Here is a new wrinkle on the Gannongate story...

[Andy_Stephenson]

I just had an interesting phone call.

Anyone in DC with access to a DC yellow pages please PM me....I need you to look up something for me. After we have found what I am looking for we may have a whole new...shall we say twist on this thing.

Andy

[graywarrior]

1. Do reverse phone numbers online

[Andy_Stephenson]

6. No I need something specific

looked up and an address.

[nostamj]

2. well, I guess you're on the mend...

and on the TRAIL! :thumbsup:

[Cha]

9. Right!

:)

[tandot]

3. Yahoo has yellow pages:

http://yp.yahoo.com/

[Blue-Jay]

4. Try this:

http://www.hellowashingtondc.com/YP/YellowPages.Cfm

[AuntiBush]

129. LOL!

The pict is hysterical! On a serious note, it's so befitting and imaginable! Thanks for the laugh!

:hi:

[Haymare22]

5. omg.....

Im gonna pee.......Do hurry, puleeze!

[Shopaholic]

Keep us posted Andy--

and hope you're on the mend!

[Shopaholic]

8. Keep us posted Andy--

and hope you're on the mend!

[DearAbby]

7. Andy, How are you feeling? Glad to see you tho! :) nt

[Andy_Stephenson]

11. Feel like I have been punched in the GUT

other than that I am feeling frisky.

[HeeBGBz]

107. You sound it.

Glad to see you posting.

[Andy_Stephenson]

10. Eureka I found it....

CAPITOL CITY ESCORTS
WASHINGTON, DC 20001
[phone]

Long known to be a CIA front company. Don't ask how I know...They apparently have been involved with more than just escorts. I am doing some searches now....anyone want to jump in...feel free. I have a huntch there is something here...can't say what. Just that there is. I was told a long time ago about Capitol City Escorts. We need to milk this one...pun/no pun intended.


Andy

[Haymare22]

12. Yer good Andy! nt

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

13. CIA Escort Service?

Well then, the sex would be secondary to their real product: "Honey Trap" ops. Blackmail of people, to get them to supply HUMINT. Nothing works better for that than a "gay indiscretion".

Am I warm? ;')

[Andy_Stephenson]

20. Boiling hot!

I would say.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

21. Boiling hot??!!

Hey, bucko, it ain't boiling hot until I start flashing some ankle!

:D

[Andy_Stephenson]

25. Show some ankle then

Show it!

[Rockholm]

79. Watch out. Sex threads get shut the boiling oil tossed on them.

[TheDebbieDee]

27. Not only that, but sometimes the escorts are Active Duty

military females (and males). They are asked to volunteer to attend these diplomatic functions, (sometimes a limo is sent to pick them up) to fill out the crowd and give the diplomats a large variety of people to mingle and flirt with.

Also, the escorts are told to keep their ears open for interesting gossip and conversation that the diplomats exchange among themselves. How do I know this? I was stationed in Germany in the late 80s with a sergeant who had recently pcs'd from Ft. Belvoir, VA and she related this info to me.

[TrustingDog]

60. Was The New Jersey governor honey-trapped?

that Cipro guy (sorry I forget his name) sure sounded suspicious as all hell.

[No Exit]

101. I sure think he was! And the accuser goes

BACK TO ISRAEL, where he is virtually untouchable... and Israel has an intelligence service that is every bit as dastardly as our own CIA... to me it really seemed a sure thing that the whole thing was a set-up.

[rocktivity]

104. The idea of Cipro being a gay undercover Mossad agent seemed funny

until he hot-footed it back to Israel without following through on his threats of legal action.

Fortunately, Gov. McGreevey realized that the goal was to force a special election the Repubs would have taken advantage of, and refused to leave office until after the 2004 election.

:headbang:
rocknation

[Clark2008]

113. So, basically, if everyone in DC just kept it in their pants

there would either be A.) No HUMINT or B.) No soap opera.

How come most people that I know seem to keep it cool? I divorced my husband for cheating, but he wasn't having kinky prostitute sex with litte boys - it was just one woman.

Feh.

Morality in Washington. :p

[Roland99]

375. Holy Crap! Is that how that "scandal" ended???

[Not_Giving_Up]

14. I found this

http://www.switchboard.com/bin/cgiad.dll?PR=118&BI=102638719&MEM=46&CID=1664&T=Washington&S=DC&QV=02A64DB1FDD61F4257303203O01A64AB1FDD61F4251303203O07A64BB1FDD61F4252303203O03A62F3DFDD61F42A6303203&QT=BCL

Trying to figure out how you run an escort service AND a real estate office from the same location. :shrug:

Business Types

# Real Estate Appraisers
# Personal Escort Services
# Escort Service-Personal
# Miscellaneous Personal Services
# Real Estate

[blm]

35. The real estate office helps when you take checks or credit cards

and likely helps to launder "extra" money.

[Liberty Belle]

105. May also provide discreet, vacant locations for trysts.

[blm]

138. Hey, how does a nice girl like you know about this stuff?

I know why I know. ;))))))))))))))))))))))

[Liberty Belle]

268. Romance novelist with a creative mind. ;-)

[Sparkly]

15. You can get more if you pay for it (so to speak)

http://smallbusiness.dnb.com/company-information-product-list.asp?prodid=&catalog=&key=132862538&itemName=CAPITOL+CITY&country=US&city=WASHINGTON&addr=4000+CATHEDRAL+AVE+NW+APT+725B&state=DC&zip=20016-5287&trade=&TelNbr=2023331024&cm_mmc=Online+Media%2ASwitchboard%2ACompany+Search%2ACompany+Search

[Not_Giving_Up]

16. Yeah, I saw that too

I'm just broke

[nashville_brook]

19. we need to start a kitty for stuff like this eom

[rqstnnlitnmnt]

17. same address as "The Westchester"

http://www.washingtonian.com/dining/Profiles/westchester.html">http://www.washingtonian.com/dining/Profiles/westchester.html

Washingtonian Restraurant Review:
This has always been a working city, and many of the city's grandest apartment buildings were built with dining rooms to spare residents the necessity of cooking after a hard day at work. Perhaps the only one of these relics of a grander past that still functions in anything like its original state is the dining room at the Westchester, the apartment complex at 4000 Cathedral Avenue, Northwest.

The Westchester, begun in 1930 and never completed because of the Depression, consists of four buildings around a central sunken garden. At the beginning of World War II, according to James M. Goode's Best Addresses, its residents included two Cabinet members, 31 congressmen, 12 senators, and 14 judges. Its best-known inhabitant in recent years was Senator Barry Goldwater.

heh

[Andy_Stephenson]

23. Isn't that on or close to

Dupont Circle?

[rqstnnlitnmnt]

28. sort of close

it's on its way headed out of downtown (4000 cathedral)

dupont is closer, definitely not walking distance

[notadmblnd]

56. here's a map

http://mapsonus.switchboard.com/bin/maps-maponly/usr=~4217d5f3.a8b83.20d3.8/c=1/refsrc=SB.newsb/isredir=1/

[Clark2008]

38. Hmmm... The Westchester Apartments could be the new

Watergate Hotel.

[Andy_Stephenson]

18. And look at this...Gannon was listed on this same site

http://www.male4malescorts.com/start.htm



"I talked with the guys at Capitol City Escorts in DC trying to get a pic on Andy who has a new review posted today. (No pics available yet). But they told me Jonathan has moved on. He's moved out of the country to pursue his education. We wish him well and if you hear he's escorting at Oxford, let us know!"

http://www.male4malescorts.com/news/news04-2000.htm

[Nordic65]

29. Wasn't there some connection between Gannon and the name J.Daniels?

There is something listed as "A NEW JACK DANIELS ESCORT" in DC.

Probably nothing, but you never know...


http://www.hellowashingtondc.com/YP/c_DATINGPERSONALESCORTSERVI.Cfm

[Nordic65]

44. More on "A NEW JACK DANIELS ESCORT"

But now with the title: "Self Made Millionaire (a New Jack Daniels Escort)"

See this page
http://adults.city-business.us/profile/DC/District-Of-Columbia/8

Click link "Show Map"


LOL

[sandnsea]

52. Here's an address

http://www.escortset.com/escorts/virginia/centreville/escort-services.htm

On Clavert on the other side of Observatory Circle. The VP's house is on Observatory Cirle, by the way.

[dqueue]

242. Occam's Razor... a sense of humor? Coincidance?

Interesting, or maybe not... Your link gives an address for:

A New Jack Daniels Escort
[phone]
2501 Calvert St NW
Washington, DC 20008

So, Google for that address, and you find a number of entries. This one struck me as funny, a page of "Star's Addresses, Letter T". Search down the page for 2501 Calvert, and you find listed Helen Thomas.

[sandnsea]

261. Shoreham Condominium

So many possibilities with that, I don't even want to speculate.

[julialnyc]

45. Gannon's other alias?

TalonNews.com and GOPUSA.com are both registered to Endeavor Media Group LLC, operating from Post Office Box 891354 in Houston, Texas. The phone number provided is 999-999-9999. The registrant for a series of web sites, including Jeffgannon.com, Theconservativeguy.com, Exposejessejackson.com, Militaryescorts.com, militaryescortsm4m.com, and hotmilitarystud.com is Bedrock Corporation of 4001 Kennett Pike in Wilmington, Delaware. Bedrock is owned by Jim Guckert, the apparent real identity of Jeff Gannon. The administrative contact for Bedrock was listed as "J. Daniels," possibly another alias.
http://onlinejournal.com/Media/021805Madsen/021805madsen.html

[julialnyc]

53. OMG read this link!!!! Much more than Gannon being J. Daniels

from above link
After the Gannon story broke, militaryescorts.com and hotmilitarystud.com were redirected to a secure log-in site at Cupertino, California-based www.dividezero.net/, which was registered to GKG.Net, which had a contact email in College Station, Texas, the home of Texas A&M University and the George H.W. Bush presidential library. Dividezero.net had a secure log-in window but no subscription information. Experts who track illegal content on the web, including child pornography, report that such sites are common where log-in information is provided separately by regular mail so that the identities of subscribers cannot be easily tracked by online enrollment and entry of credit card information.


Gannongate is reminiscent of a huge political scandal that surfaced in Nebraska in 1989 when it was learned that Lawrence King, the head of Franklin Community Credit Union in Omaha and a rising African American star in the GOP (he sang the national anthem at George H. W. Bush's 1988 nominating convention in New Orleans), was a kingpin—along with top Republicans in Nebraska and Washington, DC, including George H. W. Bush—in a child prostitution and pedophilia scandal. King was later convicted and jailed for fraud but pedophile and prostitution charges were never brought against him and other Nebraska Republican businessmen and politicians.


The scandal, investigated by Nebraska State Senator Loran Schmit, his assistant John DeCamp (a former GOP state senator), State Senate Committee investigator Gary Caradori, and former CIA Director William Colby, reached the very top echelons of the George H. W. Bush administration and GOP. Child prostitutes from Boys Town and other orphanages in Nebraska as well as children procured from China were reportedly flown to Washington for sexcapades with Republican politicians. GOP lobbyist Craig Spence and a number of GOP officials in the administration and Congress were implicated in the scandal, including Labor Secretary Elizabeth Dole's liaison to the White House. Young male members of the military in Washington, DC, were particularly sought after by the prostitution ring. During the early 1980s, a number of naval officers were implicated in a child pornography ring that extended from Oregon to the San Francisco Bay area and to Chicago and Washington, DC. The story about that ring was covered up by then-Secretary of the Navy John Lehman.


The Nebraska pedophile scandal was similarly covered up on orders from the highest levels of power in the senior Bush White House. Caradori and his young son were killed in a suspicious plane crash in Illinois in 1990. Colby was found floating dead in the Chesapeake Bay, near his home, in 1996. Craig Spence allegedly committed suicide in 1989. Witnesses, many of whom were abused themselves, were intimidated and subsequently jailed in Nebraska and the investigation of the pedophile scandal eventually collapsed. The entire military aspect of the King-Spence scandal is now being repeated in Washington in Gannongate.


Last year, a senior source on the Washington Times editorial staff (the same paper that broke the GOP pedophile scandal in 1989) linked White House Deputy Chief of Staff Karl Rove to gay activities involving top Republican political strategists in Washington, DC.


Gannon (Guckert) has been a major player in GOP and fundamentalist Christian politics in Washington and around the country. In 2004, "Jeff Gannon" was a featured speaker at a Capitol Hill Bible reading sponsored by anti-abortion Operation Rescue head Reverend Rob Schenk. In 1995, Schenk was the spokesman for the American Center for Law and Justice, an anti-abortion group funded by Pat Robertson. Schenk was also a major supporter of former Alabama Supreme Court Justice Roy Moore, who was removed from office for refusing to comply with a federal court order.


Schenk, who attended prayer meetings at John Ashcroft's Capitol Hill apartment after Ashcroft came to Washington in 1994, established his Pentecostal National Community Church at the dilapidated Giddings School in a crime-ridden neighborhood in Southeast Washington. One of his congregants was Ashcroft. The Hill newspaper ran an article on July 30, 2003, about a controversy surrounding plans by the community development Eighth Street Main Streets Project to place park benches in a small triangular park at 8th and I Streets in Southeast Washington, opposite the U.S. Marine Corps Barracks. The paper reported that a "community activist" named Jeff Gannon vehemently opposed the park bench plan claiming it would attract "vagrants, alcoholics, and other 'problem personalities.'" The park is located just five blocks from the school where "reporter" Gannon's friend Schenk first located his Pentecostal church.


Gannon hosted a web-based radio program called "Jeff Gannon's Washington," broadcast on his own web site, Jeffgannon.com, and Righttalk.com, a conservative GOP site whose registrant is based in Watsonville, California. Gannon's only journalism credentials were his attendance at a two-day seminar at the Leadership Institute's Broadcast School of Journalism in Arlington, Virginia. The head of the Leadership Institute is Morton Blackwell, a former Reagan administration official and a one-time head of the College Republicans, a post that Karl Rove also filled.



Gannon seemed particularly interested in South Dakota politics. GOP Senate candidate John Thune appeared on Gannon's radio webcast program. On February 4, 2004, while being served softball questions by Gannon, Thune called Daschle an "obstructionist and antagonist to President Bush."

more......

[bush_is_wacko]

208. Looks like THIS link has been shut down. Got another?

I'll try one more time. And BTW the one above this is a little sleazy, I'm concerned my security controlls allowed it to come up. My kids don't need to see naked guys proudly displaying their flag poles!

[dqueue]

249. I completely disagree with this seed...

Your post lede's:

After the Gannon story broke, militaryescorts.com and hotmilitarystud.com were redirected to a secure log-in site at Cupertino, California-based www.dividezero.net/, which was registered to GKG.Net, which had a contact email in College Station, Texas, the home of Texas A&M University and the George H.W. Bush presidential library. Dividezero.net had a secure log-in window but no subscription information. Experts who track illegal content on the web, including child pornography, report that such sites are common where log-in information is provided separately by regular mail so that the identities of subscribers cannot be easily tracked by online enrollment and entry of credit card information.

More than anything, it resembles an admin portal entry, perhaps a content management system. There is absolutely no recorded history of content on any of those domains.

[truth2power]

67. Alias J Daniels

James Daniel Guckert.

Look here:

http://www.dkosopedia.com/index.php/Jeff_Gannon

"Jeff Gannon" (sometimes cited in news transcripts as Geoff Gannon) whose real name appears to be James Daniel Guckert was a White House-credentialed fake news reporter"...

[julialnyc]

100. So it is really J Daniels....minus last name

NT

[ohio_liberal]

149. I thought

his middle name was "Dale"? :shrug:

[bush_is_wacko]

212. Dashle as a "target!" Interesting.... n/t

[Must_B_Free]

106. it was listed as a possible pseudonym

I can't remember thr exact placement now, but I read the J Daniels thing yesterday.

[nostamj]

30. andy, use the search function for "BULLDOG"

on the M4M site. it's our boy. 'delisted 11/04'!

hmmm.......

[paineinthearse]

36. What is the Brit term for an "escort"? nt

[nostamj]

37. 'rentboy' is one. probably others though n/t

[sandnsea]

22. That phone #

Also goes to A-Elite and Tropical Treasures.
http://www.google.com/search?sa=X&oi=fwp&pb=f&q=(202)+589-1777+++

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

26. SOP.

An escort service will have a bank of numbers, all linked to a "thematic" name. Call them up, and they will answer with the 4-digits.

How do I know this? Urrmmm...I read it somewhere? :whistlestunelessly:

[RBHam]

31. :whistlestunelessly:

stop it! you're killing me...

this thread is fascinating...

real investigative journalism at work in real time...

andy, you should work for cnn!

:chortlesmaniacally:

[blm]

39. CNN is Bush's CoverupNewsNetwork.

Wait till Al Gore gets his network.

[RBHam]

41. Exactly

I was being, let's say, a tad sarcastic...

[Melissa G]

120. whistles...chortles...ROTFLMAO!!!!!!! N/T

[sandnsea]

33. Elite for Hair Mini Spa Salon

That Elite phone number goes to Elite Escort Services at an address of 2315 Wisconsin Ave NW, which is the address of Elite for Hair Mini Spa, which gave away a hair package at a John Hopkins event.

http://www.sais-jhu.edu/programs/i-dev/AUCTION2004/SilentAuction.html

Just interesting.

[blm]

43. Y'know how much gossip you can pick up at a hair salon?

You also get an earful of people's travel plans or those of their spouse.

[sandnsea]

48. Near Observatory Circle

Here's the cheesy web site of the Hair Salon, hehe, and a map. I do web sites. I've never seen a web site more concerned with people knowing the location than the services offered. Would you get your hair done at this place?

http://www.eliteforhairminispa.com/323349.html

[icehenge]

80. Link

Google link fix for broken link
http://tinyurl.com/4dxjv



A-Elite
Address: 2315 Wisconsin Ave NW,
Washington, DC 20007
Phone: [phone] (SAME NUMBER AS CAPITAL ESCORT)


http://yp.yahoo.com/py/ypMap.py?Pyt=Typ&tuid=19444531&ck=2121037016&tab=B2C&ycat=8120393&city=Wilson-Conococheague&state=MD&uzip=21740&country=us&msa=3180&cs=4&ed=AfgUJ61o2Tw.uY.1oDRlSTTQMxra_u.liUYkzvjOSZIJ&stat=:pos:8:regular:regT:18:fbT:2

[Andy_Stephenson]

82. Doesn't the VP live at

The Naval Observatory?

[flyarm]

92. YES! N/T

[DemoTex]

98. I just called 202-589-1777. Talked with Jake. Whoremaster Jake.

I asked about services. I told him that I was with the Texas governor's delegation at the Washington Hilton (pure B/S. Ironically Dr. DemoTex is at the Washington Hilton tonight for an APA meeting). Whoremaster Jake said that they had some special "girls" for us (I made the Texas shit up!). He said they would be available all night tonight and all day Sunday. Egads! What a boook! Call Jake and schedule a girl. DU women, call too. Freak him out! Ask if he has a bald male escort named Jeff. Be crafty, now. BTW: I did not ask prices. What's a big-time DC whore going for nowadays?

[flyarm]

179. i want one of your "w" 's for my car!! here in jeb state!!

love your "w" !!!!!!!!!!!

but i need it magnet..cause they key your car here in jeb state!!

i have to have that!!
i am sick of seeing the little fishy's and support the troops...i have "bring them home " on a yellow ribbon!!
but i want that w!!!!!!!!

great!!!!!!!!!!!!

fly

[Bouncy Ball]

215. Well Jeffie was $ 1200 a weekend.

I can't remember his hourly rate, it was posted somewhere from his websites.

[bush_is_wacko]

217. $200 an hour. The weekend rate was a great deal! n/t

[msanthrope]

219. "What's a big-time DC whore going for nowadays?" Ask Condi. n/t

[DemoTex]

278. Her "husband" gets a slight discount.

Know what I mean, Vern?

[mzmolly]

24. Here's another address Andy.

A-Elite

Address: 2315 Wisconsin Ave NW, Washington, DC 20007
Phone: [phone]

http://tinyurl.com/7yl24

:hi:

[TrustingDog]

59. The Franklin coverup paper. check out 'Professional Services'...

second page, mentioned on first column.

here is the text:
Professional Services is one of several umbrella companies used by operators supply male prostitutes as escorts,...

any connection between Capitol City and Professional?

here's the link:
http://www.voxfux.com/features/bush_child_sex_coverup/franklin.htm

[Clark2008]

62. Holy Mary! Lock up your children!

:scared:

I'm gonna watch this after my son goes to bed.

[TrustingDog]

71. No Kidding! and look what else I found...

nest of vipers world wide. and that filthy Dyncorp name comes up very often.

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2003/05/265143.shtml

George Bush, The CIA, Mind Control & Child Abuse
author: gdy
Not only did King's pedophile ring lead to the top echelons of the Republican Party it also lead to the top of the Bush administration and the Oval Office. Several of the children in Kings prostitution ring recount stories of seeing George Bush at some of King's Parties. While an outsider would not suspect anything amiss, the children in the ring would know what was taking place. At least one of King's young prostitutes reported that at one party, she saw George Bush pay King and then depart with a young black man.

May 5, 2003

From the Streets of Little Beirut
Glen Yeadon

On January 28, 2003, amid the furor of the impending war with Iraq the British press briefly reported on Operation Ore, the most thorough and comprehensive police investigation of crimes against children before being squashed by the Blair government. ....

Moreover, the British report was not the first such case reported. In fact, it followed on the heels of a report from Portugal. On November 27, 2002, the press reported a scandal of pedophile ring run from a state orphanage. The Guardian reported that the scandal threatened to engulf diplomats, media personalities and senior politicians. Photographs of senior government officials with young boys from Lisbon's Casa Pia orphanage were among the evidence. More shocking however, were the revelations that systematic sexual abuse of children at the home had allegedly been going on for more than 20 years and had been known to police and other authorities for most of that time.

On January 14, 2002, Insight Magazine reported the charges leveled by Ben Johnson against his employer Dyncorp, a major defense contractor. Johnson charged that officials and employees of Dyncorp were engaging in perverse, illegal and inhumane behavior and were purchasing illegal weapons, women, forged passports and participating in other immoral acts. Johnson had witnessed his supervisors and fellow employees buying 12- to 15-year-olds as sex slaves.
....

More disgusting is the role the United States government plays in facilitating this global sex trade. Instead of banning the previously mentioned Dyncorp from further defense contracts, the regime of George W Bush rewards it in granting major contracts for the Iraqi war.

[Clark2008]

93. You're not going to believe this, but I actually did some work on this

case, as it involved Pete Townshend.
It was long speculated that Pete was the "fall guy" - the star they used to get the heat off the police officers, judges and government officials who were also alleged to have been involved. It worked. The press concentrated on Pete and not on finding out who all these other officials were/are.
In England, the names of those accused are not released upon pending litigation, but Pete's name was leaked to the media by a police officer.
As the story goes, Pete had one instance of viewing child porn - and that was only to see if he could (which is still illegal). He immediately called the authorities upon accessing it and THEY IGNORED HIM. He reported it to both the police and Childnet International to no avail. Nothing happened for YEARS until there was the investigation. We're talking three years.
He never downloaded any porn - he simply used a valid credit card to access the site to see how easy it was. I never excused him for stupidity, but he did report it after he realized what he'd done and how easily it was accessible.
In any case, the point is that they took 13 computers from Pete's house and office and found NOTHING/NADA/ZILCH in terms of child porn. If he were a paedophile, there would have been SOMETHING on those, even scrubbed (which they weren't). He took the equivalent of a plea - for the instance he admitted to, because, in England, researching a site is still illegal, even if there was no malicious intent.
Here, just read:
http://www.petetownshend.co.uk/media/020120adifferentbomb.pdf

http://www.petetownshend.co.uk/diary/display.cfm?id=33&zone=diary

Notice in the story on the .pdf, Pete talks about the international child abuse/sex ring? He knew and knows about it. He let his mind Google a bit too much (we have all done that) and accessed an illegal site - the origins of which are a couple in, ahem, TEXAS: http://www.wsacp.org/child-porn-news/Child_%20Pornography.htm (In August last year a Texas computer consultant, Thomas Reedy, was sentenced to a total of 1,335 years for running the internet child porn empire, which had a turnover of more than $1.4m (£870,000) a month.

Why do I believe Pete?
Because I helped in the public relations on this - strictly as a volunteer because I have known Pete since I was 14 and he never did anything to me. He was a mentor - and THAT alone.
What we determined, with the help of the Phoenix Survivors, a British advocacy group who supports the victims of paedophila and ended up SUPPORTING Pete and his work in bringing this to everyone's attention, is that Pete was the guy that elite governmental officials PURPOSELY planned on outing to take the heat. Nothing was further reported about any of the government officials involved. Imagine that. I am sorry, but the links I had in my hotmail to their statements on Pete no longer work (the site has been re-done), I can say that my contact there was Shy Keenan. She may prove to be invaluable in this.

Sorry to wax poetic, but I may have an in-road in this that I didn't realize I had.

[BuyingThyme]

111. Have you tried putting the old links into the Wayback Machine?

www.archive.org/web/web.php

[Clark2008]

127. I just tried

It didn't work.
They must have been archieved or - actually, in watching them try to pull, it looked like they were all some sort of Java Applet - a Macromedia.
Thanks, though. I can use this for something else. :)

[jdj]

115. Pete Townsend's history of sexual abuse is pretty well

documented in Tommy, thank God, particularly the song "fiddle about".

I believed him and reading what you have posted is even more reassuring. I knew whomever was behind that work of art had been abused and we all know Roger Daltry was not the brains of that organization.

[Cats Against Frist]

163. He was the hotpants n/t

[chookie]

234. Entwhistle wrote "Fiddle About"

And "Cousin Kevin". And Boris the Spider. He was the son of an undertaker and had a very macabre sense of humor. He wrote songs about death, and drunkeness and cruelty.

I think Townshend was interested in the psychological effects of trauma, but he never wrote anything as bleak and black as Entwhistle was in the habit of.

[Clark2008]

236. Very true

Thanks for that.

:thumbsup:

[K8-EEE]

126. Thanks so much, I always wondered about this.

Interesting post.

[tinanator]

154. thanks for doing the right thing!

the wolves around here still talk trash when PT is mentioned. The power of gullibility/stupidity is a wonder to behold.

[bush_is_wacko]

214. Any chance Micael Jackson is the current fall-guy? I usually turn the

TV off with any mention of this story so I am really not very up to date on it. Just that the list of possible witnesses testifying is a Hollywood who's who.

[Kansas Wyatt]

96. Didn't Shrub rant and rave about the global sex trade awhile back?

If I recall, he was blaming a lot of it on Castro in Cuba and he was making a mission to abolish it around the World. Or was this just a ploy to get out ahead of it, and smear others with it before it led back to him? Common Shrub tactic.

[Clark2008]

97. He can blame on Castro, if he wants, but the culprit is a Texas

couple.
Which, even as wide and vast as that state is, makes me wonder.

[Pastiche423]

108. Yes, in a speech he made in September 2003

But he spoke only of women and children in other countries. There was no mention of Castro in that speech, though.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/09/20030923-4.html

[Old and In the Way]

118. Insight Magazine....another Moonie publication.

They seem to report on a lot of these child abuse/sex scandels. Like the Franklin Savings and now we see GHW Bush doing PR work for them.

You know what I think? I think the Moonies have been able to expand their financial/power base precisely because they are in on these honey pot operations. Then they start blackmailing.

Maybe that's why they were able to rent that Senate office building? I suspect lots of the Washington news media is equally compromised / blackmailed by them.....

[Blue_Roses]

256. that is one frightening article

:scared:

[Liberal In Texas]

121. Holy bejeezes! The name of the credit union in the Nebraska was FRANKLIN!

[Liberal In Texas]

128. The more I read about this Franklin thing, the weirder it gets.

The book, "George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography" (1986), states that in 1985, Eulice (Lisa) Washington, told Youth Care Worker, Julie Walters, as documented in her Department of Social Services March 25,1986 report, that Larry King (of the Franklin Credit Union scandal) ran a massive child sex, homosexual, and pornography industry. She described how beginning in tenth grade, she had been taken by plane by Larry King, with other youths, to be used as a child prostitute at parties in Washington, Chicago, and New York. Lisa said that at these parties, she sat "looking pretty and innocent" and guests could engage in any sexual activity they wanted except penetration.

Lisa named Vice President George Bush as in attendance at least twice, according to Walters’ report. Lisa said she had first met Mr. Bush at the Dallas 1984 Republican Convention.

She also saw Vice President George Bush , Sr., at a party in Chicago in September or October of 1984, accompanied by two large white males. Walters’ report states; "She indicates that she set on a table at the party while wearing nothing but a negligee. She stated that George Bush saw her on the table. She stated she saw Vice President George Bush pay King money, and that Bush left the party with a nineteen year old black boy named Brent." According to the Chicago Tribune of October 31, 1984, George Bush, Sr., was in Illinois campaigning for congressional candidates at the end of October, 1984.
Walters’ report indicates that Lisa said she saw George Bush, Sr., again at a party hosted by Larry King in Washington, D.C., in which there were no women, only men perfectly made-up to look like women, older men and men in their younger twenties. She said she saw sodomy committed at those parties.

-much more at http://www.johnnygosch.com/gunderson_report.html

also mentioned is the CIA connection, and more links.

[Blue Gardener]

251. Noreen Gosch

Johnny Gosch's mother, Noreen, wrote a book about what she believes happened to him after he was kidnapped from Des Moines, Iowa while delivering newspapers. She believes he was kidnapped for use in this child prostitution ring. I read her book, and it explains a lot of about this scandle from the 80's. The book is difficult to follow due to the terrible spelling and grammatical errors, but it's interesting nonetheless. I'd be willing to bet she is following this latest development very closely. I think you can order it from this website:

http://www.johnnygosch.com/

[deutsey]

186. Bohemian Grove Connections?

I hesitate to bring this up because Bohemian Grove is often lumped in with oddball "illuminati" conspiracy theories. But apparently, there are reports, unfounded or not, of some sordid sexual things going on in Bohemian Grove, not to mention the bizarre paganistic ritual members of the Grove perform.

If you're not familiar with Bohemian Grove, it is a place in California where every year the world's most powerful and wealthy men (and it is all men) visit for a "retreat." Both George Bushes are members, as are lots of other men you'd know. This is all fact.

Where it gets weird is when you look at the videotape someone who infiltrated the retreat made of the "Cremation of Care" ceremony where participants are wearing red hooded robes and doing what looks like human sacrifice before a huge stone Owl. That apparently is also fact, although Bohemian Grove members say that it's just a harmless show they put on to kick off the retreat. (Sidenote: what is it with these guys and robes and secret rituals? Skull and Bones comes to mind...)

Where it really gets weird is when you hear about some of the sordid sexual things allegedly going on there. To my knowledge, these rumors are all unfounded allegations, but they're out there. The allegations (and I want to stress that these are unproven allegations) involve homosexual and heterosexual prostitution as well as pedophilia.

Taken together with the Franklin scandal and now Gannon's male prostitution connections, maybe there is more to these allegations than previously thought?

Just speculation here, maybe amounting to nothing. But who on earth would have thought a month ago that we'd be talking about Gannon's escort service and connections to the White House now?

[TrustingDog]

204. Alex Jones on Bohemian Grove. Link here.

http://www.infowars.com/alex_cspan_bg.htm

[Petrushka]

324. Did a google.com search on that phone number and . . .

. . . found the following two businesses using the same phone-number:

Capital City Escorts
4000Cathedral Ave. NW
Washington DC 20001-5249
Phone: [phone]

Business Types:
Real Estate Appraisers
Personal Escort Services
Escort Service-Personal
Miscellaneous Personal Services
Real Estate

http://www.switchboard.com/bin/cgiad.dll?PR=118&BI=102638719&MEM=46&CID=1664...

A-Elite
3734 10th St. NE
Washington DC 20001-1820
Phone: [phone]
Business Types:

Personal Escort Services
Escort Service-Personal
Miscellaneous Personal Services

http://www.switchboard.com/bin/cgiad.dll?PR=118&BI=104337642&MEM=46&CID=1705...

[KansDem]

354. Hi, Andy...

Happy to read you're doing better...

I ran a reverse on that number and found this:

Name: A-ELITE
Employees (Corporate Location): 1 to 4
Address: 2315 WISCONSIN AVE NW
Est Sales: <$500,000
City: WASHINGTON, DC 20007-1865
Location: single
Contact: na
Headquarters: None
County: DIST COLUMBIA
Credit Rating Code*: UNKNOWN
MSA (Metro Area): WASHINGTON, DC-MD-VA-WV
Phone: [phone]
Public: No
Fax**: na
Stock Exchange: None
Fortune 1000 Ranking: Not Available Ticker Symbol: Not Available
Foreign Parent: NO
Toll Free Number: Not Available
URL: Not Available

SIC Lines of Business
7299-03 ESCORT SERVICE-PERSONAL REGULAR 2002

NAICS Lines of Business
81299015 ALL OTHER PERSONAL SVCS

on edit: Whoops, just saw that several other DUers have found this company. Perhaps the additional information I provided might also help. :hi:

[DU GrovelBot]

32. ## PLEASE DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##

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This week is our first quarter 2005 fund drive. Democratic
Underground is a completely independent website. We depend almost entirely
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your support.

[spooked]

34. OMG!! Could THIS be the same Gay Escort Service with the Credit Card #s

of 2 Supreme Court Judges, 8 Senators, 5 Congressmen and 3 White House Aides?!

http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=2408

"In my second-to-last communication I talked about a male ”escort service” operating in DC for the edification of the very senior Beltway people. I have, locked up in my office safe, copies of the credit card receipts with names, card numbers and signatures of: two Supreme Court and one Appellate Court judges {Have you heard about the two judges who tried each other?} eight Senators, five Congressmen, two former and one current White House aides, a number of very prominent DC lawyers, several senior members of the RNC, four general officers and one Admiral, three of whom are still on active duty , five local newspapermen, eight ministers, high level employees of: State Department, Commerce Department, Justice Department, HEW Department, DC police department, NSA, DIA, and most especially, a number of pundits from Georgetown University and a nice collection of CIA people. The proprietor of this stud farm was one Todd Blodgett and there was a front-page story on one of his male whore establishments in the Washington Times. Blodgett was a Reagan White House aide, was fired from both the WH and later, the RNC, for aggressive homosexual behavior and then tossed out of the University Club in DC.

Information that has been kept very quiet at the highest levels would indicate that George W. Bush was heavily involved with gay groups while at Yale, had a significant affair with another man while at HBS, was a "very close friend" of a black drag queen and, according to three different inside sources, is no more a Pentecostal Christian than Saddam Hussein.

The sex material about our pure, God-intoxicated President, comes from one arrest report and several "counseling" reports now sequestered (by order of Karl Rove) at Yale (Bush's records there have been sealed) There is the temptation to run with this but there at least has to be something factual here. The Republicans are trying to plant obvious lies on everyone in the hopes that others like the nutty Rather will take them up and make Bush look like a wonderful but persecuted man. According to one report, made long before Bush was Governor of Texas, he could not have any kind of sex with women unless at least half drunk and was a practicing advocate of physical abuse. He likes to beat people, according to this. But not be beaten in return. Some of this is not only difficult to believe but downright repulsive."

[RBHam]

40. More interesting is the threat to global peace...

excerpt:
After that nice bit of pleasantry, let’s consider something far more serious as far as world peace is concerned. This concerns the US activities in the Caucasus. The Chechen rebel organization, led by Shamil Basayev, (long supplied with money and explosives by the CIA), that slaughtered 170 children and 130 adults in Beslan is about to be obliterated by Russian special military units. The Russian government has been demanding that leading members of this CIA-controlled group, Akhmad Zakayew, now hiding out in London and Ilyas Akhmadov now safe in the US, be turned over to Russia for planning and conducting the Beslan massacre. This will never happen, believe me. However, that having been said, someone has told the Russians where these two men are living and it would not come as an unwelcome surprise if aggressive burglars killed both of these child-killers and anyone else in their homes. Not that they wouldn’t deserve it.

The Russians should realize that through the request of the CIA, Ilyas Akhmadov was quietly given political asylum in the US and receives a Reagan-Fascell monthly paycheck, full medical insurance and office space, paid for by the US government, from which he engages in political propaganda for the Chechen rebels ( The Fascell Foundation is funded by Congress through the US State Department) ed

In short, the US government is trying its best to force Russia out of the Chechen area and to seize control over current and past Russian territories.

This is only a small part of the US government’s design to chase Russia out of the oil-rich Caspian Sea and Caucasus area, set up puppet governments obedient to US and British oil interests and cut Putin, whom they both view as a dangerous enemy, from the world’s oil markets

[seemslikeadream]

58. One of the Senators? Bob Dole

WASHINGTON -- The Riggs National Bank scandal has led to unexpected fallout, including "suspicious activity reports" on former Senate Majority Leader Bob Dole and former Defense Secretary Frank Carlucci, Friday's Wall Street Journal reported.

As often as once a week, Mr. Dole's assistant walks around the corner from his Pennsylvania Avenue office in Washington to a branch of Riggs Bank, where she withdraws as much as $8,000 in cash. For walking-around money, Mr. Dole keeps a wad of $100 bills in the breast pocket of his shirt. "I probably use a credit card four or five times a year," Mr. Dole confesses. "I don't even have a wallet."

Mr. Dole's affinity for cash was of no concern to anyone until recently, when federal regulators pawing through the books of scandal-tarred Riggs spotted the large withdrawals and called them to the attention of management. In short order, the bank filed "suspicious activity reports" on Mr. Dole and another prominent Washington figure, Mr. Carlucci, questioning whether the two men might have violated federal laws against money laundering.

The two aren't actually suspected by Riggs of wrongdoing, people familiar with the filings say. But the bank, a unit of Riggs National Corp. (RIGS), felt it had no choice but to file these reports because of the strict wording of the Bank Secrecy Act.

more
http://finance.myway.com/jsp/nw/nwdt_rt.jsp?section=news&news_id=dji-00094720040902&feed=dji&date=20040902&cat=INDUSTRY

[Kansas Wyatt]

64. My father has always said...

Dole has worked in public service his whole life and he is a millionaire, and he could not have made that money from public service. He's always believed that Dole was getting a lot of kickbacks to be worth that much.

[Nashyra]

103. OMG

I have heard this story repeated by a very respectful person.

[BamaBecky]

136. Makes sense

If the father has a child fetish......that the son would have been unable to escape from such childhood sexual abuse........and as an adult he might develop the very same warped fetish. Or, geeze, their could be a genetic component....running through the family. The SRA (satanic ritual abuse) aspect of this fascinates me. I have worked with two "multiples" who where child victims of SRA. It is all about POWER! Satanism is all about gaining power from Satan.

Power....is at the root of all of this.

[LeftyMom]

319. Oh not the SRA crap again!

Damned if I know why people make that shit up but thier delusions have nothing to do with escort services operating in DC. Conflating the two makes it easy for the corporate media to do another smear job. :crazy:

[thereismore]

42. CIA plant

I guessed it here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1608642&mesg_id=1608786

[julialnyc]

49. then he might know

who Valerie Plame was. Could he have been the one to leak to Novak and the others?

[julialnyc]

50. his site was

MILITARY man for man (or something like that

[spooked]

51. Awesome theory! Would be nice if the CIA was one step ahead of Rove!

Did you see the movie Horns and Haloes, about Hatfield, the author of FORTUNATE SON? And how Hatfield's outing as a former felon was engineered by Rove to discredit the Bush cocaine rumors?

Would be nice for Rove to get a dose of his own medicine.

[Eloriel]

63. More

GANNON / ROVE / RATHER connection
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1603949#
Mangate A link between Hannity/Gannon/Rather Memo story
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1588477
Link: http://mediamatters.org/items/200502100001

Gannon -- Connecting the Dots
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3131271

Gannon's real purpose
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1606495

Gannon reportedly knew about "Shock and Awe" four hours before it happened
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1247511

Radio Producer Could Always Count on 'Gannon' for Tips
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1248758
Link: http://199.249.170.220/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000808600

Conason: Gannon: The Early Years
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x107011
Link (Salon Premium) http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2005/02/18/gannon/index_np.html

[spooked]

55. Although why would the CIA have anything to do with the outing of Plame?

or maybe the CIA discovered Rove's intentions through Gannon...

[julialnyc]

57. they wouldn't

but he was on their side.......a partisan agent who leaked out of spite.

I was thinking the "bad" agent angle

[Kansas Wyatt]

65. Could this be the reason for the shake-up and purge from the CIA?

[julialnyc]

102. I think this is mission gone wrong

For someone who works in Internet news, they had to know if they had an Internet business on the web that they would be discovered.

Either Gannon wanted to be exposed, or he is the stupidest person alive. Who would ask a loaded question on TV like he did without wanting to be discovered or is well below average IQ.


Or the administrations cockiness just surpassed reality having him ask that!

[Clark2008]

68. Or, Rove was going to set up Gannon whom he knew was out for HUMINT

(or maybe had it)so Gannon one-upped him and outted himself before they could suicide him.
Think about it.
Gannon ASKED for an outting - from DU, no less.

[spooked]

73. Rove's MO

seems to be to leak a damaging true story to a reporter "with a past" so that he can later discredit the source, and thereby take the focus off the real, damaging story, and put it instead on the person reporting it. He knows the story is going to come out, so he seems a master at orchestrating WHO will leak the story.

It's what he did with Hatfield and with the CBS Memos.

So, I'm wondering, is there a damaging Bush story that Rove was planning for Gannon to leak? Did Gannon figure out the plan and out himself?

[understandinglife]

94. Interesting speculation ;-)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3141657&mesg_id=3141657

And, for someone who lives in DC (or nearby).

See if you can get access to police records and a coroner's report for a "suicide" at 3034 O St NW, Georgetown, DC, sometime in 1977 or 1978. "Ted" would be the first name of the victim. He was involved with a ~ 20 y/o male shortly before the "suicide" and had had numerous parties in his 3034 O St townhouse and garden -- parties attended by all sorts of male members of Congress, their staffs, and others (often quite young males).

Peace.

TBO;24/7

[autorank]

110. "Gannon ASKED for an outting - from DU, no less" ??? Whom did

Gannon ask at DU for an outing. Geebus?

[tavalon]

132. He asked by egging us on

by promising to "try harder" to get the number one spot on the conservative idiots list.

[HeeBGBz]

112. I think that is a possibility

When I was watching GuckGannon with Cooper he looked spooked. He had scared eyes. Not for just being a press party crasher, but for other secrets yet to emerge.

Wow, ya'll really know how to make the most of a Saturday night. I'm enthralled.

[Clark2008]

46. Some background in a discussion board

http://www.alternatehistory.com/Discussion/showthread.php?t=10745&page=1

[Catchawave]

47. Cooper-Gannon CNN transcript:

Any hints here?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0502/18/acd.01.html

[spooked]

75. This line stood out when I listened to the interview

"It isn't relevant to the job I was asked to do, which was to be a reporter." --Gannon


So, WHO ASKED Gonnon to become a reporter?? I find it interesting that it seems to be something he was RECRUITED for.

[thereismore]

85. Yes, very odd indeed. n/t

[seventythree]

119. and there is Guckert

telling that other reporter (sorry can't recall where I read it, probably here) type from a conservative web site -- To Do HIS Job. The fellow said after he saw Guckert throw a softball he undestood what he was talking about.

[flyarm]

123. i posted this afternoon the same thing..it hit me the second i heard ..

gannon say it!! it screamed at me!!

from my post this afternoon!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3140015&mesg_id=3142849




fly:hi:

[K8-EEE]

124. You're Right...JOB I WAS ASKED TO DO...

WHICH HE HAD NO EXPERIENCE DOING...

[Clark2008]

54. And here's a smorgasbord of info

All links... people with infallible memories. This is good stuff. How true it is, I don't know, but links are provided.

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2005/02/310486.shtml

U. Sam link

There is that underground censored movie(search), "conspiracy of silence" with the pedophile ring. This is a cover on top of a cover. I buy it, but how convenient it busts out just as the 9/11 "hey, how long did he know....oh, ooo, oo, I've got a secret, gannongate, check it out, huh, clinton, flight twa800, what....no I said gannongate".

Something doesn't smell right. 9/11 is their achilles heel, we know it, they know it, and they know we know it. When we start getting closer and more heat fires up(popular mechanics article immediately discredited on the internet). Then, in the last week there has been more evidence of clinton involvement. Once people start unifying and drop the "no, not my party, it can't be" bullshit, then they get scared. Divide and conquer.

RFK, jr. "95% of the republican party is corrupt, 75% of the democratic party is corrupt". Would a bones brother take the heat to keep the secret, of course he would. Bush is just a pawn for the bankers and corp. piston pumpers. Will this get major coverage and erase 9/11? Not for me. We need to clean up our house, if we don't, they'll try again in 30 years. We'll be talking about "bush flunkies" instead of "nixon flunkies".

[Malva Zebrina]

61. If Capital City Escorts is "long known to be a CIA operation

how about some links that would enlighten us.

Andy you do not have to reveal "how you know" and heaven forbid I will not ask "how you know" but certainly we should have some more concrete evidence or even some published items from somewhere that would reveal this "long known" CIA operation "long known" as Capital City Escorts"

Until then, this is only titillation and looks more like a board game than real investigation.

Point us to the evidence , or connections, or anything at all Andy, and then we can proceed if we want to jump in. And some of us might want you to tell us exactly how you "know this" before jumping in, you know. Until then, this is merely an exercise in sensationalism without anything at all that resembles the concrete or that even leads to anything concrete re the CIA connections of this group.

[julialnyc]

66. yes, before we pass this around we should be sure

so they don't call us nutty conspiracy theorists

[Andy_Stephenson]

70. Ok I am working on finding a story I once had

bookmarked and for the life of me I can't find it right now...still looking.

[Clark2008]

69. I already Googled for that, but, honestly, how many CIA

fronts would be posted on the Net?

[Malva Zebrina]

72. I understand that

but posts that tell us "not to ask" how a poster "knows this" are equally as unknowable and equally as suspect to anyone who is attempting any investigation of the facts.

Know what I mean?

Facts are what we need,not hints, or suggestions, or mysterious titillations.

If they are not there, we do indeed look like a bunch of desperate front porch garbage pickers out to make a name as "investigative" bloggers to compete with Kos or Americablog.

That is not what I see here.

The poster has made a comment that this group is CIA connected, but we are told "not to ask" how he knows this. Excuse me? Why are we not to ask that?

The thread runs with it and NO ONE asks how he knows this, but takes his word for it and assumes it to be fact.

I need more than that before going off, wasting energy, on a kite flying expedition with an announcement that seems to be a fact, but that is NOT verifiable.

If it is "well known" I want to know where that information comes from.

[Clark2008]

74. See his post at No. 10

He's doing some deep background right now on what he knows and what he was tipped off with.
The only thing we can do, at this point, is get the peripheries.
It may pan out and it may not.

I WAS an investigative journalist for five of the 12 years I reported, professionally. I can tell you that some tips are valid and some aren't, but no one is labeled a "tin foil hat freak" or a "wannabe" for checking them out, even if they lead no where. And some, invariably, do, but some don't. And those that do lead somewhere are worth their weight in gold.

This is still a new thread (well, maybe not in the Internet vernacular, but in investigative reporting, it's only a baby step). Give it some time and see what unfolds.

[Malva Zebrina]

78. Fine, then let's wait for the "peripheries"

and the facts instead of going off on a presumption or a proposition that is based on "don't ask"

Where are the facts that this group is a "known CIA operation"?

Can we please have something, anything, any hint any publication, anything at all that would confirm that other than the mysterious hints of the poster.

That is all I ask.

I am not all for just taking anyone's word for it and being told "not to ask" and then an entire thread devoted to building on that proposition on nothing more than faith .

Not cool, imo.

Let's have it Andy

[Andy_Stephenson]

84. Look...I will post a thread here for you to read.

If you want to wade through the entire thing it might help you to understand better. I would love to run off at the mouth and tell everything I know right this minute. But then if my huntch is wrong I would wind up with egg on my face. SOmeone posted here a line from his interview with Anderson Cooper "It isn't relevant to the job I was asked to do, which was to be a reporter." That seems strange to me as well. I remembered something someone told me a long time ago. Regarding Capitol. The name is not important. What is is the fact it was and to my knowledge still being used to blackmail important political figures. Now unfortunately I doub't that those kinds of stories will be plaasterd all over the net. But clues to the stories would be.

BTW there is a Capitol Escort Service in Austin Texas as well.

and here is the link I promised.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=392459

[Malva Zebrina]

88. I do not have time to do it now, too tired, but will do it tommorrow Andy

for sure. If you do not want to have egg on your face, it might serve you better to wait a while until posting, and present facts, or leads to facts, instead of teasers to avoid that egg on your face. And if you need to be bold, then you need to know that you may indeed at some point, recognize that you may indeed have egg on your face.

That is the risk you take, so it should be more imperative to you, to present verifiable evidence rather than teasers that take a thread into the twilight zone and that put the posters at risk of being accused of liberal whackos because they support the unverifiable postulate.

You present it, you face it, you give the facts and if there is egg there on your face, you take responsibility, wipe it off, and go on, but don't play this "don't ask" game.

This is a big place with lots of subscribers who read. Let us not run off half cocked with innuendo instead of fact but the promise of fact, but the promise that in order to avoid egg to YOUR face, you don't want to tell us the facts and petition us not to ask.

That is a manipulation, imo, and it does no one any favors.

Nothing personal involved at all in these posts.

[julialnyc]

133. interesting

That there is one in Texas too.

Something that struck me in the Cooper interview was how he kept talking about his "past". How long ago was the escort stuff?

[nashville_brook]

258. such a good point:

no one is labeled a "tin foil hat freak" or a "wannabe" for checking them out

only in bushworld does "following the story" or "finding the truth" amount to madness.

[Andy_Stephenson]

76. here is someting to look at

U.S. Attorney Jay B. Stephens confirmed in a statement yesterday that his office "has been investigating allegations involving credit card fraud" following a Feb. 28 raid on the call boy ring's Northwest Washington headquarters. But Mr. Stephens refused to discuss the matter further.

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:aSfNkRZZcPIJ:www.voxfux.com/features/bush_child_sex_coverup/article_archive.htm+Riggs+Bank+Capital+escorts+sex&hl=en

[Clark2008]

81. Thanks, Andy. eom

[seemslikeadream]

83. There's Riggs Bank again

Mr. Chambers used his family's funeral business to set up Professional Services' "sub-merchant" account with a Sovran Bank branch in Silver Spring. Credit card charges and checks were deposited in the Sovran account, while cash paid for escort services usually was deposited at other area banks, including Riggs, National Bank of Washington and First American.

and Bob Dole

http://finance.myway.com/jsp/nw/nwdt_rt.jsp?section=news&news_id=dji-00094720040902&feed=dji&date=20040902&cat=INDUSTRY

[Liberty Belle]

109. Riggs is on the "10 Worst Corporations" list this year

from Multinational Monitor.

[flyarm]

114. funny bob doles name comes up..i have seen Elizabeths name come up too

with this stuff...well my hubby was a baseball player and we played in kansas city..i remember back around 1976-77 or even later..maybe till the 80's...i can't remember when..but i remember the story...

elizabeth doles business partner was found dead in a cadilac..in grandview missouri i believe on or near state line missouri..he was naked as a jay bird and was found shot in his car..they said it was suicide..but no one believed that...,elizabeth was questioned about it and when bob ran against ghbush ..it came up again...bush used it to get dole smeared and out of the race...it may or may not be significant...but it was quite the scandel back then!!

and of course ghbush used it against bob dole in their presidential bid !

gh bush shows up every where there is slime and deaths doesn't he?

fly

hey andy glad to see you were chipper enough to be up and researching...you go dear one!!

fly..and a hug to andy!!:hug: :loveya: :hi:

[Andy_Stephenson]

117. How about this Bob Dole reference?

Riggs Affair Sparks 'Suspicious Activity' Alert on Dole
Thursday September 2, 11:49 PM EDT

WASHINGTON -- The Riggs National Bank scandal has led to unexpected fallout, including "suspicious activity reports" on former Senate Majority Leader Bob Dole and former Defense Secretary Frank Carlucci, Friday's Wall Street Journal reported.

As often as once a week, Mr. Dole's assistant walks around the corner from his Pennsylvania Avenue office in Washington to a branch of Riggs Bank, where she withdraws as much as $8,000 in cash. For walking-around money, Mr. Dole keeps a wad of $100 bills in the breast pocket of his shirt. "I probably use a credit card four or five times a year," Mr. Dole confesses. "I don't even have a wallet."

Mr. Dole's affinity for cash was of no concern to anyone until recently, when federal regulators pawing through the books of scandal-tarred Riggs spotted the large withdrawals and called them to the attention of management. In short order, the bank filed "suspicious activity reports" on Mr. Dole and another prominent Washington figure, Mr. Carlucci, questioning whether the two men might have violated federal laws against money laundering.

The reports are the latest strange fallout from the Riggs affair, which has reverberated through Washington in unexpected ways since the bank got into trouble with regulators this year for overlooking signs of suspicious activity by Saudi diplomats and foreign despots. The scandal has provoked a minor diplomatic crisis for the State and Treasury departments as Riggs, which has long had a lock on the diplomatic market in Washington, starts to shed all of its embassy accounts to get out from under a regulatory cloud and sell itself to PNC Financial Services Group Inc. (PNC).

http://finance.myway.com/jsp/nw/nwdt_rt.jsp?section=news&news_id=dji-00094720040902&feed=dji&date=20040902&cat=INDUSTRY
Peter Angelo

[flyarm]

122. wow andy that just jarred my memory more about eliz's partner

i just rmembered after reading what you posted about dole..that elizabeths partner supposedly committed suicide because alot of money was missing from their joint business..suposedly his briefcase was missing from the car..and alot of money was gone from the business and it was bankrupt..and the thought around town was that she ripped off the money and had him done in..it was real weird the way he was shot ..and that he was naked by the side of the road..in the car...and all the business money was gone..but under bush she was made head of transportation..and i swear gh bush gave her carte blanche and she built roads around kansas city that still dont make sense...there was not the traffic or enough cars to drive on all the roads she built in kansas and missouri!..we all said it was payola!!


glad you are doing a bit better dear andy!!..fly

[flyarm]

125. found this check elizabeth but checkother media names

looking for story about dead man in car..in missouri but found this in search..check out the media names involved..and of course the scum elizabeth..seems she keeps getting involved around people who kill themselves eh??..curiouser and curiouser!!

http://www.mindcontrolforums.com/hambone/pink.html

snip:

The GOP's Pink Triangle & the CIA (excerpt)
by Alex Constantine
Lawrence King, a 300-pound pedophile from Nebraska, Gray's home state, was alleged in 1984 to have operated a branch of the call-boy business in partnership with Harold Andersen, then publisher of the Omaha Herald, and a close friend of Gray's. King, a baritone, sang the National Anthem at the 1984 and 1988 Republican conventions.

King enjoyed Republican society and took his conservative politics seriously. In 1987 he donated $25,350 to Citizens for America, an organization that arranged speaking tours around the country for Lt. Col. Oliver North.

In October 1988, King's Franklin Community Credit Union was raided by the FBI and IRS. A month later the Treasury Department filed suit to recover the $34 million that had disappeared from Franklin's vaults under King's management.

Before his arrest, King had commuted often to Washington, D.C. He was a business partner in a call-boy operation run by the late Craig Spence, whose antics were the subject of a week-long series published by the Washington Times in July 1989. The expose was immediately occasioned by the resignation of an aide to Elizabeth Dole. In his resignation letter, the aide complained that one of Spence's male prostitutes, had blackmailed him with threats of disclosure. The Times reported that Spence, a former ABC reporter, was said to have been running a CIA blackmail operation: Spence's Victorian Mansion on Wyoming Avenue, where he often threw parties for Washington's power elite, was "planted with electronic bugs and video recording equipment that, according to homosexual call-boys and others who routinely visited the house, was used to make incriminating tapes to blackmail guests." The parties were attended by the likes of William Casey, Ted Koppel, John Mitchell and Eric Severeid. A political tempest threatened when Spence's credit card receipts implicated Reagan and Bush appointees, but few names reached the public print.

Four months after the story broke, Spence was found dead at the Ritz-Carlton Hotel in Boston. Police ruled his death a suicide.

[seemslikeadream]

91. top Labor Department adviser to Secretary Elizabeth Dole - Paul R. Balach

"It's a personal situation. It's a tragic situation if people have to resort to prostitutes," the GOP spokeswoman said. "But there's no standard for people in the federal government that's different than for the average Joe on the street."

However, a top Labor Department adviser to Secretary Elizabeth Dole resigned yesterday after acknowledging to The Times that he had procured male prostitutes and was subjected to blackmail threats by one of the call boys.

In a letter announcing his resignation as Mrs. Dole's political personnel liaison to the White House, Paul R. Balach wrote: "I hereby resign my position this date due to the public disclosure of activities concerning my personal life."

Mr. Balach said in an interview late yesterday he was told by the department's solicitor, Robert Davis, he must either resign or be fired. He said he was not allowed to talk to Mrs. Dole about the matter.

"They said they reached this decision with a great deal of pain because I was a valued employee. But they thought that the cloud surrounding me would not allow me to continue to hold a political job in the administration," he said.

"I think they are protecting Elizabeth, and frankly I would do the same thing," Mr. Balach said. "I live paycheck to paycheck. They promised me that they would try and find me another position somewhere in the government, but I just don't know. . . . Somebody else is going to clean out my office. They didn't want me to come back into the office."

According to documents obtained by The Times, the homosexual prostitution ring includes not only Reagan and Bush administration officials but military officers, congressional aides and U.S. and foreign businessmen with close social ties to Washington's political elite.

[McCamy Taylor]

77. Agree this is speculation. Also beware. This is Gannon's only "Out"

right now. Claim his "escort" services were really some kind of ultra secret hush hush intelligence work that he cant talk about in order to salvage his professional reputation.

So, be careful before you call him anything more than the $200 an hour 8 inch cut male companion that he appears to be.

[EFerrari]

86. Forgot born again.

Much as this guy disgusts me, I hope he's got a bigger, smarter, beefier pal watching over him.

[roseBudd]

87. Try whitepages.com you can search by business type or name for any state

or zipcode.

[alfredo]

89. this should be on the front page some

time soon. Good to see you back with us.

missed ya bro.

[Sparkly]

90. Check this one out!!

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a388cd49f5ce8.htm

This is a compendium of the articles on the prostitution ring of the 1980s (when Gannon/Guckert would have been a young man, in fact quite young if he's actually younger than 47 -- there was some discrepancy there).

What's also funny are all the posts from Freepers -- quite a different tone on the topic of gay sex and prostitution back then, you'll notice.

Anyway, please scour for any clues at all.

[CoffeeCat]

130. What is Gannon/Guckert's personal history??

Those who prostitute themselves are often victims of sexual abuse.

Could Gannon/Guckert have been one of the children used in these organized, child-sex-ring operations?

Where does Gannon come from? Who is his family? I haven't heard anything about his parents of other history.

It makes sense--that a current man who is prostituting himself among DC elitists--could have been involved/brainwashed/programmed in some kind of child-sex operation.

I always wondered what happened to the local boy (Johnny Gosch) who was one of the kids allegedly involved in the Franklin Cover up. Paul Bonacci, one of the children, who was abducted and forced to partake--sued and won millions in damages. Bonacci said he helped to abduct Gosch, so Gosch could be used in the pedophile ring.

Scary stuff.

[Blue Gardener]

253. Eugene Martin was also kidnapped

In 1984. Same circumstances as Johnny Gosch, delivering newpapers in Des Moines. Supposedly also sold into child porn.

[CoffeeCat]

131. Ok, maybe I'm up too late, but....

The organized child-pornography rings, run by the govenmnet, have been discussed on DU frequently.

Is it possible that Guckert/Gannon was one of these victimized children--who is recapitulating his abuse? Or possibly continuing with his marching orders?

His wording, "doing the job I was asked to do"---that strikes me as odd. That maybe he was selected to be a plant--that one just one of the jobs that he "was asked to do."

He did seem pretty scared on CNN.

I found this picture of Johnny Gosch. I looked at it and almost thought it looked like Gannon! It must be getting late. Gosch--as I mentioned in an earlier post was rumored to be part of the Franlkin Cover up. A bona fide child who was abducted and forced to be a part of the government-sanctioned sex ring (Paul Bonacci) said he helped to abduct Johnny Gosch.

Johnny Gosch would be about 35 today.

[goodboy]

139. this kid has the same face as gannon...same initiails too...would he

be the same age as gannon now?

[CoffeeCat]

140. OH my gosh...I didn't see the "initial" coincidence...

...that Johnny Gosch and Jeff Gannon/James Guckert have the same initials.

Yes, Johnny Gosch would ba about the same age as Gannon, I suppose. I don't know how old Gannon is now. However, Johnny Gosch disappeared when he was 11, in 1982--so that would make him about 34.

How old is Gannon?

This is really creeping me out.

[goodboy]

141. It is interesting isn't it? (nt)

[Spazito]

144. Geez, not just the initials of the first and last name are the same

but also the middle intial. James Daniel Guckert/John David Gosch.

At the very least, it is a very weird coincidence!

[goodboy]

150. sure is weird...I didn't realize the middle name until you posted just now

:tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat:

[sickinohio]

267. The West Desmoin Newspaper editor back in the 80s

that wouldn't print the John Gosch stories that his mother requested was named James Gannon!!! Coincidence??

[Clark2008]

273. I just read that!!!

I was getting ready to post the same thing!

Man, this is getting freaky.

[sickinohio]

279. REally weird - Jeff Gannon/James Guckert and

James Gannon - hmmm :smoke: :shrug: :crazy: :wtf:

[nostamj]

146. gannon is 47, this kid would be 35

just too big a stretch.... i'm afraid.

[Spazito]

147. Just a thought but how do we know for sure 'gannon' is 47

what is that based on?

[goodboy]

152. we need to find out if gannon ever said his age..;...(nt)

[Spazito]

155. I remember reading a post that questioned his age...

saying that there was some confusion whether he was in his thirties or forties but I can't remember if it was at DU or Daily Kos. So far, nothing 'Gannon' has said has been proven true so why would we just accept his age, without proof positive, on just his say so?

[nonny]

308. Web site said he was 32

This was from the article on americablog, interview with website designer.

http://americablog.blogspot.com/2005/02/man-called-jeff.html

<snip>
According to the date the html files were created for the USMCPT Web site – files Paul still has - Paul built the site for Jeff in September 1999. Paul says he launched it within a matter of weeks. The site was eventually migrated to its own URL, USMCPT.com. While the site is no longer live on the Internet, archived copies of it show that it was live at the USMCPT.com address at least from October 31, 2001 until May 8, 2003. (This date is relevant since Gannon reportedly entered the White House the first time as a "journalist" in early April, 2003.) When asked what USMCPT meant, Paul said he asked Jeff that very question. The answer: United States Marine Corps, Part Time. Paul recalls Jeff telling him he was still in the Marines, but only part time. Paul also recalls Jeff being around 40 years old, even though the Web site said he was 32.

The military theme continues at USMCPT.com. The “Ammunition” section contains the description of the escort. It reads: White, 200 pounds, hair “high and tight,” chest “46’ Usually Shaved or Clipped,” and under “Weapon” it says "8 inches cut." The escort mentions that he takes clients in the Washington, DC, Virginia and Maryland area, and that he prefers to “travel to your location or travel with you.”
<snip>

So I think this means that he was 32 in Sept. 1999

[nashville_brook]

281. not to throw fuel on the fire -- i don't mean to do that, but

i've noticed that there are two ages that keep popping up RE: JG -- 47 and 35. at the very least you could say given that the younger age is correct, it would fit.

but i'm pretty sure it's just a coinkydink.

then again, i've been known to say there are no coinkydinks -- so, maybe this points to a certain preference for a "look" they would seek in young boys. obviously, gannon's current "look" has marketability. (yuk, i've grossed myself out).

[Scout1071]

304. I do not believe that he looks 45 at all. 35 seems way closer.

[goodboy]

151. you're right...you have to admit it's a bit freeeeeeeky though...nm

[Bouncy Ball]

218. Has Gannon ever confirmed his age?

He doesn't look 47. Looks younger than that.

[chiburb]

142. Same guy?

John David Gosch:


Guckert:


But this would make Guckert 37 or so, not 47 or 42.

[chiburb]

143. A little more, from Gosch's mother

Gosch's mother claimed that her son is alive and that he visited her in 1997. She announced her revelations during a 1999 pedophile crime organization trial in Nebraska. Gosch's mother said that he came to her Iowa apartment in March 1997 with an unidentified male friend. She claims that Gosch told her he was abducted by members of a pedophile crime organization and he escaped from the group at an undetermined time. Gosch's mother also said that her son was in fear of repercussions from the group and that was the reason he chose to remain "underground." She stated that she has had no further contact with her son since his 1997 visit and that she remained silent about the event until called as a witness in court because she fears for Gosch's safety.

http://doenetwork.us/cases/160dmia.html

[julialnyc]

145. does anyone know if Gannon

Has any family that has spoken up for him?

[EFerrari]

169. Remember he reported that his mother and brother had

gotten harrassing calls from liberal bloggers :(

[julialnyc]

173. mentions family

http://www.jeffgannon.com/

here he mentions his family

[flyarm]

181. he should of thought about his family......

when he became a hooker and smeared his pics all over the internet!!

ohh yeah..he would make this mom proud...not!!!

what a frigging pig..now he is worried about his family??

yeah right ...

8 inch cut wouldnt be shameful for his family would it??

spread eagle on the internet wouldn't be embarrassing for his family ..now would it??

i suppose we bloggers..made him do it??
and we sold his soul for him too...

uhh huh!! sure we did!!

hey jeff jimbo..you did it ..live with it!!

fly

[Blue_Roses]

260. how do you know

it's mentioned at this web site--it's been shut down?:shrug:

[Andy_Stephenson]

148. The similarities are amazing

and a little freaky to boot.

[goodboy]

153. If he escaped, why is he still alive?: And why would he be planted

in the WH press room? Couldn't he destroy everyone involved in the pedophile ring?

[Andy_Stephenson]

156. There is a name for it...Stockholm Syndrome

Stockholm Syndrome describes the behavior of kidnap victims who, over time, become sympathetic to their captors. The name derives from a 1973 hostage incident in Stockholm, Sweden. At the end of six days of captivity in a bank, several kidnap victims actually resisted rescue attempts, and afterwards refused to testify against their captors.


While some people are suggesting the recent Elizabeth Smart kidnapping sounds like a case of Stockholm Syndrome, the most famous incident in the U.S. involved the kidnapped heiress Patty Hearst. Captured by a radical political group known as the Symbionese Liberation Army in 1974, Ms. Hearst eventually became an accomplice of the group, taking on an assumed name and assisting them in several bank robberies. After her re-capture, she denounced the group and her involvement.

What causes Stockholm Syndrome? Captives begin to identify with their captors initially as a defensive mechanism, out of fear of violence. Small acts of kindness by the captor are magnified, since finding perspective in a hostage situation is by definition impossible. Rescue attempts are also seen as a threat, since it's likely the captive would be injured during such attempts.

It's important to note that these symptoms occur under tremendous emotional and often physical duress. The behavior is considered a common survival strategy for victims of interpersonal abuse, and has been observed in battered spouses, abused children, prisoners of war, and concentration camp survivors.

http://ask.yahoo.com/ask/20030324.html

[Spazito]

158. The Stockholm syndrome

where kidnap victims start identifying with their kidnappers.

Here's a link on it:

http://www.womensaccounts.com/loving_an_abuser_stockholm_syndrome.html

[Andy_Stephenson]

160. And this from your link

Intimacy Investment – We often invest emotional and sexual intimacy. Some victims have experienced a destruction of their emotional and/or sexual self-esteem in the unhealthy relationship. The abusing partner may threaten to spread rumors or tell intimate details or secrets. A type of blackmail using intimacy is often found in these situations.

[Sparkly]

167. That's what Craig Spence was all about, apparently. n/t

[CoffeeCat]

176. The Stockholm Syndrome happens easily with children and their abusers...

Because children are often dependent on their abusers in many ways--Stockholm-Syndrome-like conditions develop.

When a child is abused by someone who has complete power over them (abductor, parent)--it is much too overwhelming for the child to grasp that their safety, emotional well being and even their existence--is dependent upon evil, abusive people who view them as objects.

A child lacks the emotional maturity and the cognitive ability to process that reality. The sheer terror would destroy their little minds. They adjust to the trauma by identifying with their abusers and by forming unhealthy attachments with them, called "trauma bonds."

Abusers and those in organized child-sex rings understand the Stockholm Syndrome and they actively cultivate it in their child victims. It keeps the victim silent and compliant. In addition, after the child has been "groomed" to comply, the abuser emotionally blackmails the child with their own dependent behaviors.

Abusers will often say, "You've been going along with this! You didn't run away! You wanted this! No one will ever believe you because you did x, y and z to me." This further cements the trauma bond.

Children who are abducted or forced to participate in child-sex rings go along--to keep themselves safe and emotionally protected from the horror. Then, as these children are brainwashed with their own behavior, they become more dependent because they no longer have a "self." They're so confused by their own emotions and behaviors--and the abusive tactics--that they become even more entrenched in depending upon the abuser. They rely on him more for their reality.
Hence, the Stockholm Syndrome and very deep trauma bonds.

It's very real.

[troubleinwinter]

191. I am DISTURBED...

I have skimmed over this thread, and thought maybe most of it was sorta nutzie, until... I saw the childhood pic of Gosch. (NOT the computer enhanced one).

I am a talented artist... of "life-drawing" (nekkid folks!) and portraits. I just have an "eye", is all. I am utterly SPOOKED by that child's photo and Gannon. I hate to say this, but my eye for faces is quite concerned about this.

I think it needs very serious looking at, by a forensic photo-analyst, especially one who specializes in children's photo forensics.

To me, it is his eye expression, chin and lower lip.

Maybe nuthin, but I just thought I'd say how my practiced eye reacted, and suggest a forensic expert might look at the child vs. adult Gannon photos.

Maybe we are all nuts... maybe not. It is all so odd. Gannon's life seems off the radar... claims to have been a teacher, a union truck driver. Any day, a fellow teacher will step forward, a military buddy... SOMEONE who has known him in the past... but so far, NO ONE.

[Andy_Stephenson]

192. Ok

I am way spooked as well now. Termite said "it looks like the same person"...he was a fine arts major.

Your correct in the assessment that we need a photo analysis...and quick

[troubleinwinter]

200. I think it would be a fairly simple matter to email the photos

to several people with those qualifications and ask for their 'take' on it.

Some may be unwilling to step into this 'issue'. I guess it needs to be "presented" in a certain way, but I think most of the experts are highly concerned about the well-being of 'lost children'.

Someone needs to find a coupla those forensic photo folks.

[troubleinwinter]

203. Oh, yeah... and Gannon does NOT look 47 to me...

not a line, crease or wrinkle.

Looks late 30s, early 40s to me.

Ask Termite to look at the eyes, see what he thinks. I could be all wet. I see chin, lip and eyes.

[Pachamama]

321. If Jimmy-Jeff is 47, I want whatever cream or solution it is that he has

found, because your absolutely right, he does not look 47 - I was thinking Mid-30-late 30's.

Note: I've noted and posted before that I don't even think his real name is James Guckert - I think that there is more to this guys past than what we think we know...

[TalkingDog]

233. Don't bother, it's in the ears

When you apply for a passport you will notice that they demand an image with your ear showing. Ears are nearly impossible to reconstruct with plastic surgery, so they are very much like fingerprints. Each unique to the individual.

There is a head shot of both Gannon and Gosch with the head oriented in the same way. A 3/4 view of the right (Gannon's in the hat). Gannon's ears stick out much farther (look at the ear on the far side of both heads...Gannon's points outward, Gosch's lays close). Gannon's lobes are "attached" whereas Gosch's ears lay closer to the head with "detached" lobes.

The Pinna (outer ear) is shaped very differently between Gannon and Gosch.

They do bear a resemblence. But that's about it.

[Spazito]

240. The only actual photo that was not age-enhanced

shows Gosch's ears covered by hair so comparing ears to the actual photo is not possible.

This is the real photo at the time he disappeared according to an earlier post #142:

[troubleinwinter]

264. Nope.

I have my passport right here from 2003. Hair covering ears. No one EVER mentioned anything to me about that... applying for passport, exiting to China nor returning.

The only actual photos of the boy have hair covering his ears. (the others are computer generated).

Forensic photo experts measure eye-distance, etc.

I am saying that perhaps it is worth a look.

[NV Whino]

282. Check again

The lower lip and cleft chin look alike, but the ears don't match. Kid's ears are close set to his head. Guckert's are not. Scary but no cigar.

[Bouncy Ball]

224. That last part has always struck me as odd.

I mean, he seems to have NO ONE. No friends, no family. Even if he were keeping them from interviews, we still would have heard about them by now.

And no confirmation on his age, no proof he was EVER in the military, nothing adds up in his background. You peel back one layer and find even more stuff.

It's just downright weird.

[qanda]

157. Good Lord

Look at the chin.

[justiceischeap]

159. Nope, different ears (eom)

[chiburb]

162. Maybe, maybe not...

That's an age-enhanced photo, and the REAL photo has his ears covered by hair. See here:

http://www.state.ia.us/government/dps/dci/mpic/gosch2.htm




From a different site (also enhanced):

[Blue_Roses]

272. Okay, I am officially creeped out

As much as I hate to go along with this theory, one thing that does stand out is the dimple in the chin on both adult and child pics. I remember in the 70's the "white slavery child ring" going on 'cause they made a movie about it.

[loritooker]

164. The ears and eyebrows are not the same. nt

[Andy_Stephenson]

165. I dunno...it is hard to tell from the photos we have.

I think we need more and better photographs of both to tell for sure.

[merh]

170. another image of jimmy-jeff

another article fyi:
http://www.washblade.com/2005/2-18/news/national/reporter.cfm

[BuyingThyme]

266. Does anybody recognize the logo on the shirt?

Baseball?

[CoffeeCat]

166. That image of Johnny Gosch is not a "real" photo...

...that image of Johnny Gosch is one of those computer-generated photos, produced by professionals--to show what Johnny Gosch might look like at a certain age.

I live in the area where Johnny Gosch disappeared and I remember seeing this photo. I believe it was a "guesstimate" of what they think Gosch would look like at around age 18 or so.

This other photo of Johnny Gosch--when he was 11--is an actual photo. I think there are similarities.



Edited to add: Someone mentioned that the ears are different in the aged photo and in Gannon's photos. In the aged photo, Gosch's ears are lying flat against his head. I can't be completely sure, but Gosch's ears in this real photo--appear to be protruding a bit. It's hard to tell from the photo, but that's what it looks like to me. Notice the small portion of Gosch's right ear that doesn't appear to be flat against his head.

[EFerrari]

171. I also think there are significant similarities and/but

we need better pictures. And, anyone think JDG has used steroids? I don't know anything about it, but if you use them particularly as an older teen/young adult, can they change the shape of your face?

[merh]

172. There are some similarities,

the check bones, thin upper lip and ears? Who knows? :shrug:

[Vinca]

168. Wow - look at the similarity in the cleft of the chin.

The cleft is also easily seen in the actual photo of the little boy (on another post on this thread). The lips also look similar. Does Guckert/Gannon have a gap between his front teeth? This entire notion is from the far reaches of the bizarro universe, but wouldn't it be something if it was actually true?

[flyarm]

184. can someone send the pic of gannon to the mother in iowa..

we can all play detective..but a mother knows her child..i dont ccare what happens and how long they are separated..a mother knows her child...by smell and insticts..

where is this gannons so called mom ..the one he refers to??
how could people have gotten to her and harrassed her..does anyone know..he made that claim..so how did anyone know where she is ??

i will just say this as a mom of a son...if my son had been kidnapped and i found him or he found me..i would never let him go..unless he told me his life was in danger...i would be like a fly on stink with my son..now if he told me his life was in danger i would protect him every way i could ..including lying and cheating..if i was called on a stand and told to tell where he was and i knew his life would be in danger..i would go to my grave first before i ever exposed him..
this is one woman who has been in more pain than any of us could imagine...she would never give up her son again..to no one!!

but if she were gannons mom and gannon was gorch..and she thought his life depended on going to authorities to protect him from the * cabal..she will do it!!
but she more than any of us know..she knows ..she knows this cabal kills..she knows!! she will not let him get killed..if it is in her power she will never let that happen!!

gannon was scaredshitless on anderson coopers show..i watched as a mom to a 27 yr old son..and i watched his emotions and his behaviour..his eyes blinked so bad..that to me is a sign of fear..actually i would say terror!!


he is scared for his life..and i am concerned..that rove has him saying the victim shit over and over..so he can be suicided and then blame it on the left wing bloggers...

jeff gannon /j gukert..if you read this..i believe you are in grave danger..they are telling you to say stuff to set you up..and then they get off scott free...don't do it..go to fbi or a just retired cia..dont trust the thugs there now under porter goss..there are several who just quit search them out..now!!!!! dont trust your lawyer..you don't know who he is in bed with...gannon you are in grave danger!!!

these peoplke have killed bigger people than you...get help now!!!

fly

[Andy_Stephenson]

189. I absolutely concur!

And thank you for this post!

:thumbsup:

[CoffeeCat]

195. Mrs. Gosch undoubtedly has seen Gannon in the press...

...and she would know if he is her son, Johnny Gosch.

According to her own testimony before a grand jury, Johnny Gosch visited his mother (Noreen Gosch) several years ago. He told her he had been abducted for use in a child pornography/sex ring. He also told her he was frightened and that he was "underground" to avoid being killed.

Since Noreen Gosch has seen Johnny within the past several years, she would undoubtedly know if Guckert/Gannon was her son.

I feel for her tremendously. She is one courageous woman. She has fought hard against these thugs in our government--who do these things to children, and the media has vilified her every step of the way. She is a very credible, strong and amazing woman.

I am very concerned about Jeff. Obviously, anyone who prostitutes themselves does this for all of the wrong reasons. He's probably a victim of something sinister that is not his fault--be it childhood abuse or being forced into a child-pedophile/sex ring.

It's easy to make jokes about all of this--because sexual issues can be uncomfortable. However, I see Gannon as a victim. He's been used by whomever put him in this position in the White House. He does not deserve that. It appears that someone used his past and his prostitution against him. Ultimately, they're using his own personal trauma against him, and that is downright evil.

Does anyone else find it strange that Jeff could be a well-known prostitute and companion to high-level government officials, and not one helped him with his outstanding tax bill? Someone could have helped him out and wiped that out with one keystroke. This smacks of abusive dynamics all the way around--with serious power discrepancies between himself and his "clients." This is truly not good.

I hope that Gannon is protecting himself.

Jeff, if you are out there--please keep yourself safe.

[Clark2008]

235. How ironic that the very people (we bloggers) who outed Gannon

may also be the very people who step in to save him.

Has anyone just, you know, written him?

I will - I have to qualms about it.

[flyarm]

290. clark if you find a way to write him let me know

i am very worried for this young man!!

fly

[Minstrel Boy]

206. Two clues from Paul Bonacci that could help ID Gosch

Referring now to my copy of The Franklin Cover Up, Bonacci testified that Gosch had been branded on the buttocks after an escape attempt. Presumably a scar would still be visible. Anyone who has a Gannon ass photo care to check (or inspect the photo for photoshopping)?

Also, Bonacci said that Gosch, for a while, was being kept on a farm in Colorado, where he had been given a new "family."

Whatever, the photo resemblance is bloody eerie. And I've thought from the start that Gannon was about 10 years younger than 47.

[KyndCulture]

276. Gannon was supposedly in the marines, yes?

Are there any military records of this? If so, I highly doubt it could be this abducted child.

[brainshrub]

211. So this is an enhanced picture?

But I'm no photographer. Where was this generated?

[CoffeeCat]

229. Yes, this is an "aged" photo of Gosch, not an actual photo of him...

...as others have said--Gosch disappeared when he was 12 or so. This picture is an professional estimation of what he might have looked like when he was in his late teens/early 20's.

[Andy_Stephenson]

216. Can someone photoshop the hair off Johnny Gousch

please.

[Minstrel Boy]

227. here's my crude attempt:

[CoffeeCat]

232. Could you please Photoshop another image?

Minstrel Boy--if you have the time, could you please P-shop the hair off of this picture of Johnny Gosh? This is a real photo--one of the last ones taken.

The picture you P-shopped is an age-enhanced photo that was produced by someone guessing what Gosch might have looked like in his late teens/early 20's.

Actual photo of Gosch, taken right before his abduction:

[Minstrel Boy]

238. tried, but it's not worth posting.

Just looks like a big white cap on his head. :)

[CoffeeCat]

239. Thanks for trying! (n/t)

[Bouncy Ball]

221. Is that top picture age progression enhanced?

It looks odd.

[Andy_Stephenson]

225. Yes it is

here is a photo from when hi vanished.




The story in his mothers words. and photos
http://www.johnnygosch.com/chap.pdf

[nashville_brook]

283. ears, eye color diff

child has distinguishing moles and scars on left side of face.

BUT the similarities: cut chin, the heavy brow ridge and the roman nose might suggest to a preference on the part of the "market," if the hypothesis holds that gannon was involved in the child sex ring.

[Spazito]

289. The ears are an unknown as the only original, unaltered photo

of the boy before he disappeared has his hair covering his ears. The other photos of him are computer generated age enhanced photos of what he might look like.

As to his eyes, the shape is similar, it would be interesting to know the color of both the boy's eyes and Guckert's. Guckert's, I assume, would be on his driver's license.

[BuyingThyme]

293. Green eyes on Gannon

[New Earth]

306. WIEEERD

ok, well Guckert doesn't look anywhere near over 40. i would be REALLY shocked if he was.

i studied the pic of the young kid to Guckert and there are some similarities - they both have that dimple-chin, similar shaped eyes, similar shaped ears, but Guckert's nose has a broader/longer peak (?) and his ears stick out more. but that could be an illusion because he shaves his head bald.

i think it's still very possible but i don't know - this is really really really weird.

[Clark2008]

95. IMPORTANT - Please see my post at 93

:kick:

I am onto something, myself.
Gee, didn't know helping out an old friend two years ago would suddenly make me an expert on something.

[HeeBGBz]

116. Dig

[jazzjunkysue]

99. Who's sending this to Olberman?

[julialnyc]

134. I have a question

I know one of his sites was military man for man (or something to that effect). Does he have any military background? I know it could be just a fetish thing, but maybe he did serve? If he did, wouldn't he have a record of some sort?

[Andy_Stephenson]

135. Yes He would.

But we would need his real name. I am not sure if Service records are reachable under FOIA requests.They may be...but I am not sure.

[julialnyc]

137. I wish we could get

Sy Hersh on Gannon's case. He has many CIA sources.

[julialnyc]

161. his site

http://www.jeffgannon.com/

[Andy_Stephenson]

174. John Walsh and America's Most Wanted

Police and FBI Cover-Up
According to the sworn testimony of Noreen Gosch, an activist on behalf of
"Missing Children," whose own 12-year-old son Johnny, a West Des Moines, Iowa
paperboy kidnapped in 1991, was drugged and sold into prostitution and
pornography. “There was no law on the books in Iowa or most any other state
in the country specifying that the police would have to act sooner than 72
hours—even though we had five witnesses that could describe the car, the man
and various details of the kidnapping. So I wrote the first piece of
legislation which became the Johnny Gosch Bill.

Gosch also alleges that the FBI were active in quashing a TV expose. “Just
prior to the ‘America’s Most Wanted’ story going on the air…within a week or
two of airtime, the FBI in Quantico, Virg. contacted ‘America’s Most Wanted’
and told them to kill the story,” Gosch continued.

They did not want the Johnny Gosch story broadcast,” she says. The only
reason the story went on is because John Walsh is a personal friend, and he
stood up to them, and he said this story goes. This woman does not lie. I’ve
known her for years. We’re going with the story. You can fire me afterwards.
We’re doing the story. And they did the story. But the FBI tried to kill this
story.”

When DeCamp, the attorney, asked her if she knew why, she replied, “Well, of
course. It would have opened up the biggest scandal in the United States,
bigger than the Iran-Contra story. Bigger than President Clinton’s
infidelities.”

The Satanic-Military MK-Ultra Mind Control Connection
Continuing her sworn testimony, Noreen Gosch spoke about “the MK-Ultra
program developed in the 1950s by the CIA. It was used to help spy on other
countries during the Cold War because they felt that the other countries were
spying on us. It was very successful.

http://216.239.63.104/search?q=cache:3CchcJe8mCMJ:www.mail-archive.com/ctrl%40listserv.aol.com/msg25484.html+%22John+Walsh%22+%22Johnny+Gosch%22&hl=en

FBI ATTEMPTS TO KILL AIRING OF GOSCH STORY ON AMERICA’S MOST WANTED

Following Bonacci’s 1989 confession to participating in the kidnapping
of Johnny Gosch, investigators for the television show, “America’s Most
Wanted”, began working with the investigators for Noreen Gosch and
prepared to televise the story.

Noreen Gosch testified in U.S. District Court, Omaha Nebraska, on
February 5, 1999, (the Bonacci suit against Larry King) that within one
or two weeks of the “America’s Most Wanted” story airing, “the FBI in
Quantico, Virginia contacted America’s Most Wanted and told them to kill
the story. They did not want the Johnny Gosch story broadcast”. John
Walsh aired the story anyway. When John De Camp asked Noreen Gosch if
she knew why the FBI wanted to kill the story, Noreen Gosch responded:
“Well, of course. It would have opened up the biggest scandal in the
United States, bigger than the Iran Contra story. Bigger than President
Clinton’s infidelities.”

CIA KILLS “20-20" SHOW ON JOHNNY GOSCH

ABC's “20/20" contacted Noreen Gosch in 1997, asking to do a one hour
special program
called "The Johnny Gosch Story". The documentary was intended to depict
the 17 year journey of Noreen Gosch in her search for her son, Johnny.
In the process of her investigation, Karen Burnes of “20/20" uncovered
45 other victims of child sexual abuse, satanic abuse, and kidnapping,
several of whom knew Johnny and were with him on many occasions.

One of the victims interviewed in this show is the almost 30-year-old
son of Antoine Szandor La Vey, founder of the Church of Satan, author of
the “Satanic Bible”. During this interview, Antoine La Vey’s son said he
was with Johnny Gosch several times and Johnny saw him several times. La
Vey’s son told “20/20" that his father, Antoine, had castrated him. The
only reason he was willing to talk to “20/20" was because his father was
dead and he no longer feared him.

Karen Burnes also interviewed many CIA MK-Ultra Mind Control survivors,
including a number of interviews with Brice Taylor (a pen name; her real
name is Susan Ford), who has published two books detailing her
experiences (“Starshine: One Woman’s Valiant Escape from Mind Control”,
1995, and “Thanks for the Memories...The Truth has Set Me Free: The
Memoirs of Bob Hope’s and Henry Kissinger’s Mind Controlled Slave”,
1999, available through amazon.com). On June 23, 2000, Brice Taylor lost
her daughter to state conservatorship based, in part, on her accounts
of satanic abuse, CIA mind control programming, and high-level
government corruption (see section below).

Karen Burnes and the film crew all had to sign a "hold harmless clause"
absolving ABC of any liability if any of them were to be killed during
the process of telling this story. To our knowledge, never before had
any producer and crew been forced to sign such an agreement.

The Johnny Gosch Story was scheduled for airing April of 1998, but was
postponed four times. Now Karen Burnes is apparently very ill and
hospitalized with a disease of unknown origin. She remains extremely
ill. Before departing for medical leave, Karen Burnes informed Noreen
Gosch that Frank Snepp, who Gosch claims is a former CIA agent, would
be taking over the investigative reporting for the show.

Frank Snepp claimed the documentary had no validity unless Johnny was
turned over to Congressional protection. However, many congressmen and
other politically elite have been accused by Franklin abuse victims and
other victims (including Brice Taylor) of being their owners and
handlers under circumstances that have re-established slavery in this
country on the part of the ruling elite.

For about 6 months, Ira Rosen, Senior producer with “20/20" was unaware
that Frank Snepp had taken over the investigatory reporting for the
show. He was outraged when he heard the news.

Noreen Gosch was then informed the show would be "on the shelf"
indefinitely. Approximately,$300,000 has been spent on this one hour
special and it sits on a shelf at ABC's “20/20". Frank Snepp had a
great deal to do with the halting of the TV special on Johnny Gosch. He
claims to be a former CIA agent. Once CIA, always CIA!

http://www.mail-archive.com/[e-mail]/msg46054.html

[Andy_Stephenson]

175. More.

Johnny himself, came to see his mother in March 1997, then 27 years
old. He confirmed all that Paul Bonacci had told her of the case and
asked for her helping in bringing justice. He shared the names of
people who were responsible. Finally after all these many years, Noreen
knows the "who, how, and why" of her son's kidnapping. She vowed to
her son she would do something about this and set about in a plan to
bring the entire story out. She realized that she must keep her promise
to her son and not reveal that he had been to her home. He had begged
her not to share that unless it was absolutely necessary.

Noreen Gosch kept this confidential until March of 1999, when she
appeared in court to testify for Paul Bonacci, who had been vindicated
by a Federal Court order and allowed to bring a civil suit against Larry
King. Noreen, while on the witness stand was asked by John DeCamp, Paul
Bonacci's attorney, "if she had ever seen or talked to her son in all
the years he had been missing". Being under oath at the time, she had
to answer with the truth. This led to a huge onslaught of press
coverage. Some people believed her and others made vicious attacks upon
her character, calling her everything from a liar to crazy. The
faithful who know her and followed this story knew differently. This
led to another appearance on "Inside Edition" and other network TV
shows.

http://www.mail-archive.com/[e-mail]/msg46463.html

[MelissaB]

180. Just when you think the news

can't get any more bizarre! :shrug:

[Blue Gardener]

254. Need a picture of Eugene Martin

Looking but haven't found one yet. Since he was supposed to have taken by the same people, it would be interesting to compare his picture as well. Kidnapped from Des Moines in 1984 while delivering the Des Moines Register.

On edit: Here's a picture. Doesn't look like the same person to me.


And here's the link to the National Center of Missing Children:
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewChildDetail&caseNum=601815&orgPrefix=NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US

[Vinca]

183. Can you clarify?

"LaVey’s son told “20/20" that his father, Antoine, had castrated him."

I assume this means the son was castrated, because if it was Johnny, Gannon/Guckert/Bulldog is immediately ruled out based upon photos and ad nauseum description of privates.

[Andy_Stephenson]

187. LaVey's son was talking about himself

as being castrated? The sentence structure is a bit ambigous. But I am going to look into this further to see if one of the known and deposed participants have ever said anything like that.

[Vinca]

231. Thanks. Glad you're feeling better, by the way. nt

[Blue Diadem]

185. Excerpts from the book The Franklin Coverup

http://www.davidicke.net/tellthetruth/coverups/decamp.html

snip:

In May 1992, shortly after the first edition of this book was published, Monsignor Robert Hupp, who had been the head of Boys Town from the late 1970s through the decade of the 1980s - the critical time in question for the Franklin case, contacted me and asked to have a meeting, at which he specified that witnesses must be present. I anticipated that his purpose was to attack me, and to deny what I had written about Boys Town.

I was completely wrong. With two witnesses present, Monsignor Hupp opened our discussion with the simple statement: "John DeCamp, your book stated the game; I hope I can help with some of the names."

Monsignor Hupp and I then entered into an in-depth discussion on the entire situation involving Boys Town, Larry King, Peter Citron, the pedophile problem in general, and the entire story of the Franklin cover-up.

He verified piece after piece of evidence of the Franklin story for me, and provided guidance on other directions in which to look, to develop further proof of the children’s stories of abuse by this country’s wealthy and powerful.

[bearfan454]

177. OMG !

The tentacles reach very far into the White House.

[flyarm]

190. and the so called religous who are supposed to protect children!

i have had alot of this stuff in my files for years now..scared to post any of it..i am a grown woman..think how frightened these children must have been and are still to this day..wow i cry every time i read it..
these bastards are evil..and i hope to god that the god they spit upon while tricking their stupid and sheep..i just hope to god they pay for this to eternity!
hell would be too good for them!

a crying fly..

ohhh my heart breaks...those poor poor children...and now poor hurt and wounded adults.

[Catherine Vincent]

178. ah haha...love that avatar!

[Mojorabbit]

182. bulldog x's 2

I don't know if this means anything.
But victor ashe's nickname was also bulldog from one of *'s speeches...
I want to thank my old college classmate -- you used to call him Bulldog, we call him Victor -- the Mayor of Knoxville, Mayor Victor Ashe.
http://www.vote-smart.org/speech_detail.php?speech_id=4491

[KittyWampus]

228. No Way! GET OUT!

[Catherine Vincent]

188. Very interesting stuff in here.

Bookmarking.

[flyarm]

193. investigator Gary Caradori and his 6-year old son are killed in the crash

http://www.winterboy.com/dejavu15.html

On July 11, retired state police investigator Gary Caradori and his 6-year old son are killed in the crash of his private plane, after a mid-air explosion- the cause of which is never determined. Caradori had been hired by the Nebraska Senate to investigate Lawrence King Jr, an influential black Republican and friend of George H.W Bush- who called him “our Party’s most rapidly rising black star.”
King is director of the Franklin Community Credit Union in Omaha, NE, and is suspected of embezzling $40 million after it, too, went belly-up in the Savings & Loan collapses of the 1980’s. The bank is later found to have been a clearinghouse for Iran-Contra funds, and there are hints of sex scandal that could involve the Bush White House.
Caradori claimed to have been threatened frequently, as had some of his witnesses. He told family members his vehicle had been repeatedly tampered with. Caradori’s brother insists Gary obtained a key piece of evidence, specifically a book of addresses and phone numbers- which “if they knew he had it, they’d kill him.”
The wreckage of Caradori’s plane is, as a reporter on the scene notes, “strewn over a mile stretch.” Within twenty-four hours of the crash, the FBI impounds all of his records.
The NTSB rules the crash accidental, with no evidence of sabotage. The Franklin Committee- led by Senator Schmit, who suspects sabotage- orders a private investigation into the cause of the crash. Ironically, the man selected to conduct the inquiry is former-CIA Director William Colby. Colby’s hiring is urged by his protégé, Nebraska Senator John DeCamp. According to the Omaha World Herald, Colby concludes: “although the crash had strange aspects to it, there was no specific evidence of sabotage.”

A young Nebraska woman named Alisha Owen holds the dubious distinction of spending more time in solitary confinement than any woman in the history of Nebraska’s penal system. For alleged perjury in her testimony against Republican embezzler Lawrence King in the Franklin Credit Union case, she receives a 9-25 year in prison sentence- ten years longer than the sentence received by King himself for looting the Credit Union of $40 million.

[flyarm]

194. homosexual prostitution ring under invetigation

http://www.tarpley.net/bush21.htm

snip;

On the morning of June 29, 1989, pandemonium erupted in the corridors of power in the nation's capital. ``Homosexual Prostitution Probe Ensnares Official of Bush, Reagan,'' screamed the front-page headline of the Washington Times with the kicker ``Call Boys Took Midnight Tour of White House.''

The Times reported, ``A homosexual prostitution ring is under investigation by federal and District authorities and includes among its clients key officials of the Reagan and Bush administrations, military officers, congressional aides and U.S. and foreign businessmen with close ties to Washington's political elite.''

The exposeé centered on the role of one Craig Spence, a Republican powerbroker known for his lavish ``power cocktail'' parties. Spence was well connected. He celebrated Independence Day 1988 by conducting a midnight tour of the White House in the company of two teenage male prostitutes among others in his party.

Rumors circulated that a list existed of some 200 Washington prominents who had used the call boy service. The Number Two in charge of personnel affairs at the White House, who was responsible for filling all the top civil service posts in the federal bureaucracy, and Secretary of Labor Elizabeth Dole's chief of staff, were two individuals publicly identified as patrons of the call boy ring.

Two of the ring's call boys were allegedly KGB operatives, according to a retired general from the Defense Intelligence Agency interviewed by the press. But the evidence seemed to point to a CIA sexual blackmail operation, instead. Spence's entire mansion was covered with hidden microphones, two-way mirrors and video cameras, ever ready to capture the indiscretions of Washington's high, mighty and perverse. The political criteria for proper sexual comportment had long been established in Washington: Any kinkiness goes, so long as you don't get caught. The popular proverb was that the only way a politician could hurt his career was if he were ``caught with a dead woman or a live boy'' in his bed.

Months after the scandal had died down, and a few weeks before he allegedly committed suicide, Spence was asked who had given him the ``key'' to the White House. The Washington Times reported that ``Mr. Spence hinted the tours were arranged by `top level' persons, including Donald Gregg, national security advisor to Vice President Bush''@s1 and later U.S. ambassador to South Korea.

We have already had occasion to examine Don Gregg's role in Iran-Contra, and have observed his curious performance when testifying under oath before congressional committees. Gregg indignantly denied any connection to Spence, yet it is public record that Spence had sponsored a dinner in Gregg's honor in the spring of 1989 at Washington's posh Four Seasons Hotel in Georgetown.

George Bush was less than pleased with the media coverage of the prostitution charges and kept abreast of the scandal as it mushroomed. The Washington Times reported in an article titled ``White House Mute on Call Boy Scandal,'' that ``White House sources confirmed that President Bush has followed the story of the late night visit and Mr. Spence's links to a homosexual prostitution ring under investigation by federal authorities since they were disclosed June 29 in the Washington Times. But top officials will not discuss the story's substance, reportedly even among themselves.

``Press officers have rebuffed repeated requests to obtain Mr. Bush's reaction and decline to discuss investigations or fall out from the disclosures.''@s2 By midsummer, the scandal had been buried. The President had managed to avoid giving a single press conference where he would surely have been asked to comment.

As the call boy ring affair dominated the cocktail gossip circuit in Washington, another scandal, halfway across the country in the state of Nebraska, peaked. Again this scandal knocked on the President's door.

[flyarm]

196. Conspiracy of Silence video Child sex ring

http://sandiego.indymedia.org/en/2003/03/4516.shtml


Conspiracy of Silence video Child sex ring that reached Bush Sr's Whitehouse.

This documentary exposed a network of Washington politicians who flew children to Washington D.C. for sex orgies. This video was blocked from the air at the last minute. But here it is.

[flyarm]

197. The Bush/Reagan White House Male Prostitution Scandal

http://sanderhicks.com/franklin.html

snip:*** link no longer works for video!! fly

The Bush/Reagan White House Male Prostitution Scandal:
Banned 1994 Video Surfaces on Web

John W. DeCamp is a respected Nebraska attorney, a Nam vet, a former Republican delegate, and a man of integrity who exposed corruption in his own GOP, with the Franklin S&L Scandal. He is author of the Franklin Cover-Up, which inspired the video that was made for (and then killed by) the Discovery Channel.

This story, originally broken by the Washington Times, was violently squelched in Omaha and Washington by heavy pressure direct from the FBI and other sources. They were covering for the heavies in the Bush White House with lethal methods very similar to those I've observed in my other investigations. A major investigator died in a mysterious small aircraft crash, and other investigators then folded their hand. Witnesses gathered up their courage only to lose it again.


The Franklin Cover-Up Video is a story a little too real for the gutless big media not accustomed to standing up to Federal intimidation. It involves satanic cults, black ops, and sexual abuse of children in order to shock them into mental trauma and a slavish-state of submission. Watch it.

[Andy_Stephenson]

199. Damn!

I know Sander. I should call him regarding this thread.

yes...yes indeed.

[flyarm]

202. andy can you pm me if you get any answers??

i have had some stuff in my files for years...i so care about these kids..young adults many now..i hold them to my heart..please let me know if you find out anything?/ please..fly

[flyarm]

201. SCANDAL IN NEBRASKA

http://www.beyondweird.com/ufos/Bruce_Walton_The_Underground_Nazi_Invasion_15.html

snip:

SCANDAL IN NEBRASKA



Gary Caradori was a retired state police investigator who had been
hired by the Nebraska Senate to investigate the case, and who had
DIED mysteriously DURING THE COURSE of his investigations. /
Note #5

[Andy_Stephenson]

198. read this thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=392459

[flyarm]

205. yes the illuninati..and i have seen those videos..

but will go through it all...

movie "eyes wide shut" all about the illuminati!!

thanks andy!! hugs!!

fly

[MelissaB]

209. Here is a link to

Free Republic from that thread that janekat posted in that archived thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a388cd49f5ce8.htm

I must say this is interesting reading!

[Binka]

320. Holy Shit Moon Gregg Sex Iran Contra It's All The Same

"Mr. Spence hinted the tours were arranged by `top level' persons, including Donald Gregg, national security advisor to Vice President Bush''@s1 and later U.S. ambassador to South Korea.

We have already had occasion to examine Don Gregg's role in Iran-Contra, and have observed his curious performance when testifying under oath before congressional committees. Gregg indignantly denied any connection to Spence, yet it is public record that Spence had sponsored a dinner in Gregg's honor in the spring of 1989 at Washington's posh Four Seasons Hotel in Georgetown."


Holy shit two months after the Moonie Times broke the story Gregg was sent to South Korea as an ambassador WTF. Moon had many ties to Iran Contra as did Gregg. The following two links give some more info about these scum bags. Moon is in this thing up to his eyeballs. In fact I think he is running the entire show. Google rev moon and read myriad articles about his ill gained fortune. He is blackmailing all of these fuckers.

Fucking Gregg is on a lucrative speaking tour. I'd wager Gregg killed Spence himself. Once CIA always CIA. These stories are ALL interconnected and it is the same evil people over and over...Bush and Moon at the top of the dung heap





Check out these links:

http://www.iapprovethismessiah.com/


http://www.news.cornell.edu/Chronicle/04/4.1.04/Bartels-Gregg.html

[Liberal In Texas]

247. Here's another take on the mysterious Caradori plane crash...

By Ted Gunderson:

<snip>
The evening of July 11, 1990, Gary Caradori, the investigator for the Nebraska State Legislature, Special Committee, called Senator Loran Schmit, Chairman of the Committee, from Chicago and told him he had the "smoking gun". Caradori told Senator Schmit he would fly that night from Chicago on his private plane with his son en route to Lincoln, Nebraska, with the evidence. The plane exploded in mid-air a short time later while flying over Aurora, Illinois killing Caradori and his 8-year-old son.

Officials claimed the plane disintegrated in mid-air. They denied an explosion took place. De Camp writes in his book, "The Franklin Cover-Up"; "A farmer reported he saw a flash of light, heard an
explosion, and saw the plane plunge to the ground .The eyewitness account of the flash of light and the explosion was on the early edition of television news in Nebraska, but was pulled from subsequent reports which said that the plane exploded on impact". (p. 2-3)

Bob Wadman, former Chief of Police of Omaha, and a perpetrator identified by the children (see above), was Chief of Police in Aurora at the time.

Caradori’s briefcase and the rear seat to the plane have never been found. Ted Gunderson (this writer), suspects his briefcase contained the evidence mentioned the previous night to Senator Schmit, probably the incriminating materials, including photographs, provided by Rusty Nelson to Caradori. The rear seat to the airplane was not found, Gunderson suspects, to avoid evidence of a bomb.

The wreckage of the plane was examined on a military base rather than at a location under the control of civilian personnel. Under the Federal Delimitation Agreement, civilian personnel matters are handled by civilians and military matters are handled by the military. The crash was ruled an "accident" by government officials and not an act of sabotage.

Both Gunderson (this writer) and Noreen Gosch, mother of missing-child Johnny Gosch, later learned that Caradori had in his possession evidence that her son was a victim of the Franklin satanic cult/sex/drug ring. Paul Bonacci and Rusty Nelson have both provided detailed testimony attesting to this (see sections on Johnny Gosch below).

Gary Caradori repeatedly told friends in the weeks before his death that he feared his plane would be sabotaged. -more

http://www.johnnygosch.com/gunderson_report.html

[starroute]

207. Covenant House

I'm not sure I buy the pedophile angle where Gannon is concerned. But the topic in general is worth discussing.

I'm reminded in particular of Covenant House and its odd nexus of connections to sexual abuse, right-wing Catholics, the s&l scandals, and Reagan policies in Central America. Here's a writeup from 1991:

http://www.blythe.org/nytransfer-subs/99cov/The_Real_History_of_Covenant_House:_GroupWatch_Files

Covenant House is a New York-based organization for teenage runaways founded by Franciscan Father Bruce Ritter in 1968. Ritter began the organization to serve "streetwise" youths who could not obtain assistance from New York social service agencies. In 1977 Ritter and his cause caught the attention of business magnate and founder of AmeriCares, Robert Macauley. Macauley "adopted" Covenant House and recruited some of his influential friends, including former Treasury Secretary William Simon and J. Peter Grace to join the Covenant House board of directors. Under the tutelage of Macauley and the board, Covenant House gathered influence and financial support from around the nation and expanded its operations. It is now a multinational organization with 17 centers serving 25,000 youth in Canada, the United States, and Latin America. Many of the Covenant House land acquisitions were financed by a $40 million loan from Charles Keating. Keating, a major figure in the savings and loan scandal and a devout Catholic, was chairman of Lincoln Savings and Loan.

<snip>

The Covenant House image began to crumble in December 1989 when former resident Kevin Lee Kite, a former male prostitute, claimed in an interview in Outweek Magazine that Father Ritter had used some $25,000 in Covenant House funds to support him in return for sexual favors.

<snip>

Kite's accusations opened the door for financial scrutiny of Covenant House which led to charges of financial impropriety stemming from the use of a $1 million tax-exempt "Franciscan Charitable Trust." This fund was established by Ritter in 1983, apparently without the knowledge of his Franciscan order or of the full board directors of Covenant House. The fund was not registered with the state of New York, nor did it file returns with the IRS.

<snip>

Among the organization's board of directors were wealthy, well-connected individuals who spearheaded Covenant House's rapid growth from a small organization run by the individual efforts of Father Ritter to a multi-million dollar international agency. It is quite possible that Covenant House was seen as a useful and sympathetic political tool by its influential benefactors. In Guatemala Covenant House took in children reported orphaned as the result of death squad activities. In the United States, it fit into the Reagan scheme to "privatize" social services. According to Russ Baker's article in the Voice, the vast majority of Covenant House's clients were inner-city minority youth suffering from the loss of social services under the Reagan administration.

[flyarm]

210. The CIA, Mind Control & Children

http://www.nlp-mindcontrol.com/cia_children_mind_control.htm

snip:

The CIA, Mind Control & Children
A Talk by John Rappoport


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CKLN FM 88.1
CKLN-FM Mind Control Series — Part 10
Ryerson Polytechnic University
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
International Connection

Producer: Wayne Morris

Subtitles in brackets added by reviewer.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today we are going to hear from investigative journalist Jon Rappoport give a talk entitled The CIA, Mind Control, and Children about the CIA’s use of children for creating mind control agents. Author of U.S. Government Mind Control Experiments on Children, he talks about the impact of the mind control testimony submitted to the Presidential hearings on radiation experiments. Jon also speaks about the mindset of those responsible for these horrors and the implications to society.

John Rappoport:

We are going to launch into this subject, but with a few comments before we start. Mind control is one of those things people don’t like to talk about, including yours truly frankly. I got into it, and I saw the evidence, and it was ... you know, there it was.

< MKULTRA, ARTICHOKE, And BLUEBIRD Secret Mind Control Projects >
Officially MKULTRA was a CIA mind control project that lasted about 10 years ... let’s say from 1952 to 1962-63 ... Before it started, there was ARTICHOKE AND BLUEBIRD ... those were other CIA mind control projects. After it ended, supposedly in 1963, an office called ORD Office of Research and Development took it over. Their job we don’t know about ... we are not sure of everything they did because that information is not available. It is in 130 boxes of material somewhere ... maybe in Langley, Virginia but they won’t release it. Various people have said that they employed more sophisticated measures than MKULTRA to do mind control on people.

< Mind Control, Secret Societies And Death Cult >
I think one of the reasons that this is such an important subject is because we are looking at people here who have a certain attitude about life itself, and these people are in the government and they are in important positions in the government ... and in order to understand what they are really about, we get a look at them that is unprecedented by looking at what they did with this kind of experimentation on humans. In other words, they hate life. That’s pretty clear. They have their own version of life, which is like “death” and that’s where their life is ... that’s what they feed off of. I would say that most, if not all, secret societies are based on the same concept. Once you cut through all the paraphenalia and symbology of secret societies, you are basically dealing with people who have, for one reason or another, given up on life completely. They are now into the form of life that is involved with death ... that’s their territory. And it’s a pretty horrendous thing to say, but I think that would be borne out. My own feeling is that we are talking about a confluence of different influences here on individuals that go back a long way into the past ... into the history of families in which they grew up ... I am talking about long term history of what those families are ... and these people who are entirely functional, but entirely psychotic if you want to use that term. It doesn’t really do it justice but it tells you something about them. I am talking about John Foster Dulles and Allen Dulles ... I would say they are very good examples. Look at their faces ... look at what you see there ... you see almost nothing. There is a kind of mask-like quality about these people, an emptiness — very competent people who go about their business, who seem to have no feeling or “juice” for life. And I would say these people are often born into families who go back centuries possibly in that kind of disconnected condition from life. While they are able to function very successfully in society and deal with power, because that is their ticket and their coinage, they find that control and destruction of life is the only thing really that gives them life.

[flyarm]

213. (Advocacy Committee for Human Experimentation Survivors - Mind Control)

http://www.hgsys.com/aches/mind_control.html


snip:

In March of 1995, Valerie Wolf, M.S.W., and two of her clients who had been subjected to mind control experimentation since early childhood appeared before the President's Advisory Committee on Human Radiation Experiments. After consulting with forty other therapists across the country (the majority of whom remained anonymous for reasons of personal safety), Ms. Wolf documented in writing the names of the research projects and the names of the people involved.

The two survivors, Claudia Mullen and Chris DeNicola Ebner, testified that as victims they experienced electric shock, hallucinogens, dislocation of limbs, sadistic acts of pedophilia, hypnosis and sensory deprivation. Often they were locked in cages for long periods of time. At the conclusion of the Presidential Hearing, the Committee recommended further exploration of the mind control experimentation on unwitting human subjects. It has been over a year and a half since this recommendation was made, but nothing further has been done by the President's Advisory Committee. You will not be surprised to learn that there has been no coverage or investigation by the mainstream media despite the testimony provided by Wolf, Mullen and Ebner.

Survivors seeking to end the horrors began immediately to document cases in writing, and we have now formally created ACHES - MC (Advocacy Committee for Human Experimentation Survivors - Mind Control) in order to lobby for formal recognition of these atrocities by the government. In preparation for a Presidential Hearing, a letter-writing campaign that includes therapists and researchers, as well as survivors, is under way.

[flyarm]

220. gary caradori 'I got it, Loran. We've got 'em by the balls' "

i was at the chicago all star game of which gary and his son had just attended..my husband was in baseball then!fly



http://www.thisistherealtruth.com/

On November 4, 1988, in Omaha, Nebraska, the Franklin Community Credit Union was closed by the FBI and the IRS. A kingpin in the operation had been siphoning off many millions of dollars to reportedly finance a paedophile ring operating between Omaha, Chicago, and Washington, D.C. Caught up in the mess of paedophiles, child porno, and such was Daddy Bush.

Related details are in a book called "The Franklin Cover-Up", by John DeCamp, a Lincoln, Nebraska attorney once a Nebraska State Senator. A companion book is called "The Mystery of the Carefully Crafted Hoax", with a forward by Ted Gunderson, the former head of the Los Angeles FBI office who after 1979, specializes in investigations of child molesting ring satanic rituals and such.

A Committee of the Nebraska State Senate was formed to investigate the pedophile charges. Their investigator was Gary Caradori. He took his son to a sports game in Chicago and while in Chicago, Gary was able to apparently pin down with witnesses the role in the pedophile ring of the Elder Bush. Gary called from Chicago to Loran Schmit, a member of the Nebraska State Senate investigating committee.

Gary "called committee chairman Loran Schmit, before his (Gary's) return trip and said, 'I got it, Loran. We've got 'em by the balls' ".That was July 11, 1990. "Caradori wasn't finished with his investigation. He and his son were killed on 7-11-90 while returning from the All Star game in Chicago. The plane came apart in the air and crashed and burned on impact. The NTSB has not issued a formal statement on the cause of the crash. In addition to going to the ball game, he was also working some leads on the case." And Gary's "briefcase and papers were inexplicably missing from the crash site, along with the two rear seats of the plane." (from "The Mystery of the Carefully Crafted Hoax", pages 77-78. The book goes into great details how the state and federal authorities, through a hoax, tried to cover up the pedophile ring operating at the highest levels in the nation's capital.)

[flyarm]

223. The Asbestos Connection

not my words..fly


http://mindprod.com/asbestos.html

The Curious Asbestos Connection
The following table contains all state and federal American politicians killed in plane crashes since 1980, and a few others who suffered similar incidents.

[Goldmund]

222. This is still too flimsy to be called a story...

on the other hand, these two show definite similarities, and I think that this is one of the million leads we have that deserves being looked into:


Age-enhanced Johnny Gosch:


Gannon:

[flyarm]

226. i put them together and the eyes and mouth as sooo alike!!

its uncanny!!

fly

[Zan_of_Texas]

244. I'm not good with faces but

Young Johnny looks like his face is a different shape -- Guckert's face seems longer and narrower to me. That could be a function of age? Maybe.

Plus, in one of the ads, didn't JG say his eyes are green?

Young Johnny looks like he has brown eyes.

Regardless, young Johnny's mother will undoubtedly see the news photos and make her own judgment.

I believe the number of kids abducted in the 1980s was pretty large -- probably no way of knowing, but I would guess hundreds rather than dozens. So, even if JG was one of those kids, it could be a different one.

I don't buy it though, as likely, just because it's so public to be on tv at a White House press conference -- why would his handlers risk that, if indeed he has a past of being undercover and in hiding?

[zann725]

245. The ears are quite different, as is the nose bridge. And his age.

n/t

[flyarm]

250. remember these are computer generated pictures..

the 18 yr old picture is a computer foresic photo..its not a perfect picture of johnny..its a close guess!!..a computer picture!!

[shadowlight]

248. Anyone have any closer shots

of Gannon for comparison? Head shot I mean, errrr... portrait.

[brainshrub]

230. To sum up this thread so far:

Am I reading this right?:

This thread is alleging that Gannon/Guckert was a CIA honey-pot, and that's how he got his connections to the Whitehouse.

Also, it's possible that Gannon/Guckert is lying about his age and his real identity could be a person named Johnny Gousch.

--- Okay. Time out. ---

I love DU and many of the posters in this thread I consider friends. So, as your friend, and with the deepest respect, I'd like to warn you all about the dangers of libel and and this forum being marked as a bunch of tinfoil-haters.

I'm just pointing out that the reputation and credibility of DU could be seriously marred if posters here don't think carefully about what they are doing.

--- Time in. ---

Good luck with the research. I'm getting a pot of coffee ready, warming up my own site and looking forward to doing some research of my own.

Go get 'em DU.

[icehenge]

237. Thats how it looks to me

I hope no one goes of half cocked. No pun intended.
In my opinion we are sometimes represented as wearing
tin foil hats. Be certain, BESIDES the photo ID that
there is a connection. This is a big leap.

[rman]

317. "marked as a bunch of tinfoil-haters"

"I'd like to warn you all about the dangers of libel and and this forum being marked as a bunch of tinfoil-haters."

By that logic we shouldn't discuss anything that reeks of conspiracy, because the RW, the MSM, mark us as tinfoil-hatters all the time. I don't think we should let the opposition frame our debate.

[drm604]

241. Andy,

There's something that's been intriquing me about you and this whole story. Back in January before any of us had even heard of Gannon/Guckert you posted this thread about the homosexual prostitution scandal in the Reagan Whitehouse. At the time I had the impression that you were bringing it up because you thought that something was about to break that was somehow related to it. You didn't say that explicitly but you did say "Who remembers this? Just in case you forgot here it is." It gave me the impression that you wanted to remind people of it for some reason. My question is - what was your reason for doing it? Did you in fact know or suspect that another somehow related story was about to break?

[Andy_Stephenson]

246. Idon't remember why I posted it.

kismet perhaps.

[drm604]

252. Okay, never mind then.

It seemed so coincidental. I was hoping that maybe you had some kind of inside scoop or something.

[understandinglife]

303. Interesting link in that thread:

http://www.indybay.org/news/2003/02/1570946_comment.php#1631192

[BuyingThyme]

243. I don't buy into this thread, but

Gannon's prostitue profile says he's about 35 or 36 years old.

See his profile (from 1999 or 2000) and do the math:

http://web.archive.org/web/20010210193928/http://www.male4malescorts.com/reviews/jeffphilly.html

[soulcore]

255. This has been beautifully summarized here

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2005/02/crazy-yes-but-crazy-enough-to-be-true.html

[slay]

257. Welcome to DU soulcore!

An interesting theory indeed.

[Nickster]

305. This is all pretty interesting, but....

just be careful you guys and gals. Remember, there is bound to be a huge disinformation campaign to derail getting to the bottom of this pit. Just keep your eyes and ears open, that's all I'm saying.

[in_cog_ni_to]

259. ANDY! Important info! Des Moines Register Editor's name...JAMES GANNON!!!

Holy shit. The coincidence is too much! Is there a connection somewhere with Jeff/James Gannon/Guckert? Here's the PDF that was posted above by someone. I was reading what Gosch's mom had written and THIS NAME GLARED OUT AT ME!!! JAMES GANNON!!!! He was the Editor of the Des Moines Register when Johnny Gosch was kidnapped!

Here's the link from the above post. http://www.johnnygosch.com/chap.pdf


<snip>I decided to make an appeal to the Des Moines Register editor…James
Gannon, only to make someone aware of things the police were not doing in
the investigation. I had made repeated efforts to gain cooperation between the
police and our detectives from the beginning of the case. They simply would
not.
The result of my letter pleading for help was another disaster. Mr.
Gannon published it on the front page of the paper and allowed the police to
dissect it in print and make crude remarks. The letter was never intended to be
used for publicity … only as a plea for help for my little boy. It was another
blow to our family, the impact left me shell shocked, unable to sleep, severe
loss of weight because I simply could not eat under all of the stress.
I was afraid to open up the newspaper each morning, because I didn’t
know who would be attacking us next. Nor could I understand “why!” I kept
asking this question daily how could they do this and why … what was their
motives? Why would Gannon, the editor of the Des Moines Register encourage
and assist in the attacks against parents to find their child. Today, we know
many important people in business and in government are themselves
pedophiles or for one reason or another are sympathetic to those who are.
Pedophiles can be in any walk of life, male or female teachers, coaches, scout
leaders, politicians and police at all levels.<snip>

[Liberal In Texas]

262. "Very curious, indeed," said Alice.

[in_cog_ni_to]

265. Isn't it? What are the odds that we see the same name connected to THIS

story? :tinfoilhat:

[soulcore]

269. Two James Gannons for the price of one

yes ... if ever there were a connection saying "please, follow me" this would be it.

So is the James Gannon (Des Moines Register Editor) still alive? I bet he's not.

weird stuff...

[in_cog_ni_to]

263. Andy! You MUST see this! James Gannon?? related to Jeff Gannon????

:kick:

[Liberty Belle]

270. A geneology website might be able to help.

[Minstrel Boy]

277. great catch. my head is swimming.

I added this to my blog'd summation of this thread, with a link to your post.

[Minstrel Boy]

280. Some stuff on James P Gannon:

He's described as a "prominent Mid-western Republican." He and his wife have retired to Virginia.

"James P. Gannon is a former reporter and bureau chief with the Wall Street Journal and former editor of the Des Moines Register. Jim and his wife Joan run the Old Sperryville Bookshop in Sperryville, Virginia."
http://www.perseusbooksgroup.com/perseus/author_detail.jsp?id=1000016981

Here's a conservative opinion piece he wrote on Kerry last year for USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2004-06-01-gannon_x.htm

[in_cog_ni_to]

284. A Republican. ANOTHER coincidence.

:eyes:

[in_cog_ni_to]

286. ANOTHER twist! Johnny Gosch worked for the Des Moines Register!

WHY on earth would his employer not want to do EVERYTHING in his/it's power to help the Gosch family find Johnny? Odd. VERY odd!

<snip>The Des Moines Register was ignoring any kind of helpful publicity
(no one could understand why…. (Johnny worked for them), so we worked
with other forms of the press, in and outside our state. I received a phone call
in the spring of 1983, a woman saying, she worked at the Des Moines Register
in the newsroom…. She reported, “Shortly after the kidnapping, the editor at
that time, came into the newsroom and announced …all articles written about
the Gosch boy WILL be slanted against the family and for the police.” She
would not give me her name… she was afraid of losing her job. I now knew
what was happening but didn’t understand “why”!<snip>

http://www.johnnygosch.com/chap.pdf

[tanyev]

288. So did the other kid mentioned upthread,

Eugene Martin. Does anyone know what became of him? Was he ever found?

[in_cog_ni_to]

292. No. He has never been found.

I was googling for a pic of him, but couldn't find one.

[wishlist]

331. Interesting that editor was prominent Republican writer- James Gannon

Mrs Gosch has negative things to say about how the unhelpful Des Moines Register editor James Gannon handled the case. Interestingly, this same James Gannon is a prominent Republican fundraiser and Bush supporter whose recent writings include pro-Bush articles and a book about military history. He is retired and now lives near D.C but wrote a rabidly anti-Kerry, pro-Bush letter to editor complaining when the current Des Moines Register editor endorsed Kerry.

[Kansas Wyatt]

296. So this James P. Gannon is a devout Catholic?

Hmm? Don't some pedophiles turn out to have been molested when they were a child? It would be interesting to see if there were any Priests in this James P. Cannon's childhood who were accused of molesting children.

No offense to any Catholics, but it seems odd after the recent scandal in the Catholic Church.

[in_cog_ni_to]

298. It's a vicious circle. Pedophilia, that is.

I wish I was an investigative journalist. It would be a good angle to look at. Lexus-Nexus could be useful right about now. ;)

[Minstrel Boy]

301. Here's a story today from Toledo: ritual satanic abuse in the church

SPECIAL REPORT
Dark allegations arise amid probe of nun's slaying
Authorities expand investigation to claims of ritualistic sex abuse



For Toledo police, it was a rare assignment: Search an abandoned house on the edge of a cornfield in western Lucas County where people reportedly took part in ritual abuse ceremonies.

...

No longer was the probe focusing solely on the man accused of killing Sister Margaret Ann Pahl, but was expanding into a new direction: accusations that children were molested and raped by priests in ritual services.

For the past year, police have embarked on one of the most unusual investigations in the department's history, spurred by leads emerging after the priest's arrest in April for the killing in the Mercy Hospital chapel more than 24 years ago.


http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050220/NEWS08/502200352/-1/NEWS

[Kansas Wyatt]

365. This Sperryville, VA place....

Would be fairly close to Spotsylvania, VA. In a residential neighborhood in Spotsylvania that consisted of retired military and spooks, how possible would it be for a military family to be 'touched' by this? I recognized the area code for the retired editor as relating to some trouble that I knew about a few years back, which involved a rising star in the military from the Afghan campaign who took a job promotion.

[Tracyjo]

300. Old Sperryville Bookshop & Coffee House

44 main st. Sperryville, Va.
540-987-8444

[kk897]

271. Ya'll realize Lawrence King should be getting out of prison right about

now, or already has. I tried for some time to find out, back in December when I was checking some other stuff out, but was unable to find anything conclusive.

[Minstrel Boy]

275. I understand he's out, and looking for a GOP appointment.

Seriously. There's an interview, somewhere, I think with Noreen Gosch a couple of years ago, that mentions this.

[understandinglife]

299. Is this the interview ?

http://educate-yourself.org/tg/noreengoschradiotalk15feb04.shtml

http://educate-yourself.org/tg/goschcradiointerview19aug03.shtml


Peace.


BE THE BU$H OPPOSITION;24/7

[Minstrel Boy]

302. Yeah, that's it:

"Now that Lawrence King is out of prison, where he was being held on financial crimes, Bonacci may be able to get that $1 million in damages from him.

"DeCamp has been told that upon getting out of prison, Lawrence King was slated to go to Washington for a job within the Republican Party."

[elehhhhna]

274. Gosch this is getting bizarre.

[Andy_Stephenson]

285. Does Someone have the profile Gannon posted on the web???

Something big is about to break in this story I think and I need the BIO on this fella.

[moobu2]

287. Here's all the links to his prostitute pages from Americablog

Dont know if you'll find what you need there but here it is

LINK

[soulcore]

294. oh man i can't wait (n/t)

[Clark2008]

295. Andy, is it along the lines we've posted?

There have been several ideas here, but could you clue us into which avenue this is going to break and where? MSM?

[MelissaB]

297. The pictures of

Gannon and the child abducted look similiar, but they are not the same unless "Gannon" had some moles/freckles removed on his neck. I just don't think so...

[Lerkfish]

291. FWIW: 15 years ago, a former friend who was a psychic told me....

...that Michael Jackson's Neverland ranch was actually a recruiting tool for kidnapping young boys to be used as sexual objects for rich and very powerful men. I asked him, like who? He said "You'd be shocked. it goes all the way up to the top in DC."
He said he had seen this psychically, not actually.
Before anyone jumps on me, this guy was one of those level of psychics whom police depts. used from time to time to find missing and abducted children, well respected. He never charged for his services or held public sessions or the like, he had a real day job (coincidentally in a govt. agency), and did these other things to help.
He stopped, though, because the things he'd "see" with these missing kids gave him the real frights, and he couldn't stomach the negative engergies anymore.
He told me that there are people so evil, that they no longer are human.

Just for what its worth, because this thread has triggered that memory in me.
I'm no longer friends or stay in touch, though, so I can't tell you any more than that.

[Sparkle]

307. Did Michael Jackson have his Neverland ranch 15 years ago?

[AgadorSparticus]

318. you'd think the answer to your question would be easy enough to

find, but it wasn't. i actually had to dig for it. there was a complaint filed by one little boy in 1990 at jacko's neverland. but it's odd to me that i couldn't find the actual year in which he established neverland. maybe someone will have better luck than i did at this god forsaken hour. ugh. i'm going to bed.

[Lerkfish]

322. 16 yrs ago....here's a link:

googled to find this:

http://www.mjfanclub.net/history/beyond_2.html#1993

1989
February -- Children at the Cleveland Elementary School in Stockton, California receive a visit from Michael Jackson. The children had earlier been traumatized by a sniper opening fire on their school. Many of those present reported that Jackson's visit helped them to feel safe again.

Spring -- Michael Jackson invites two hundred children from St. Vincent's Home for Dysfunctional Children and from the Big Brothers and Big Sisters Programs to the Circus Vargas in Santa Barbara to help him celebrate his purchase of Neverland Ranch.


that's 16 yrs. ago.

[AgadorSparticus]

315. reading your post and well, this whole thread is giving me the chills.

i can't imagine what your friend "saw" and i'm not sure i want to know either. i'm very sensitive and not sure i could handle it--esp. when it comes to kids.

[Lerkfish]

323. he wouldn't elaborate, which is just fine by me.

[Andy_Stephenson]

309. I sent Mrs Gosch an email.

Followed by a phone call. Here is her response

"Andy,

Thank you for taking the time to email me the photo link. I have already contacted my PI and we will be checking this out as much as possible.

If I have any questions, I will get in touch with you.

Regards,


Noreen "

[Minstrel Boy]

310. Good man, Andy. n/t

[New Earth]

311. man oh man

this is really really really wierd. i'm starting to get the creeps.

[KyndCulture]

313. Ok I am completely creeped out. I have the video's on my blog.

The franklin story. You have to use IE but here they are.


www.liberalpatriots.com

[EFerrari]

314. Good job, Andy. Be careful. We don't know how safe Noreen

is.

I read all the doubters/warners above and they have a good point.

We should all be mindful we're on a public forum, no?

I know how that sounds. I mean it in the most careful way.

heavy hearted, Beth

[chiburb]

327. What am I missing?

"Noreen" says she saw her son in 1997. Wouldn't she ALREADY know if G/G was her son?

Gosch's mother claimed that her son is alive and that he visited her in 1997. She announced her revelations during a 1999 pedophile crime organization trial in Nebraska. Gosch's mother said that he came to her Iowa apartment in March 1997 with an unidentified male friend. She claims that Gosch told her he was abducted by members of a pedophile crime organization and he escaped from the group at an undetermined time. Gosch's mother also said that her son was in fear of repercussions from the group and that was the reason he chose to remain "underground." She stated that she has had no further contact with her son since his 1997 visit and that she remained silent about the event until called as a witness in court because she fears for Gosch's safety.

http://doenetwork.us/cases/160dmia.html

[tanyev]

341. She kept quiet about the 1997 contact for

two years, and even then only talked about it when called as a witness in court.

[in_cog_ni_to]

336. Wouldn't Mrs. Gosch know if her son was Gannon/Guckert?

Why does she need a PI to look into this? Hmmmm. More to ponder. She just saw her son in 1997. Right? He couldn't have changed that much in 8 years, could he? Her response is interesting. Is that why you sent the pic links? or am I missing a bigger picture here?

[Andy_Stephenson]

337. I wonder if she is afraid to ID him?

I just don't know. It is another "wrinkle" in this whole story. I am totally perplexed by the whole affair.

[Minstrel Boy]

338. She's said her son changes his identity, and

even called him "the chameleon."

To protect him, if it is him, I doubt she would give a positive ID.

[Andy_Stephenson]

339. MB...what does your gut say in all of this...

is it him?

[Minstrel Boy]

340. I start to lean towards, "Naaah, couldn't be..." and then

I see Republican editor James Gannon, Johnny's employer, had some weird vendetta against Noreen Gosch.

The physical likeness aside, there are those recurring JGs - even JDGs - what the hell are those chances?

And that Mrs Gosch didn't blow this off, after seeing the pictures, is certainly noteworthy.

I'll tell you what, though: I've long thought about the Franklin/Spence scandals, that if this shit were real, then we needed to totally rethink our assumptions about the world. Even those of us who are already accused of wearing the foil. If this is the way the world works, if this is the enemy, then we're really up against it. And we oughta get metaphysical on their luciferian asses.

[seemslikeadream]

342. Yea MB

And we oughta get metaphysical on their luciferian asses.

[Andy_Stephenson]

343. Explain how we get

metaphyscical on them?

[Minstrel Boy]

345. I think we need to find our own ways, probably by

finding our own spirit, maybe learning from our own traditions, or those we adopt.

I know I risk sound like a raving religious loony to say it, but if we don't admit there's a spiritual battle going on, then I think we've already lost.

Look at the stories of mind control survivors - the Satanic ritual abuse perpetrated covertly by goverment agencies. Look at the case right now in Toledo, a priest on trial for murdering a nun on an altar, and a circle of priests ritually abusing children for decades. It's Crowley-inspired Thelemic sex magick. And I think it's the secret state religion.

[troubleinwinter]

384. According to the flyer made when Gosch was kidnapped,

the child had a large birthmark on his left chest.

No such thing on Guckert in his (!) photos.

[New Earth]

312. i'm kicking this creepy story

should stay on first page until we hear more, i think.

[lamp_shade]

316. kick

[elehhhhna]

325. kick

for semi-tinfoilers, myself included.

[Vinca]

326. Just a thought Andy, but why not try going directly to Gannon?

(Haven't a clue how - you're the expert.) If he actually was this poor kid, his entire image would change from what it currently is - smarmy - to a sympathetic one. Who could condemn a person who led the life described in previous posts? It would be in his best interest to spill ALL the beans, not only from a psychological standpoint, but from a current, personal safety standpoint. If he knows what people think he might know, he may be a "suicide" waiting to happen.

[Andy_Stephenson]

329. I am not so sure I want to go there...if I did

I might be a suicide waiting to happen as well.

BTW...I would NEVER take my own life!

EVER!!!

That was a piblic service announcement.

[Vinca]

332. Good point. It's not worth putting yourself in harm's way.

Maybe Gannon/Guckert/Bulldog or one of his minions will read this and decide to come clean. It's going to come out eventually and Gannon could turn this whole episode around if he quit the charade. I smell a "made for TV" movie, don't you?

[Andy_Stephenson]

333. I hope G/G/B

is safe right now. But i fear the worst. Suicide is in fashion these days.

I can see the headlines now.

"Distraught reporter kills self over viscious attacks by left wing bloggers"

[in_cog_ni_to]

334. If the man knows he's in danger

it would behoove him to go public before he "commits suicide." :(

[Andy_Stephenson]

335. Agreed...

:shrug: Will he though? That is the 64k question.

[flyarm]

357. my sentiments exactly andy!!

i fear for this mans life...and i do not believe we can ignore the fact that this man may have been abused sometime in his life, and that he may be and very possibly could be a victim of something in his lifes experience. There was some reason he was in that white house..and it does not pass the legitimate sniff test...we don't know what put him in that white house or who was using him..it could be he was an oportunist..that could be an answerable thing anywhere else..but in the white house..nooo there is something very twarted here...that stinks to high heaven..
i will not judge this mans actions, i will however judge the gate keepers at the white house..mr. gannon did not get where he was in the white house without a very planned, and executed purpose.
we have not walked in this mans shoes, so we can not possibly judge him. we can try to understand him, but not judge him. we can try to figure out why he was in the white house and why he allowed himself to be used by this white house..but not judge him.
i really fear for this young mans life.

fly

[bklyncowgirl]

328. People be careful out there

The Dark side must be floating all sorts of disinformation.

The allegations in this thread are explosive. The coincidences are bizarre, however and it should be pursued. The fact that Mrs. Goesch didn't dismiss Andy out of hand is significant.

The fact that several people related to this story have died under mysterious circumstances is frightening.

[Hissyspit]

330. kick n/t

[Andy_Stephenson]

344. WTF!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:g74AfMrkl3sJ:www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php%3FNumber%3D292808407+Paul+Bonacci+Bohemian+Grove+Hunter+S.Thompson&hl=en

"In other testimony, Bonacci said that Larry King was smiling and laughing the whole time the film was being shown, and that 'the men with the hoods' were a Satanic group which planned to use the dead boy in some sort of ceremony . He also named the director of the snuff film, whom they had picked up in Las Vegas, as 'Hunter Thompson'."

[New Earth]

346. i'm confused

are you wtf'ing that there might be a connection between the Gannon story and the death of Hunter S Thompson?

[Andy_Stephenson]

347. Yes.

one I had not heard of until this morning...literally a few minutes ago.

[New Earth]

348. you know something

honestly, the second i heard that Thompson 'killed himself' last nite, i thought it was kind of timely to THIS very thread, and what seemed to be coming together. man....this story gives me the ultimate creeps.

[bklyncowgirl]

349. What kind of crazy wacked out forum is that?

Scroll down a bit.

"A typical show last week revealed that President George W. Bush ("Bush-fraud") was involved in a satanic mass murder in 1984 in Brownsville TX in which 17 cult members were slain and skinned. During the 2000 election campaign, reporters confronted Dubya and he didn't deny it. Apparently Dubya's teeth marks were found on one of the victims but Daddy Bush, a practicing satanist himself, got it covered up."

There's also something about Kerry being either involved in a snuff film with underage girls or a member of British intelligence or both.

The tie in with Hunter Thompson is truly bizarre but this sounds like some sort of true tinfoil hat stuff.

This basicly accuses Bush of cannibalism.

[Andy_Stephenson]

350. Yeah. I am looking

Here is another source...and is apparently from John DeCamp's book

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:9vSF-ISOkMMJ:www.m...

[Minstrel Boy]

351. Here's another source:

That is a quote from page 105 of John DeCamp's The Franklin Cover-Up.

[Andy_Stephenson]

353. Fuuuuuuuck!

This is really freaking me out now. All of a sudden a person named in the Franklin Coverup dies of suicide. Tell me this is just one of those strange coinkydinks.

[flyarm]

360. it would be against all odds!!

and last night there were many posting trying to shut this discussion down...i found that odd..and they were baiting stuff we have not even come close to inferring...i found that unsettling..it was like some were trying to censor this story..or this research or discussion or what ever you want to call it..i immediately thought..we are getting close to some truths here...and some are trying to shut this conversation down!

fly

[Andy_Stephenson]

362. I am afraid we have hit on the truth here.

but I am afraid to vocalize it.

[MelissaB]

364. Andy,

please go back and look at the pictures. Look at the moles/freckles on "Gannon's" neck. I just don't think they are the same. I'm not trying to poo poo, but just feel this need to make sure you have noticed this. The guy has moles all over his (beautiful) naked body, but the moles on his neck as an adult aren't there as a child.

On edit: I'm going back to work where this site is blocked. Just be cautious. Also, I guess I've had moles appear on my body that weren't there 30 years ago. :shrug:

[Kansas Wyatt]

368. Vocalize it!

There are some of us still trying to catch up, don't know too much about this, and would like to see the truth for a change, instead of so many accidents & suicides.

[Andy_Stephenson]

369. I need something to tie it all together.

can't and won't till then.

[flyarm]

377. i know what you mean..andy..

i know exactly what you mean!!be careful dear.

fly

[flyarm]

376. want to check this one outt too i had in files!!

again nebraska!! fly
sorry link no longer works!! don't know if these help anything..but had in files fly

Guardian Unlimited | World Latest | Body of Neb. Senator's Aide Found in Pond
Body of Neb. Senator's Aide Found in Pond

Tuesday February 10, 2004 6:01 AM


McCOOK Neb. (AP) - Divers found the body of an aide to Sen. Ben Nelson in a pond Monday, a day after he was seen walking his dogs in a park south of McCook, authorities said.

Two of Scott Hoffman's dogs had returned to his home without him and another was picked up Sunday afternoon. Authorities believe Hoffman, 33, may have gone after his dogs as they chased geese onto the park pond's thin ice.

Nelson issued a statement Monday saying Hoffman ``will be missed and remembered fondly by all who knew him.''

Hoffman was an editor at the McCook Gazette from 1995 through 2000 before taking a job with Nelson's campaign. He was Nelson's field representative in McCook.



http://www.rense.com/general45/violnt.htm

Top Secret Advisor To 4 Presidents Dies 'Violently' In DC
Posted Dec 8, 2003 07:06 AM PST
Gus W. Weiss, 72, adviser to four presidents on top secret policy matters, died violently in Washington, DC, on November 25, 2003, but his death was not reported by The Washington Post until December 7, 2003, in the obitiuary section at the bottom of page C12.

[New Earth]

352. you might want to check 'plain text'

that link becomes broken with a :P in the middle. lol

[Swamp Rat]

355. That's right

[bklyncowgirl]

356. Yum!

Maybe that's why Pickles fired the White House Chef and hired one who could cook Texas style.

The old one didn't have a good recipe for "BBQ People Shoulder".

[Swamp Rat]

363. Maybe they'll hire a Cajun Chef

[flyarm]

358. omg!!!!!!!!!!!! andy!!

i had a lousey feeling yesterday when i heard about this weed guy exposing * pot stuff..i thought ..this is being planted by rove for a cover for something bigger..something explosive..i thought ..people are getting too close to the truth...


* is wisked out of the country...and then weed comes out with the tapes..its too pretty..its too perfect..

and who in this country gets their bips in a snit over pot anymore..no one..

so rove gets the pot crap out there..to cover for bigger real stuff..then last night hearing of hunter thompsons suicide..i started crying ..i thought ..dangggggggggg,,they did it again...

this is like seeing a horror movie ..only its real!

i think we may be closer to the truth here than anything before!

fly

[in_cog_ni_to]

373. OMG. OMG. OK. I'm taking 10 deep breaths. This is freaking me out.

Look at what else I found in some testimony from Paul Bonacci. :( I think I'm going to be sick. Those poor children. :cry: Bonacci was only 12 years old when he got involved in this ring. :(

<snip>MR. DECAMP: Your Honor, the next witness I'd want to call is Paul Bonacci.

THE COURT: All right.

THE CLERK: Sir, would you state your full name and spell your last name, please?

THE WITNESS: Paul Anthony Bonacci, B-o-n-a-c-c-i.

THE CLERK: Paul Anthony Bonacci, B-o-n-a-c-c-i.

PAUL BONACCI, Called as a witness, being duly sworn, testified as follows:

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. DECAMP:

Q. Paul, I had originally planned to just go through detail of everything in the petition. For the purposes, as I understand it, of this hearing all that is presumed to be true.

MR. DECAMP: Is that correct, Your Honor?

THE COURT: Yes, that's right. That's acceptable.

Q. (By Mr. DeCamp) So for my purposes today I just want to briefly talk to you about how your life has been impacted, changed if you would, by Larry King. And all the things that he involved you in as a young boy. Go ahead.

A. Well, when I first met Larry King and stuff I had already been abused by some other people. But the one thing that I can remember a lot, Larry King, the most was the fact of all the threats that he used to use to try to keep all us kids in.<snip>


<snip>
Q. Okay, I'm going to interrupt you here because I know we probably want to get to lunch here. I have just one more witness, might take probably three to five minutes, I'd like to ask just a couple final questions. Alisha Owen, do you know her?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Do you know Robert Wadman?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Do you know Alan Baer?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Do you know Larry King?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Were all those people at these parties that you've heard described here today?

A. Yes, they were.

Q. Where were the parties?

A. Like I stated, a lot of them were at the Twin Towers. In various apartments and penthouses. Some were at a farm house. Some were actually at Larry King's house. Which was on a, all I know it had a big hill on it. It was nice, nice house and stuff. Also down in Washington, D. C. We had parties in Kansas City, couple of parties in some place in New York.

Q. What was the nature of these parties?

A. A lot of the parties when we went to, that we went to and stuff, the ones in the Twin Towers were basically for one reason. And that was for sex.

Q. Sex between who?

A. There was sex between adult men and some other adult men but most of it had to do with young boys and young girls.

Q. Young boys and young girls with each other or with older folks?

A. With the older folks. Also some of the parties, there was some parties above The French Cafe that they would bring people in and stuff that were from out of town. Those were specifically for sex with minors. Also in Washington, D. C. there were, there was also parties like Rusty had already talked about where there was parties after a party. Where they would have a party where they would have a legitimate party with like some politicians, businessmen. And a lot of them never knew about what happened at the after, you know, the party afterwards and stuff. Like in Washington, D. C. there was a lot of parties where they would be senators and congressmen who had nothing to do with the sexual stuff. But there was some senators and congressmen who stayed for the parties afterwards. And one person that I'm not afraid to talk about because his, because Larry King always said him and this guy were on the opposite ends of the field because this guy was a Democrat and Larry King was a Republican. That's a known fact and stuff. And this guy, every time I see him on TV and stuff, my wife knows my hatred for him. Because every time I see him and stuff it disgusts me because it's --his name is Barney Frank.

Q. Did you have relationships with him?

A. Yes.

Q. Where?

A. In Washington, D. C. And also I was sent to a house, I believe it was in Massachusetts in Boston where I believe it was his house because there's pictures on the wall that, with him and with different people and stuff. And that he had met I guess. But it was in his basement.

THE COURT: Mr. DeCamp, sorry, maybe we better break for lunch.<snip>

http://www.ritualabuse.net/franklin.htm

I don't think this is JUST a Republican cover up. Could THIS be why the congressional Dems don't want to touch this with a ten foot pole? My guess is... yes.

[Minstrel Boy]

378. You're right about that. It's not just Republicans.

Take a look at the archived stories here from the Craig Spence White House call boy scandal:

http://www.newsmakingnews.com/sexandcapitol7,18,01.htm#article4

Especially these:

"Sex sold from congressman's apartment; School used as base for sex ring"

and

"THE GOBIE STORY; Frank's 'call boy' tells all"

[Roland99]

379. Holy f-in shit!

[flyarm]

382. yes you are right..its why it never went anywhere 15 yrs ago..

and it could be kept quiet then..now with the internet..they can not shut it down..although they are trying to.

fly

[shadowlight]

385. This, from the same site,

describes birthmark on the chest of John David Gosch

A. Right. I had begun to, between 1992 and 97 I had started to give up hope that he was alive. At that point I began to pursue more of the who did it part. The criminal aspect of it. Because I felt that there was no more news on Johnny and I wouldn't have known what he would look like because he obviously aged if he was alive. And in March, in the middle of the night there was knocking on my door. And I went to the door and I looked out and there was a young man out there. And there was someone with him, he had someone with him. I don't know that person's name, they didn't give it to me. And I let him in and we talked for a little over an hour, hour and a half. And he began telling me what had happened to him. And he told me the exact same story that Paul Bonacci had told me in prison. I know that Paul's telling the truth. And I know that my son fell victim to the very same organization that affected and almost destroyed Paul's life and the lives of many other young people.
 
Q. Is this the first time you've told this story publicly?
 
A. Yes. And that's because I'm under oath. Otherwise I never have shared that I actually talked to my son.
 
Q. I understand. Do you have any how do you know it was your son?
 
A. My son has a very large birthmark on his chest. And I asked to see it.
 
Q. And was it there?
 
A. Yes. Yes, it was my son.

http://www.ritualabuse.net/franklin.htm

[in_cog_ni_to]

389. OK. Does Gannon/Guckert have a birthmark on his chest?

We have that one photo of him spread eagle on the bed. Does he have a birthmark? Can birthmarks be removed? Yes. My son has a HUGE birthmark on his behind and his pediatrician told me we could have it removed if he ever wanted to. So, if there's no birthmark, is there a scar on his chest?

[bklyncowgirl]

391. If this is true I'm sure there are others who went to these parties.

This is horrifying and scary as hell--like something out of a bad thriller novel.

[soulcore]

359. Thompson, whose legal representation is provided by the same politically

connected law firm that successfully shielded John and Patsy Ramsey from prosecution, has been accused by the child witnesses in the case dubbed the 'Franklin Cover-Up.' Anger was suspected by police investigators, but was shielded from prosecution by sex researcher Alfred Kinsey, a devoted follower of Aleister Crowley. Kinsey died shortly after he and Anger visited Crowley's Thelema Abbey in Sicily.

...

???!!!

[Minstrel Boy]

366. soulcore, what's the reference for that?

Reminds me that Crowley is far more influential than popularly credited.

I wrote about him a few weeks ago on my blog, with respect to some other high weirdness to the backstory of the National Security State:

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2005/01/occult-history-of-national-security.html

[soulcore]

367. found it here

http://davesweb.cnchost.com/wtc13.html - towards the bottom of the page, last paragraph before the references start.

[Minstrel Boy]

370. Thanks. David McGowan is good on this material. n/t

[soulcore]

371. yeah, i'm a regular reader of your blog

that how i found this site. I'm the one who thanked you for posting something intelligent about chemtrails. We're not all tin-foil hatters ya know. www.soulcore.net/chemtrails if your interested.

This story is just boggling my mind ... i can't wait for it to really "break"...

[Minstrel Boy]

372. hey, thanks!

I'll check out your site.

:hi:

[seemslikeadream]

381. Hi soulcore

We get to talk about chemtrails here but ya have to go to the basement!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=111&topic_id=42139&mesg_id=42139

I Want A Serious Chemtrail Discussion
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=111&topic_id=26287&mesg_id=26287

Part II - I Want A Serious Chemtrail Discussion
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=111&topic_id=29628

the sky here is beginning to look like a checkerboard . . .
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=111&topic_id=40905

:hi:

[soulcore]

388. wow. I'm all over it

amazing just how many people are starting to really notice this. these are the most interesting times indeed.

[New Earth]

361. "a" wrinkle?

this has turned into a thousand wrinkles. i am literally stalking this thread until it all comes together.

[Spazito]

374. Me too!

I don't know where this will all end up at but, geez, it is fascinating, horrific, informative and terrifying all at the same time. I am wearing out my refresh button and trying to keep the hair on the back of my neck from being permanently raised!

There are way too many 'coincidences' to be coincidences even for the most skeptical of us, imo.

[Roland99]

380. Is there any link to Rev. Moon in any of this?

[soulcore]

383. well if Gannon/Guckert is a Rove "disciple" could that be the link? n/t

[flyarm]

390. check this out!! i will separate the section i want you to look at!!

http://www.the7thfire.com/Politics%20and%20History/gunderson_report.htm

GARY CARADORI , KEY INVESTIGATOR OF FRANKLIN, DIES IN PLANE CRASH--


GARY CARADORI , KEY INVESTIGATOR OF FRANKLIN, DIES IN PLANE CRASH--The evening of July 11, 1990, Gary Caradori, the investigator for the Nebraska State Legislature, Special Committee, called Senator Loran Schmit, Chairman of the Committee, from Chicago and told him he had the "smoking gun". Caradori told Senator Schmit he would fly that night from Chicago on his private plane with his son en route to Lincoln, Nebraska, with the evidence. The plane exploded in mid-air a short time later while flying over Aurora, Illinois killing Caradori and his 8-year-old son.

Officials claimed the plane disintegrated in mid-air. They denied an explosion took place. De Camp writes in his book, "The Franklin Cover-Up"; "A farmer reported he saw a flash of light, heard an
explosion, and saw the plane plunge to the ground .The eyewitness account of the flash of light and the explosion was on the early edition of television news in Nebraska, but was pulled from subsequent reports which said that the plane exploded on impact". (p. 2-3)

Bob Wadman, former Chief of Police of Omaha, and a perpetrator identified by the children (see above), was Chief of Police in Aurora at the time.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


Caradori’s briefcase and the rear seat to the plane have never been found. Ted Gunderson (this writer), suspects his briefcase contained


the evidence mentioned the previous night to Senator Schmit, probably the incriminating materials, including photographs, provided by Rusty Nelson to Caradori (See Rusty Nelson statement below). The rear seat to the airplane was not found, Gunderson suspects, to avoid evidence of a bomb.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

The wreckage of the plane was examined on a military base rather than at a location under the control of civilian personnel. Under the Federal Delimitation Agreement, civilian personnel matters are handled by civilians and military matters are handled by the military. The crash was ruled an "accident" by government officials and not an act of sabotage.

Both Gunderson (this writer) and Noreen Gosch, mother of missing-child Johnny Gosch, later learned that Caradori had in his possession evidence that her son was a victim of the Franklin satanic cult/sex/drug ring. Paul Bonacci and Rusty Nelson have both provided detailed testimony attesting to this (see sections on Johnny Gosch below).


XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Gary Caradori repeatedly told friends in the weeks before his death that he feared his plane would be sabotaged.



XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Both Gunderson and Noreen Gosch recently learned from undisclosed sources (whose lives and the lives of their loved ones could be placed in greater danger should their identities be revealed)

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

that a deputy sheriff of a local Illinois sheriff’s department was the first person on the scene of the plane explosion. The deputy sheriff said that there was child pornography all over the farm field.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

The man picked up a large number of photographs and other evidence. The FBI immediately arrived with three flatbed trucks, grabbed the evidence from his hands, cordoned off the field, walked the field, picked up every piece of evidence, took the plane and its parts and put it on the flatbed trucks, and told the peace officer, "This is confidential information and don’t ever speak of it again". The evidence has never surfaced again in the Franklin investigation or any other investigation.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


The deputy-sheriff did not remain silent.
*******************************************

****************************************************


A few months later, as the deputy sheriff and his wife were driving, the couple suffered a head-on collision in which the man’s wife was killed and he was very seriously injured.


xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


It is the opinion of Ted Gunderson (this writer), who has 49 years experience in law enforcement and counterintelligence activities, that this probably was a kill-by-car covert operation attempting to silence and intimidate yet another witness in the Franklin case, as probably occurred, according to sources, in the death of Kathleen Sorenson, the original complainant in the Franklin case.

[in_cog_ni_to]

392. Do we know where this deputy sheriff is from in Illinois?

Too many people connected to this story have died! TOO MANY COINCIDENCES! This is not all happenstance. These people are being murdered. :scared:

[Binka]

394. Fly check out my post #320 it is ALL about the Moon connection

Spence, Gregg, Moon it is the same scandal all over again. Moon is everywhere. And this current admin is rife with Iran Contra shits Negroponte and Arbrams to name just two. Moon was at the center of Iran Contra. The sex scandal seems to have come full circle. They are going to SPENCE Gannon I am sure of it.

But it is Moon that creeps me out. His ex-daughter in law paints a bleak and horrific picture of the despot. Her ex husband Moon's number one son was a drug addict and abuser. A quick google search gives one more than ample insight.

[Roland99]

386. http://www.bushbodycount.com/

http://www.bushbodycount.com/list.php?catid=17&blogid=2

Orlando Letelier
He was torn to bits by a car bomb on the streets of Washington DC just before he was to testify against the Chilean dictator Pinochet. After the bombing, CIA Director George H. W. Bush told the FBI that there had been no Chilean involvement whatsoever. In 1991 the post-Pinochet Chilean Supreme Court asked George H. W. Bush if he would submit to questioning. BUSH REFUSED.

Ronni Moffit
She was Letelier's assistant. She and her husband were riding in the car with Letelier when the bomb exploded. Mr. Moffit survived. Ronni didn't.

Paul Wellstone
He was a vocal opponent of the Bush administration and the only real progressive in the Senate. Polls showed that his popularity surged when he voted to oppose the war on Iraq. His victory in the Senate race was a foregone conclusion.

Senator Wellstone, his wife Sheila, daughter Marcia, three of his staff and both pilots were killed when his small plane went down in Evelyth, Minnesota, on October 25, 2002.

Governor Mel Carnahan
In the midst of a heated race for the Senate against John Ashcroft, the Governor died in a plane crash on October 16, 2000. His death affected Democrats in two ways - it would hurt their chances of seizing control of the US Senate, and it would strongly impact the Presidential race between Al Gore and George W. Bush. Said St. Louis University political scientist Ken Warren, "There will be a sympathy vote, but that won't be enough to allow him to win. "I don't think the race will be very close. It's over." As we know now, Ashcroft lost to a dead man. Carnahan was elected by a landslide.

Lori Klausutis
Lori Klausutis, age 28, was found dead behind a desk in the offices of US Representative Joe Scarborough of Florida, a Republican, on July 20, 2001. Death was apparently due to a blow on the head. Claims that a heart condition precipitated an accidental fall are tenuous at best; Lori was a marathon runner, and one would think that a heart condition would already have become apparent. At the time of her death, she was treasurer of her chapter of the Florida Federation of Young Republicans. Readers will note that there is no mention of young Lori's passing, although there is that ever-present link to the Chandra/Gary dungheap that commands the attention of our media.

It is an interesting coincidence that Tim Klausitus, Lori's husband, worked on targeting technology for missiles, in light of the fact that Lori's body was discovered within a week of George W. Bush's much-ballyhooed missile defense test. Another interesting tidbit: Rep. Scarborough sits on both the Military Construction and the Research and Development Subcommittees. Scarborough has resigned and is leaving office in November, giving his family as the reason.

Dan Rocco
He died on April 1, 2002, in a plane crash in Gainesville, Georgia. He was an executive vice president at ChoicePoint, the firm that gained infamy with their faulty "felons" list supplied to Katherine Harris during the 2000 election in Florida. As a result of this list, thousands of voters (mostly African-American voters) were wrongly identified as felons and purged from the rolls.

William Casey
William Casey was CIA Director during the Reagan/Bush Administration. He died 2 days before he was to testify about his and others' involvement in the Iran/Contra scandal.

Gary Caradori
He was investigating Lawrence E. King, Jr., a very influential black Republican who was also a friend of George H.W. Bush. King was director of the Franklin Community Credit Union in Omaha, Nebraska, and was suspected of embezzling $40 million. The Nebraska Senate questioned child prostitutes, who accused King of running a child prostitution ring. One of these children said that she saw George H.W. Bush at one of King's parties. "Pronto", a newspaper in Barcelona, Spain, reported that the scandal "appears to directly implicate politicos of the state of Nebraska and Washington DC who are very close to the White House and George Bush himself". Gary Caradori claimed that he had evidence that supported these allegations. On July 11, 1990, Gary Caradori was killed along with his 6-year old son in the crash of his small plane, after a mid-air explosion, the cause of which was never discovered. He had told friends repeatedly in the weeks before his death that he was afraid his plane would be sabotaged.


Katherine Smith
She had been implicated in February in a phony documents scheme said to be related to the September 11 hijackers. One day before she was due in court, she was incinerated in her car after having hit a utility pole. An investigation revealed that the crash was minor and was not the cause of the fire that burned Smith beyond recognition. Who was really behind 9/11? Was Katherine Smith privy to that information? Why did she have to die, and who killed her?


Bob Stevens
Mr. Stevens died of a mysterious case of anthrax. He worked as a photo editor for American Media, who owns the National Enquirer. The Bush family suffered enormous embarrassment at the hands of the Enquirer when they published a photo of daughter Jenna Bush, obviously intoxicated, cigarette in hand, cavorting on the floor with another drunken female.

Don C. WIley
Dr. Wiley disappeared November 15, 2001 in Memphis, Tennessee. He was attending a two-day annual meeting of the scientific advisory board of St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. His work on deadly diseases such as ebola and HIV raised fears of a terrorist kidnapping. Four hours later, his rental car was found on a bridge, raising the question of suicide, which his family vehemently refuted. Dr. Wiley was found a month later in the Mississipi River.

Salem bin Laden
In 1979 Bush business Arbusto Energy obtained financing from James Bath, a close family friend. Bath had extensive ties to BCCI and the bin Laden family. Bath was the sole U.S. business representative for Salem bin Laden, the brother of Osama bin Laden. It is well known in certain circles that the Arbusto money came straight from Salem bin Laden, although Bush denies it. Salem bin Laden died when for no apparent reason, he flew his airplane into power lines where it became entangled, and fell 150 feet to the ground. "He was a very experienced pilot. He was a good pilot. We just can't understand why he decided to go right instead of left," recalled airstrip owner Earl May field.

John O'Neill
He was Director of Counterterrorism at the New York offices of the F.B.I. until he resigned in August 2001. One of the world's top experts on Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda, he grew to believe that "all the answers" regarding what they needed to destroy Al Qaeda lay in Saudi Arabia. However, starting in January 2001, Bush blocked all efforts by Mr. O'Neill to investigate Saudi ties to bin Laden. In the summer of 2001 O'Neill declared that the main obstacles to his investigation were U.S. oil interests.

In late August, a frustrated O'Neill quit the FBI and took a position as head of security for the World Trade Center. From Democrats.com:

September 11: On O'Neill's second day of work on the 34th floor, the WTC is hit by the first plane. O'Neill makes it out of the building safely, calls his son to say he is OK,. then goes into the other tower to help guide those still inside to safety. Minutes later, O'Neill, along with hundreds of others, is dead, killed by the terrorist the Bush administration refused to allow him to pursue to the best of his ability.

You know, I've long dismissed such stuff as conspiracy theorist stuff.

But, this is just getting too damn consistent in some of these manners of death:

Heart attack before fall (2)
Plane crash (5)
Car crash (3)

[Bethany Rockafella]

387. Maybe Jeff Gannon chose the name Gannon (name of newspaper boss),

knowing he would be on tv in the future, giving his mom a tip that it was him. He couldn't use his real last name to protect his mom.:shrug:

[flyarm]

393. check this as well!!

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/ring.htm

Urgent recent developments in the Franklin satanic
cult/sex/drug ring

[flyarm]

395. gop's pink triangle

http://www.mindcontrolforums.com/hambone/pink.html

[flyarm]

396. Where in Washington, D.C. is Sun Myung Moon?

http://iapprovethismessiah.com/2005/02/day-washington-times-went-after.html

2/18/2005
The day the Washington Times went after a Republican White House
New wrinkles in the Jeff Gannon scandal have reminded some of of a strange Thursday in 1989. It seemed to come out of nowhere. Readers passing by the "Brighter. Bolder" newsstands dispensing Rev. Moon's Washington Times, accustomed to faithfully pro-Bush headlines, instead saw this (click newspaper to read story):

[Moderator]

397. Locking

This discussion has run its course.

[Moderator]

398. A notice

You may start a new thread on the subject.