Afghanistan: Soviet failures echo for US

[Adsos Letter]

Source: Christian Science Monitor

KABUL, AFGHANISTAN - Recent headlines from Afghanistan have read like a history lesson from the Soviet 1980s.

That war "devolved into a fight for control of … the road network," concludes a 1995 US Army study. Militants are now stepping up attacks against American supply routes, destroying some 200 trucks in Pakistan this month.

Anti-Soviet militants controlled "the rural areas," says a former Soviet official. Today's militants have a "permanent presence" in 72 percent of the country, according to a Dec. 8 study.

There are differences between then and now. Yet 20 years later, many problems are similar: The US and NATO control neither the countryside nor the militants' hideouts in Pakistan, and as civilian casualties increase, Afghan anger is mounting.

Read more: http://www.csmonitor.com/2008/1219/p01s01-wosc.html

[Fumesucker]

1. Once again "the far left" proves correct and the pragmatic centrists incorrect..

Basically the only people who were against going into Afghanistan were the far left, the pragmatic centrists were all for it.

[Hydra]

3. The only way invasion works is if you kill or enslave all of the population

The neocons had such grand ideas on paper- I wonder how many of those ideas were actually meant to work?

[Acadia Blue]

8. Obama..........pay attention please. No one has ever won in Afghanistan.

[ohio2007]

12. the wrath of Khan proved otherwise

oh,
but you can argue the world was very different back in his day
so,
a moot point it is


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongolian_Empire


Barack doesn't intend turning Afghanistan into a colony called New Chicago.. although some here claim the opium harvest might make it a tempting buisness proposition

[wuushew]

14. I have several questions regarding the nature of opium poppies

according to my research the poppy was cultivated many many thousands of years ago, most probably in Asia minor.

It seemingly can be grown all over the world and in many conditions. Is Afghanistan a country which has a comparative advantage in the natural conditions that favor its cultivation? The poppy likes moist but not wet conditions with a neutral soil pH combined with mild days, cool nights and 8 to 12 hours of sunlight a day.


If a country with more favorable natural conditions also cultivates poppies the only way to compete in a free market is to reduce your labor costs and thus reduce the amount of wealth flowing into the country. A similar situation would occur if you tried to turn the country into a center of manufacturing or textiles. The only way to overcome natural disadvantages caused by lack of sea access, poor transportation infrastructure and difficult terrain is to race to the bottom vis a vis your competitors.



Are Afghanistan's problems caused by absolute poverty or relative poverty? When part of the silk road Afghanistan was a prosperous place. What amount of economic activity would provide a modern analogue to this period?

[jetphixer]

2. FACTS

This is a un winnable war.. The only way we can do anything there is replace the military with the peace corps.. These people have done in every invading force so what makes the us think we are so good??If we are to gain anything at all in Afghanistan we need to show the people we mean to build not bomb out Well thy tossed out the britts an the Russians out what makes us think we can do it ??
We need to offer constructive things like building ,schooling, better farming practices etc.what the Bushies want from there mess there is a pipe line where Halburton can make $$'s or some big oil/gas companies get the bucks

[MJJP21]

4. Nice try

"We need to offer constructive things like building ,schooling, better farming practices etc.\"
=======
They could have that for the asking. They don't want it. They really do want to live in the 16th century and shun education and better farming practices unless you can show them a better way to raise poppy. It is the raising of poppy that gives the most bang for the buck and they accomplish two chores at the same time. One is raising revenue the other is destroying the culture of the infidels.(us)
If you really want to change things in Afghanistan or any other place in the middle east you need to get them (or force them) to abandon their religion and in order to do so we need to abandon ours and that is not going to happen. A good start for all concerned is to make "The Age of Reason" by Thomas Paine required reading.
http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/thomas_paine/age_of_reason/

[izquierdista]

5. Not for the asking

What they can have for the asking is Unocal oil pipelines, U.S. air force bases, and American munitions to carry out their feuds. Don't be so naive to think that they were actually offered things that could help THEM instead of things that American corporations wanted to sell.

[Karenina]

6. How very white of you.

[ohio2007]

13. ignorance is bliss

http://www.nato.int/isaf/docu/pressreleases/2008/12-december/pr081220-726.html

a mind is a terrible thing to waste


http://archive.salon.com/mwt/feature/2001/10/02/fatima/

[roamer65]

7. Just like the Soviet Union, the United States will die on the cross called Afghanistan.

[Acadia Blue]

9. Shouldn't Obama be aware of this? Is he?

[ohio2007]

10. He's aware Putin is willing to make deals now that Russian economy is collapsing

If BHO doesn't understand the the story between these lines....

He is clueless and will be lost for the next for years

Russia to axe some weapons if U.S. abandons shield

MOSCOW, Dec. 19, 2008 (Reuters) — Russia will stop developing some strategic weapons if the United States drops plans for a missile shield in Europe, Interfax news agency quoted the commander of Russia's strategic missile forces as saying on Friday.

The remarks may be another step in Moscow's efforts to build ties with the incoming U.S. administration but also reflect difficulties Russia faces in financing its ambitious military programs at a time of global economic crisis.

"If Americans give up plans to deploy the third positioning region and other elements of the strategic missile defense system then certainly we will adequately respond to it," Colonel-General Nikolai Solovtsov said.

"We will simply not need a number of expensive programs," he added echoing earlier Kremlin overtures to the new U.S. administration.

snip


http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/lj276189-us-russia-shield/

Russia can't afford to do jack with oil dropping to $30 bbl.....
Barack should strike while the iron is hot if he wants to secure victory in Afghanistan while building trade routes with Russia

[bemildred]

11. And the British before them, and a whole bunch of other guys before them ... nt

Edit: Ah, here it is:

The Massacre of Elphinstone's Army was a victory of Afghan forces, led by Akbar Khan, the son of Dost Mohammad Khan, over a combined British and Indian force, led by William Elphinstone, in January 1842. After the British and Indian troops captured Kabul in 1839, an Afghan uprising forced the occupying garrison out of the city. The British army, consisting of 4,500 troops and 12,000 working personnel or camp-followers, left Kabul on January 6, 1842. They attempted to reach the British garrison at Jalalabad, 90 miles away, but were immediately harassed by Afghan forces. The last remnants were eventually annihilated near Gandamak on January 13. Only one man, the assistant surgeon William Brydon, survived and managed to reach Jalalabad.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacre_of_Elphinstone's_army