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Shooting Samarra's Schoolboys in the Back

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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 10:35 PM
Original message
Shooting Samarra's Schoolboys in the Back

Schoolboy Issam Naim Hamid...was shot in the back as he tried to protect himself with his parents in his home...It was three in the morning, according to his mother, Manal, when soldiers of the 4th Infantry Division came to the house, firing bullets through the gate. One of the rounds pierced the door, punched through a window and entered Issam's back..His father was hit in the ankle and was taken to Tikrit hospital yesterday in serious condition. Issam cries in pain in the Samarra emergency hospital ward, a drip-tube sticking into his stomach through a wad of bloody bandages....The Americans claimed to have killed 54 "insurgents"...and the only dead to be found in the mortuaries were nine civilians, including an Iranian pilgrim...Four days ago, they boasted of a further 11 "insurgents", but the only dead man who could be found was a vegetable seller....31-year-old farmer Maouloud Hussein who was trying to push his five young daughters and son into the back room of his two-room slum home...yet another bullet came whizzing through the gate and the outer wall of the house, and smashed into Maouloud's back......Hamed winces as he sees Maouloud cringing in agony --the wounded man tries to wave a hand at me and lapses into unconsciousness...23 bullets hit the house...lay bleeding for several hours before help came. Manal, Issam's mother, tells a terrible story. "The Americans had an Iraqi interpreter and he told us to stay in our home," she says. "But we had no telephone, we couldn't call an ambulance and both my husband and son were bleeding. The interpreter for the Americans just told us we were not allowed to leave the house."

..."You said you would bring us freedom and democracy.." he asks. "My neighbour, the Americans took him in front of his wife and two children and tied his hands behind his back and then, a few hours later, after all this humiliation, they came and said his wife should take all her most expensive things and they put explosives in their house and blew it up...

A Mississippi private said: "That's us", when I asked who was blowing down doors. "And you know what?" he asked. "After we do that, they go to the American authorities and ask for compensation." Which is true....young men tell me that they intend to join the mukawama--the resistance--after the humiliation and shame visited upon their homes. "We are a tribal people and I am from the al-Said family," one says to me. "I have a university degree and I am a peaceful man, so why are the Americans attacking my home and filling my wife and children with fear?"

The American military still talk about their battle against "terrorism" in Samarra, a story that might be more convincing if their troops were not accompanied in the city by hooded men in plain clothes carrying Kalashnikov rifles... Just a day earlier, the Americans announced that after an "investigation"--the oddest in recent history, one has to say--they had concluded that the truck bombing in Baghdad which killed 16 innocent civilians on Wednesday morning, was a "traffic accident"...in the land of innocent "insurgents" and "traffic accidents", the war continues to be spun. Just don't mention the hooded policemen. Or schoolboy Issam Hamid.

http://www.counterpunch.com/fisk12192003.html
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Military Brat Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. It is for the sake of honor that they require compensation
I really do wish that the Americans "in charge" would give some lessons on Arabic culture before they send our troops in.
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kainah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. My heart sinks
just reading the headline.
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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 08:11 AM
Response to Reply #2
14. What make my heart sink...
is how junior appointed that murderer John D. Negroponte
United States Ambassador to the United Nations!

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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
3. same old shit from
the veitnam war-body counts and dead civilians....
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tlcandie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. Well at leats one DU poster might be quieter about these
Edited on Fri Dec-19-03 10:55 PM by tlcandie
stories since it's Robert Fisk instead of electroniciraq and such :P Very sickening. I'm not sure I might not start having nightmares from all the pictures in my head and sorrow in my heart :cry:

I just don't understand how people...intelligent human beings... can be trained to do this to other human beings. How can a person do these kind of things and then live with themselves or in society ever again?

If this is war and it's byproducts I want no part of it even if you try to white-wash it and say sometimes it can be a good thing. Nothing I've seen, read, or heard is a good thing. Nothing. All of it is barbaric and inhumane.

After all this time...all these years it all comes down to this, yet again. We do not learn. We do not grow. How can anyone ever forgive us for these cruel, vial, disgusting acts in the name of freedom and liberation no less!

I now know the feeling of wanting to rend my clothing, scream and fall to my knees in utter agony crying and fasting in shame and desperation until I die of the world changes.

:cry:


Edit: There is no one but Kucinich who can bring us back from this desolate place because it isn't just about $$$, bills, constitutional rights, political parties, WMD, bombs, resources...it is about spirit and the sacred connection of all things. Until we get that and understand it nothing will ever change...nothing. It will just mutate and come back again like the diseases that eat away at our flesh.
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mmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. true enough about Kucinich
He is cut from different cloth.
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lumpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
5. And we are supposed to applaud the troops?
To hell with that.
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pansypoo53219 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-19-03 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
6. so, how does it feel to be
the Bad Guys.
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manfriend Donating Member (38 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
8. Counterpunch?
I'd have to see a major news outlet report that story before I'd believe it. Counterpunch is notorious for its inaccurate (and sometimes plain false) reporting. It's as bad as indymedia where they let anyone post "the news".
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vision Donating Member (818 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Here you go original source
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RedSock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. well, that's the last you'll see of him
thanks for the link!
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Tinoire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. Yeah...
Edited on Sat Dec-20-03 01:21 AM by Tinoire
as opposed to the versions authorized by the US/UK/Israel axis of evil? I'll take Counterpunch anyday- a LOT fewer 'mistakes' there.
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donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. agree - Counterpunch is ok
nt
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lefty_mcduff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. Yeah. I would wait till the news hits CNN, Faux or MSGOP...
...before considering it credible. These internet sources are way too librul...
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. I am sure you can catch this story on faux news....
any minute now......
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 08:06 AM
Response to Original message
13. The flip side plays the same tune.
This thread shows the view from a US combat leader in the Samarra incident. Rings true, and pretty much matches Fisk.

LBN - Combat Leader Gives The Inside Skinny Of The Biggest Battle Since The War

The thread links to a report at the Soldiers for the Truth site, but the link is old; this one works:

SFTT Story


"Of greater importance in the scale of the attack and the coordination of the two operations. Iraqi Rebel Guerilla Units elements still retain the ability to conduct synchronized operations despite the massive overwhelming firepower "Iron Hammer" offensive this month.

Hack, most of the casualties were civilians, not insurgents or criminals as being reported. During the ambushes the tanks, brads and armored HUMVEES hosed down houses, buildings, and cars while using reflexive fire against the attackers. One of the precepts of "Iron Hammer" is to use an Iron Fist when dealing with the insurgents. As the division spokesman is telling the press, we are responding with overwhelming firepower and are taking the fight to the enemy. The response to these well coordinated ambushes was as a one would expect. The convoy continued to move, shooting at ANY target that appeared to be a threat. RPG fire from a house, the tank destroys the house with main gun fire and hoses the area down with 7.62 and 50cal MG fire. Rifle fire from an alley, the brads fire up the alley and fire up the surrounding buildings with 7.62mm and 25mm HE rounds. This was actually a rolling firefight through the entire town.

The ROE under "Iron Fist" is such that the US soldiers are to consider buildings, homes, cars to be hostile if enemy fire is received from them (regardless of who else is inside. It seems too many of us this is more an act of desperation, rather than a well thought out tactic. We really don't know if we kill anyone, because we don't stick around to find out. Since we armored troops and we are not trained to use counter-insurgency tactics; the logic is to respond to attacks using our superior firepower to kill the rebel insurgents. This is done in many cases knowing that there are people inside these buildings or cars who may not be connected to the insurgents...

Since we did not stick around to find out, I am very concerned in the coming days we will find we killed many civilians as well as Iraqi irregular fighters. I would feel great if all the people we killed were all enemy guerrillas, but I can't say that. We are probably turning many Iraqi against us and I am afraid instead of climbing out of the hole, we are digging ourselves in deeper."


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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Definitely NOT "peacekeepers" them Murikkans ! Warriors - one and all


. . UN and peacekeeprs should have been allowed in Iraq 6 months ago

. . Murikkkan arrogance prevented that

. . now it's IraqNam
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prisonerseven Donating Member (90 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
17. Is there another account of this story?
I'd like to read the American soldiers account of what happened before passing judgment on our troops. It's always a good idea to hear both sides of a story when it's filled with this much emotion. The soldiers accounting could reveal details that may have been glossed over.
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-20-03 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. "Colonel Rudesheim is not trained in Counter-Insurgency,
and my soldiers are taking the heat."

Please click on the SFTT Story link in post #13 above, an American soldier's account from a combat leader in the Samarra battle.

:shrug:

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