Glyn Dwr
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Thu Jun-16-11 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #6 |
| 54. My Pre-emptive solution to those arguments |
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Was to be against attacking Libya in the first place... not here, though, I mainly lurk here. On HP (I know, I know...) I found myself arguing with a lot of "liberals" who were all for invading/attacking/not-at-warring in Libya for humanitarian reasons. Basically, it's been all of the reasons that we had to go after Saddam all over again. I asked why won't he go to congress if it's so important to get involved. Why? Because NATO and the UN said it was okay! All right, I countered, why do decisions by those bodies override the Constitution and the will of the people? If the nation was founded on a (somewhat loose) notion of self-governance as a moral obligation, then isn't a unilateral decision like this from one branch of government just reinforcing the Unitary Executive principle that we all just really, really hated a few years ago? The rebuttal is always something about how I want civilians to die (though in our other invasions, we've done a pretty bang-up job of killing civilians ourselves) or something.
The whole thing is morally dicey at best and it was the wrong decision then, it remains the wrong decision now, and at the very least I'd like some congressional approval of it. I know they'd probably thumb up the thing, but I'd at least like to see them pretend to give a crap about what we think.
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| -Obama claims he doesn't need the approval of Congress to continue the war in Libya. Congress sues. |
Better Believe It |
Jun-15-11 04:34 PM |
#0 |
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K&R Who would have ever thunk it. nt |
Shagbark Hickory |
Jun-15-11 04:35 PM |
#1 |
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By letting Bush go free for his war crimes, not to mention a few others |
TBF |
Jun-15-11 04:39 PM |
#2 |
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Just dropped from +1 to zero and I'll bet that trend continues - |
TBF |
Jun-15-11 04:41 PM |
#3 |
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just brought it to +9 :) |
inna |
Jun-15-11 05:11 PM |
#9 |
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how sad to be so disillusioned that you would let others suffer and die for it |
Eagle Mall |
Jun-15-11 05:15 PM |
#12 |
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War is Peace! |
EFerrari |
Jun-15-11 05:27 PM |
#16 |
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what's sad is believing that we're there to help the people |
inna |
Jun-15-11 05:29 PM |
#18 |
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Why you are a bit more pro-active |
Riftaxe |
Jun-15-11 06:55 PM |
#32 |
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Whether they want it or not. |
Better Believe It |
Jun-15-11 08:13 PM |
#33 |
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Whatever narrative will help you sleep at night.. |
girl gone mad |
Jun-15-11 10:50 PM |
#36 |
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There are polls that state otherwise. |
bobburgster |
Jun-16-11 03:22 PM |
#95 |
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oops, dupe |
inna |
Jun-15-11 05:21 PM |
#14 |
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Shame, Shame. That the first U.S. President of African descent would so belittle bombing Africans |
Distant Observer |
Jun-15-11 04:43 PM |
#4 |
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Repukes don't like Wars where they aren't making a profit. No money in humanitarianism. |
Eagle Mall |
Jun-15-11 04:52 PM |
#5 |
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You know I tried that line too |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 05:02 PM |
#7 |
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did you point out the difference between a unilateral war for profit |
Eagle Mall |
Jun-15-11 05:09 PM |
#8 |
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You are arguing semantics..... |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 05:28 PM |
#17 |
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+100 |
Myrina |
Jun-16-11 08:41 AM |
#51 |
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War is never "Humanitarian" |
Dutchmaster |
Jun-16-11 12:09 PM |
#65 |
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profit |
trud |
Jun-16-11 12:35 PM |
#70 |
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Yes. |
obxhead |
Jun-16-11 03:38 PM |
#96 |
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Libya is pure profit == The GCC has $Trillion funds managed by west and Libya has Trillions in Oil |
Distant Observer |
Jun-15-11 05:13 PM |
#11 |
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Fantasy loves company |
Eagle Mall |
Jun-15-11 05:17 PM |
#13 |
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In Libya, Foreign Bankers See a Coming Bonanza |
EFerrari |
Jun-15-11 05:29 PM |
#19 |
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So then this truly is a... |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 05:31 PM |
#22 |
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The media campaign has been relentless. Look at this analysis |
EFerrari |
Jun-15-11 05:55 PM |
#23 |
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Wow!! Even I got suckered by that one. |
RufusTFirefly |
Jun-16-11 07:44 PM |
#102 |
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Is this your humanitarian alliance? |
Distant Observer |
Jun-15-11 06:06 PM |
#24 |
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you are the one living in lala land |
fascisthunter |
Jun-16-11 11:31 AM |
#56 |
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you got it |
lovuian |
Jun-16-11 02:59 PM |
#93 |
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Tomahawk missiles |
Dokkie |
Jun-16-11 11:53 AM |
#58 |
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And democrats don't seem to like wars unless a democrat is leading it |
WatsonT |
Jun-16-11 01:31 PM |
#83 |
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This what I said. |
ej510 |
Jun-16-11 01:54 PM |
#89 |
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Just like supporting one sports team over the other but with the added fun |
WatsonT |
Jun-16-11 01:58 PM |
#90 |
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Very damaging to our party and its principles.. |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 05:01 PM |
#6 |
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you really need to study the differences between what Bush did and what Obama is doing |
Eagle Mall |
Jun-15-11 05:13 PM |
#10 |
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This is the right way to pursue wars? |
Better Believe It |
Jun-15-11 05:26 PM |
#15 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Jun-15-11 05:29 PM |
#20 |
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It fits perfectly into their profiteering schemes |
EFerrari |
Jun-15-11 05:30 PM |
#21 |
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The use of force in your statement |
Abq_Sarah |
Jun-15-11 06:17 PM |
#28 |
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Well, even the hated bush went to congress for authorization for the horrible iraq war. |
krabigirl |
Jun-16-11 12:08 PM |
#64 |
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So, this is OK, if only France and Germany profit. |
backtomn |
Jun-16-11 12:46 PM |
#75 |
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Already we're finding out that our allies, those who voted to support the war |
WatsonT |
Jun-16-11 01:33 PM |
#84 |
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You really need to study the similarities. |
readmoreoften |
Jun-18-11 06:21 AM |
#112 |
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My Pre-emptive solution to those arguments |
Glyn Dwr |
Jun-16-11 10:25 AM |
#54 |
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Which of these people do not belong? |
erodriguez |
Jun-15-11 06:11 PM |
#25 |
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You pegged it... |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 06:12 PM |
#27 |
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The flying nun? |
Better Believe It |
Jun-15-11 06:34 PM |
#31 |
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The old woman who took millions in donations but let the sick suffer and die |
davepc |
Jun-16-11 02:35 AM |
#40 |
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Once they get entrenched in war, arrogance and stubbornness set in. |
NCarolinawoman |
Jun-15-11 06:11 PM |
#26 |
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Obama should give his Nobel Peace Prize |
humbled_opinion |
Jun-15-11 06:21 PM |
#29 |
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+1 |
emilyg |
Jun-16-11 01:31 AM |
#38 |
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+ |
swilton |
Jun-16-11 12:34 PM |
#68 |
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He should have tied it to the first bomb/missile to be fired at libya |
WatsonT |
Jun-16-11 01:33 PM |
#85 |
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Just what we need. Another 'decider'. nt |
Obamanaut |
Jun-15-11 06:22 PM |
#30 |
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The suit'll be bounced. |
Igel |
Jun-15-11 10:43 PM |
#34 |
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I hope it gets heard and the congress people in question get nailed for failing to uphold the... |
joshcryer |
Jun-16-11 01:34 AM |
#39 |
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knr n/t |
slipslidingaway |
Jun-15-11 10:46 PM |
#35 |
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We don't need no stinkin' badges! nt |
lutherj |
Jun-16-11 01:16 AM |
#37 |
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Pentagon estimates costing U.S. taxpayers $2 million a day |
Ichingcarpenter |
Jun-16-11 02:47 AM |
#41 |
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I am so sure that we are NOT on the ground there, after all, this IS an... |
webDude |
Jun-16-11 05:44 AM |
#42 |
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Congress didn't sue |
VeryConfused |
Jun-16-11 06:50 AM |
#43 |
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Yeah, something's fishy about the GOP jumping up and down... |
Cappadonna |
Jun-16-11 09:44 AM |
#53 |
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John Conyers? Dennis Kucinich? DINOS??? |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Jun-16-11 12:01 PM |
#60 |
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Yeah that must be it |
VeryConfused |
Jun-16-11 01:25 PM |
#81 |
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Welcome, Rep. Conyers! There's probably still a little room for you under the HopeMobile! |
RufusTFirefly |
Jun-16-11 06:30 PM |
#101 |
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You lie, Obama |
JJW |
Jun-16-11 07:43 AM |
#44 |
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How do you explain the 100+ other times Presidents |
VeryConfused |
Jun-16-11 08:04 AM |
#46 |
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American Presidents have been abusing their office for decades - |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Jun-16-11 12:06 PM |
#61 |
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2008: Hope and Change! |
WatsonT |
Jun-16-11 01:34 PM |
#86 |
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How low can he go |
Yon_Yonson |
Jun-16-11 08:01 AM |
#45 |
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The proper question is how low can his critics and attackers go |
VeryConfused |
Jun-16-11 08:05 AM |
#47 |
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I am very akin to warfare |
Yon_Yonson |
Jun-16-11 08:14 AM |
#48 |
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So the Korean war was covered by the War Powers Act. Thanks for the info. |
Better Believe It |
Jun-16-11 08:26 AM |
#49 |
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"The proper question is how low can his critics and attackers go..." |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Jun-16-11 12:11 PM |
#66 |
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So if the president does it, then it must be OK. |
liberation |
Jun-16-11 12:38 PM |
#71 |
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Dude, this person thinks the Kuch and Conyers are DINOS - |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Jun-16-11 01:48 PM |
#88 |
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War Powers Experts Say Lawsuit Filed Against the Obama Administration is Right on the Merits |
Better Believe It |
Jun-16-11 08:35 AM |
#50 |
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Obama's flouting the Constitution is giving the Teabaggers just what they want -- a Rogue President |
Distant Observer |
Jun-16-11 09:42 AM |
#52 |
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I believe some Presidents feel the power of their office puts them above the law. |
NorthCarolina |
Jun-16-11 11:08 AM |
#55 |
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President Obama learned well from his apparent mentor..... |
democrank |
Jun-16-11 11:41 AM |
#57 |
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The war in Libya is about imperialism. All about resources. If anyone believes |
ej510 |
Jun-16-11 11:58 AM |
#59 |
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You think this war has to do with the $5+ trillion dollars of oil |
hulka38 |
Jun-16-11 03:54 PM |
#97 |
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Good for congress. Finally, a bit of backbone. |
krabigirl |
Jun-16-11 12:07 PM |
#62 |
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The House |
sulphurdunn |
Jun-16-11 12:08 PM |
#63 |
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He can't be wrong |
avaistheone1 |
Jun-16-11 12:13 PM |
#67 |
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So that Nobel Peace Price was sarcastic I see... |
liberation |
Jun-16-11 12:35 PM |
#69 |
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! |
Bluebear |
Jun-18-11 05:48 AM |
#110 |
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Finally some real news |
swilton |
Jun-16-11 12:38 PM |
#72 |
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It is a shame that Obama has become a Neo-Con on the middle |
ej510 |
Jun-16-11 12:42 PM |
#73 |
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So, we can essentially go to war forever, as long as we can prop up some meatshield in front of us |
AtheistCrusader |
Jun-16-11 12:44 PM |
#74 |
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In this case, I hope Congress wins. |
LiberalAndProud |
Jun-16-11 12:46 PM |
#76 |
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The precedent was set when Obama let the Bush administration off the hook |
nonperson |
Jun-16-11 01:00 PM |
#77 |
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Commit the same crimes so he wouldn't be prosecuted for war crimes either. |
ej510 |
Jun-16-11 01:01 PM |
#78 |
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Laws are for peasants. Our warmonger overlords do not bow to law. nt |
ProgressIn2008 |
Jun-16-11 01:05 PM |
#79 |
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" "the war" " nt |
guruoo |
Jun-16-11 01:19 PM |
#80 |
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Then lets withdraw from NATO and the UN - wouldnt that please the Liberal Dems? |
pasto76 |
Jun-16-11 01:31 PM |
#82 |
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NATO is corrupt and engages in global imperialism |
ej510 |
Jun-16-11 01:34 PM |
#87 |
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Good point! NATO should be dissolved. I don't think we need fear an invasion of Europe by Russia |
Better Believe It |
Jun-16-11 04:45 PM |
#99 |
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"Congress" didn't sue. Ten members sued -- out of more than 500. n/t |
pnwmom |
Jun-16-11 02:18 PM |
#91 |
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K&R! Very Important. |
KoKo |
Jun-16-11 02:40 PM |
#92 |
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Actions on Libya: February 23 - June 15 |
ProSense |
Jun-16-11 03:17 PM |
#94 |
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According to far too many around DU these days, |
hulka38 |
Jun-16-11 04:02 PM |
#98 |
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Obama Asserts Sweeping Executive Powers in Libya War Powers Justification |
Better Believe It |
Jun-16-11 05:04 PM |
#100 |
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Another Kick...for BLINDING TRUTH! Thanks for the Post! |
KoKo |
Jun-16-11 08:16 PM |
#103 |
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Line up them tankers, boys... |
BadtotheboneBob |
Jun-17-11 05:30 PM |
#104 |
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It will be interesting to see if the courts agree or disagree with the administrations |
cstanleytech |
Jun-17-11 10:42 PM |
#105 |
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It'll probably be tossed out as Congress already hs the authority to deal with it. |
Kaleva |
Jun-17-11 10:45 PM |
#106 |
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If you mean via the power of the purse I am not going to get my hopes up since many |
cstanleytech |
Jun-17-11 11:34 PM |
#107 |
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That and the authority to impeach. |
Kaleva |
Jun-18-11 12:09 AM |
#108 |
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James Fallows: Obama Is Wrong About Congress and Libya |
pampango |
Jun-18-11 06:21 AM |
#111 |
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Interesting read, wonder if the majority of scotus will agree though |
cstanleytech |
Jun-18-11 06:48 AM |
#113 |
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Probably a good thing he wasn't caught "sexting" huh ..... n/t |
divvy |
Jun-18-11 04:28 AM |
#109 |