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sabra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:20 PM
Original message
Ben Nelson Says He Might Block Dem Health Care Bill
Source: CBS News

Sen. Ben Nelson (D-Neb.) said Tuesday he would join a Republican filibuster of the Democratic health care bill if he thinks it is a bad bill.

"Faced with a decision about whether or not to move a bill that is bad, I won't vote to move it," Nelson told ABC News. "For sure."

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid intends to bring his health care bill before the full Senate next week. After debating the bill, he will need all 60 Democrats in the Senate to vote for "cloture" -- in other words, to stop a Republican filibuster in order to vote on whether to approve the bill. Reid's only other option would be to resort to a process called "reconciliation," which would enable Democrats to bypass a filibuster and get the bill approved with only 51 votes.

Nelson is not the only Democrat who has threatened to vote against cloture. Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-Conn.) has said he would filibuster a bill with a government-run health insurance plan, or public option. Sen. Evan Bayh (D-Ind.) said on CBSNews.com's Washington Unplugged that he would even block a motion to proceed with debate on the bill if he strongly objected to the legislation.

Read more: http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/11/11/politics/politicalhotsheet/entry5615006.shtml?tag=stack
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. Nelson is having a hissy-fit over what passes for a public option
He actually wants an "opt-in" for states, which is much worse than "opt-out," and he wants Republican state governors to be allowed to create their own draconian alternatives.
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denverbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Are these the same asslickers that held hands to prevent the 'nuclear option'?
Remember, the 'moderates' who decided the Senate would give an 'up or down vote' to every lunatic fringe wacked out freeper for a federal judgeship to avoid Republicans going 'nuclear' and ignoring the filibuster rule?
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Dr Robert Donating Member (381 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
3. Reconciliation. Then strip these traitors of their seniority. Case Closed.
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
23. strip them now. why wait?
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Dr Robert Donating Member (381 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. good point
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Bitwit1234 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
4. HE will block it if HE thinks it is a bad bill
Let me get this straight. WE the public elected him to do what WE want. WE overwhelming want a Health Bill and it is there job to get it right and then vote for it. NOT IF THEY THINK THEY DON'T WANT TO. I don't understand what gives them to right to block a bill that the public wants. I think we as citizens who vote and want them to do what we want and they as public servants are obligated to do so should be reminded that being in congress for their benefit is not the object. Being in congress for OUR benefit is the object. If we would continue to write them letters not emails, because most them don't pay a damn bit of attention to emails, but letters if the get enough they have to physically see them, and tell them to get off their ego and remember they are there to do OUR BIDDING NOT THEIRS.
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Beavker Donating Member (784 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
18. I've written this piece of crap several times.
I got a form letter back, basically saying the same old shit. I also unsubscribed from the Nebraska Democratic Party emails, because they back this turd.

He needs to be stripped of any funding from the DNC, he needs to be primaried as well. I told him he has disenfrachised me as a Dem and left me unrepresented in DC, and I would even vote GOP before him. At least I know who they are. I'd rather know I was dating a cheating whore when I got into the relationship than find out after we'd already been dating.

Bottom line is the people of this country are letting all this happen. The fact that the GOP blew this place up, Obama and other Dems blitzed DC, but yet it's like anything the Dems want is being fought tooth and nail just speaks volumes of this country and where we realy are. Maybe it's laziness or we're really just more stupid as a whole than we thought we were as a Nation, but were going no where fast thanks to our Checks and balances. That nets zero.

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kelly1mm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
26. Technically, the citizens of Nebraska elected him. Do they want
this health care bill? I don't know. Also, there are (at least) two theories on what our elected representative are supposed to do.
One is as you describe - cast their vote based on the wishes of their constituents. If that is the way you want to go I pose the question why have a house and senate at all? With modern technology we could have referendum via computer for all issues. However, as our GLBT friends can attest this may not work out how we may like.

The second is that we elect people who we think are wise and responsible and will make good decisions based on their knowledge and life experiences. If they are not doing that, we have a chance to "fire" them every 2,4,or 6 years. This is how our system currently works and is why we have Stupack's and Cao's in congress who don't tow the party line.

Neither is necessarily better than the other.
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still_one Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
5. It is time for Obama to do his job. Either he goes over their, or Ralm Emanuel
and in no uncertain terms tell these blue dogs that they either support it, or they will not get any funding for re-election from the Democratic party. In addition, and state projects they can forget about

If Nelson decides to change parties, then that will open the door to a Democratic to run

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rudy23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #5
21. Oh, they've told Dems exactly that. But it wasn't the Blue Dogs they told it to.
It was the Progressive Caucus. They're simply not on our side in this fight.
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still_one Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. I have the distinct impression they haven't strong armed anyone /nt
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24601 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-12-09 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #5
32. And welcome back to the minority as repugs replace them all.
It also runs right over the separation of powers between the three different branches of government.
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
6. Nelson needs some money?
Has he got his hand out to the HC Lobby hoping for a little extra cash?

Wouldn't surprise me. Half of congress are insurance company agents.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. "Half of congress are insurance company agents."
That's why NO BILL will be better than the piece of shit that they will give to Obama to sign ... PREMIUMS will be ultra-expensive and a public option, if it exists at all will be miniscule and only for the destitute.

Obama has shown ZERO leadership. Words can not describe how damn disappointed I am with him as The Leader of our beloved Country.
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. No Bill? Sorry
If only the destitute are saved from further agony.... it's good.

For 50 years nothing was ever passed.
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a diff outcome is insanity.

We have a change. Finally. Now we work to make it better.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. You don' t get it. The rest of us will be "working poor" living from hand to mouth.
The poor won't get great treatment until they are chronically ill.

You don't get it! = This bill will continue to pass OUR TAX DOLLARS upward to the 1%.

We STILL won't be able to afford health care, there will be a modest Merchant Class and the upper 1%.

The Rest of US will be SCREWED!
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. We'll see
You may be correct, but you may be wrong. Certainly what did pass, barely passed. And did so after 50 years of nothing, which is what you are saying you want more of. Nothing.

I get that the rich are getting richer. The rest of us are getting screwed.
But there is finally a change. The insanity is on the way down. Not there yet, but....
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Salviati Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
8. Who exactly does he think that he is representing?
Poll: Nebraska Senator clashes with constituents on public option
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/281537

A free clue for the "honorable" Sen. from Nebraska: Your constituants are the people who vote for you, not those who have cut you $2 million in checks.
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lamp_shade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
9. Get in line Ben.
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
12. If Obama does not kick the asses of these whiny, petulant self-aggrandizing little fuckers *now*
...his entire Presidency will be ruined.

This is it for him. No more Mr. Nice Guy.

Reconciliation, stripping all pork from their districts/states, whatever it takes.

That's almost more important than the reform itself, at this juncture, since the entire balance of his remaining agenda -- regardless of how secretly progressive, or actually compromised it might be -- hangs in the offing.
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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. His entire presidency is already ruined...
He has sold out on everything that matters, and there's no evidence that he won't continue to do so.

Obama = Ben Nelson = Joe Lieberman = Harry Reid... there's no difference. They're all just lightweight corporate lackeys. Obama conned a lot of people into believing that finally there would be change. He lied. He sold us out. He was a Trojan horse. The bad guys won. It's over.
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sharp_stick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Yeah Everything!!
fuck me that is one pathetic bit o tripe you tapped out there.
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winyanstaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
16. time to trash this bill and give us single payer....
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Beavker Donating Member (784 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. that would be great
But will NEVER EVER EVER EVER happen in this country. Ever. Too stupid and selfish to get it done...as a whole.
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SandWalker1984 Donating Member (533 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
17. 48 MILLION potential "health" CRIMINALS
This article proves why we should kill this bad health "care" bill:


Welcome Back to Pottersville: Congress pulls the Trigger
http://welcomebacktopottersville.blogspot.com/2009/11/congress-pulls-trigger.html

Three years ago, You were Time's Man of the Year. By next year, you could be Public Enemy #1.

For years, journalist Michael Collins has been calling them “the Money Party.” It’s a mere paraphrase of Gore Vidal’s very correct assertion that there are no Democratic or Republican parties- There’s only the Corporate Party and the only difference between the two is how fast their knees hit the carpet when a lobbyist walks into their office.

In order to see just how evil and hostile our Congress is to their constituents, one need look no further back than the Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act in the spring of 2005. The bill, written by self-dealing lenders seven and a half years before it passed, was essentially a veiled piece of sarcasm that preemptively sought to paint Mr. and Mrs. John Q. Public as criminals or potential criminals for “abusing” the bankruptcy protection laws while these self-same, self-dealing corporations as the poor victims whose Plan B was always the bankruptcy courts, corrupt, irresponsible entities that were given the same protections that are rightfully ours.

The “consumer protection” part of the bill only protected those consumers of shrinking private incomes, namely the credit card companies who largely wrote the bill. They were still able to hike APRs up to 36% and even the subsequent credit card reform bill of this year does little to alleviate these crushing Tony Soprano-like interest rates. It only forces the credit card companies to give you a little more notice before capriciously jacking up your APR whether or not you’re a good customer.

Regarding election reform, it’s long been noted that lawmakers (especially, audaciously, Republicans) and the corporate mainstream media are more prone to believe or to have you believe that the real issue isn’t election fraud perpetrated every other year by multi billion dollar, Republican-connected vote tabulation companies and an army of shadowy, partisan operatives, it’s voter fraud. Forget the fact that only a handful of voter fraud cases were ever prosecuted by the Justice Department between 2002-5. Diebold, ES&S and Sequioa Systems aren't the bad guys. It's ACORN.

We’re also the Dillingers, Bonnie and Clydes and the James Gang. We’re the ones who abuse the bankruptcy system. We’re the ones who bully poor credit card and banking giants. We’re the ones who abuse the election laws. Yet we’re also the ones who have to bail out Wall Street to the tune of trillions and finance two losing wars thousands of miles away for trillions more whether we want to or not.

It can be said that the only truly criminal act perpetrated by the national electorate is when we keep voting into office actual criminals and corporate stooges (from now on referred to as “members of Congress”) and it’s that brief, shining moment when, ironically, we’re appealed to by these earnest, hopeful candidates and incumbents who never think beyond the next election cycle. It’s the one time that we can be trusted to “do the right thing” when we walk into the polls.

How many times in the movies have we seen henchmen and accomplices spring the bad guy from prison or do him some other favor only to see the bad guy turn around and shoot his naïve benefactor in the back? Last Saturday night, the people that we elected to Congress, did it again and this time we can’t blame the Republican Party.

In the dead of Saturday night, the House passed their version of a health reform bill that, frankly, makes Max Baucus’ first health care proposal look like a bleeding heart liberal/socialist piece of legislation by conspicuous relief. One of the most alarming aspects of HR 3962, that passed 220-215 (219 Democrats and one Republican voted for it) are the purely evil sections 7203 and 7201. The less evil of these sections, 7203, calls for $25,000 in fines and up to a year imprisonment for “defying” the federal mandate for getting insurance. That's the misdemeanor. The felony? A quarter of a million dollars in fines and up to five years in prison.

You read that right. A quarter of a million dollars in fines and 60 months in prison for being put in the position of choosing food or your mortgage over health care that are hardly any cheaper than the bloated rates we’re already paying. Add to that the nonpartisan CBO’s projection that any government-run public option would wind up being even more expensive than those offered in the private sector. Add to that the fact that Blue Dog Democrats and Republicans had shoehorned language into the bill that allows individual states to opt out of the public option, a tack favored by the President. It’s called “the trigger option”, so-called because it would trigger the implementation of said so-called option if the private sector doesn’t meet certain conditions.

And those of you who are actually found guilty of the crime of not buying over $100 of health insurance every week will lose their jobs and earning potential. For up to five years, we will not be contributing to anything other than a prison economy. We will not be paying taxes. We will not be paying child support if we already are. And when we get thrown into the prison system, who gets to foot the bill for the health care that we'd defiantly refused to get?

You guessed it: Joe Sixpack and John Q. Public, aka the already burdened US taxpayer.

The Draconian 7203 and 7201 are supposed to be mere threats, deterrents to prevent us from cruelly withholding and willfully denying poor HMOs who are just trying to get by like the rest of us.

But what difference does that make to the rest of us who are held at gunpoint and told, "Don't worry. We won't really shoot you unless you refuse to jump ten feet into the air"?

According to the latest projections, this $1.3 trillion health care bill (HR 3962) passed in the House would force you to buy insurance if you don’t have it already, raise premiums and allow states, including those that have near-monopolies in the health care industry (such as Maine, for instance) to drop out of the program. Essentially, it’s a massive individual mandate without anything resembling a public option and co-ops would essentially be shouldered and jostled out of contention. It would be very easy to imagine health insurance giants leaning on state-level lawmakers to opt out of the federal program.

Perhaps the Republican Party had the right idea about this, all along: Perhaps the last thing we need is health care “reform.” At least under the status quo, 48,000,000 of us can’t afford health insurance but no one’s proposing putting us in jail for the crime of being indigent or fining those that can’t afford even $5300 in annual premiums or $15,000 for family plans (the cheapest single and family plans under the ratified House bill) to the tune of $250,000.

The last such early Christmas present to the health care field, the $800,000,000 gift-wrapped present to Big Pharma from Congress and George W. Bush was just a precursor, a warmup. It was obvious from the gitgo that any health care “reform” would be a massive corporate giveaway seeking to create a captive customer base of hundreds of millions for a part of the private sector that is already richer and more powerful than most national GDPs. And the pre-emptive supposition that any working or unemployed man who chooses to feed his family or pays his mortgage to stave off foreclosure for another month is a potential criminal is plainly the most despicable legislation to come down the Beltway in years. Specifically, four and a half years.

I mentioned the bankruptcy bill of 2005 for another reason. A 2004 Health Affairs study discovered that out of 1,660,245 people who filed for bankruptcy the year before, around half of them did so because medical bills made them default on credit card or mortgage payments. And almost 73% of those people already had health insurance. At the very black heart of the bankruptcy bill was the need for health care reform, something that took four more years to seriously address.

But We the People are under siege by our own Congress. They have met the enemy and do so during every election cycle and it is us.

The House passed a bill last Saturday that forces you to buy health insurance at rates higher than what we’re already paying, without a real public option and credit card companies can still charge you up to 30% interest even if you’re a good customer. It’s impossible to see how this miraculous “jobless recovery” will pan out when unemployed, underemployed and struggling working families are saddled with crushing home lending rates, rising credit card payments and an unwanted mandate that seeks to burden these same families with at least $15,000 in corporately/Congressionally-mandated health care costs that at least now are optional and with little to no real chance of successfully filing for bankruptcy protection. And to somehow be able to do all this with the unemployment now officially at 10.2%.

What I’m proposing here isn’t Monday morning quarterbacking. This is real. The Democratic Congress did this to us last Saturday after the C-SPAN cameras were turned off for the night. It was as if they shot us in the back of the head Soviet-style so as to leave behind no witnesses or to take a bigger cut of the heist. While I’m not lauding the GOP’s motive for opposing it, it can be said that this time, unlike 2005, they didn’t have a hand in this Satanic bill that seeks to enslave and imprison American consumers both literally and figuratively. And why we’re not marching on Capitol Hill right now by the tens of millions, torches, ropes, buckets of hot tar, bags of feathers and pitchforks in hand is anybody’s guess.

And why is it that the only people whom we’d seen come out in full force and in full-throated, well-organized opposition to health care reform was the clearly insane, criminally stupid and willfully ignorant radical factions known as astroturfers and teabaggers?
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
20. I dare you to fucker
Your career is over just for saying that shit.
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David Zephyr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-12-09 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #20
35. It would end his career. I agree.
.
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cascadiance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
22. Then we should BLOCK his reelection! Get rid of this fake Democrat M*f*r!!! PRIMARY HIS A$$!
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
24. I THINK...
ALL the senators who block health care...should be BLOCKED from receiving THE GOVERNMENT HEALTH CARE THEY NOW ENJOY! Don't WE pay for it??
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Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
27. Reconciliation is the only way
.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
29. ben nelson's inner attention-
whore acting up.
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
30. Better NOT, Benny Boy!1 n/t
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-11-09 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
31. Throw this traitor out of the party!
:grr:
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mstinamotorcity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-12-09 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
33. Ben Nelson
simply needs replacing. Are there any Dems in his state? Democratic minds want to know.
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The Northerner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-12-09 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. Unseat him in 2012
Or at least someone who's not as conservative as Nelson is .... if possible, considering that Nebraska's a conservative state.
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lsewpershad Donating Member (964 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-12-09 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
34. Know who
will be blocked comes the next elections?
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