How to Fight the Religious Right

[gully]

http://www.elroy.net/ehr/fighttheright.html

A taste of what the site has to offer here;

"LIBERALS ARE ANTI-GOD"

Not true. The Bible doesn't support multi-national capitalist companies. Rather it says greed is a sin (1 Corinthians 6:10). The Bible doesn't support the notion that we all deserve to have big cars, big houses, and even bigger churches in which to worship. In fact, gluttony is a sin (Proverbs 28:7). The Bible doesn't even say we should oppose taxes. Christ told his followers to pay them (Mark 12:17).

And, in a part of the Bible that most donation-driven Fundamentalists seem to ignore, in the very first Christian church, conservative Capitalism was not the rule of the day. The first church was pure Communism. In Acts 2:44-45 we read "All who believed were together and had all things in common; and they sold their possessions and goods and distributed them to all, as any had need." Sounds a lot like Karl Marx's famous statement about Communism when he wrote that it would take "from each according to his ability to each according to his need." In the beginning, the Christian Church stood for equality and the redistribution of wealth, not for huge churches and even bigger so-called Christian broadcasting networks that spend millions of dollars in donated funds on five-star-hotel-quality buildings and even fancier satellite networks.

Here is some interesting information on what Progressive Christians are accomplishing as well.


http://beliefnet.org/frameset.asp?pageLoc=/story/37/story_3789_1.html&boardID=4828

[Muddleoftheroad]

1. I wish you were right

But I have seen how ugly the anti-religion threads get here.

[gully]

3. Goodness, not trying to be 'anti-religion' at all...

Just giving a different perspective...which is why I posted about Progressive Christians also...

Peace

[Blue_Chill]

14. I don't think muddle was talking about you

Your thread is helpful. However there are many on this baord and within the left wing that simply don't want Christians in their party.

[gully]

17. Gosh, who are they going to vote for then?

Lieberman? I don't know of many non-christian progressives running do you guys?

[Mel]

5. I don't think it's

anti-religion to point out how Xtians are twisting religion. I think people that are Christians should start sticking up for what Christ taught and stop letting zealots speak for them. I'm glad they are it's about time.

[Blue_Chill]

13. What's the motivation to stay in the democratic party?

When most liberals on this board are openly hostile? Christian that do stick up for what Christianity is realy about (like me) are attacked for not keeping my mouth shut while someone calls me a cancer on the earth.

I think Muddleoftheroad makes a good point. More and more Christians that I know may agree with the left but can't be fully accepted. Catholics have tradtionaly been democrats and in case you haven't noticed that trend has shifted.

[gully]

16. Here here...

I feel out of place in church because I'm a 'progressive/liberal' what eva? And, out of place here being Christian. :shrug:

I find it ironic that a person who calls them selves progressive and/or liberal and supposedly hates intollerance, would be so guilty of it themselves.

[Blue_Chill]

29. Wha?

Who exactly am I intolerant of? Name the group. I defend my faith I don't attack the beliefs of others.

Like it or not what I said is true, the left is becoming openly hostile to religious persons.

[Dob Bole]

38. Things that the "Religious Left" has done...

Thanks to applied "social gospel," or the What Would Jesus Do question, before it was ripped off by the whole bracelet thing:

Remember the Civil Rights Movement? Martin Luther King?

Remember the Knights of Labor, one of the First Labor Unions?

Remember Jimmy Carter, the best human rights president we've ever had?


All of these people were EVANGELICALS. So I find it a pity that the religious right has had so much influence among them, or that the media confuses the two.

[Blue_Chill]

39. You don't need to remind me

Tell that to those that feel religion and liberalism can't mix.

[rasputin1952]

2. I have found nothing of Christianity...

in the Religious Right.

I also find little of Christianity in many of the mainstream churches we are more used to.

The message was lost long ago, and the accrual of wealth and power has become the most prized thing in many "churches" and "Christian"
sects.

The cause of this are numeerous, but basically, it comes down to intellectual laziness. We find it easier for others to tell us HOW to think, and WHAT to think, rather than seek answers for oourselves. Thsi is an old ploy, when clergy were the only ones permitted an education; ignorance is fertile ground for many bad thoughts and ideologies.

In any case, if we look at the Scriptures and actually seek the truth, there is much to be learned. Whether one belkieves that Jesus was the Son of God or not, the Bible has many lessons in it, and should not be overlooked as a testament to man's morality, (or lack of morality).

What people should be frightened of, are the "pick and choose Christians", they are the ones that demand salvation by vindication.


We all may be flawed, but we are not all beyond salvation. Those that would condemn other for their behavior while committing behavior that is equally iniquitous, are little more than hypocrites. And hypocrites are the number one target in the Bible, and in many other religions.

Search for the Truth, whatever youo perceive it to be, never stop because your are comfotable in one aspect; reject those things that do harm to others, and keep honesty and love as your goals.

[SharonAnn]

36. My friend say "The Religious Right is neither"

and that about sums it up for me.

[izzie]

4. This is to be printd and re-read. I can not even find out whar Bible they

n/t

[Blue-Jay]

6. I can respect nearly anyone's religious beliefs.

That being said, I truly believe that religious zealotry (is that a word?) is the root cause for many of the world's ills. The other major cause is greed. When you combine them, you get two great tastes that taste great together....or something.

(speling edut)

[Blue_Chill]

15. religious zealotry is not the problem

The misuse of it is. When a person simply believes strongly and lives their own lives by a strict code, they really bother no one. When they try to force other to live by that strict code they become a problem.

[Clete]

7. The bible was written for people who lived

two thousand years ago. There is much we can gain from the wisdom of ancestors from the past, but one size certainly doesn't fit all in this age. It can't address the moral problems of today because ancient people didn't have electricity, technology and advanced science to deal with. This is what is wrong with fundamentalists and actually other religions. They are trying to apply traditions that were perhaps the best solution for their times, but which are woefully inadequate and antiquated for our times.

[Muddleoftheroad]

20. Not entirely

I find the 10 Commandments a good starting point even now. I wish more people did.

[billyskank]

25. Fundamentalists

In my own faith, I take every word of our scriptures completely seriously. I take the view that, if you're going to accept the authority of scripture, it is a nonsense to then ignore some parts of it because it doesn't fit your lifestyle.

This must surely make me a fundamentalist. But I'm no danger to anyone, because it is not my job to make sure everyone else is following the rules. My faith is a minority one in the west, so most people won't accept my particular religious rules anyway.

I just wanted to make the point that it's not fundamentalism that's necessarily the problem, since to be a fundamentalist just means to have complete and unquetioning faith in scripture, but what is a problem is when people think everyone else should follow their own religious rules, and get angry (and maybe violent) when they don't.


On edit: removed superfluous "anyway".

[donco6]

8. The Bible is irrelevant to me.

And I don't bother to engage in discussions about what it "really means" with the RW fundies. I just don't care.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

9. The religious right is to Christianity what conservatism is to

compassion.

If one reads the words of Jesus, the ones usually highlighted in red, you won't find the vitriolic narrow mindedness, hatred, self-righteousness, and greed, espoused by the RR. When the likes of Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Tom DeLay and their ilk spout off bible verses they are fond of the old testament, fire and brimstone, blood and sword verses of Exodus, Leviticus, Deutoronomy, etc, or the nightmare visions of Revelations. Seldom, if ever, do you hear them quote the words of Jesus. Quite unlike Martin Luther King, Desmond Tutu, the MaryKnoll sisters (who protest war and injustice), etc, who do so because of the teachings of Jesus.

Religious leaders and thinkers have often been at the forefront of stuggles for justice, peace, equality and liberation:

Martin Luther King
Desmond Tutu
Mohandas K. Gandhi
Leo Tolstoy
The Southern Christian Leadership Council
The "liberation theology" Catholic priests in Latin America that the right wing landowners and persecuted.
The MaryKnoll sisters who are in prison because they protested at nuclear missle sites.
The Berrigan brothers.

and many more.

I view most of the attacks on "religion" here at DU as the rantings of adolescents trying to offend, people with little understanding of religion, those who have suffered or have been (rightfully) offended by the bigotry of "fundamentalists".

I view the religious right as, if anything, unChristian, even anti-Christian.

Just like their spiritual brothers, the fundamentalist Islamists, they pick & choose the words that suit their own ends, ignore the rest or pervert it, and miss the message.

BTW I'm an agnostic. No, not a lukewarm athiest, or a tepid believer, an agnostic. The universe is a big and mysterious place and there's a lot I just don't know.

[xchrom]

10. fundies are ANTI-christian

and i for one am sick of them being considered the definition of whats christian.
anti-religion stuff doesn't bother me -- perversion of the faith bothers me.
i for one believe in active, changing, broadminded, loving spiritual approaches to any faith -- it's about people for god's sake. and people go through changes. live and let live, love and let love.

[Sophree]

31. Great analogy

For the Religious Wrong.

"The religious right is to Christianity what conservatism is to compassion."

:thumbsup:

[hippywife]

11. I work among

many of the religious right. My response to most of what they stand for is to remind them of what Christ said when asked by his apostles which of the commandments are the most important:

Love your God with all your heart and soul. Second to that only is to love your neighbor as yourself.

Period. No if's, and's, or but's. No qualifiers whatsoever.

[opihimoimoi]

12. Some delusional church leaders make money doing the snake thing

They convince their followers to handle snakes....

church goers support the church/pastor

The delusion goes on.

[donco6]

19. There's another passage in the Bible that talks about . . .

how the Christians of the day were making themselves known throughout the world by their acts of kindness and love for one another. Are these the things that come to mind when you think of Christians today? Not hardly.

[leesa]

18. This is exactly right. Only Christians can point out to the rabid

right wing christians how and where they are off the mark concerning their interpretations of Christianity.

[jiacinto]

21. Take a page of the Christian Coalition's playbook

I met a girl from Alabama and she told me that the CC has a "contact person" in literally "every church" in the state. Conversely I think progressives are going to have to do the same. Also they should run for very local offices.

[gully]

23. Progressive Christians are starting to network...

http://www.tcpc.org/index.html

[sandnsea]

22. I worship Jesus, not the Bible

Anybody who thinks they're going to fight the religious right by arguing scripture is on a loser's mission.

These people have made the Bible an idol over God. When they're forced to decide between Jesus and the Bible; and the Constitution and the Bible; the bible ought to quickly be reduced back to the personal guide to salvation it's supposed to be. It is the word of God, not God.

[gully]

24. Good point, I should have called the thread

How to fight the RR on 'their' terms..

[Sophree]

32. Basic Intructions Before Leaving Earth

Acronym of this phrase is "Bible."

"These people have made the Bible an idol over God."

I never realized that before, but you're right- they have.

[sandnsea]

33. Hey, I learned that on DU!!!

I don't know remember who posted it, but it was a lightbulb moment for me!

[TahitiNut]

26. "The love of money is the root of all evil"

There is a creature for which the 'love of money' is the sole motivating force: the corporation. We're in the belly of that beast.

[Muddleoftheroad]

27. The corporation

Ain't a creature. It's a collection of people who got together to establish a business. In our legalistic society, it's practically the only safe way to do so.

[billyskank]

28. That's how it should be

not how it is. When corporations can claim human rights such as free speech, then they have become more than that.

[PaPaJohn]

30. Christian Stores

I recently left a temporary job at a wharehouse for a Christian Bookstore distributor. We had over 300 stores as clients. The information I saw being distributed there was horrifying. Having viewed literally thousands of titles and having tried to skim over some of the more offensive ones I gained a glimpse of how the RWs are raising their children. The hate runs deep in many of these books most of which take a smite the evildoers approach. Everyone from Jews, to Catholics, to gays and especially Atheists and women are attacked vehemently and hatefully in inumerable lines of childrens book. They are literally rewriting history and forcefeeding it to the most innocent in our society.

I seriously wasn't prepared for the effect that viewing all this material would have on me. I had no idea the hate speech was so bold and clear in this type of literature. I really had no idea people were writing books talking about cleansing the earth of Jews and Gays and then giving them to children. I am still a little sick to my stomach after reading the rage and disdain expressed towards the Catholic church. Several of the books I took the time to set aside and read in their entirety made it clear that they see no room in the world for non-believers or semi-believers.

I know the look I got into that world isn't complete or entireley representative, but what I was able to see was utterly terrifying. The experience of it all really can't be relayed in words.

[newyawker99]

34. Hi PaPaJohn!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[donco6]

37. When I see a Christian bookstore, I think of Jesus' words:

Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you whitewashed tombs full of dead mans bones.

Or something similar anyway. Don't have my Bible here.

[maxanne]

35. so many Christians

so few lions....