Univ. of Illinois decides to end Chief Illiniwek's run

[Doondoo]

Unless a judge stops them, University of Illinois officials will announce Friday that Chief Illiniwek, the controversial and storied mascot who has performed for 81 years, is to dance for the last time next week.

University officials had made extensive preparations for Friday's announcement. But according to a source familiar with the university's plan, the process took a turn Thursday when the two students who portray the chief filed a lawsuit against the university and the National Collegiate Athletic Association.

The students are seeking a restraining order that would prevent the university from dumping the chief and would lift the NCAA's sanctions against the university's sports teams. A Champaign County judge will hear their application Friday morning in Urbana.

.......

In 2005 the NCAA ruled that Chief Illiniwek and some mascots at other universities were "hostile and abusive." The resulting sanctions have prevented the university from hosting men's tennis and women's soccer championship games.

Last month, university board of trustees Chairman Lawrence Eppley said a decision about the chief's future would be made this year in response to the NCAA ruling. Eppley did not return a call seeking comment Thursday.

The students' lawsuit against the university and the NCAA alleges that being forced to abandon their positions as chief would violate, among other things, their freedom of speech, academic freedom and future economic earnings.



http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-0702160179feb16,1,3166359.story?coll=chi-newsnationworld-hed

[rebel with a cause]

1. OMG

two students are suing to keep the mascot because they would loose the college credit they now receive from the school of music. Also, it would infringe upon their freedom of speech!!!! also "many valuable employment and career opportunities and professional associations have been opened to those who have had the privilege and honor of portraying Chief Illiniwek." Who in the world hires a guy because he dresses up in a costume and dances around, except maybe a dance company.

Another couple of quotes, "saying it is a revered tradition that honors Native American culture." and "The tradition and the origins and the efforts that we have made over the years have only been done in respect of the history of Illinois and the history of the Illinois tribe." Isn't it a shame that those poor-sport Native Americans just don't see it that way.:sarcasm:

One thing that make me suspicious of the U of I's decision is the following from the article. "In a similar lawsuit in North Dakota, a state district judge granted a preliminary injunction in November that allowed the University of North Dakota to keep its "Fighting Sioux" name and use of Native American imagery without NCAA penalties pending a trial." Could this all be a hoax on the University's part to get the same results as U. of N.D.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

2. Nope

As an alumni of the U of I, I can tell you that this isn't a "ploy" or a "trick".

We already took this to higher powers -- as did Florida St. (Seminoles), ND and other schools. For some reason, ND and Florida St. are allowed to keep their "racist" mascots (or maybe they aren't really racist as the NCAA apparently doesn't have a problem with them???), but Illinois is not allowed to keep theirs.

[bmbmd]

3. And how can you forget the McMurry University Indians?

My alma mater, in Abilene, Texas now calls their squads "McuMurry Football Team", "McMurry Basketball Team" etc. Let's see the NCAA take that away.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

4. Not totally up on the subject...

but it might be the dancing mascot. Dance is an integral part of Native American worship tradition, and even I'm a little uncomfortable with a white guy doing an imitation of a sacred dance in front of thousands of cheering, partially-imebriated college students. And I'm not the easily-offended type.

Perhaps Florida State and SD were able to keep the logo and the name without the other extracurricular activities.

Just guessing, though...

[Tyrone Slothrop]

5. Actually...

(and let me add this disclaimer: I don't have a dog in this fight. I'm neither pro- nor anti-Chief; I just follow the story as I went to school there and it was a big deal when I was there).

As I recall, Florida St. brought some representative of the Seminole tribe to the NCAA, and he told them that he didn't have a problem with the school using the Seminoles as a mascot. This, as I understood things, was the reason they got to keep using the mascot.

In Illinois, the University's relationship with the Illini tribe is...unusual -- particularly as the Illini tribe is no longer in existence.

The closest relative, the Peoria tribe, has had various leadership changes over the past decade and their position has, likewise, changed depending on who is in charge.

"The Peoria Tribe of Indians of Oklahoma are the closest living descendants of the Illiniwek Confederacy, having been relocated to Oklahoma in the 19th century. The position of the tribal leadership has evolved over the years. In a television interview with WICD-TV in 1995, Don Giles, then Chief of the Peoria Tribe, said, "To say that we are anything but proud to have these portrayals would be completely wrong. We are proud. We're proud that the University of Illinois, the flagship university of the state, a seat of learning, is drawing on that background of our having been there. And what more honor could they pay us?" Supporting Chief Giles was another tribal elder, Ron Froman, who stated that the protesters "don't speak for all Native Americans, and certainly not us." <8>

Ron Froman was later elected Chief, by which time his views on the Chief Illiniwek mascot changed. His views changed following meetings with American Indian students attending the University. In April 2000, the tribal council, with Chief Froman's support, passed by the margin of 3 to 2 a resolution requesting "the leadership of the University of Illinois to recognize the demeaning nature of the characterization of Chief Illiniwek, and cease use of this mascots ". <9> Froman stated "I don't know what the origination was, or what the reason was for the university to create Chief Illiniwek. I don't think it was to honor us, because, hell, they ran our (butts) out of Illinois." <10> This puts Chief Illiniwek in a position different from that of the mascots of other schools such as Florida State University, whose Native American mascots are not opposed by the leadership of the corresponding tribes. In 2005, a new Chief, John P. Froman, when asked his position by the NCAA, indicated that "the Chief was not representative of our tribe and culture, mainly because the costume is Sioux" <11> In 2006, in response to a widely published column by journalist George Will in support of the mascot's use, he wrote a letter reiterating the Peoria Tribe's opposition to the mascot and decrying that the "University of Illinois has ignored the tribe’s request for nearly five years." <12>"

(from wikipedia)

[DBoon]

6. yeah, lets call the team the "Priests"

and have them don robes and perform a mock Latin mass at half-time.

See how long that one would last

[saigon68]

10. Well OK be sure to close the Day care Center then

Keep those little boys away from the robed ones

[rebel with a cause]

8. Ok, am not an alumni of the U of I and not a football fan.

Do believe in respecting other people's culture and heritage, and do not like the use of symbolisms such as this. You can site all the others and I still won't change my mind but I am not going to get into a fight over it. There are some used around here for high school mascots that are as bad if not worse than the U of I's chief.

I've got a great one that should be used. A Jerry Falwell type of preacher as a mascot and call the team the Christian Evangelicals. You could then have the cheerleaders dressed in short choir robes doing the cheers. the helmets could have crosses on the side of them. Another team could be the Jewish tribe. A rabbi could be their mascot, and the star of David on their helmets. Don't know about their cheerleaders. A third team could be the radical Islamics, you provide the rest. You see where I am going. If we don't think there is anything wrong with this type of thing, then lets make it relevant and what relates to today's world and people.

Flame away, my dogs are calling. SI Salukis? No mine are lab mixes.

[rebel with a cause]

9. Better one:

Team - Vengeful Honkies
Symbol on side of helmet - Picture of Saltine crackers
Mascot and ceremony - The Klansman marches around the field at halftime with his burning cross proudly held aloft
Cheerleaders dress - White skirted tennis outfits with pastel sweaters tied loosely around their necks.
Cheer - For the pride, white pride, for the power, white power. Proud to be honkies, honkies are our pride.

Alright, I have much too much time on my hands. Now use your imagination and come up with some opposing teams. Should make ball playing much more interesting and personal.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

11. I don't know where you got the idea that I'm pro-Chief

You should try actually reading what people write sometimes.

My posts on this thread were supposed to do 3 things:

1. Refute your ridiculous assertion that the lawsuit filed by the students is some sort of "hoax" concocted by the University

2. Provide Jeff in Milwaukee with a little background info

&

3. Question why the Seminoles and other like schools are not being held to the same standard that the NCAA is holding Illinois too

Where you got the idea that I'm pro-Chief from that...well, I have no idea.

[rebel with a cause]

12. Ha ha ha

I don't know if I thought you were pro-chief or not, but your answer (post #2) to me sure did not indicate that you were not. And that was the post I was responding to.

I did not make an assertion that the lawsuit was some sort of hoax, I think I was basically saying that the way things in this country are made me suspicious of everything and the article made that thought possible by their mentioning what had happened in North Dakota. Really, as I said, as a non-sports fan this is not important enough for me to fight over it.

Unfortunately, I forgot and used the universal "you" in my reply and forgot that people tend to take this to mean the comment is to them personally/a personal attack. Whether or not you are pro-chief or not does not make a difference to me, I was not mad at you but being rather a little sarcastic with my proposals. These proposals were just to anyone, as was my comment to flame. I am surprised you did not catch on with the reference to the Salukis that I was being flip and not really that serious.

The funny thing is that I did not take your original response to me that personal, but now I see it was. Sorry I offended you, but then life goes on and I am sure so will we. Good luck and good day.

[fishwax]

16. Florida State has the support of the tribe whose name they use

that's why the NCAA made an exception for them. (Same with the Utah Utes.)

But I agree with you that this isn't a ploy or trick. No way the University wants to wade back into this mess.

[Rosie1223]

7. Illinois Alum

I am a UofI grad and I will be sad to see the Chief retired. The Native American heritage is treated with respect by the students of the University of Illinois. The students do not wear headdresses or tomahawk chop. The Chief performs an authentic dance during halftime only. He does not roam the sidelines with the cheerleaders for the entire game. He is not a foam-headed cartoon character mascot.

The NCAA has allowed Florida State University to retain the use of "Seminoles" because the Seminole tribe gave it's blessing to the usage. I guess that makes it OK for a white boy to dress like an Indian, at least in Florida. But does this mean Michigan State must get the Greek government's permission to be the Spartans? Does the Michigan State Spartan mascot have to be a native Greek before he can don the costume? Must a college get a special dispensation from the Pope to be "The Crusaders" to portray themselves as genocidal soldiers? I suppose Illinois could become the "Fighting Trapeziods" but then the Society for Irregularly Shaped Objects would get all up in arms. Is is possible to have a mascot that doesn't offend someone?

Unfortunately the Illini tribe no longer exists so such permission will not be forthcoming for Illinois. The Illini Tribe was virtually wiped out by the early 1700s. They were overcome by Eastern Tribes who sought out the Ohio and Mississippi Valleys for beaver and other natural resources to trade with the Europeans. The greed of whites indirectly caused the demise of the Illini.

I guess I must accept that college athletics mean big money to universities. NCAA sanctions mean lost revenues. It is ironic that the Illini tribe will once again be wiped out by the white man's greed.

RIP Chief

[Bonobo]

13. I'm an alum too. I was even in the card section. Sure was fun.

We're loyal to you Illinois
We're orange and blue Illinois
We'll back you to stand, gainst the best in the land,
Cause we know you've got sand, Illinois

So crack out that ball, Illionois
We're backing you all, Illinois
Our team is our home protecter
On boys for we expect a victory from you, Illinois

Che hee cha haw cha haw haw haw Go Illini Go!!

[HardWorkingDem]

14. Sorry, to disagree, but...

You are factually in error about some of your claims. Suggest you read Dancing At Halftime by Carol Spindel.

http://www.amazon.com/Dancing-Halftime-Controversy-American-Mascots/dp/0814781276/sr=1-1/qid=1171727105/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/105-2040195-3530802?ie=UTF8&s=books

She discusses many of the myths of this mascot and how it is not what people claim it is. For example, the items worn are not accurate and the "authentic dance" is not authentic.

Also, another book is Team Spirits by Vine Deloria.

This is a long awaited and overdue decision. Though I don't think it is over. More white people will feel compelled this is still their "heritage" and file lawsuit after lawsuit instead of really looking at this issue from other sides.

[fishwax]

17. the chief had nothing to do with the illini tribe, and the university is not changing its name

because (according to the university, anyway) the name refers to the people of the state of illinois, not to the tribe. So it's hardly the case that "the Illini tribe will once again be wiped out by the white man's greed."

[davsand]

15. I'm an alum and I live in the area still.

Frankly, I'm glad it is done.

While I was not especially involved in the issue WAAAAY back in the early 80's when I was working on my undergrad, I do remember seeing an awful lot of cartoon Chief stuff on people. I also remember seeing the Chief on beer cups, baby bottles, shot glasses and on everything else you can dream up. I do not have them still, but I was gifted once with a pair of orange tennis shoes with the Chief on them...

When I was in school, I went to a few games (but not many.) At the time I remember thinking the Chief's performance at halftime was kinda cool, and that the screaming crowds generally were happy to see him. I didn't GET the whole mania that accompanies fan-dom for a sport--still don't really--but I'm kind of strange that way, I guess.

When they first began talking about the Chief locally and the "Anti-Chief" activists began to be visible, I was pretty apathetic about the issue. While I generally agreed that it IS pretty disgusting to be seeing a cartoon of any cultural icon on crap like beer mugs and jockey shorts, I also didn't really understand why some folks felt the appearances at halftime were such a disgrace.

My lack of understanding was further compounded when there was a big deal about how some Native American man MADE a new Chief outfit and presented it to the University. Gee, if it is ok with him it must ok--right?

The argument about the Chief just never ended. Year after year it kept on coming up, and year after year the University Foundation kept arguing that they'd get less in funding from alums if the Chief was retired. I'd see a lot of the university students out there working to retire the Chief, but I never saw a lot of change in the attitude of the Foundation.

Finally, I came to a point where I realized that the people who were the most vehement about KEEPING the Chief were the ones who had never gone to school there. The Foundation was handing out a load of crap because the alums give money because they went to school there NOT because of what the mascot it. I was seeing "Save the Chief" stickers and T-shirts on people who had NO freaking connection to that university at all. That realization brought me to the following point:

This is a school mascot we are talking about. The choice of the mascot has absolutely zero impact on improving the education available at that school and every opportunity to HURT the school if it erodes academic credibility (can you imagine how the Anthropology Dept feels about this subject?) or if it offends the students who are PAYING to attend that school. In this case it is clear--from the years of argument that have surrounded this subject--that the choice of mascot IS, in fact, creating a problem.

It was time for the Chief to hang up his moccasins.

Just my opinion.



Laura

[fishwax]

18. Yesterday was a great day for the University of Illinois

'Bout time! :woohoo:

[barb162]

19. It's about time; this should have happened years ago