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Female U.S. soldiers taken hostage by Iraqis "raped repeatedly" ???

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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:40 PM
Original message
Female U.S. soldiers taken hostage by Iraqis "raped repeatedly" ???

I read this paragraph at http://www.usvetdsp.com/atrocities_iraq.htm
A Pictorial History of
NAKED ISLAMIC HYPOCRISY
"As for Islamic claims of outrage because Arab prisoners were sexually humiliated, every United States female soldier taken captive by the Iraqis, without exception, have admitted they were raped repeatedly while being held prisoners of war."

(I linked to this site from http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com which I went to from the C-span "I'm a veteran" thread.)

Can anyone tell me instances of female U.S. soldiers stating they were raped by their Iraqi captors? There may have been a case in Gulf War 1 that I vaguely recall...I remember it was claimed Lynch was raped before she had a chance to tell her own story, but I thought she denied it. And Shoshanna Johnson said she was well-treated. This site is a piece of work, a whole page of Abu Ghraib torture photos one by one, side by side with WTC 9/11 jumper photos, etc. Amazing, these people DO NOT CARE that the Iraqis weren't responsible.

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NecessaryOnslaught Donating Member (691 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. Osama raped Jessica Lynch!
Film at 11.
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lil-petunia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
129. No, Obama and the dems raped her. hannity has proof!
And any librul willing to oppose this god-given righteous cause to erradicate them stinkin, queer, atheistic camel-polers who abuse our wimin deserves to be drawn and quartered, 'cause you never gonna get rapture, bucko, not if I have anything to say.

And that blackie runnin for senator? in our country!?!? When did that crap become legal? Sheeit, we took this country from dem colored injuns 'cause they didn't know how to use it. If we allow dem into the senate, their color might rub off on the rest of us kristian gawd-fearin real Amurricans!
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CaTeacher Donating Member (983 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. actually, I have heard that this is true--
all of the females and many of the males as well. We have tried to keep it quiet--because we didn't want to negatively impact the morale of the military.

But SO WHAT? That does NOT excuse US for what WE did at Abu Ghraib.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. See that's the problem, hearsay.
Seems like they would use it to inspire the military.

I highly doubt that they would sodomize people, but I could be wrong.

Anyway, I am just putting this out there, because I haven't seen in print any female in this war say she was raped.
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CaTeacher Donating Member (983 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. I have a relative who is quite high ranking in the
military, from what I have heard this is considered common knowledge.

Several things that I have seen in print have confirmed that many of the prisoners suffered abuse. We have to admit it, people who like to hurt other people are often attracted to war--where they can abuse others with impunity. This applies no matter what race or religion they are. This is why I am for PEACE not war EVER.

But like I said above--that does NOT justify OUR bad behavior.

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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Unless your relative has seen any proof firsthand, instead of relying on..
...information from "rumor central", he or she should avoid talking about it. Just because it's common knowledge doesn't make it true.

FratBoy and Big Dick have been telling us that Iraq has WMDs and a strong connection to Al Qaeda. Do you believe that, too?
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. The claim made by the site is false.
Lynch and Johnson were not raped.

It says "every female U.S. soldier admitted"; if she admitted this,there is documentation somewhere, and one thing I know for sure is they would use it if they had it, these women would be all over the news and cable shows daily, yet, interestingly enough, all we see on these shows are female soldiers who have been raped by their fellow U.S. soldiers. If these women are speaking out I have no doubt that at least some of the women raped by Iraqis would speak out, especially since the gov't desperately needs something to counter Abu Ghraib with.
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #9
41. it's common knowledge that saddam has wmds..
take that for what it's worth.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #9
70. There have been rapes of female soldiers by members of the
US military in Iraq that has not been reported. I met a mother of a young women stationed in the Green Zone and she was so afraid for her daughter because of the number of rapes being committed by members of our own military on the females stationed over there.

I have not read or heard of any rapes by the Iraqis on female soldiers. I suppose it is possible that it has gone on but has not been reported, but I doubt it with this bunch of sickos in the admin. They would report the rapes so that we would support the killings of the evil Iraqis.
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lazarus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
113. a lot of things
in war are "common knowledge". It's always "common knowledge" that the enemy is vicious and brutal and will do unspeakable things to you if you're captured.

Of course, that sort of "common knowledge" is spread when morale is really low, to keep people fighting. This may be a clue as to how military morale is really doing.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Documentation please. Rumors about this kind of subject....
...should never be acceptable.

Besides, if this administration had anything to support those charges, you can bet they would have used it by now.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. That's absolutely true. They would have used it by now.
Since they don't, they let creepy crazy internet sites like the one in the header post do their work for them. And the site mentions no names either. I do believe there was a female soldier in Gulf War one who was captured and said she was raped, went on TV, but my carpal tunnel is acting up so I'm not up to googling right now.
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Demonaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
26. I've never heard this................EVER....and I read everything I can
about this war. This would have made mainstream media
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:44 PM
Response to Original message
3. Lynch was knocked out and did not remember
But yes, she was raped.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Documentation please.
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ThatPoetGuy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Why do you assert that?
I seem to recall Lynch herself and her doctors saying otherwise.
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The Shadow Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. No She Was Not!
This is a myth and has been refuted by many, please do not perpetuate lies of the media and this administration.
Jessica Lynch was near death and brought to a hospital. People that cared for her say that she was left in their care, no soldiers, no interrogation, and no rape!
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. That is what I thought too.
But the U.S. gov't put out the rumor while she was still recovering , knowing most wouldn't get the follow up. I did not read her book, so I don't know what it says with regards to this.
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tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. that rumor was retaliation for her setting the record straight
absolutely disgusting treatment of a soldier. Now we can watch posters here putting forth the same lies. caveat emptor.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. In regards to "her" book, it was written by Rick Bragg, a guy that was...
...forced to resign from the New York Times for paying stringers to do his work for him and then swooping in to claim the bylines.

<http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A51506-2003May... >

Rick Bragg's book deal was not with Jessica Lynch, but was instead with Jessica Lynch's family who were under pressure from the Pentagon to get the book written. Bragg was given Lynch's Army medical records which did not indicate ANY signs of ANY recent sexual abuse.

Additionally, from the time that she was knocked unconscious when her vehicle wrecked, until she awoke in the Iraqi hospital, there was too little time for ANY incident as described to have taken place. From the moment she was in the hospital until her "rescue" from a hospital that was ALREADY in friendly territory, she was cared for 24 hours a day by the Iraqi medical personnel.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. She was not conscious
When she was at the military hospital. She awoke days later in the Saddam Hospital after being taken there by Iraqi intelligence.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Right. So, despite the fact that her medical records showed no sign of...
...any forced sexual activity, you want me to believe what you're telling me?

Right.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. Saying that doesn't make it true either
And you yourself have not provided any documenation of your own claims.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. It's not my position to prove anything. You're making the claim...
...that Lynch was raped, so you need to provide documentation that supports that point of view.

So, back to where we started....where are the documents supporting your claims?
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #46
51. It's in her medical record
As stated in her book.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #51
58. I see that you responded to my post #24, but you must not have read it....
...try again.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. I was in Nasiriyah
And the doctor who initially took care of her told us she was raped and the US medical records confirm that. Additionally, she was accompanied by an Iraqi intelligence officer who was the one who took her to the Saddam Hospital along with Lori Piestawa's body.
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The Shadow Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. No, The Media Said That.
The doctor who cared for her said nobody touched her.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. The Media, eh?
Sorry, I don't get my information from the media, but by being there myself.

Also, she was cared for by multiple doctors and in two different hospitals. She was raped in the military hospital in the southeast of the city below the Euphrates River before being taken to the Saddam Hospital by Iraqi intelligence as US forces approached.

Also, I would not trust these media reports interviewing medical staff months later. Of course, they have a reason to protect their reputation by saying she was not raped. Rape is a horrific sin to Muslims and if they admitted that they let her be raped, then that would portray them very poorly.

But I don't expect anyone to believe me. No one usually does. I've found that people will just believe what they want to believe anyway.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. There is a very good reason why very few people believe what...
...you're saying about this. For one thing, you've provided nothing in the way of documentation to support your allegations. Secondly, in every single article and report that I've read about this case, her medical records indicate that there simply was no evidence to support the allegations of rape.

Now, when you say that you were "there", what exactly does that mean? How did you get about this information? Is it first-hand? Did you talk to Jessica Lynch personally and ask her specific questions? Do you actually know anyone that talked to her directly, face-to-face, and asked her specific questions? Who made the statement that Jessica Lynch was raped, and then who told you?
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. Sure there is, it's because they don't want to
I was in An Nasiriyah, Iraq during the whole thing and saw the actual report from the Iraqi doctor.

Of course Jessica Lynch doesn't remember, she was UNCONSCIOUS at the time.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #36
43. And you saw this Iraqi doctor write a report? I've never seen ANY...
...reference to any such document...do you have a link? I would think that the NeoCons would have released this document to the public before the ink was even dry. So, where is it?

In what language was this alleged report written, and how many people saw the alleged report before it got to you?

Ah, yes...now I see that you're back to the old "Jessica Lynch was unconscious" story. Interesting.

So, despite the fact that not one single credible account supports the rape story, and her medical records don't support the rape story, and you have no links to documents that prove what you say is true, and her book was written by a guy forced to resign from the New York Times for using other people to write his stories, you want to continue to insist that your story is absolutely correct.

Right.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #43
50. The Iraqi doctor was interviewed
And gave the account of what I had previously stated. I read the report the morning it was passed.

But hey, I'm just a guy on the internet, right?
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nose pin Donating Member (291 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #50
57. You're forgetting an important fact here on DU
All Iraqis = good
all Amurkins = bad

Get in lockstep NOW.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #57
62. I do believe most Iraqis are good
I have met many of them and they are a wonderful people with an overly genorous hospitality.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #57
63. All generalizations are bad. Try again.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #50
61. You're absolutely correct. You're just a guy on the internet....
Have you found that documentation yet?

How many people saw the report from the Iraqi doctor before you saw it?

Do you knw what the Iraqi doctor looked like?

In what language was the report written? Was it translated in any way?
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #61
66. And so are you
I am the documentation.

I'm sure hundreds to thousands saw it since it was on the network.

Never met him, but I'm sure he looked like an Iraqi.

It was in English. Just about all Iraqi doctors are educated and thus speak English.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #66
72. No, I have supplied a couple of links during this thread, which is...
...couple more links than you have provided.

You may be a great person for all I know, but stating that you're the sole documentation for something that you claim to be true is just not going to work on DU. In fact, I doubt seriously that your tactic would work on any other message board, to be honest.

Now, back to the action...

Now you're telling me that this alleged report was on a network of some sort with hundreds of thousands of potential users? What kind of network was it...was it being used solely for military and/or government purposes, or did it have access to the outside world? Who was the originator of the document, or was there any way to tell?
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
88. Don't you think you are one of those who believes what you want to
believe? The records you saw may have been amended to include the allegations of rape. That is possible. The physician that treated her said that she was fully clothed when brought into the hospital and that her injuries were so severe, she was fighting for her life, that if anyone raped her, it would have killed her.

It is not unheard of for the military to doctor records to serve its own purpose.

:shrug:
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #17
25. Oh, really? Interesting. Her medical records confirm nothing of the...
...other than evidence of OLD sexual activity.

None of the "evidence" in her medical records support ANY sexual activity as taking place in and around the time of her capture and hospitalization.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. You are incorrect
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #30
35. Documentation please...
Quit playing silly games and link the source documents that prove what you're saying is the truth.

No source documents, no credibility.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. Silly games?
Look, you believe what you want ok? It seems you have already made your mind as it is. I know the truth and it is no sweat off my back if you don't believe me.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #39
55. You know the truth but you can't provide anything to back up....
...your claim.

If the roles were reversed, what would you be thinking?

Here's the bottom line, Columbia, and you can take this any way that you want. I'm tired of being told that I have to accept information from certain sources as the undeniable truth without any documentation whatsoever. That's not good enough anymore, and if you want to blame anyone for causing me to think that way, blame the NeoCon Junta. They have lied about anything and everything since the day they took control of the reigns of government.

You only think you know the truth, but in the harsh glare of reality, you don't know jack-squat. As far as making up my mind about that, I came to that realization when you failed to provide documentation the FIRST time I asked for it.

No documentation, no credibility. End of conversation.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:02 AM
Response to Reply #55
68. Fine by me.
Media, I do appreciate your cynical nature. Lord knows we have been too complacent lately. However, I am being totally honest with you. I don't have the documentation, I am only telling you what I saw. I have no reason to lie to you. I'm just sharing what I know. That is all.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #35
42. Hey, come on, he says he was there, saw the report
Isn't that good enough for you?

I mean, isn't everybody on the Net just exactly what they claim to be?
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Suit yourself
The truth hurts doesn't it?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #44
49. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #49
53. And I guess you get to decide what is the truth and what isn't huh?
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #53
65. If you can't provide any links to back up what you're saying,...
...you make that decision very easy to make.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #65
67. Links! Links! Links!
How am I supposed to provide a link to prove what I saw? It is what I saw and that is that.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:14 AM
Response to Reply #67
73. Okay. Whatever. You'll forgive me for continuing to have major...
...problems with your story, won't you?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #44
64. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #42
128. yes they are
especially on DU
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nose pin Donating Member (291 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #25
54. You've seen her medical records?
How interesting that you hold to your belief so strongly, yet provide no documentation. You keep talking about her medical records like you have access to them. In reality, you don't know anything.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #54
59. I was there
And I have absolutely no reason to lie about what I saw. I am just trying to correct a myth that keeps being perpetuated here. There are two versions of this story going around and I am corrorborating that one version is true from my experience.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #59
69. You have absolutely no credibility on this issue until you provide...
...the documentation to back up your claims.

It'a simple process, really...you should try it some time.

But actually, we may be making a small sliver of progress. You stated that you are "corrorborating that one version is true from my experience". So, any rational person would understand that comment to mean that you have no first-hand knowledge of that which you claim to be true. Is that a fair appraisal of what you just stated?
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liberalcanuck Donating Member (339 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 06:26 AM
Response to Reply #59
126. By the way, how are you privy to such sensitive medical information?
Your story sounds very shaky indeed.
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #25
56. Have YOU seen the actual medical records
or are you going on a second hand report of what's in the records.

I believe in first-hand reports.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #56
60. Have you?
I am going on first hand intelligence reports.
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #60
78. Details please
You are saying that someone told you she was raped by someone. You say someone proved this to you. Who exactly told you this and what exactly did you see in the way of documentation. Describe the "medical report. Who was the doctor? What kind of document was it? Details!

Otherwise this claim of yours just appears to be one more example of you spreading reich-wing disinformation and repeating their talking points.

Let me give you credit for actually having the encounter you describe (so vaguely) and ask you what further information you can provide that would help anyone here decide is it was a real event and, if it was real, not just a run-of-the-mill psyops game designed to improve the fighting spirit of troops whose indoctrination was beginning to fail.

Surely you are aware that motivational lies are a standard part of military leadership techniques?
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #78
79. I just would not believe a medical report, even if one is produced.
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 12:35 AM by jdjkkse
Lynch was unconscious for three hours. Apparently the report said she was sodomized. If she was conscious this soon after the rape, she would have a distinct memory of hurting "down there". Period.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #79
82. Period?
She was just in a horrific car accident in which her companion died. She suffered massive trauma and almost died herself.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #82
84. Which makes me think that an additional traumatic assault,
which is what rape is, may well have finished her off.

And yes, she would have remembered pain if she was only out for three hours.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #78
107. It's all in the thread
Believe it or do not. I don't care anymore. Everyone keeps saying lying this, propaganda that, and yet they will believe the first thing that confirms what they want to be true.

I'm sorry folks if it is so hard to take. I tried to inform you guys of what I saw. In fact, I've been withholding it for many months because I was still in the military, but now that I have gotten out, I am speaking out.

Do you really think I want or like the fact that Jessica Lynch was raped? What good does it do me to make this up? It was bad enough that Bush sent me to spend a year over there and now I come here and try to tell how horrible it was for one of our soldiers and I get branded a right-wing liar and propagandist.

Thanks a lot everybody. Really. What a wonderful welcome home.
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:02 AM
Response to Reply #107
109. Details!
Who told you what? Were you being scammed? What evidence did you see? You are still withholding whatever facts you may have. I am inclined to believe you (believe it or not) but you have to go beyond vague assertions that that you "know" this. As I said, disinfo is a common tool used to motivate soldiers.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #107
110. The only thing that is in this thread
Is your constantly-changing story.

First you say that you've personally seen some report (and just because you saw it, does that make it true? Of course not, but don't let that minor detail stop you) that proved that Lynch had been raped.

Then when asked for more documentation than your recollection of a document that may have been completely erroneous or an outright lie, designed to whip up manly patriotic fervor (gosh, it's not like propaganda has ever been used in wartime before, is it?), you refer everyone back to a book that has been completely discredited.

That is what a careful examination of this thread reveals.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #60
98. Which is it? The book, or those reports you've seen yourself?
And how do you know any reports you may (or may not) have seen were accurate and truthful? It would NEVER happen that mistakes and/or lies would be included in reports made during the invasion of another country, would it?
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nose pin Donating Member (291 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:05 AM
Response to Reply #25
71. Again with the medical records?
Post them, or drop it. You're bagging on Columbia for doing EXACTLY what you are doing repeatedly.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #71
75. Hey, bud...I gave my position on this issue in post #24. In that post...
...I provided a link to the very uncomplimentary story about the author of the book on Jessica Lynch, and I described the circumstances under which that book was written. I also indicated what Lynch's records actually stated as opposed to the crap being tossed around this board.

If you have anything of value to add to the discussion feel free to jump right in. But don't feel hurt if I ignore your subsequent posts if they are anything like this one.

How does that sound to you...does that sound fair?
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liberalcanuck Donating Member (339 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 06:35 AM
Response to Reply #71
127. I would think the onus is on Columbia to provide a few more details
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 06:36 AM by jubug3
to support this truly incredible claim. The assertion that Jessica Lynch was raped needs to be backed by credible evidence, otherwise Columbia's claim is just hearsay.














edited for clarity
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #3
16. Do you have a source for that piece of information?
Especially since it contradicts everything else that was reported about Lynch. If you're going to post something like this, there ought to be some supporting evidence for it.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. There are two versions of the story
One that is described in her book and one from media reports from medical staff interviews months later.

The first one is the truth. Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #31
96. Oh, so when it gets right down to it, all you really have is the book
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 01:19 AM by meluseth
It's not "her book" and it and its author have been thoroughly discredited.

(spelling edit)
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #31
104. No, there's the truth, and then there's your version of the propaganda
:eyes:

:puke:
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Grover Cleveland Donating Member (83 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:44 PM
Response to Original message
4. they cummin' for our white wimmin' (nt)
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
6. Hard to see how any rational person can look at the stuff on either...
...site and not be completely and utterly revolted.

Crackpots. And they are, quite possibly, very dangerous crackpots.
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Curious Dave Donating Member (173 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:56 PM
Response to Original message
14. Lies and proganda
Nothing more than an attempt to smear Iraqis by making them look as bad as us.
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
18. With all respect to Jessica Lynch
on top of being raped she fought valiantly against overwheleming odds firing on her attackers until her weapon jammed. She was then taken hostage by the enemy and held captive until the heroic Marines came to her rescue. This entire story was bullshit. I cannot say for a fact whether or not she was raped but the rest of the story was bullshit. Just like that football player who was valiantly killed taking the fight to the enemy, leading his guys in an uphill charge. I mean accidently killed by friendly fire. I smell more propaganda here. On top of that there haven't been a whole lot of American POW's so....
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. yeah, when I saw her interview she said she never got off a shot.
her gun jammed from the get go.

The initial rumor I heard was that she was sodomized, and , well, let's just put it this way, SHE WOULD KNOW ABOUT THAT.

Then the rumor died down. It was started during the time she wasn't able to speak for herself. Forget Lynch though, anyone else?
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Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
19. Actually, female US soldiers have been raped
by MALE US SOLDIERS.

Repeatedly.

THAT'S the story they don't want to get out.

The shame is with the U.S.

Kanary
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. Agreed, that is the cold hard truth. And very little is being done.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
28. Vile and disgusting utterly false propaganda of the crudest sort
The only sexual abuse that has occurred in Iraq is coalition soldiers raping and sodomizing Iraqi women, children, and men.
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Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. That's *not* the "only" sexual abuse
As I posted above, women U.S. soldiers have been raped by MALE U.S. soldiers.

Kanary
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. Good point n/t
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #32
45. Theres been huge Sexual Abuse scandals
at the Air Force Base in Colorado Springs so it wouldn't suprise me if it was happening in Iraq..
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Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. Exactly, and that was just what was publicized.
There is much more being hushed up.

Including overseas.

Kanary
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #45
48. delete previous thought. Oh, you mean U.S. soldiers
raping female U.S. soldiers in Iraq?? God, wouldn't that be sad if that were the case. Sadly, since they have raped everyone else (male, female, and child Iraqi prisoners) it wouldn't come as a shock, I suppose.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #48
52. Since we're hung up on Jessica, this came from O'Reilly sucks.com
it's a synapsis, and covers the bases:


But Lynch is also a mite angry about the Pentagon's manipulation of events and can't seem to stop correcting the record.

She says she never got off a shot because her gun jammed. The Iraqi medical staff were kindness itself. She was out cold for three hours after her Humvee crashed in the grenade attack, so she doesn't remember any sexual assault. And shocked Iraqi doctors deny it.

As for the dramatic, Rambo-style hospital raid on April 1, she says there was no resistance, no Iraqi military in the hospital, and staff even offered the rescuers a key.

The Pentagon "used me to symbolize all this stuff," Lynch told a fawning Diane Sawyer on ABC last week. "It's wrong."

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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #52
74. Good site to debunk the myth that Columbia likes to repeat.....
....http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=Jessica_Ly...

Jessica Lynch

According to the German national news show Tagesschau, July 11, 2003 ("The Today Show"), extensive coverage on POW Jessica Lynch was based on lies and propaganda. The following is some of the key sentences translated into English:

* Originally, army circles had announced Lynch had fought especially bravely and defended herself fiercely until she ran out of ammunition. Now it is reported that she was not able to shoot at all because her weapon was jammed.
* The doctors who treated Lynch in the small town of Nassirija said later that Lynch did not have bullet wounds but broken bones and a surface wound on the head. Today even the US Army assumes that Lynch's injuries are due to a car accident where Lynch's car collided with another car from an US convoy.
* In the Army report published two weeks ago one can read that non-ready guns, erroneous navigation, and exhaustion were responsible for death and imprisonment of the US soldiers.
* The spectacular rescue of the US Army on April 2nd today is exposed as propaganda: At night US soldiers stormed the hospital in which Lynch was treated. The whole action was filmed. "We are greatful for the excellent and brave rescue of private Jessica Lynch," said defence minister Donald Rumsfeld to the American public.
* The Iraqi doctors in Nassirija reported they had offered to hand over Lynch before the hospital was taken over. But when the ambulance with the soldier approached a checkpoint the Americans released warning shots. Then the driver returned to the hospital.
* According to the doctors, the spectacular military action in the hospital was not necessary: Hours before the US attack not one single weaponed person remained in the hospital.
* John MacArthur, editor of Harper's Magazine said on the occasion of Lynch's return: "In America it doesn't matter any more what is right or wrong. The public is conditioned to believe everything: no matter if it is emotional stories or lies on weapons of mass destruction."

See also Jessica Lynch 2003 Chronology

Lots of good links to the TRUTH! :evilgrin:
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #74
76. Outstanding post! Thanks!
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #74
77. plus if she was only out for three hours...
plus with a head injury would she have even survived a rape or other additional assault?

But since no one else has brought up any other names, I guess this means that Lynch is the only soldier who "may have" been raped by Iraqis, and this is very dubious.

Wonder why the puke site doesn't question why the Iraqis only rape female soldiers yet Americans have been accused of raping everything that moves (except livestock, so far). Strange they don't account for this discrepancy. Makes us look mighty gay.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #77
91. The only reason we've heard nothing about the livestock....
...is the fact that they can't talk or write.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #74
81. Of course none of that has anything to do with what I had to say
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #81
86. Now why did I just know you were going to say something like that...
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 12:57 AM by Media_Lies_Daily
...you're getting to be far too predictable.

By the way...where's all of that documentation you claim to have seen and that I asked you to provide?
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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #28
115. What about the Iraqis who are raping Iraqi men, women and children? n/t
-
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:54 AM
Response to Reply #115
118. The very definition of a non sequitur
"a reply that has no relevance to what preceded it."

http://www.hyperdictionary.com/dictionary/non+sequitur
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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:58 AM
Response to Reply #118
119. And yet you found it worthy of reply... haha...
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 03:59 AM by Kiliki
of course it is relevant. There is no "one Iraq". In war, men use rape as a tool of power and control. Iraqi men are no less succeptable to such barbaric behavior. Look at the accusations against Iraqi translators. Perhaps it is irrelevant to you, but I am sure the victims of such crimes find their plight quite relevant to this discussion.
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:04 AM
Response to Reply #119
121. I found it worthy of ridicule, mostly
Thanks for the opportunity.

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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:05 AM
Response to Reply #121
123. Admit it, you have a crush on me. n/t
-
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:37 AM
Response to Original message
80. Jeesus H Keeriist!
Now I've heard everything! I would normally be the last person to seriously say, "there oughta be a law", but da**it, there oughta!
I'm pretty new at this internet stuff, but here I am, reading reading a bunch of debunked claptrap and watching Jeff Kincaid of "Accuracy In Media' spewing unsubstantiated vitriol on C-SPAN, which sorely needs its integrity filter adjusted or replaced. We need some sort of inflammatory statement law that says if you spread such tales, you must have 3 verifiable, quotable, public sources available to back up your statements or clearly label any info as opinion, meant for entertainment only. I'm sorry for ranting. Maybe I can hide behind unfamiliarity with the media. The Man was right--This is not a 'stress free' zone!
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #80
83. At least before Reagan we had the fairness doctrine.
Which meant we at least got to spew an equal amount of claptrap.

But no more.

This was just a link on an internet site, not really media, but it made me feel nuts, like I had missed some huge news, so I posted it to see if anyone could come up with names. So far there is only Lynch's alleged rape, which she herself denies.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #83
85. Denies?
"In her first interview about what happened to her, the former prisoner-of-war told ABC television that medical reports indicated that she had been raped.

She said she had no recollection of the attack. "Even just the thinking about that, that's too painful," she told interviewer Diane Sawyer."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3251731.stm
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #85
89. Right. And this info is coming straight from ABC and Diane Sawyer,...
...who was one of the cheerleaders for going to war with Iraq.

Sorry, but they're not real credible sources, and haven't been for quite some time.

My bet is that Lynch didn't tell Sawyer anything of the sort.
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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:58 AM
Response to Reply #83
87. She not only denies it but the best medical evidence indicates......
......that she would have bled to death had someone taken the time to rape her instead of getting her medical help ASAP! As a former E.M.T. from an ambulance crew I can attest that the internal bleeding she suffered from the injuries suffered in a 45 MPH crash in a Humvee into an overturned tractor trailer that killed others in her vehicle (fractured arm, femur, compression fracture to her spine and bleeding head wound) she would have surely bled to death with the additional trauma sustained during the time it would have taken to undress her and rape her. The hospital reports all say the same thing about cutting her uniform off to address her injuries.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #87
90. Oh, come on now...you're making too much sense!...
...and some posters on this board don't respond very well to that kind of tactic.

Thanks again for the excellent info.
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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:14 AM
Response to Reply #90
95. Not a problem.....
.....I've been watching the postings of several people here who fit the D5E profile for a while now. :)

For those who haven't become aware of D5E, here's a link to some fascinating information about what you've been experiencing lately.

D5E:destruction, degradation, denial, disruption, deceit, and exploitation

CONCEPT PAPER



Working Group on Preventive and Preemptive Military Intervention


William W. Keller and Gordon R. Mitchell1
Project Coordinators


<Snip>

U.S. Senator Jay Rockefeller (D-WV), the ranking Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, called for an FBI investigation into the forgery of documents cited by President Bush and Secretary Powell as proof of Iraqs nuclear transactions with Niger. As Rockefeller explained in a letter to FBI Director Robert Mueller: There is a possibility that the fabrication of these documents may be part of a larger deception campaign aimed at manipulating public opinion and foreign policy regarding Iraq.26

The timeliness of Rockefellers proposed inquiry was underscored by the appearance of official documents that lay out official American deception plans: "In a document last autumn, the joint chiefs of staff stressed the need for strategic deception and influence operations as tools of war. The army, navy and air force have been directed to devise plans for information warfare."27

According to defense analyst William Arkin, the Bush strategy lays out goals for information warfare that pursue D5E: "destruction, degradation, denial, disruption, deceit, and exploitation." Arkin notes that the wide array of sites and ractices of information control brought into the range of this policy "blurs or even erases the boundaries between factual information and news, on the one hand, and public relations, propaganda and psychological warfare on the other."28

This fusion of military deception programs with media propaganda efforts enabled the Office of Strategic Influence to commission officers from the U.S. Army's Psychological Operations Command to work as interns in the news division of CNN.29

Eventually, the Bush Administration was burned by the political heat generated when the Office of Strategic Influence was leaked to the media. The ensuing firestorm of controversy prompted Secretary Rumsfeld to close the propaganda unit. Yet less than a year later, Rumsfeld stipulated that his action had only been symbolic, and that information warfare missions were still underway at other Pentagon offices: And then there was the Office of Strategic Influence. You may recall that.
And oh my goodness gracious isn't that terrible, Henny Penny the sky is going to fall. I went down that next day and said fine, if you want to savage this thing, fine, I'll give you the corpse. There's the name. You can have the name, but I'm gonna keep doing every single thing that needs to be done and I have.30

The political implications of blurring military strategic deception and public sphere propaganda are worth exploring, given Arkin's concerns about military deception that "while the policy ostensibly targets foreign enemies, its most likely victim will be the American electorate."31

<More>

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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #95
100. Want to kill a thread? Just post the above and see what happens!
Yo! Columbia! You got any comments? :shrug: :evilgrin:
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #100
101. i cut and pasted this, thanks.
It always amazes me just when you think you've figured out how diabolical the repukes are, they always go you one better.
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #100
102. Yeah
:crazy:

and

:tinfoilhat:
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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #102
103. LOL!
Thanks for the :kick: :evilgrin:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #102
105. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #102
130. file under "give em enough rope"
and theyll rape themselves
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:44 AM
Response to Reply #95
106. Welll...
Think mebbe ah bin down on the farm waay too long. I had tumbled onto some of this fairly recently and went into prefrontal paralysis and failed to dribble enough breadcrumbs, due to excessive late night internet research or perhaps an over ingestion of prescription pharmaceuticals, to be able to find my way back. Muh hat is off to you, kind sage, and I stand in awe. You've grow'd me up a bit. I'm thinking I'm maybe a hundred. Some digging is needed, now, with your compass and my mixed metaphor. I'm sure we'll cross paths again,soon. Thanks again.
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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #106
108. I hope so......
.... :evilgrin:

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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:05 AM
Response to Reply #95
124. This article's a GIFT! Thanks for the link. n/t
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #87
94. I remember seeing the film of Lori Piestewa, she too
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 01:14 AM by jdjkkse
had a head injury, it was awful, they were lying side by side on cots on this tape. I wonder if this film was made during the time Lynch was unconscious and allegedly "being raped". wouldn't that be interesting. I don't know how long Ms. Piestewa lived after her injuries were sustained; one of the reasons that Lynch took such issue with the Pentagon spin was because of the fact that Piestewa HAD acted heroically, and because of the fact that Lynch came to the realization that had this war not been fought "Lori would still be alive." One NEVER hears Lynch's name mentioned in the media at all anymore, so it's apparent that the Pentagon divested themselves of her very quickly when she refused to go along with their spin, and when she sought instead to speak out in protest about the senseless death of Lori Piestewa.

Looks like they finalized the renaming of Squaw Peak for Lori Piestewa! This is great, I knew they had talked about it, but now it's official:

"...the Piestewa Peak Recreation Area. This area was recently renamed, and used to be known as Squaw Peak. The new name was given memory of Lori Piestewa, a Tuba City soldier who gave her life in Operation Iraqi Freedom in 2003. The name is pronounced: py-ess-tuh-wah." (this from a tourism site)

edit: this is going to sound horrible, but I wonder if medical reports indicate that Lori Piestewa was the victim of a rape as well? Or did the Pentagon deem her not "usable" because she died from the injuries she sustained, and therefore couldn't show up for p.r. jaunts?
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:08 AM
Response to Reply #83
93. I kinda think
maybe we people have sunk so far into the cesspool there will never another breath of fresh air. When I was a small child, punishment for even small infractions was swift and brutal, so a nimble mind and ready obfuscation was an asset that took me years to recover from and a constant guard is still important. After being pretty much totally immersed in the dung heap of a year's worth of politics and this week of media monster attacks on the convention and its participants,my opinion of humanity has sunk pretty low. Probably the single greatest need is not peace or money...it's integrity!
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Demonaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:29 AM
Response to Reply #80
99. welcome to DU and well put
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
92. On a recent Larry King Show
Shshanna Johnson said she had been well treated and not abused. She said that the Americans, herself included were treated better than we treated the Iraqis.She credited the Iraqis with saving her life and her mobility.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #92
97. yes, from the beginning Ms. Johnson's behavior has
been admirable. She has been unbelievably humble, stating only that she was "just doing her job". When the Congressional Black Caucus honored her, she was so reserved and dignified, and took no credit whatsoever for heroism, seeming more than reticent to be there, and somewhat embarassed at all the hoopla. And she has always maintained from the beginning that she was not harmed by her Iraqi captors.
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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:28 AM
Response to Original message
111. The gulf war I women were raped...
If you google it you'll see the documentation.

Shoshanna Johnson says she was not mistreated. Jessica Lynch claims to have blacked out and her medical records show she was sodomized. My theory there is if she can't recall, then its possible the injury was suffered in some other way (like the accident) but yes- in Gulf War I our women were raped by their captors, in fact it became something of a scandal when several spoke before congress after being called to the floor in the women in war debate- and only after the debate had ended was the information released about their assaults.

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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:31 AM
Response to Reply #111
112. Her medical records don't show anything of the sort
Where do you get that information?
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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:39 AM
Response to Reply #112
114. I just made it up... oh wait, no I didn't!
really, you sound so affronted and accusatory, are you saying you havn't heard that, or that you think I made it up??

Here are some links, perhaps you will find them untruthful or dispute the information, but you can at least rest assured MY information is reliable.

http://www.herald-dispatch.com/2004/April/01/LNtop2.htm

<<<According to medical records cited in her biography, she was also sodomized, apparently during a three-hour gap that she cannot recall.
>>>


http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2003-11-06-lynch_x....

<<<In the book, author Rick Bragg writes that scars on Lynch's body and medical records indicate she was sodomized, but that Lynch recalls nothing: "Jessi lost three hours. She lost them in the snapping bones, in the crash of the Humvee, in the torment her enemies inflicted on her after she was pulled from it.">>>



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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:44 AM
Response to Reply #114
116. You're repeating propaganda--wait! Yes you are!
How did I know you were going to cite Bragg's book?

<<<In the book, author Rick Bragg writes that scars on Lynch's body and medical records indicate she was sodomized, but that Lynch recalls nothing: "Jessi lost three hours. She lost them in the snapping bones, in the crash of the Humvee, in the torment her enemies inflicted on her after she was pulled from it.">>>

This book and the author are both thoroughly disreputable.

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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:48 AM
Response to Reply #116
117. Um... not.
Did you see the records yourself? Nope.

Neither Lynch nor her family have disputed the medical record claim. So who to believe? The woman whose body we are speaking of, who actually HAS seen her own medical records... or the anonymous internet poster who is so hard to discredit any claim of abuse by an American soldier he/she has somehow managed to completely MISS the part of my post where I said I theorize the injury may have occured in the accident.... who should I believe, who is more credible to lil ole me?

I'm going with the disreputable book thank you very much.

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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:01 AM
Response to Reply #117
120. You're free to believe any amount of lies and propaganda
Those of us who are better-informed, are also free to point out that it's a steaming pile of shit.

The soldier did not make the claim, for example--so why do you say such a thing? The book written by a faux journalist made the claim, not Lynch.

I've read that there are no such medical reports.

Hmmm, who do I believe, those articles, or you?

See post 24 for the facts about the book.



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Kiliki Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:04 AM
Response to Reply #120
122. But I'm not believing your lies and propoganda so its all good! n/t
-
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:07 AM
Response to Reply #122
125. By all means make sure you believe the RIGHT lies and propaganda n/t
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tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #111
131. not to mention the incubators
should we google those as well?
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