The draft: the truth is only 20 year olds are at risk

[ringmastery]

There are 1.8 million young men turning 20 each year. In the largest years of the Vietnam draft, only 300,000 troops were drafted. Now, while this may seem like a daunting number, consider the fact that there are 14 million men aged 18-26. Only the smallest subset (those turning 20) will be under the gun for a draft and more than likely an initial draft will be relatively small, under 50,000 draftees in the first round.

Yeah, a draft will suck, but not everyone aged 18-26 has to freak out. Only those younger than 20.

And yeah, congress can change the draft laws, but I doubt they will. The current draft laws on the books have been on the books for decades and were written up after the Vietnam war to be fair and close all the draft loopholes for college deferments and the rich.

Read the law:

http://www.sss.gov/viet.htm

A draft held today would use a lottery system under which a man would spend only one year in first priority for the draft - either the calendar year he turned 20 or the year his deferment ended. Each year after that, he would be placed in a succeedingly lower priority group and his liability for the draft would lessen accordingly. In this way, he would be spared the uncertainty of waiting until his 26th birthday to be certain he would not be drafted.

[pmbryant]

1. If it's true that all the loopholes for college and wealth are closed...

then that is all the more reason why there is no need for anyone to be worried about a draft any time soon.

--Peter

[hang a left]

6. the loopholes are not closed.

There are a couple of bills in congress whose intention it is to plug those holes, but they are in committee.

[ringmastery]

7. what loopholes still exist?

They took away the college rule. You can only defer one semester.

There is also an agreement with Canada to deport draftees hiding in that country.

[hang a left]

11. When did they take away the college rule?

[ringmastery]

24. Read the link in the first post

[hang a left]

45. I didn't realize that had been changed.

The site claims that the draft was "improved" in 1971. For some reason I thought it was the two bills in Congress that sought to ammend the college deferment.

Well what do you know? However this is quite sobering, I was hoping I could use this loophole for my sons.

[wuushew]

2. How many of those 14 million are mentally and physically fit to serve?

It seems the actually subset would be much smaller.


Perhaps someone has the percentages of the A1-4F of draftable people during WWII? Besides more obesity the general health of the population should be comparable.

[ringmastery]

5. even if half aren't

7 million men is a hell of a lot of people.

900,000 20 year old men a year is a hell of a lot of troops.

[hang a left]

3. That is not true, they are just the first to be drafted. Then in the

following year the were-19 years olds are now 20. But the age starts at 20, then when they want more 21, 22, 23, 24, 25. The older ones get safer as every years passes. The younger ones however get unluckier.

[ringmastery]

8. yeah, you are right

but hopefully, after the horror of the first group of 20 year olds being drafted, public outrage will take over and the public will vote for anti-draft congressman in the next election.

[rocktop15]

4. I AM under 20.

Don't feed me this. I don't care. I turn 19 in June and will not be shedding my blood for oil. I have already written my senator about this issue.

[childslibrarian]

15. I have a son who is 19

And I find the theme of this post extremely offensive... Are you saying it doesn't matter because it won't be you? Hey what an attitude!

[atre]

33. Why is that offensive to you?

I'm not the poster, and I'm narrowly out of the affected age range, but it shocks me that so many people here find it offensive that young people refuse to sacrifice themselves at the altar of Halliburton....

Whether or not you have affected love ones does not appear to matter at all to this discussion... Certainly it is no reason to expect others to fight and die with a grin...

[Waistdeep]

9. I don't interpret it the way you do

There is a presumption in that passage that each person spends one year of eligibility. I would assume that if the draft were instituted, that all 20-25 year olds would be in the first lottery, and 20 year olds each year after that. There might be an advantage being the first lottery cohort, but it's not clear from that passage that anyone over 20 would be exempted from the first lottery. It could also very well be that more would be drafted the first year than in following years, even though the chances of being drafted might be less.

This is of special interest to me since my son turns 21 this summer.

[ringmastery]

13. no

The first lottery is only for 20 year olds. They only go to 21 year olds after they exhaust the full supply of 20 year olds, which is unlikely.

http://www.caller2.com/2001/september/24/today/localnew/12530.html

And under new rules, the draft would begin with 20-year-olds.
Selective Service officials say that age was chosen because a 20-year-old is likely out of high school and probably not yet married with kids.
A lottery would establish the birth date for the first draftees and call-ups would proceed to 21-, 22-, 23-, 24-, and 25-year-olds.
At that point, if even more draftees are needed, 19- and then 18-year-olds would be called to serve.
During the Vietnam War, 18- to 25-year-olds were put on a waiting list until they turned 26 and were out of the woods. In the new system, men would spend only a year in the first priority for the draft before being placed in a lower priority group.

[robertpaulsen]

29. If Bush gets a second term, EVERYONE 18-25 is in jeopardy

Because it won't stop with Iraq. Syria and Iran are both on the PNAC hitlist. Then there's Cuba, North Korea, France, China...

But if Kerry wins, then maybe it will "only" be 20 year olds in a worst case scenario.

[YankeeFan]

36. But Have You Noticed...

But have you noticed, calls for resumption for The Draft are mostly coming from Democrats.:grr:

By the way...If the Viet Nam War had gone a year longer, I would have been eligible to be Drafted Myself.
X-:hippie:

[alittlelark]

47. I'll explain it to you....

The Good Guys (Dem's) are bringing it up because they know that * is filling the draft boards. They want to get this issue into the open.
They also want to CLOSE THE LOOPHOLES that allow the children of the elite to escape the draft via the National Guard, deferments, and other means.

This is a BIG DEAL - and at least some people are exposing the issue to the light of day.

[pinto]

10. oh boy! good news! No offense, ringmaster, but some of them will die,

whether 18, 19, 20 or whatever.

[ringmastery]

14. I'm not saying it doesn't suck

it does and I'll fight against the draft, no matter if I'm too old or not.

But I do think it is important to learn the facts and the law and to know who is at a greater risk and who is not.

[pinto]

25. Got that. During Vietnam we had many polls on how high the # would go.

They drafted by birthyear and birthday. Human nature.

[democracyindanger]

12. Until they run out of 20 year olds. nt

[Karenina]

16. Errraaaa....

NO ONE should be "at risk" of putting life and limb on the line in support of this *criminal enterprise involuntarily. Let those who support this nonsense bear the weight. Calling all freepers! Calling all freepers! Calling all anal cyst challenged!

[Nlighten1]

17. Not true...

The specifically said they are in need of a "special skills" draft for Information Technology folks and that the age limit was 45 years old.

My wife is worried that I will get called up.

[Kahuna]

21. "Not true?" "They said?" When did you start believing repukes?

forget about what they said and examine the events in front of you. Remember that you're dealing with a overgrown brat whose motto is, it's my way or the highway. He wants more wars.

If bush wins, he will certainly go after more Muslim countries. It's the PNAC plan. Even if he didn't plan more wars, at the rate he is creating enemies we will never run out of enemies to defend against.

[Missy Vixen]

26. I'm worried, too

>My wife is worried that I will get called up.<

My husband, the King of Software, (20 years in IT,) went to Gulf War I. He was a loadmaster. He then spent several years in the Reserves, and left with a honorable discharge. He's now 39.

:scared:

Julie

[PaDUer]

31. Get on your local draft board...

there's an online form to fill out..Someone from DU, don't know which state or who it was, posted he/she had received their acceptance letter.

[Nlighten1]

38. I tried that...

but I think I was turned down.

[PaDUer]

39. Did they reply to you?

What did they say? Why do you think they turned you down?

[Nlighten1]

48. Yes they did...

but the letter sounded like I was rejected for the job or they are keeping my application on file for future reference.

[PaDUer]

49. How long before you received

that letter? As far as I remember, I think one person on DU made it to the position, but I don't remember who it was..Any idea on how many people on DU sent in for this? Wonder what qualifies one to be on the board?

[Nlighten1]

50. Many questions.

that I don't have the answer for. I filled out the application but I don't know if the response I got was an acceptence or a denial. It seemed to me to be one of thos polite "thank you for applying" messages.

[Nlighten1]

37. Almost my story too.

I got called up for DS1. I have been in IT for 10 years.

[stevedeshazer]

18. Hey, no problem, right?

Wanna tell my 16 year old that it's no big deal? :grr:

[MsUnderstood]

19. More good news

Women, you don't have to worry about being drafted because, you guessed it, you aren't men!

But don't try that "gay thang" boys. . . .it is only used during peace time to kick military personnel out of the army when the enlisted #s are too high. . .say you are gay when you get drafted and it is off to the brig with you.

*sarcasm off*

We wouldn't need a draft if we hadn't gone into an illegal war. I am extremely digusted by anyone who tries to justify any part of the draft. Rush Limbaugh today talked about how Liberals were being prejudiced by pointing out the current military is made up primarily of young, poor, high school education Americans who went into the military to pay for a higher education because their family couldn't afford it.

Meanwhile, where is the statistics of the parental income of our soldiers in the war zone? Only 1 Federal congressman has a child in the military in Iraq.

The wealthy, well connected, educated WILL NOT BE GOING TO IRAQ. Even if they are drafted they will pull a BUSH and go into an office job somewhere in Alabama.

[PaDUer]

32. Someone should call into Limpballs

and ask him WHY are the freepers not running in droves to register and volunteer to go since so many apparently aren't working and are attending freeps, and send him the pix!

[nonconformist]

20. I'm 30 (and a woman), but I have a brother that will be 17 this year

I'm worried about him, I can't help it.

[oneighty]

22. Yup!

First they came for the twenty year old and I did nothing. Then they came for the twenty one year old and I did nothing.

They pulled that during the big one, they got all the way to the thirty four year old, if I recall correctly. If the war had not ended it would have gone higher.

Do not be bullshitted into complacency.

180

[Missy Vixen]

23. This is unacceptable

>The draft: the truth is only 20 year olds are at risk<

ONE young person is too many to be drafted for the War Without End.

One young person dying in this quagmire is too goddamn many.

Julie

[wuushew]

27. The only way to beat the draft is to find religion...which is BS

What the point of being a CO or religious student? There is no need for dual classification. Does this mean that religion is somehow naturally against war? I don't think so, look a the pResident a self-proclaimed Kristian who has a constant hardon for war.








Classifications
Men are not classified now.

Classification is the process of determining who is available for military service and who is deferred or exempted. Classifications are based on each individual registrant's circumstances and beliefs. A classification program would go into effect when Congress and the President decide to resume a draft. Then, men who are qualified for induction would have the opportunity to file a claim for exemptions, deferments, and postponements from military service.

Here is a list of some, though not all, classifications and what they mean:

1-A - available immediately for military service.

1-O Conscientious Objector- conscientiously opposed to both types (combatant and non-combatant) of military training and service - fulfills his service obligation as a civilian alternative service worker.

1-A-O Conscientious Objector - conscientiously opposed to training and military service requiring the use of arms - fulfills his service obligation in a noncombatant position within the military.

2-D Ministerial Students - deferred from military service.

3-A Hardship Deferment - deferred from military service because service would cause hardship upon his family.

4-C Alien or Dual National - sometimes exempt from military service.

4-D Ministers of Religion - exempted from military service.

Student Postponements - a college student may have his induction postponed until he finishes the current semester or, if a senior, the end of the academic year. A high school student may have his induction postponed until he graduates or until he reaches age 20.

Appealing a Classification - A man may appeal his classification to a Selective Service Appeal Board.

[bloom]

35. I'm not saying you should join

but the Quakers DO have quite a history of Conscientious Objecting - even during WWII.

If anyone were to be interested in this - they have a lot of info.


http://webarchive.afsc.org/youthmil/choices/co.htm

[ParanoidPat]

28. The TRUTH is the law you cite is not the only law concerning it......

.....You neglected to mention the "Special Skills" draft that is being worked up as I type this!

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/164693_draft13.html

Agency initiates steps for selective draft Congress shows little support for effort to draw skilled Americans

By ERIC ROSENBERG
SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER WASHINGTON BUREAU

WASHINGTON -- The government is taking the first steps toward a targeted military draft of Americans with special skills in computers and foreign languages.

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is adamant that he will not ask Congress to authorize a draft, and officials at the Selective Service System, the independent federal agency that would organize any conscription, stress that the possibility of a so-called "special skills draft" is remote.

Nonetheless, the agency has begun the process of creating the procedures and policies to conduct such a targeted draft in case military officials ask Congress to authorize it and the lawmakers agree to such a request.

<Snip>

The agency already has a special system to register and draft health care personnel ages 20 to 44 in more than 60 specialties if necessary in a crisis. According to Flahavan, the agency will expand this system to be able to rapidly register and draft computer specialists and linguists, should the need ever arise. But he stressed that the agency has received no request from the Pentagon to do so.

<More>

If Bush* is reselected, this will happen. Count on it!

[yardwork]

30. There is a much bigger problem looming with the draft.....

If Chimpy is allowed to continue his demented rampage around the world, all hell will start to break loose. The war in the middle east might expand whether we want it to or not. It could become a World War III.

My two children are pre-teen boys. What will be going on in the world when they turn 18, 19, or 20?

That's the big problem. It's not just Iraq. It's the fact that * has destabilized a big part of the world. And, while he's busy fighting his bizarre war in Iraq and causing coups in Haiti, we're ignoring genocide in Sudan and who knows where else. Has anyone seen any mention of our neighbors in South America lately? Didn't think so.

Bush has caused a ripple of despair to shudder through the world. Our old allies are no longer our allies - they are suspicious of the United States, and for good reason. We've dragged Britain down with us. It is entirely likely that much of Europe will figure out how to unite themselves, and they will not necessarily be our friends.

For one hundred years the U.S. has been the big guy on the block, but I don't think we will be in the 21st century. W has done a lot of harm.

[bloom]

34. plus

drafting lots of people - expanding the military takes more and more resources.

I think it was McCain saying today how we are going to need to cut social programs to pay for the war.

It's all part of the PNAC plan.

[yardwork]

41. In fact, we seem to be making the same mistakes

that the Soviet Union made. We keep invading countries for no good reason, and we're driving our military costs through the roof. The U.S. government even controls the news media now.

[PaDUer]

43. Cut more social programs??

Hell, no need to do that...* and Sheeney gang has plenty that they can donate.

[Jacobin]

40. Hey, Dude

PNAC plans to invade Syria and Iran and continue to occupy Iraq. To occupy Iraq alone, using the same ratios we use in Kosovo would take 350,000.

How many do you think it will take to "do" Iran and Syria.

You're whistling past the graveyard. Millions are going to be drafted in the next few years if Bush gets to stay and who knows what Kerry will do.

[nomatrix]

42. Lou Dobbs had on

Brig. Gen. David Grange. He asked him about the draft, he responded, we'd have "too many" candidates. Remember, that before this era, the military was combat and noncombat. Now we have contracted the work. It's going to be a hard one to decide. With the cost that aren't even in the budget, we are rapidly tanking, like the USSR did.


Suggest you read "Sorrows of Empire" by Chalmers Johnson. Beyond politics, the most revealing look at where we are, and where we are headed. He was interviewed on C-Span. He advised, everyone, everyone should have 2 passports and be prepared to leave. Any questions?


Sorrow of Empire book page. Read the reviews. Even CATO knows this is a train wreck about to happen.

http://www.americanempireproject.com/bookpage.asp?ISBN=0805070044


Buzzflash interview with Chalmers Johnson
http://www.buzzflash.com/interviews/04/03/int04013.html

[Senjutsu]

44. "Only"

One is too many as far as I'm concerned.

[K8-EEE]

46. Kick!!! I Say: George P Goes First

OMG....one 20 year old is a tragedy, especially for this unnecessary, unjust war.