Reply #9: First, I think we need to make what we need

[Sinti]

I personally think the system itself is a failed/failing system, so we need to repair it, or get a new one. I'm not considering anything that involves primacy of the state as a viable alternative, I think we've seen that fails clearly.

We can produce, we've done it before. That part is not difficult - it's hard to do so when all productivity must greatly enrich a few with money that is meaningless to them at this point. It can be done, obviously, even cave men did it. Division of labor is a great advantage human beings have - lion prides would also die off without division of labor.

We can pay enough to enable people who work to participate fully in the economy if what they're creating has value. if not, then they should create something else. It's not hard, we used to do it. I knew mailmen and butchers, auto mechanics, etc., when I was a kid who made a good living wage, wife didn't work, 2 (used) cars, little vacation every summer, sent their kids to college, and retired without worry at 65 or younger. Of course, I was a child before Reagan took office - class of '84.

Maybe we need to start thinking outside the box. I was hoping for some input on the general idea. :)