The great blood libel of Sept. 11

[Behind the Aegis]

Blood libels never die, they just get digitized.

Thanks to new media, ancient prejudices need never fade away. So it is that Jew hate, nothing if not adaptable, has become easier to disseminate than ever before. Bigotry as old as time can now be downloaded, podcast, cable cast, sat-phoned, text-messaged, downloaded, YouTubed across state lines, oceans, and all continental borders at the touch of a grimy button.

At this point, you never quite know where you're going to find it next, or what form it will take.

This year, I found it at Ground Zero.

I was handed a complimentary DVD by a 9/11 conspiracist. It was a newly enhanced version of the Protocols of the new millennium, the theory ? simultaneously promulgated by elements of the far left, the far right, and fundamentalist Islam, people who in every other respect hate each others' guts and each others' every opinion ? that it was Israel and the Mossad that brought down the World Trade Center.

more...

[JackRiddler]

1. Ask & Ye Shall Receive

The thesis that 9/11 was an inside job - the most common thesis among 9/11 skeptics - is no more "anti-Semitic" than the thesis that Russia's 99 apartment bombings were an inside job, or that Reichstag fire was an inside job, or that the Bologna train station bombing was committed by Italian fascists backed by the CIA, who succeeded in having the blame falsely placed on communists. Or that the Lavon Affair involved an attempt by Israeli agents to have attacks on American targets in Egypt blamed on Arabs. These are valid and well-supported hypotheses about specific historic events, not just logical but also very much in keeping with past historical precedents.

In this case, the cited writer says he was handed a dvd at Ground Zero on 9/11/06. He does not name or specify what was on it, invalidating anything further he may have to say. Apparently all he has to do is claim that it's anti-Jewish, and that is suppose to instantly make whatever it is radioactive, too dangerous to even name, something that should be banished by way of Internet filter before our weak and mortal eyes are burned by exposure to its title.

In all likelihood, the dvd in question it was a copy of Loose Change 2, since copies of LC2 outnumbered copies of everything else handed out at GZ this year by a ratio of 10:1. LC2 is a very lousy film in terms of evidentiary presentation, but not one that in any way focuses on Jews as perpetrators of 9/11. But what's a detail here or there?

Then he digs up the usual suspect, Christopher Bollyn, and attacks him (although Bollyn was nowhere near Ground Zero on 9/11/06, and is otherwise not a representative of the 9/11 truth movement).

You're obviously out looking for evidence of Jew hatred among 9/11 skeptics, and if you don't find it up front, you'll have no trouble manufacturing it.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

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[Behind the Aegis]

3. You link to anti-Semitic filth....

That link you provided is a PRIME example of anti-Semitism! For fuck's sake they blame the death of Natalee Holloway on the Jews! Columbine? A link that is titled: Timeline for world domination, and it's 2010! Auchwitz was just a work camp?! WTF!

Chertoff doesn't hold dual citizenship.

Your post is disgusting!

On edit: You do realize your link is in the Franklin Hate Sites directory, yes?

[Name removed]

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[RedSock]

5. jeez

If you want to make it clear you're not anti-semtic, you might think twice about linking to something called:

www. jewsdidwtc .com

[Behind the Aegis]

6. Are you fucking kidding me?!

STORMFRONT?! That's a fucking neo-nazi site! JEWSDIDWTC?! Please, do not send anymore "proof." I have had my fill of anti-Semitic filth sites today!

[Bolo Boffin]

7. I can't believe my eyes either.

There's nothing like people showing up to vividly demonstrate the OP's point.

Incredible.

[JackRiddler]

9. very predictable...

Not impressed with DemInDistress's behavior and links either. (Ahem, you could stand to get the most obvious facts straight: the Lavon Affair was the false-flag op in Egypt, 1954; the Liberty was the US spy ship attacked by Israeli planes during the 1967 war. And it goes on from there.)

Doesn't change that the OP is fishing for this kind of thread - by characterizing 9/11 skepticism ("conspiracism") instantly & fundamentally as a sub-genus of "Jew hating." (As opposed to a perfectly reasonable view of any spectacular terror attack: that it was done under a false flag.)

Thus, someone handing out a "dvd" at Ground Zero (almost certainly LC2) becomes a participant in the age-old "blood libel."

This is no way to seriously critique 9/11 skepticism. It is attack by association.

[KingFlorez]

8. Those sort of links might be acceptable at right wing sites

But not here. Take that mess off of here.

[Tom Joad]

15. anyone that links to Storm** should be removed from DU immediately.

it has no redeeming value whatsoever. Pure pornography.
I think most of the conspiracy theories regarding 9/11 are from nuts, anyway.
I agree with BTA, for once.

[Behind the Aegis]

11. response

The thesis that 9/11 was an inside job - the most common thesis among 9/11 skeptics - is no more "anti-Semitic" than the thesis that Russia's 99 apartment bombings were an inside job, or that Reichstag fire was an inside job, or that the Bologna train station bombing was committed by Italian fascists backed by the CIA, who succeeded in having the blame falsely placed on communists. Or that the Lavon Affair involved an attempt by Israeli agents to have attacks on American targets in Egypt blamed on Arabs. These are valid and well-supported hypotheses about specific historic events, not just logical but also very much in keeping with past historical precedents.

I didn't see the author state the idea that 9-11 was an inside job was anti-Semitic. Seems you are reading something clearly not written, or even implied. The only possible way you could reach that conclusion is by his stating that some believe it was the Jews in the Bush administration that orchestrated it, and that is anti-Semitic!

In this case, the cited writer says he was handed a dvd at Ground Zero on 9/11/06. He does not name or specify what was on it, invalidating anything further he may have to say. Apparently all he has to do is claim that it's anti-Jewish, and that is suppose to instantly make whatever it is radioactive, too dangerous to even name, something that should be banished by way of Internet filter before our weak and mortal eyes are burned by exposure to its title.

Because he didn't state the name of said DVD it invalidates his further points? Hardly! Your foolish hyperbole notwithstanding, the point he made is that some of the "theories" out there are anti-Semitic in nature, reminiscent of the "Protocols." I wish he had revealed the name of this DVD. It could be one that was homemade, and not in large reproduction. However, we don't know because he didn't tell us and that is, IMHO, a bit sloppy.

In all likelihood, the dvd in question it was a copy of Loose Change 2, since copies of LC2 outnumbered copies of everything else handed out at GZ this year by a ratio of 10:1. LC2 is a very lousy film in terms of evidentiary presentation, but not one that in any way focuses on Jews as perpetrators of 9/11. But what's a detail here or there?

Yes, what is a detail here or there, like the detail he never said what the DVD was, so everything you wrote is nothing more than speculation. What I find interesting is that you state that LC2 is "...a very lousy film in terms of evidentiary presentation, but not one that in any way focuses on Jews as perpetrators of 9/11." Well, if LC2 doesn't focus on Jews, isn't it more than likely that wasn't the DVD that Mr. Burston was handed?

Then he digs up the usual suspect, Christopher Bollyn, and attacks him (although Bollyn was nowhere near Ground Zero on 9/11/06, and is otherwise not a representative of the 9/11 truth movement).

This makes no sense. Burston doesn't hold up Bollyn as a "representative of the 9/11 truth movement." What he does say he is "one of the more prolific conspiracists." Nowhere does he say it was Bollyn that handed him the DVD, so Bollyn's location is irrelevant and nothing more than a red herring.

You're obviously out looking for evidence of Jew hatred among 9/11 skeptics, and if you don't find it up front, you'll have no trouble manufacturing it.

How dare you presume to know what I am doing, then preemptively accuse me of wanting to make shit up!?! Talk about intellectually dishonest and a perfect example of an ad hominen attack! But, I didn't have to wait long, now did I? The very response to you was a link to an anti-Semitic site. That poster went on to post a LITANY of Jew-hating sites, what did they all have in common besides anti-Semitism? Jews were the reason the towers fell! So don't fucking presume to tell me that some of the "theories" out there AREN'T based in anti-Semitism. AND THAT was the point of the OP!

BTW, as you are a denizen of this forum, I am sure you are aware of the rules, one of which states, very clearly: "Many groups have used 9-11 to pursue very bigoted agendas. A notorious example is where anti-Semites claimed Jews were foretold of 9-11 and stayed home as a result. Remember this."

So you understand me clearly, I do NOT think that the 9-11 truth movement is anti-Semitic as a whole, nor do I think all the theories around it are, even some of the ones that imply Israel may have had something to do with it. But, like the author, I have found that 9-11 brought out the Jew-hating whack-a-doos in full force, and some slide under the radar!

[Bryan Sacks]

13. what's the big deal?

As you said, Aegis, anti-semitism shows up in plenty of places. You were handed a single video, and from that extrapolated what, exactly? An anti-semitic 'blood libel' of September 11?

It's the undue attention paid to anti-semitism, Aegis, that is my issue.

That whack-a-doos in the 9/11 truth movement use 9/11 skepticism as an excuse for their Jew hatred is very true. But it's of virtually no consequence. Honestly, so fucking what?? You can find prejudice just about anywhere, including in your first post. You say the "far left" promulgates anti-semitism, as does the far right and fundamentalist Islam. That's a lie. Some ON the far left promulgate anti-semitism, but anti-semitism is hardly an essential or defining feature of the 'far left'.

[Behind the Aegis]

14. You do realize I am not the author, yes?

I didn't write the piece, it is an opinion piece from Ha'aretz. Therefore, the rest of your post really doesn't make sense.

However, I will answer "what's the big deal?" The 'big deal' is that anti-Semitism has corrupted legitimate discussion of the topic, as well as made headway in the 'movement.' What is the big deal? Well, when any form of bigotry gains traction, then it is a problem and should be addressed. When you have people running around thinking "Jews brought down the Towers," it fuels a hate that eventually emerges in more insidious forms, including attacks, vandalism, even, murder. So, that is what the "big deal" is.

[Bryan Sacks]

19. A non-sequitir

Off point, I am aware that you did not write the piece, but posted it in an approving manner. If his views are not yours, good.

Second, you wrote:

"When you have people running around thinking "Jews brought down the Towers," it fuels a hate that eventually emerges in more insidious forms, including attacks, vandalism, even, murder. So, that is what the "big deal" is."

That's a silly point of view. Even the least discerning listener will inspect such a strange-sounding claim before attacking, vandalizing or, for heaven's sake, murdering someone for it.

[Behind the Aegis]

22. ?

Off point, I am aware that you did not write the piece, but posted it in an approving manner. If his views are not yours, good.

I posted it. Period. I didn't post it "approvingly," happily, sadly, or any other emotion. You will not that in the OP there is nothing but the blurb and the link, no commentary from me whatsoever. His views are similar to mine, in this case. I find bigotry disturbing and having no place in legitimate discussion, unless it is about the scourge of bigotry.

Second, you wrote:

"When you have people running around thinking "Jews brought down the Towers," it fuels a hate that eventually emerges in more insidious forms, including attacks, vandalism, even, murder. So, that is what the "big deal" is."

That's a silly point of view. Even the least discerning listener will inspect such a strange-sounding claim before attacking, vandalizing or, for heaven's sake, murdering someone for it.

A silly point of view? That is your opinion, however the statistics after 9-11 do not lie. As one would expect, attacks against Muslims and Arabs quadrupled. Why? Because 9-11 involved Arab/Muslim fanatics, an atmosphere of hate and intolerance and bigotry prevailed in the media, which in turn provoked actions against Muslims and Arabs, no matter what their feelings were about 9-11. Interestingly enough, after 9-11, attacks on Jews doubled! Why? Well, from the day the planes hit, there were those screaming it was the Jews and some latched onto that "mantra," therefore, innocent Jews were harassed and two were murdered. Were all the hate crimes because of 9-11? Certainly not. But when bigotry is allowed it dehumanizes the victims in the minds of the perpetrators. So your "theory" that "Even the least discerning listener will inspect such a strange-sounding claim before attacking, vandalizing or, for heaven's sake, murdering someone for it.", actually would need to be backed up more substantially. Because, in fact, sometimes people act out on the bigotry they hear every day, no matter how far-fetched it may seem to the more rational of us.

[Bryan Sacks]

24. You misunderstand the statistics

First, let's see the proof that attacks against Muslims increased fourfold.

Assuming they did, it would be important to understand why. You wrote:

"Because 9-11 involved Arab/Muslim fanatics, an atmosphere of hate and intolerance and bigotry prevailed in the media, which in turn provoked actions against Muslims and Arabs, no matter what their feelings were about 9-11."

The second part of your claim is the correct part. The first part doesn't matter much at all. It's NOT THE ACT, but the officially-sanctioning fear-mongering that creates the hostile climate. For a recent example of this, see the coverage of the Amish reaction to the murders of schoolchildren in Bart Twp, PA.

The media creates the conditions for large-scale events like this in society. The veracity of the claim it rests on ("9/11 involved Arabs/Muslims) means next to nothing.

For a primer about the way the media can operate to spread information and alter people's behavior in a seemingly unforeseeable fashion, see Edward Brecher's "How To Launch A Nationwide Drug Menace".

Obviously, the US corporate media has not scapegoated "the Jews" for 9/11, and thus I would be surprised if 9/11-related anti-semitism has had any major effect whatsoever on anti-semitic behavior in the US.

One can always comment on whatever one wants. But in my view the effects of anti-semitism the world over these days are far less newsworthy than, say, anti-Islam sentiment. Jews are not in peril anywhere in the world in the way many Arab Muslims are in peril (in the case of Gaza, in peril from a Jewish State).

I say this as a Jew.

[rman]

31. right, you have like, no opinion about the OP that you posted.

sure...

[Behind the Aegis]

32. I never said I had "no opinion."

But then again, I know yours.

[rman]

35. I could not care less.

First you deny you wrote the OP approvingly (calling "approval" an emotion), then you say you agree with the views expressed in the OP. That is mincing words at best, a waste of time as far as i am concerned.

[rman]

30. Same as what certain other well-known DUers do

Take one example of some ridiculous claim relating to 9/11, and associate the entire 9/11 truth movement with it. Optionally while claiming not be using the broad brush.

[petgoat]

10. The conflation of "Jew hate" with the legitimate discussion of

possible connections between the state of Israel (known to
have the most ruthless and competent black ops operatives
in the world) and 9/11 is so dumb as to be hardly
worth comment.

But it's well for those of us in the movement to be
sensitive to the fact that genuine anti-semites do
lurk around the edges of the movement seeking to
exploit 9/11 skepticism, and we need to conspicuously
distance ourselves from them because the belief that our
movement is anti-semitic will be its political death in
this country.

I am always careful to distinguish between "the Israelis"
and "the Jews". Of course more Jews like Rabbi Michael
Lerner and Naomi Klein could make the distinction more
obvious to everybody, but that's another story.

In public discussions I avoid the Israeli stuff because
it's inflammatory, distracting, divisive, useless--and
unnecessary. When somebody wants to get on his "Jews
Rule the World" schtick I just say "Even if that were
true, what use is that information to me? I'm trying
to get a new 9/11 investigation and drive out the
Bush regime. Once we've accomplished that we can
worry about whether some secret cabal rules the world."

[quickesst]

12. Simple questions...

Why is there such a widespread beief that Israel can do no evil, and if they do, we should ignore it? At what point, no matter the gravity of the injustice done to them during the holocaust, does Israel finally come forward and take their share of responsibility, their share of the crow pie, so to speak, for the ills of the world? Just about every country in the world eats theirs on a daily basis. Anti-Semite is a word that, along with "racism", that has been hijacked by a segment of the population who neither want, nor welcome any dialogue that would narrow the bounds of discussion that could lead to a meeting of the minds. As a matter of fact, there are those who take an active role in perpetuating the hijacking of these two words. Honest debates on either subject are few and far between. Anything else is bullshit. Just my o2. Thanks.
quickesst

[DemInDistress]

16. new source... Paul Thompson, "Timeline to Terror"

September 11, 2001: Five Israelis Arrested for Puzzling Behavior near WTC The white van used by five Israeli agents as they were leaving New York on 9/11.
Five Israelis are arrested around 4:30 pm for “puzzling behavior” related to the WTC attacks: filming the burning WTC from the roof of their company’s building near Liberty State Park, New Jersey, then shouting in what was interpreted as cries of joy and mockery. A neighbor spotted them and called the police and the FBI. The police tracked them down in a van with the words “Urban Moving Systems” written on the side. One man was found with $4,700 in cash hidden in his sock, another had two passports on him, and a box cutter was found in the van. Investigators say that “here are maps of the city in the car with certain places highlighted... It looked like they’re hooked in with this. It looked like they knew what was going to happen.” One of these Israelis later says, “our purpose was to document the event.” The FBI later concludes at least two are Mossad agents and that all were on a Mossad surveillance mission. The FBI interrogates them for weeks. They are held on immigration violation charges, but are released 71 days later. Their names are later identified as Sivan and Paul Kurzberg, Oded Ellner, Omer Marmari, and Yaron Shmuel.

Entity Tags: Federal Bureau of Investigation, Yaron Shmuel, Israel Institute for Intelligence and Special Tasks, Omer Marmari, World Trade Center, Oded Ellner, Paul Kurzberg


this is their van..


here is the page:http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&geopolitics_and_9/11=israel

[geek tragedy]

17. Too late. You already proved the OP right.

And I'm not sure why you're still here. Most anti-semites get banned.

[quickesst]

23. And you...

geek tragedy, have proven the point of my post above nicely. Playing in the shallow end of the pool. Thanks.
quickesst

[Lurking Dem]

25. So

when one sees an antisemite spewing libel and linking to nazi sites we should pat his hand and say, "That's nice dear"???

[freedom fighter jh]

18. Michael Ruppert says the Mossad did know something . . .

. . . and tried to warn US authorities. An article on his site, by Michael Meacher, says, "Two senior Mossad experts were sent to Washington in August 2001 to alert the CIA and FBI to a cell of 200 terrorists said to be preparing a big operation." See http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/090803_meecher.html . Evidence that the Israelis knew it was coming is not evidence that they were behind it.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[truth01]

27. It wasn't the Jews and it wasn't the Arabs

The Jews did not cause NORAD to stand down that morning.

19 Arab guys with box cutters (some still alive) did not cause NORAD to stand down that morning.

The official conspiracy theory - 19 Arab guys with box cutters let by a guy in cave is, in my opinion, a blood libel that goes against the facts.

I could say more, a video will serve better:
Press for Truth
http://www.911blogger.com/node/3604

Peace.

[savemefromdumbya]

28. th enemy is within the gates

[rman]

29. Then again, Arabs most certainly did play a role in 9/11,

as did individuals of other nationalities, quit likely including Israeli nationals.

False-flag ops like 9/11 are done by criminal factions within governments and government agencies - these factions have no loyalty to any nation, they operate globally.

What i think is peculiar about the OP is that it equates accusations of Israeli involvement to "jew hatred". This is as silly as saying Americans were involved equates to anti-Americanism, or to say that there was Saudi involvement equates to anti-muslimism.

[Behind the Aegis]

33. Take a look at your own bias.

"Then again, Arabs most certainly did play a role in 9/11 as did individuals of other nationalities, quit likely including Israeli nationals." The first part of your sentence is fact, the second, merely speculation.

"What i think is peculiar about the OP is that it equates accusations of Israeli involvement to "jew hatred"." Where is that?

[rman]

34. Depends on whether or not you believe the OCT,

which i don't.
By "Arabs" i don't mean the so-called highjackers - even though they did play a part, as patsies - rather i mean financing of terrorist organizations. Officially the financing of 9/11 is no issue whatsoever, so my statements about Arab involvement are no more or less speculation than Israeli involvement.

[seatnineb]

36. I agree with you 100% rman.........

This affair is a transnational operation...

Wierd...it is a mirror reflection of the OTC in the sense that the OTC claims that Alquida is an entity that belongs to no state or country.....yet the "real perps" probably have the same "countryless and stateless" background.

[Nozebro]

37. What does "OTC" mean? Thanks. EOM

nt

[seatnineb]

38. Official Conspiracy Theory n/t

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

39. Here's another thread where...

...a bit of thoughtful discussion actually took place that was about to disappear into the 9-11 archival abyss.

Is that "software bug" ever going to be fixed? -- anybody know?

[Fainter]

40. Pure Anti-anti-ism-itism. Don't You Have Something Better To Do?