom option is most excellent... i found them all on experiment to be similar, flavours of wine, and certainly i like all the natural seed/shoorm trips over the chemical composites... unless i'm very sure the LSD 25-R was pure.

The websites about these seeds like this one http://www.seekershop.com/hbwr_seeds.html

If you link around you can see them talk about tripping and what its like, and what precautions to do it safely. There are also a whole variety of things that may work differently depending on the chemistry of the individual and their state of awakening and aspiration sincerity. Best if you have a friends who knows, but second best are the webchitchat room stuff like this... check around and feel what makes sense. and what is the truth. Tell the truth, hold the intent sacred to awaken when tripping and you will have a most profound one. If you know anyone with a sensory isolation tank, that is a real gas on acid. Or without for that matter... being totally awake yet unable to "know" the body experience was a trip on the seeds even with the nausea".

I look at this stuff like american indian medicine. Its sacred these plants and the spiritual path is sacred. Respecting the experience and the chemicals keeps you alive. Tripping can be dangerous, and some unstable people that do not respect the experience doing it in nasty surroundings or around neocon energy, that those people get really affected and have a bad trip. The psychological sensitivity of the trip state really begs purity.

[Yaoi_Huntress_Earth]

29. Interesting

I don't know too much about Buddism, but it does sound interesting. But could you immagine the shit-fit freepers and fundies would be throwing if we had a Buddist canidate? I've heard about how upset some people were about Kennedy being Catholic ("The pope is going to rule America.") Personally, I'd like to see it. The governmental WASP nest needs a stick poking.
Is anyone familiar with Ba Hai? They have some interesting ideas on how government and religion shouldn't have to be enemies and can work together. (Ditto for logic and faith.)
Love,
Yaoi Huntress Earth

[TahitiNut]

30. Since there are no 'followers' in Buddhism ...

... I doubt there could ever be a BLC (Buddhist Leadership Council). :evilgrin:

Indeed, if we met the Party Buddha on our political path, we'd have to kill him. Was Wellstone the Buddha? :silly:

(The cognizant will understand this: Buddhism is intrinsically "democratic".)

[Northwind]

47. There is no platform

The platform is an illusion.

[Character Assassin]

55. If the Buddha runs for office, kill the Buddha

[sweetheart]

57. and since there is no "other"

the buddha = (the spirit wanting to be liberated speaking in your intent) is the perfect-superego-authoritarian "buddha" and the ego that gives rise to the authoritarian. The buddha is not other. Buddhism is subjective.

[TahitiNut]

59. "Buddhism is subjective."

Well, I'd say that's the pithiest 3-word sentence in this thread. {giggle} It's quibble-proof. Awesome.

[sangh0]

72. More pith, less quibble

seems to be the motto

[buddhamama]

61. the moment

"...or truth of the moment, essence of the moment essence of all things, truth of you, me, this computer and every blessed thing on earth."

'is'.

[sweetheart]

80. i love this

n/t

[buddhamama]

81. thanks.

i hope you know that i wasn't being flippant about the subject or your words in the opening thread.

if you would like to know my feelings on it, i honestly don't believe it would happen.

i realize there are different buddhists sects/philosophies but,on the most basic level it seems to me that it would go against buddhism,even subjective buddhism :-)

in the moment the moment 'is' as it should be.

[TSElliott]

62. I don't think we have to worry...

because the ACLU would be beating them with their own canes screaming separation of church and state.

[buddhamama]

63. not if they called themselves

the Buddhists DEMs,progressive or whatever.

[PlanetBev]

70. As a Practicing Buddhist for 33 years

I'd have to say the platform would be to recognize that everyone has a Buddha nature, it lies beneath all the karma and bullshit we have piled up over numerous incarnations. Bring out your own enlightenment and others through acts of kindness and altruism. Also, to realize that the law of cause and effect is strict. That might explain why things in Iraq are not going the way the government thought they would. Agression breeds agression, violence breeds violence.

[Flubadubya]

88. "Everyone has Buddha nature"...

is absolutely true, even the neo-cons... a real challenge to the faithful Buddhist. :)

[roughsatori]

69. Buddha's final words "Be a light unto thine self"

would be antithetical to a "Political Party." However that does not mean that members of a political party would not benefit from Meditation, the ideas of the 8 fold path, and practicing "Loving Kindness."

[TahitiNut]

73. They'd have to be "big ferryboat" Buddhists.

I doubt the "little ferryboat" Buddhists would be interested. :shrug:


I've been under the impression that my stance of being an antipartisan independent liberal was most consistent with my "boutique" Buddhist/Taoist/Deist personal beliefs. Go figure. :silly:

[Capn Sunshine]

76. Without a doubt the platform would be:

ZEN HAPPENS

[salmonhorse]

78. Compassion, Understanding, Community...

And with a little creative advising here & there: Arcology: http://www.arcosanti.org

Conventions in Lhasa? Works for me ~

http://www.sacredsites.com/final40/613.html

No more bombing, no more flying airplanes filled with unwilling passengers into the side of tall buildings, no more high-siding this human condition, no more to pretense to this life as the one and only...