Reply #69: Yes, it is cause and effect.

[Hobarticus]

They have the most restrictive gun control laws because of the historically high gun violence rates. It's not a matter of which came first, the chicken or the egg; The local authorities are reacting by restricting guns. They didn't restrict guns first, THEN the crime came along. That's flawed logic.

And yes, it is fair to mention suicides. If I'm comparing gun violence stats with you, and quote a stat of say, 250 gun deaths in my city, then add that 240 were by suicide, that certainly affects the actual crime rate in my city, does it not?