Would a Clinton resignation have kept Bush out?

[mvd]

I'm happy that Clinton feels victorious over the Republicans. But a Philly Inquirer article written by editorial staff member Chris Satullo got me thinking: if Clinton resigned, would there be no Bush pResidency? He makes good points: Gore would have had two years in as an incumbent. Likely there would have still been peace and a good economy when the 2000 election came. Also, Gore would have been able to concentrate more on Bin Laden, since the Republicans were on Clinton for every foreign policy action.

I don't agree, though, that Clinton not resigning was more important than Harris's sleaziness or the selection by the Supreme Court.

So what do you think? I can certainly be swayed by the posts here. I'll check back later.

[mvd]

1. No interest?

I'm surprised..

[FlemingsGhost]

2. They would have ambushed Gore, as well.

In fact, they did anyway ...

[ibegurpard]

3. I agree

Having successfully taken down a president over something like lying about a blowjob, they would've gone into overdrive to keep the fever ramped up.

[mvd]

4. True, but Gore would have had a record

And he would have had time to distance himself from the Clinton scandal.

[mvd]

5. Of course, the way the media hated Gore..

It was no guarantee. I guess we'll never know for sure. But I think it was a well-thought-out article and LEAN towards it being right.

[Lindacooks]

6. Nope, would have emboldened the repukes

A victory that huge for them would have set them up for years. President Clinton did the right thing fighting those bastards and winning.

[mvd]

7. I thought they were emboldened anyway

They brought out all the stops against Gore. However, if Kerry wins, I'll stay happy that Clinton didn't resign. It could take Kerry 2 terms to even be half started fixing Bush's damage, but the wait would be worth the satisfaction of Clinton standing up to them until the end.

[monchie]

8. Might've Kept Bush Out...But Gingrich In

Remember, these right-wingers were using their patented media manipulation techniques to try to steamroll the country--and destabilize the country--into dropping its support of President Clinton. I believe the goal wasn't so much to go through with impeachment, but rather to force Clinton's resignation.

And remember, at the same time, the GOP Slime Machine, with the quisling-style collaboration of the so-called "liberal media," was also concocting other phony "scandals" involving Gore (e.g., Buddhist temple and fundraising phone calls from the WH). IMHO, they were hoping to create enough of a loss of support for Clinton and Gore, and enough destabilization of our political system, to force both the President and the Vice President to resign. And guess who was next in the line of succession? Yep, then-Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich.

Salon ran a story about a similar but slightly different scenario at the time. Apparently, NBC's Elizabeth Drew let the cat out of the bag one morning on "Meet the Press" and was treated as if she were insane.

But the idea of forcing the resignations of both Clinton and Gore makes perfect sense. The ultimate goal of the RETHUGs in our time is to seize total unchecked, unbalanced power, by any means necessary. Preferably by elections, but if that's impossible, well... And getting rid of just Clinton would've left their job unfinished.

So, due to the unwillingness of the American public--the true heroes of the late '90s--to go along with their plans, the impatient ReTHUGs had to wait another two years--and when they couldn't actually win an election, they stooped to stealing it.

[NuttyFluffers]

9. read up on their motives.

when communism fell they needed a new rallying cry, a new target to focus their unending amount of hate. and that's the only thing that seems to unify them, hate. so after communism they decided upon democrats themselves as their new crusade. more than one source has pointed this out, but a very open and easy one is David Brock's "Blinded by the Right."

they hate democrats with the zeal of a cultist. period. know thine enemy, these people have *nothing* besides unending hate and have now targeted it upon *you*, their fellow citizen. that's why there are many republicans who feel they've had their party hijacked - this cultural civil war is *not* what they signed up for. but notice the joy with which previous crazy reactionaries, not too powerful before during the past 40 years before reagan, are absolutely in love with current state of affairs. they see civil war and violence a hair breadth away from their wettest dreams - they can taste your sweat and fear and are dying to taste your blood. there are monsters parading as humans out there and are scaring the hell out of old-fashioned republicans. they made a deal with the devil and now we all must live with it.

if it wasn't clinton, it would have been anyone else. they already have almost all of their heart's desire politically. and you know what? it's still not enough. they want your complete and utter destruction, and they will do *anything* to get it.

live it, learn it, then fight back. this time means your life.

[dmr]

10. The Neo-Cons wanted in at any cost

and that is very evident by each and everything they have done to this country beginning with the election shenanigans and the unconscionable SCOTUS appointment.

That argument by the Philly Inquirer is only good in trying to discredit and embarrass President Clinton further, as well as to break the momentum of his messages in his book and public appearances.

[FredScuttle]

11. Would RFK taking the front way out of the hotel have kept Nixon out?

point is moot....Clinton beat back the mongrel GOP and WON.

There should never have been a Bush presidency, but for that egregious SCOTUS decision that will take its place as among the worst in its history.

[mvd]

12. Well, I wondered what DUers thought

It fits in with the Clinton talk here of late. The editorial writer does not like Bush, so I don't think he was trying to discredit Clinton. I already know that they would have gone on to Gore - I'm just not sure they would have been as successful. Clinton's policies were still popular.

[Mandate My Ass]

13. NO! The Satullo screed followed an equally nauseating

Polman article re: Clinton's new book and his "tawdry"
saga. It was a tag team smear campaign.

The gist of the Satullo article was that Clinton should
have resigned, not because of Monica (right :eyes: ), but
because the lies began stacking up on each other and
created a "tower of deceit" or some such nonsense. Never
mind that the Inky has been stenographers and apologists
for Buscho* since before he stole the election....

I found the logic behind his assertions very flawed, particularly
since Satullo and the Inky have never once called Bush's integrity
into question about matters much more weighty than sex.

[bossfish]

14. What's with these...

"...let's be pussies!" posts today. This one and the one about giving up citizenship /leave the country if Bush wins in Nov, etc.

We have to FIGHT, people! That's what people need to understand. We're starting to make progress. Of course, Shrub is an easy target.

KEEP HAMMERING on these guys. Start arguments, but back up what you say.

THE FACTS ARE ON OUR SIDE!

[Mandate My Ass]

15. EXACTLY!

Satullo's ass was particularly chapped because Clinton
said he took it as a mark of honor that he didn't cave in
to the RW impeachment onslaught. That really seemed to be
the thing that pissed him off.

But why? Because they would have cut a mild-mannered Gore
one inch of slack? NO! They would have started about the
"no mandate" thing and anything else to undermine his presidency
as well. You can't be nice to RWers and expect the same in return. They will simply redouble their attacks. Assholes.

[bossfish]

18. Should have seen a column I read from Rich Lowry

in the today's print edition of the Orange County (CA) Register. Lots of Clinton boo-hoo. (Can't seem to find it on their website)

And I think I saw one yesterday in the Long Beach paper that was more of the same from Girly Man Rich.

I always tell these wingnuts that CLINTON'S BEEN OUT FOR OVER THREE YEARS! QUIT CRYING ABOUT HIM! YOUR GUY IS FUCKING UP AND IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH CLINTON!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

16. Probably. But, he should have stood up to the press.

Instead of wimping out with the ridiculous coverup attempt.

[gulliver]

17. Yes. Clinton should have resigned.

He should have beaten impeachment and then said something like the following:

"I have done the good causes I serve a grave injustice. For that, I am deeply ashamed. Good causes such as environmentalism, tolerance of the differences of others, and an open society did not commit adultery with a young lady in the Oval Office. That was me, and I will never get over the sorrow of it.

Many Republicans disgraced themselves by dragging me through the mud of Whitewater and an impeachment based on little other than a vicious partisan whim. Their partisanship magnified my shameful act beyond all sanity and rocked at their hands the very foundation of our government and Constitution. Over what? In the final analysis, over what?

I hereby resign the presidency as partial payment of my debt."

[bossfish]

19. Yeah, run away that's the answer....

nfm

[Mandate My Ass]

20. Partial payment to the adulterers who stood in judgment

while the majority of Americans supported Clinton???!!

Yeah, whatever.

[Longhorn]

21. Nixon resigning didn't do anything for Ford.

I don't think it would have prevented Bush from being selected. Clinton actually repaired much of his own image by the time he left office and Gore still didn't end up president. Many criticize Gore for not embracing Clinton in his campaign but most of Clinton's support came from people who were already going to vote for Gore. There were (and are, for that matter) plenty of people who would be less likely to support Gore if he and Clinton were joined at the hip.

I think in hindsight some folks are beginning to realize that Clinton's "crimes" pale in comparison to what's going on in this administration and he is popular again. But that wasn't the prevailing view with many independents back in 2000. How effective would Gore have been stepping in after a Clinton resignation with the Republicans in even more of a feeding frenzy having forced it?

[mvd]

22. Gore didn't have Clinton's baggage

As much as his reputation may have been repaired, I still think too many swing voters remembered it. It's not right, but I think it happened.