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Reply #259: you've certainly avoided my question [View All]

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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #214
259. you've certainly avoided my question
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  -Glenn Greenwald: The Due-Process-Free Assasination Of U.S. Citizens Is Now Reality Hissyspit  Sep-30-11 06:24 AM   #0 
  - OH MY GOD THAT'S BRILLIANT!  Hoosier Daddy   Sep-30-11 06:26 AM   #1 
  - Permalink:  Hissyspit   Sep-30-11 11:03 PM   #300 
  - Glen Greenwald can suck it  Syrinx   Sep-30-11 06:33 AM   #2 
  - +1...nt  SidDithers   Sep-30-11 06:37 AM   #4 
  - Keith Olbermann can suck it, too!  bananas   Sep-30-11 07:10 AM   #23 
  - The genius of the constitution is that it guarantees its citizenry  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 01:55 PM   #191 
     - +1 Absolutely! nt  snappyturtle   Sep-30-11 05:45 PM   #237 
     - +2 n/t  louslobbs   Sep-30-11 06:20 PM   #246 
     - +3 --  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:03 PM   #280 
     - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Sep-30-11 09:10 PM   #285 
     - Why didn't Obama simply extradite this man and try him?  JDPriestly   Oct-01-11 12:48 AM   #314 
     - PLUS FUCKING ONE!  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 04:50 AM   #326 
  - DU is the real world for liberals dealing with reality. nwat  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 02:07 PM   #193 
  - Ok..  girl gone mad   Sep-30-11 09:45 PM   #293 
  - No suprise you support this.  RetroLounge   Sep-30-11 11:41 PM   #305 
  - Umm, wingnuts have declared war on us, Syrinx..  Cyrano   Sep-30-11 07:04 AM   #20 
  - Don't equate a metaphor with fact n/t  Inuca   Sep-30-11 07:14 AM   #26 
  - Exactly. Awlaki commanded no army and had no means to wage war  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 07:21 AM   #31 
     - I call trying to take down an airliner with a bomb a means to wage war. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:09 AM   #54 
     - How do you know that?  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:38 PM   #255 
     - A jury in the UK put the guy on the other end of his emails in jail for 30 years.  Robb   Sep-30-11 08:52 PM   #276 
        - That's nice, but this is the US, not the UK. n/t  Exilednight   Oct-01-11 05:38 AM   #332 
        - So if the RAF had killed him, it would be OK?  Robb   Oct-01-11 09:48 AM   #338 
           - I don't buy into the question. The UK would never assassinate a US citizen without  Exilednight   Oct-01-11 02:51 PM   #353 
              - I like this answer.  Robb   Oct-02-11 08:00 AM   #384 
                 - I would argue no. The simple reason, AaA was never tried and convicted. The only way I could argue  Exilednight   Oct-02-11 10:23 PM   #389 
        - Because he was on the OTHER end of the emails.  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:16 AM   #360 
           - You're arguing two different things.  Robb   Oct-02-11 07:57 AM   #383 
              - That's just the point. There were emails.  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-03-11 10:37 AM   #390 
     - As I asked another DUer, why couldn't Obama simply extradite  JDPriestly   Oct-01-11 12:51 AM   #315 
        - Obama is now a true believer in  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 04:54 AM   #327 
        - Because the government of Yemen does not control parts of its territory?  hack89   Oct-03-11 10:55 AM   #391 
     - Neither did Osama bin Laden. He managed to make quite a  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 11:51 AM   #343 
        - Last I checked bin Laden wasn't an American Citizen.  FedUp_Queer   Oct-01-11 02:30 PM   #349 
           - I was responding to the post that claimed that al-Awkli had no means  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 07:17 PM   #354 
              - Yeah, OBL had no means of waging war  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:20 AM   #361 
  - As long as they don't publicly declare that they intend to murder...  Amonester   Sep-30-11 06:16 PM   #244 
  - And when they set up shop in a lawless ME state where  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 11:50 AM   #342 
  - No you don't. You must be tried in a court of law for treason.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 07:25 AM   #35 
  - I emphatically agree.  ChadwickHenryWard   Sep-30-11 11:02 AM   #138 
     - Eh. If your name was found in Benedict Arnold's papers, you got your house burned to the ground  Robb   Sep-30-11 11:57 AM   #158 
        - That was BEFORE there was a Constitution. n/t  DeSwiss   Sep-30-11 12:25 PM   #167 
        - Correct. (nt)  Robb   Sep-30-11 01:58 PM   #192 
        - And therein lies the crux of this entire debate. nt  ooglymoogly   Oct-01-11 10:55 AM   #340 
        - I don't romanticize the Revolution.  ChadwickHenryWard   Sep-30-11 02:43 PM   #204 
        - Habeas corpus, one of the rights that this murder violated,  JDPriestly   Oct-01-11 12:56 AM   #317 
           - I didn't say anything about habeas corpus.  ChadwickHenryWard   Oct-01-11 08:24 AM   #337 
              - That is the essence of habeas - the concept that every man deserves  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:28 AM   #362 
        - "US troops"??? Try again with your history lesson.  WinkyDink   Sep-30-11 05:21 PM   #231 
           - Yes, US troops. By 1780 the notion of the United States was well established.  Robb   Sep-30-11 05:30 PM   #235 
              - I'm aware that 1776 preceded 1780. The connection to B. Arnold?  WinkyDink   Oct-01-11 06:40 AM   #336 
  - I don't think anyone's civil rights are safe with you /nt  Bragi   Sep-30-11 07:26 AM   #36 
  - Even if he does "reliquish his citizenshiop" . . .  markpkessinger   Sep-30-11 07:38 AM   #42 
  - another thing the Obama Presidency is doing is mainstreaming Bushite stuff  MisterP   Sep-30-11 01:48 PM   #187 
  - +1 ---  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:10 PM   #284 
  - Bush's arguments are repeated here all the time  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 10:48 PM   #299 
  - Yup, our elections have become little more than sporting events.  UnrepentantLiberal   Oct-01-11 12:53 AM   #316 
  - That is becuause pugthugs have taken over the dem party  ooglymoogly   Oct-01-11 11:01 AM   #341 
  - Or irony  FedUp_Queer   Oct-01-11 02:33 PM   #350 
  - +1000  RetroLounge   Sep-30-11 11:44 PM   #307 
  - Sadly,  chervilant   Sep-30-11 02:52 PM   #207 
  - +1.....what you said. n/t  louslobbs   Sep-30-11 06:24 PM   #248 
  - +100000  emilyg   Sep-30-11 10:33 PM   #296 
  - fail.  Javaman   Sep-30-11 09:47 AM   #99 
  - Do we get to use my definition of when you relinquish your citizenship?  lumberjack_jeff   Sep-30-11 09:49 AM   #100 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 09:58 AM   #106 
  - I must admit I can't work up too much outrage over this  catbyte   Sep-30-11 11:00 AM   #136 
  - Best hope a Republican President doesn't mis-identify YOU.  WinkyDink   Sep-30-11 05:22 PM   #233 
     - Ted Kennedy ended up on the "no fly" list -- had he not died he might have been assassinated ... !!  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:11 PM   #286 
  - the founding fathers can suck one too..  frylock   Sep-30-11 11:02 AM   #137 
  - +1 n/t  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:39 PM   #256 
  - And that's just up to you?  _ed_   Sep-30-11 12:25 PM   #168 
  - do you also relinquish your humanity? Where was the necessary indictment and due process?  librechik   Sep-30-11 12:49 PM   #176 
  - When did Awlaqi declare war on this country? Do you have  sabrina 1   Sep-30-11 02:28 PM   #199 
  - +1  Muskypundit   Sep-30-11 05:04 PM   #224 
  - One citizen cannot "declare war" on the United States. That is patently absurd.  WinkyDink   Sep-30-11 05:20 PM   #230 
  - Really? Where is it written and what is your proof?  tblue   Sep-30-11 08:57 PM   #277 
  - When Bush/Cheney did these things we rightly thought it was TREASON ....  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:07 PM   #282 
  - I don't know the exact legal definition of treason,  tblue   Sep-30-11 09:20 PM   #289 
     - It's a matter of consciousness raising ....  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:37 PM   #292 
  - Yup. Join the other side in a war and plot against your country, you should be looking over  TwilightGardener   Sep-30-11 09:08 PM   #283 
  - Actually, no. In fact, we have LAWS governing the relinquishing of one's citizenship.  FedUp_Queer   Sep-30-11 10:13 PM   #295 
  - Reading that it sounds like the last section 2385 comes closest to  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:39 AM   #363 
  - And when your President decides that to be the case  obxhead   Oct-01-11 01:55 AM   #321 
  - Maybe in your world  tavalon   Oct-01-11 04:45 AM   #325 
  - 94,000+ Americans killed by the government without a trial  whistler162   Oct-01-11 06:03 AM   #334 
     - How many fools does it take to screw in a light bulb? nwat  ooglymoogly   Oct-01-11 10:52 AM   #339 
  - He relinquished his citzenship rights.  Windy   Sep-30-11 06:35 AM   #3 
  - What do you think is the most compelling evidence against him?  jpgray   Sep-30-11 06:38 AM   #5 
  - the fact that he was on the list  Enrique   Sep-30-11 06:40 AM   #8 
  - Easy answer. The emails between him and the British Airways plotters.  Robb   Sep-30-11 07:57 AM   #47 
  - The public fatwa he issued against a female cartoonist? The evidence in the Stephen Timmns'  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:17 AM   #59 
  - What part of this do you not understand?  trumad   Sep-30-11 06:40 AM   #7 
  - And he got his due process of law under the AUMF of 9/18/01.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:43 AM   #72 
  - Oh yeah? Then I would imagine that you could get an indictment with no problem then.  TheKentuckian   Sep-30-11 06:43 AM   #10 
  - Bingo and that's the point.  trumad   Sep-30-11 06:45 AM   #12 
  - Yemen has the right to hunt fugitives. He didn't show for his Yemen murder charges. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:29 AM   #64 
  - so using your logic, the US should drone-attack every person in the world who doesn't show up for  stockholmer   Sep-30-11 10:05 AM   #109 
  - No. The US should target SDGTs and break Al-Qaeda. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:52 AM   #130 
     - break al-Qaeda? lolol, they are really 'breaking them' by putting them in charge of Libya  stockholmer   Sep-30-11 11:27 AM   #148 
  - Yemen didn't waste him, we did. Smarter clandestine services and an Administration  TheKentuckian   Sep-30-11 06:01 PM   #241 
  - Well-said.  closeupready   Sep-30-11 04:04 PM   #215 
  - Our President has placed himself above the law, just like his predecessor.  sad sally   Sep-30-11 05:26 PM   #234 
  - should have been a piece of cake to arrest and indict him then, right?  piratefish08   Sep-30-11 06:50 AM   #15 
  - Again---what part do you not understand?  trumad   Sep-30-11 07:00 AM   #18 
     - He got his due process when he didn't show for his murder charge in Yemen.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:45 AM   #76 
        - Are you kidding? Yemen? Do you know what is going on there  sabrina 1   Sep-30-11 02:37 PM   #203 
        - they are truly stupid, aren't they? we all have gps in our cell phones,  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:08 PM   #264 
        - That's a bullish reply and you know it is  DisgustipatedinCA   Oct-02-11 10:13 AM   #386 
  - Did he ever renounce his US Citizenship? Why not try him for Treason in a court of law?  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 07:26 AM   #37 
  - No, he didn't "relinquish his citizenship rights" . . .  markpkessinger   Sep-30-11 08:00 AM   #48 
  - Then you're sickened by the rule of law, then  _ed_   Sep-30-11 12:27 PM   #169 
  - reccomend...  madrchsod   Sep-30-11 01:47 PM   #186 
  - +1  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 02:11 PM   #194 
  - +1  EmeraldCityGrl   Oct-01-11 02:18 AM   #323 
  - PLUS ONE!  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 05:15 AM   #329 
  - You hit it right on the head.  bighart   Oct-03-11 10:59 AM   #392 
  - +1  CopingBarker   Sep-30-11 12:44 PM   #174 
  - Really? Which Americans? Where? How? With What?  2banon   Sep-30-11 05:10 PM   #226 
  - Yea, I really dont get it either.  Muskypundit   Sep-30-11 05:21 PM   #232 
  - With that logic, couldn't American presidents rightfullly be targeted for  UnrepentantLiberal   Oct-01-11 01:27 AM   #319 
     - If they didn't quietly go along with Wall Street theft  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 05:19 AM   #330 
  - To believe he tried to kill many many americans,  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 05:09 AM   #328 
  - Poor, poor al-Awlaki...nt  SidDithers   Sep-30-11 06:38 AM   #6 
  - I'm sorry, but really? nt  AverageJoe90   Sep-30-11 01:00 PM   #180 
  - Poor poor US Constitution  DisgustipatedinCA   Oct-02-11 10:17 AM   #387 
  - This has a way of snowballing. But, it's hardly unprecedented.  leveymg   Sep-30-11 06:41 AM   #9 
  - i don't doubt it, but...  Enrique   Sep-30-11 06:43 AM   #11 
     - The first Predator drone/Hellfire missile casualty was a US Citizen, for one.  leveymg   Sep-30-11 06:53 AM   #16 
        - Is that the right article?  bananas   Sep-30-11 07:36 AM   #41 
        - Read down to the second or third para.  leveymg   Sep-30-11 08:04 AM   #50 
        - That is incorrect  RZM   Sep-30-11 08:35 AM   #68 
           - Kamal Derwish, a USC, was in the vehicle targeted in the Nov 05, '02 Predator strike.  leveymg   Sep-30-11 11:13 AM   #144 
              - Atef died in 2001. According to your info Derwish died in 2002.  RZM   Sep-30-11 11:31 AM   #150 
              - I misread the year. You're right - Atef 11/01 and Derwish 11/02.  leveymg   Sep-30-11 11:38 AM   #153 
                 - Thanks. I agree that it doesn't affect your argument.  RZM   Sep-30-11 11:40 AM   #155 
              - It is one thing to kill and pass it off as casualties of war.  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 02:32 PM   #201 
                 - finally a smart assessment  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:14 PM   #266 
  - a drone bomb here and a drone bomb there  court jester   Sep-30-11 06:45 AM   #13 
  - That detached, vacant stare says it all.  drokhole   Sep-30-11 01:09 PM   #181 
  - A look of pure boredom.  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:53 AM   #365 
  - exactly  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:15 PM   #267 
  - The constitutional scholar strikes again. Oh, I meant Obama - he certainly  seaglass   Sep-30-11 06:49 AM   #14 
  - Didn't he just yesterday or the day before lecture Cuba  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 06:57 AM   #17 
  - The legal backing is the AUMF of 9/18/01. The ACLU agrees.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:36 AM   #69 
     - Of course. I have already learned that a President can torture people with legal cover and zero  seaglass   Sep-30-11 09:25 AM   #92 
     - +1 -- and now it's a bit clearer why Obama saw no need to prosecute Bush/Cheney --- !!  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:16 PM   #288 
     - John Yoo approves this message  Supersedeas   Sep-30-11 09:54 PM   #294 
     - The ACLU certainly does NOT agree!!!  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 12:01 PM   #160 
     - You have no idea what you're talking about  _ed_   Sep-30-11 12:30 PM   #170 
     - The ACLU didn't challenge the merits of the law, only the process.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 12:51 PM   #177 
     - The Nazi concentration camps were legal, too. Didn't make them RIGHT. nt  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 12:56 AM   #366 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 07:00 AM   #19 
  - "at least given a trial and appeals and the other trappings of due process before being killed"  TacticalPeek   Sep-30-11 07:06 AM   #21 
  - Secret Courts + Wall-to-Wall Wiretapping + Summary Executions = Police State  Octafish   Sep-30-11 07:08 AM   #22 
  - You don't really know what a police state is  Inuca   Sep-30-11 07:17 AM   #28 
     - So what if it's not like East Germany or wherever? Read''Friendly Fascism'' by Bertram Gross.  Octafish   Sep-30-11 07:30 AM   #40 
     - For the first 23 years of life  Inuca   Sep-30-11 10:13 AM   #116 
     - Do you REALLY think this site is not being monitored right now? nt  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:01 AM   #368 
     - yet somehow you are able to still say we live in a police state  zappaman   Sep-30-11 12:21 PM   #165 
        - Like in a police state people would be watching what you say.  Octafish   Sep-30-11 01:19 PM   #182 
     - Neither, apparently, do you. nt  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 02:22 PM   #198 
     - We have the highest percentage of the population incarcerated  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:00 AM   #367 
  - I want to be on record... Killing terrorists is not against the ideals of all liberals.  Syrinx   Sep-30-11 07:13 AM   #24 
  - I don't know...maybe it's me...but aren't Liberals for the Constitution of the United States?  trumad   Sep-30-11 07:14 AM   #25 
  - he gave up his citizenship when he declared war against America  Syrinx   Sep-30-11 07:20 AM   #30 
  - He did?  trumad   Sep-30-11 07:21 AM   #32 
  - Article 3 Section 3 of the constitution says that waging war against the government...  Syrinx   Sep-30-11 07:46 AM   #44 
     - Tell us how what you propose or support is even REMOTELY constitutional.  Hassin Bin Sober   Sep-30-11 08:05 AM   #51 
     - Wrong law--targeted killing of terrorists is permitted under the AUMF of 9/18/01.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:11 AM   #56 
        - ANYTHING is permitted under AUMF using your rationale  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 10:08 AM   #113 
        - No. Targeted killing of SDGTs is, though. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:38 AM   #126 
           - Nothing is forbidden  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 11:10 AM   #141 
           - You love your fucking acronyms. SDGT?  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:10 AM   #372 
        - will you have such a hard-on for AUMF when president perry is wielding it?  frylock   Sep-30-11 01:23 PM   #183 
           - Tell ya' what--I'll be voting for Obama, so President Perry won't be my fault.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 03:59 PM   #211 
              - it really won't matter who is at fault..  frylock   Sep-30-11 04:29 PM   #223 
              - It's not whether Perry will be your fault -- it's whether your trust is misplaced ---  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:23 PM   #290 
     - No, it says giving allegience to a foreign government and waging war  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:09 AM   #371 
  - Bullshit. Did he renounce his citizenship? if not he is still a US ctizen.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 07:30 AM   #39 
  - It's not extrajudicial. It's been the law for 10 years in this country.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 07:55 AM   #46 
  - You mean Bush's BS laws? Fuck that noise.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 08:01 AM   #49 
  - You mean the laws passed with overwhelming Democratic support? Laws reviewed and passed by SCOTUS?  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:07 AM   #52 
     - No US Citizen can be deprived of his rights without due process of law.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 08:08 AM   #53 
        - Ok. Again, tell us what his due is? Cite the law that says he gets a 'trial' and a 'jury of his  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:23 AM   #60 
           - It's called the CONSTITUION, read it.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 08:27 AM   #62 
           - Cite the Constitution where it says you get a 'jury of your peers?'  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:34 AM   #67 
              - The 6th Amendment:  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 08:49 AM   #79 
                 - Cite 'jury of your peers.' Further, he didn't show for his Yemen murder charges. Yemen has the  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:59 AM   #84 
                    - The US constitution supercedes statutory law, so AUMF is irrelevent.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 09:21 AM   #91 
                       - I don't think you understand my question--you haven't defined HOW the statute violates the  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 09:52 AM   #102 
                          - AUMF contains no process  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 09:57 AM   #105 
                             - The Grand Jury Clause doesn't apply to military targets or actions. It's not even adopted by a  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:37 AM   #125 
                                - The Grand Jury Clause certainly does apply  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 11:09 AM   #140 
                                   - No. It doesn't. Read Ex parte Quirin.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 12:47 PM   #175 
           - What the hell does Yemen have to do with all of that?  Fool Count   Sep-30-11 10:02 AM   #108 
  - Laws are always subject to constraint by the constitution  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 09:02 AM   #86 
  - You need to do a little more reading.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 09:18 AM   #90 
     - Everything required is in the first clause of the 5th Amendment  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 09:46 AM   #98 
        - The Grand Jury Clause doesn't apply to military targets or actions.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:35 AM   #124 
  - It's clearly extrajudicial  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 10:06 AM   #112 
  - You do realize that judicial review happened there? The case was thrown out because of lack of  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:51 AM   #129 
  - you want to go on record in support of bush's draconian laws?!  frylock   Sep-30-11 11:09 AM   #139 
  - I want to go on record saying this--too bad Bush didn't use the bipartisan-passed AUMF  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 04:02 PM   #214 
     - USAPATRIOT was also bipartisan-passed  frylock   Sep-30-11 05:34 PM   #236 
     - you've certainly avoided my question  frylock   Sep-30-11 06:44 PM   #259 
     - I want to go on record as saying Obama/Biden = Bush/Cheney.  UnrepentantLiberal   Oct-01-11 01:36 AM   #320 
  - Why don't you define how his assassination does NOT violate  sabrina 1   Sep-30-11 02:31 PM   #200 
  - First, tell me which International or Domestic law you think was violated?  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 04:05 PM   #216 
  - What is the AUMF?  ChadwickHenryWard   Sep-30-11 03:11 PM   #208 
     - AUMF = Authorization for the Use of Military Force, or bullshit as I call it. SDGT? No clue. n/t  Mnemosyne   Sep-30-11 08:50 PM   #274 
        - According to that trusted legal scholar, Dr. Google Machine,  ChadwickHenryWard   Oct-01-11 02:50 PM   #352 
  - How do you try someone living in, and directing terrorism attacks from, a foreign land  Schema Thing   Sep-30-11 08:34 AM   #66 
     - He didn't show up for his Yemen murder charges, either, a fact people here ignore, nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:37 AM   #70 
     - So? Now US is supposed to kill every fugitive in the world?  Fool Count   Sep-30-11 10:05 AM   #110 
        - No. Just the ones that try to bring down airliners or send PETN bombs. That'll be a busy  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 04:00 PM   #212 
     - You can't, but that does not give you any right to assasinate him.  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 08:51 AM   #82 
     - True, but it does give you the right to kill him.  Schema Thing   Sep-30-11 08:54 AM   #83 
     - Who said he was 'directing terrorism attacks'? He was here in the US  sabrina 1   Sep-30-11 02:34 PM   #202 
        - What the hell are you talking about? He was not 'here' 2 years ago. He left the US in 2002. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 04:07 PM   #217 
  - His giving up his citizenship somehow created a situation in which the US Constitution is no longer  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 08:46 AM   #77 
  - It doesn't say "citizen."  ChadwickHenryWard   Sep-30-11 11:13 AM   #143 
  - No PERSON shall be deprived...  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:07 AM   #370 
  - Can you tell us how this violates the due process outlined in the AUMF of 9/18/01?  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 07:53 AM   #45 
  - There is no process outlined in the AUMF of 9/18/01  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 10:14 AM   #117 
     - Well, if you really think that, it's too bad Al-awlaki didn't avail himself of the courts  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 10:56 AM   #134 
        - You don't agree that there is no process established by the AUMF?  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 11:11 AM   #142 
  - Ghastly. I feel like I'm in a twilight zone.  tblue   Sep-30-11 09:31 PM   #291 
  - Objecting to extra judicial killing is not pacifism or  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 07:17 AM   #27 
  - Yep...  trumad   Sep-30-11 07:20 AM   #29 
  - he did not object to certain policies of our government  Syrinx   Sep-30-11 07:22 AM   #33 
  - So you want to not only shred the Constitution but Geneva  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 07:27 AM   #38 
  - Yemen has the right to hunt fugitives. He didn't show for his Yemen charges. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:16 AM   #57 
     - 2000 years of Western Civilization and you're arguing for execution without trial.  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 11:30 AM   #149 
  - At what specific point does an allegedly traitorous citizen lose his citizenship?  Ignis   Sep-30-11 05:52 PM   #238 
  - Targeted killing is Constitutional. nt  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:25 AM   #61 
  - Sure, it is. It directly follows from  Fool Count   Sep-30-11 10:09 AM   #114 
  - If the Congress passes it, the President signs it, and the SCOTUS reviews it?  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 04:09 PM   #218 
  - targeted killing is constitutional  frylock   Sep-30-11 11:13 AM   #145 
  - Yeah,  chervilant   Sep-30-11 03:30 PM   #209 
     - me too, I cant stand a dumbo who just isnt bright enough to see the target  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:23 PM   #268 
  - Anwar al-Awlaki's extrajudicial murder  EFerrari   Sep-30-11 01:31 PM   #185 
     - this has been happening in my nightmares, people walking down a street  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:26 PM   #269 
  - Thank you. Jesus. When did Bush's "pre-emptive defense" theories become DU gospel?  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 09:40 AM   #96 
  - They issued us this set of pom-poms and by God, we're gonna use them. n/t  lumberjack_jeff   Sep-30-11 09:54 AM   #104 
  - Hear, hear! n/t  Mnemosyne   Sep-30-11 08:51 PM   #275 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 07:43 AM   #43 
  - Due process should be. n/t  lumberjack_jeff   Sep-30-11 09:53 AM   #103 
  - How about killing propagandists? THIS guy was a propagandist  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:05 AM   #369 
  - Factual error on your part  DisgustipatedinCA   Oct-02-11 10:23 AM   #388 
  - Horrifying. The Imperial Presidency has become an uncontrolable monster!  Odin2005   Sep-30-11 07:23 AM   #34 
  - +1  pecwae   Sep-30-11 02:22 PM   #197 
  - Think about this: EVEN if you think President Obama can be trusted with such powers ...  markpkessinger   Sep-30-11 08:09 AM   #55 
  - No one can be trusted with such powers. Not Perry, not Obama, not even Ralph fucking Nader.  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 08:44 AM   #74 
  - I absolutely agree ....  markpkessinger   Sep-30-11 09:01 AM   #85 
  - Thank you.  Enthusiast   Oct-01-11 05:33 AM   #331 
  - Most Americans don't care, as long as they can drive their SUVs.  krabigirl   Oct-01-11 12:58 PM   #348 
  - Absolutely disgusting. I am at a loss for words. Murdering citizens without trial is a new low even  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 08:16 AM   #58 
  - He was charged in Yemen. Didn't show. Yemen does not have to suffer our citizens murdering  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:28 AM   #63 
     - Well they didn't kill him with a drone strike, we did.  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 08:43 AM   #73 
     - A "successful joint intelligence-sharing operation" according to Yemen. They claimed it.  msanthrope   Sep-30-11 08:51 AM   #81 
        - You are aware the Yemeni government has a history of claiming responsibility for our dirty deeds  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 09:03 AM   #87 
     - So you'd be OK with Iran sending people over here to murder the three hikers  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:15 AM   #373 
  - What is new here exactly?  treestar   Sep-30-11 08:30 AM   #65 
  - Was Osama bin Laden a US citizen?  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 08:44 AM   #75 
  - So being a US citizen should be a license to kill?  Schema Thing   Sep-30-11 08:49 AM   #78 
  - No, but it does unquestionably entitle someone to say constitutional rights.  Puregonzo1188   Sep-30-11 09:04 AM   #88 
  - No, but what difference does it make?  treestar   Sep-30-11 09:09 AM   #89 
  - Oh, right. Assassination is now okay, because we did it to Bin Laden. On to the next killing.  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 12:54 PM   #178 
  - That's the way it looks. nt  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:21 AM   #375 
  - OBL was just as bad. He, and we, deserved a trial. He was IN CUSTODY -  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:19 AM   #374 
  - Sadly this is the truth  malaise   Sep-30-11 08:42 AM   #71 
  - Due Process or Don't they?  malthaussen   Sep-30-11 08:50 AM   #80 
  - It's telling the arguments in favor are, "Bush-era 9/11 laws make it legal." Meaning, "we no longer  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 10:48 AM   #127 
  - A dangerous man is dead,that is a good thing.  Swede   Sep-30-11 09:29 AM   #93 
  - Which, in effect, amounts to "the end justifies the means" ...  markpkessinger   Sep-30-11 12:01 PM   #159 
  - Really?  watajob   Sep-30-11 10:38 PM   #297 
  - LOL  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:23 AM   #376 
  - The callousness & hyprocrisy is stunning. Not only unconstitutional, but we'd condemn ANY country  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 09:33 AM   #94 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 09:36 AM   #95 
  - No. Unfortunately, way too many DUer's are enjoying the instant  COLGATE4   Sep-30-11 09:50 AM   #101 
  - This is  ProSense   Sep-30-11 09:59 AM   #107 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 10:05 AM   #111 
  - Sure  ProSense   Sep-30-11 10:10 AM   #115 
  - If you don't understand the difference between a foreign terrorist  COLGATE4   Sep-30-11 12:04 PM   #161 
  - I dunno, Lincoln killed plenty of American citizens without due process...NT  Elmergantry   Sep-30-11 06:48 PM   #262 
     - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 07:32 PM   #270 
  - Weak sauce, Pro.  theaocp   Sep-30-11 07:09 PM   #265 
  - He CAN'T have a heart attack. At this point, he could only suffer  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:31 AM   #378 
  - Selective memory there. I remember a LOT of discussion about  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:29 AM   #377 
  - The notion that 9/11 put the Constitution on hold is Bush/Cheney ideology, and a lie. Why any Dem or  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 10:16 AM   #118 
  - Exactly. When Russians poisoned that Litvinenko guy with  Fool Count   Sep-30-11 10:21 AM   #120 
  - Ding ding ding...youve hit the nail on the head. Hypocrisy in  OwnedByFerrets   Sep-30-11 07:54 PM   #273 
     - Of course. Or one of ours? Can Canada launch a missile at Cheney?  DirkGently   Oct-01-11 01:00 AM   #318 
  - The killing of a terrorist is now a reality  ProSense   Sep-30-11 09:41 AM   #97 
  - Due Process is so 18th Century  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 10:23 AM   #121 
  - Al-Awlaki was actually indicted in two countries last year.  Robb   Sep-30-11 10:18 AM   #119 
  - Of course, an indictment is NOT a trial.  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:35 AM   #379 
  - You know who else were American citizens.  AngkorWot   Sep-30-11 10:24 AM   #122 
  - Funny---but so were the Union Soldiers.  trumad   Sep-30-11 10:49 AM   #128 
  - +1  COLGATE4   Sep-30-11 12:06 PM   #162 
  - True... true...  AngkorWot   Sep-30-11 04:28 PM   #222 
  - Wondering when someone would bring it up  Elmergantry   Sep-30-11 06:44 PM   #258 
  - So, like, now it's legal to assassinate the Wall St. protesters at will?  Zorra   Sep-30-11 10:33 AM   #123 
  - I heard they're terrorist sympathizers who once met a 9/11 hijacker for tea. Let the missiles fly.  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 10:55 AM   #132 
  - I second that lamentation.  Jamastiene   Oct-01-11 12:50 PM   #344 
  - Obama: A Disaster for Civil Liberties  G_j   Sep-30-11 10:53 AM   #131 
  - Turley's being hurriedly stuffed the bus, I see. Getting crowded down there.  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 10:55 AM   #133 
  - Speaking of the Nuremberg Trials  MNBrewer   Sep-30-11 11:54 AM   #157 
  - Now it seems like we're determined to show the opposite. Another murder cheered amid waving torches.  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 12:39 PM   #173 
  - Excellent point. Justice and revenge are two separate things. n/t  xocet   Sep-30-11 05:05 PM   #225 
  - I think this case is clearly separating the wheat from the chaff.  tblue   Sep-30-11 09:05 PM   #281 
  - a terrorist gets smoked and greenwald fills a pamper. now that's what you call a two-fer.  dionysus   Sep-30-11 10:58 AM   #135 
  - Extrajudicial killings are okay when our guy does it!  Feron   Sep-30-11 11:20 AM   #147 
     - Given that only the killings considered good P.R. are even revealed, who knows who's being targeted?  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 11:37 AM   #151 
     - hmm...  chervilant   Sep-30-11 03:52 PM   #210 
        - Same here.  Jamastiene   Oct-01-11 12:53 PM   #345 
        - Which is, of course, the result the trolls want.  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:42 AM   #380 
     - +100  stockholmer   Sep-30-11 11:37 AM   #152 
        - +1000000000  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 07:43 PM   #271 
  - K&R for Greenwald.  bvar22   Sep-30-11 11:19 AM   #146 
  - Extra-judicial killing is what Al-queda...and the USA does.  Tierra_y_Libertad   Sep-30-11 11:39 AM   #154 
  - Unfortunately, the notion that the response to evil is to become evil isn't a new one.  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 11:46 AM   #156 
     - The tragic truth.  chill_wind   Sep-30-11 02:51 PM   #206 
     - As Hitler said "To defeat us they will have to become us."  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 01:44 AM   #381 
  - Greenwald's apoplexy is contrived and convenient.  madamesilverspurs   Sep-30-11 12:14 PM   #163 
  - Did you read that in your crystal ball?  _ed_   Sep-30-11 12:34 PM   #171 
  - more likely read from their crystal meth  frylock   Sep-30-11 04:27 PM   #221 
  - Do you have a response the substance of the piece?  DirkGently   Sep-30-11 12:38 PM   #172 
     - I'm thinking it would be along the lines of  Puglover   Sep-30-11 05:56 PM   #240 
        - We have got to do better than this.  DirkGently   Oct-01-11 12:47 AM   #313 
  - K&R  Solly Mack   Sep-30-11 12:16 PM   #164 
  - Oops...dupe.  KoKo   Sep-30-11 02:17 PM   #195 
  - Thanks Solly. It's a good time, indeed to reread that letter...  KoKo   Sep-30-11 02:17 PM   #196 
  - So true...  chervilant   Sep-30-11 04:02 PM   #213 
  - K&R n/t  DeSwiss   Sep-30-11 12:23 PM   #166 
  - I think Glen really means well, but there are a few problems with his theory.....  AverageJoe90   Sep-30-11 12:59 PM   #179 
  - Here is the list  stevenleser   Oct-01-11 06:32 AM   #335 
  - Hard to believe many on this of all sites, can be so deadly myopic.  ooglymoogly   Sep-30-11 01:29 PM   #184 
  - sad isn`t it.........  madrchsod   Sep-30-11 01:50 PM   #188 
  - Erect bogeyman. Wave flag. Send in the assassins. Announce victory. Works every time.  Tierra_y_Libertad   Sep-30-11 01:52 PM   #190 
  - That is how they do it in the movies. How could it not work out well?? n/t  xocet   Sep-30-11 05:16 PM   #227 
  - "We've always been at war with Eurasia."  Ignis   Sep-30-11 05:54 PM   #239 
  - +1  Marr   Sep-30-11 05:17 PM   #228 
  - K&R. (nt)  Kurovski   Sep-30-11 01:51 PM   #189 
  - Lots of Senior Officials Spilling State Secrets Today  chill_wind   Sep-30-11 02:48 PM   #205 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 04:16 PM   #219 
  - You didn't expect them to NOT use the post-9/11 laws they wrote for themselves, did you?  blkmusclmachine   Sep-30-11 04:22 PM   #220 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 05:19 PM   #229 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 06:01 PM   #242 
  - +1 nt  abelenkpe   Sep-30-11 06:15 PM   #243 
  - Their support  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:30 PM   #252 
  - This is deeply disturbing.  democrank   Sep-30-11 06:18 PM   #245 
  - He had it coming  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:26 PM   #249 
  - I'd rather be in the dirty laundry, in the worn brassiere. n/t  louslobbs   Sep-30-11 06:32 PM   #253 
  - +1 not for those who haven't done anything wrong. This will only happen to people who are bad or  louslobbs   Sep-30-11 06:29 PM   #251 
  - This decision of Obamas scares me in ways  EmeraldCityGrl   Oct-01-11 02:23 AM   #324 
  - We are truly fucked!  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:21 PM   #247 
  - Because we're not into a totalitarian nightmare already?  Amonester   Sep-30-11 06:29 PM   #250 
     - Maybe I should have written  whatchamacallit   Sep-30-11 06:33 PM   #254 
        - Yeah, I wish the Founding Fathers had foreseen the whole corrupt mess  Amonester   Sep-30-11 06:47 PM   #261 
           - Too bad. They could have written us a constitution or something  RaleighNCDUer   Oct-02-11 02:00 AM   #382 
  - My whole problem with drones  abelenkpe   Sep-30-11 06:41 PM   #257 
  - Fuck off, Greenwald.  Major Hogwash   Sep-30-11 06:45 PM   #260 
  - Not surprising  pmorlan1   Sep-30-11 11:19 PM   #302 
  - Wow. Right wingers just love Obama now.  krabigirl   Oct-01-11 12:56 PM   #347 
  - they'll keep cheering til a missile hits 1 of them or their family, then....  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 06:59 PM   #263 
  - Absurd analogies don't lead to truth. Why should reasonable person  bluestate10   Sep-30-11 11:58 PM   #311 
  - Thank you Mr Greenwald...you are correct, however, its been  OwnedByFerrets   Sep-30-11 07:49 PM   #272 
  - It is out in the open now  Harmony Blue   Sep-30-11 08:57 PM   #278 
     - Just as they have been condition to believe in torture....if its  OwnedByFerrets   Oct-01-11 10:30 PM   #357 
  - Obama is a disaster ---  defendandprotect   Sep-30-11 09:00 PM   #279 
  - The next Bush has this power, as does every other president from now on  saras   Sep-30-11 09:16 PM   #287 
  - The day will come when  emilyg   Sep-30-11 10:42 PM   #298 
  - I regret it now  pmorlan1   Sep-30-11 11:21 PM   #303 
  - Unbelievable.  pmorlan1   Sep-30-11 11:15 PM   #301 
  - Glenn, Glenn, Glenn. Your thinking is so... 2006. It all doesn't matter now. nt  ProgressIn2008   Sep-30-11 11:22 PM   #304 
  - US Laws of War here  StarsInHerHair   Sep-30-11 11:42 PM   #306 
  - In this case, the argument really doesn't apply  The Traveler   Sep-30-11 11:45 PM   #308 
  - The supreme court has ruled that renouncing citizenship does not equal giving up  Exilednight   Oct-01-11 05:53 AM   #333 
  - Wow the crazy talk in this thread is as scary as and right wing forum. D:  pam4water   Sep-30-11 11:45 PM   #309 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-30-11 11:53 PM   #310 
  - K & R - seeing exactly this kind of BushCo "reasoning"  Raksha   Oct-01-11 12:24 AM   #312 
  - Maybe I'm getting more pragmatic in my old age, but  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 02:06 AM   #322 
  - I can't imagine explaining to innocents  trumad   Oct-01-11 02:36 PM   #351 
     - It's not an easy call. If I could have prevented the 9/11 attacks  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 07:22 PM   #355 
  - Americans love violence and killing, as long as the people killed are brown.  krabigirl   Oct-01-11 12:54 PM   #346 
  - Nonsense. We've killed millions of Caucasians. nt  Flatulo   Oct-01-11 08:18 PM   #356 
  - "no evidence except unverified government accusations" and remember, Saddam has WMD's  L. Coyote   Oct-01-11 11:12 PM   #358 
  - Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours  L. Coyote   Oct-01-11 11:13 PM   #359 
     - Yeah, I hate that line,too. K, anyhow.  Desertrose   Oct-02-11 12:46 AM   #364 
        - Good idea, get rid of the time limit and allow recs to keep threads afloat!  L. Coyote   Oct-02-11 09:56 AM   #385 
 

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