Reply #111: Important: Mineta's testimony about Cheney's order. It MUST have been

[Minstrel Boy]

stand down.

Read this, and tell me otherwise:

Mineta: There was a young man who had come in and said to the vice president, "The plane is 50 miles out.The plane is 30 miles out." And when it got down to, "The plane is 10 miles out," the young man also said to the vice president, "Do the orders still stand?"

And the vice president turned and whipped his neck around and said, "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" Well, at the time I didn't know what all that meant. And.

Hamilton: The flight you're referring to is the.

Mineta: The flight that came into the Pentagon.

http://www.9-11commission.gov/archive/hearing2/9-11Commission_Hearing_2003-05-23.htm

Note how Hamilton steers Mineta away from the topic. He doesn't even ask what the orders were.

What were the orders? The orders could not have been to shoot down, because Cheney did not have the conversation with Bush in which he recommended a shoot down until nearly 20 minutes after the Pentagon was struck. And Mineta's testimony describes events before the crash of Flight 77.

From the timeline:

After 9:56: After flying off in Air Force One, Bush talks to Vice President Cheney on the phone. Cheney recommends that Bush authorize the military to shoot down any plane under control of the hijackers. "I said, 'You bet'" Bush later recalls. "We had a little discussion, but not much."

The order to shoot down the planes came AFTER the Pentagon was struck.

Now, logically, just because we can rule out a shoot down order doesn't give us conclusive proof that "Do the orders still stand?" "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" must refer to a stand down, but it does make the exchange that much more suspicious. And what else, in the context, could be the explanation?

The meaning of "the orders" is understood between Cheney and the aide. The orders remain unnamed in front of Mineta. "The Orders" is clear enough for them to avoid confusion. And since confirmation was requested, it's likely they were outside Standard Operating Procedure.

The aide, who's been counting down the approach, is compelled to confirm the order with Cheney as the plane is almost upon the target, suggesting the order was extraordinary. Since nothing was done to impede the aircraft, Bush did not authorize shoot down until 20 minutes later, and Cheney said, heatedly, that the order stood, I'm inclined to think the order was to do nothing. This interpretation is, I think, supported by the aide's second guessing Cheney.

Here's an earlier thread in which this was discussed:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1103706