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Wes Clark: "this administration is too flipping arrogant..." (Iraq)

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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:35 PM
Original message
Wes Clark: "this administration is too flipping arrogant..." (Iraq)
Door now being opened to sending in more troops
Web Posted: 04/07/2004 12:00 AM CDT

Sig Christenson
Express-News Military Writer

~snip~

The violence, which has prompted a U.S. lockdown of Fallujah, prompted criticism from former Democratic presidential hopeful Wesley Clark and divided Republicans loyal to President Bush among them Sens. Kay Bailey Hutchison and John Cornyn, both R-Texas.

"We all know Shinseki was right," said Clark, NATO's supreme allied commander during the 1999 Kosovo air war. "That was the official Army estimate. And everybody knew there weren't enough troops there."

Neither Clark nor Hutchison could say how many more troops are needed. But Hutchison said she "would rather have more than less and beef up our numbers as much as it takes."

~snip~

Clark, who claimed the administration is "too flipping arrogant to admit they're wrong," said it erred by ignoring key Shiite religious rulers who are becoming increasingly agitated as the June 30 deadline nears.

"You've got to find a political answer, not a military answer," he said, predicting the situation will remain the same or perhaps worsen. "The military is merely buying time for a political answer."

~more~

Source: San Antonio Express-News 4/7/04


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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. Nope...not like Vietnam at all...
/sarcasm.....grrrrrrrrrrrrrr God this just sickens me.
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RichV Donating Member (858 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. I like Wes's sentiment, but...
He needs to stress the need for more INTERNATIONAL troops, and not just one's with the star-spangled banner on their sleeves.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. He does always
He's said it a million different times, a million different ways.

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maggrwaggr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
3. what I want to know ...
how many more people are gonna die because Bush is president before he's finally out in January?

We need to get rid of him NOW
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DancingBear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
5. Just when I was starting to get over it...
Edited on Wed Apr-07-04 02:41 PM by DancingBear
Damn you, WesDem! :)

He is, as always, correct, succinct, and to the point. And he pulls no punches either.

Note to Kerry: Correct, succinct, and pulling no punches are all GOOD things. Please take note and act accordingly.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Not to mention, prophetic
Here's my letter, DancingBear.

To the Editor:
San Antonio Express News
4/7/04

Gen. Wesley Clark (ret.) is right in Sig Christenson's report on your website today: "Everybody knew there weren't enough troops there." And he was right when he testified before the Senate Armed Services Committee in September 2002: "I think that there is a substantial risk in the aftermath of the operation that we could end up with a problem which is more intractable than we have today."

Don't we all wish Gen. Clark's warnings had been heeded?

"When we go in there with a transitional government and a military occupation of some indefinite duration, it's also very likely that if there is an effective al Qaeda left -- and there certainly will be an effective organization of extremists -- they will pour into that country because they must compete for the Iraqi people; the Wahabes with the Sunnis, the Shi'as from Iran working with the Shi'a population. So it's not beyond consideration that we would have a radicalized state, even under a U.S. occupation in the aftermath."

In so bloody a week as this, we might remember that Clark saw this clearly, while the Bush administration did not. Had we not aborted the mission in Afghanistan in the war on terror, had we not taken this neo-con misadventure to Iraq, so many of our dead soldiers would still live.

Sincerely,
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. what i was thinking
if Kerry were to pick clark to be his vp it would actually be a pretty good competition. clark will be taking on cheney where both are considered to be the best at. but we all know who has the TRUE experience, of actually serving on the battlefield and on making peace.

and kerry has been giving great speeches on all the other issues. of course i think kerry is great on national security also, but we know that's something bush leaves to cheney so clark would be a good one to take that up.


i still can't make up my mind on who would be the best vp but i do have a few favorites and like to imagine how the campaign would be.
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DancingBear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Very nice

What a wonderful tool this will be if Kerry asks Clark to be on the ticket. I can just imagine him reading these verbatim quotes to Dick Crashcart at a VP debate. "Well, Dick, I knew what the results of your ill-fated folly would be 2 years ago, and stated it to the Armed Services Committee. Did you happen to see that, or were you too busy with that whole Niger/yellowcake thing?"

Oh for what could have been...

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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I was trying to remember
Some neo-con from the Bush administration said after this 2002 hearing, in a dismissal of Clark's testimony, something like, "Well, Wes Clark is just against going to war in Iraq." I can't remember if it was Wolfowitz or Perle or Rumsfeld or who it was, but it was one of that type.
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Jai4WKC08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. It was Perle
Basically said that all of Clark's rationale about needing the international community and legitimacy and so forth were just "excuses" because he didn't want to fight.
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Crunchy Frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-04 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
21. Is this the one?
PERLE: "So I think General Clark simply doesn't want to see us use military force and he has thrown out as many reasons as he can develop to that but the bottom line is he just doesn't want to take action. He wants to wait."
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. why do you think Kerry asked him to be his surrogate ?
Kerry asked edwards to also go on lou dobbs for him last week. do you think he is using it to help in vp search ? i think it's a good way to see who would be the best in answering questions and presenting his agenda.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. You may be right
I try not to think about the VP search. It's driving us all insane

I thought Edwards was very good on Lou Dobbs. When it comes to national security, I don't think there is anyone better than Wes Clark. But Kerry has a million and one reasons to weigh on the question of VP, and as the situation changes, so does the relevancy, so who knows?
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Blaze Diem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. Flip-Floppingly Arrogant.....
Bush is in Crawford playing with his legos.

"Maybe I could just quit this presidentin' business an try some other line of work..like when I quit that whole Harkin fiasco..Hmmm, there's just gotta be somethin' a kid like me is good at"
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Daisey Mae Donating Member (654 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
8. Too "Flippin" arrogant to admit that they were wrong?
about ANYTHING.... if it isn't Clinton's fault.... then the "Dog must have eaten my homework"-President Dumbell.......
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Leilani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
10. Thanks for the article, Wes Dem
Anytime Wes speaks he makes perfect sense, unlike the idiots who are running this catastrophe.

If only these arrogant assholes had listened to the military, but no, the chickenhawks in their armchairs made it all sound so easy. Easy, because they & their kids wouldn't be over there getting killed.
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cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
13. This is why I respect Clark so much
He wants a political solution. He knows the militarty can't do it alone.
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Scoopie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
17. I love when he talks all tough
It makes my heart beat faster and tells me that I know I voted for the right person! :loveya:

Note to Kerry: stop talking about the economy. I realize that it's very, very important, but you're not making the media change it's coverage of the mess in Iraq - you're not succeeding at reframing the debate. Talk about the economy when it's in the news! Follow Clark's lead - kick the Bushies with some steel-toed combat boots while their blunders in Iraq are so very obvious! :kick:

Wes, hon, you da man!! :yourock:


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dfong63 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. the problem is, Clark's criticism applies almost equally to Kerry
"too arrogant to admit he was wrong".

so when is Kerry going to admit it?

Kerry is smart to focus on the economy. Kerry has to tread carefully when it comes to Iraq. he voted for the IWR. he was a bush-enabler. yes Iraq is a disaster, but the economic issues hit home, as the saying goes, for more people.

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Jai4WKC08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-07-04 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. I think that's unfair
Kerry has admitted that he was wrong to trust Bush to do what he said he would. And he has admitted that he didn't think ANYBODY could fuck it up as badly as Bush has.

It wasn't wrong, imo (and apparently in Kerry's either), to give the commander in chief the leverage to go to the UN with. Or rather, it would not have been wrong with any normal commander in chief. We had Bush instead, but most people did not realize quite what that meant.

It's easy to look back with 20-20 hindsight.
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Scoopie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-08-04 12:02 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. I agree that the economy "hits home"
with more people, but that's not what's in the news right now - as much as we'd like it to be.
People losing their jobs just can't compare to the "if it bleeds, it leads" philosophy of the media. They'll go for the war over the economy, no matter what.
IF (and I'm beginning to wonder) there was a slow news day in Iraq, Kerry should make news about the economy so that he and it actually gets the attention they deserve; however, in watching the regular news (not all the stuff we political junkies watch, but the stuff regular folks watch), there is little mention of the economy save the bogus "Bush done good with 308,000 new jobs" meme.
That's what I'm pointing out.

So... do you think Kerry's weak against Bush? Just wondering from the tone of your post. I'm not flaming you, I'm serious about my question because I've had a lot of Dems and moderates say it's going to be tough for him to beat the Shrub. They say Kerry's a yawner, not a fighter and that sort of thing.
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