OBAMA AGREES WITH PANETTA, ENDORSES MEDICARE ‘ADJUSTMENTS’ OVER DEFENSE CUTS

[kpete]

Source: Think Progress

OBAMA AGREES WITH PANETTA, ENDORSES MEDICARE ‘ADJUSTMENTS’ OVER DEFENSE CUTS | In a letter on Friday, Rep. Barney Frank (D-MA) asked President Obama to repudiate Defense Secretary Leon Panetta’s insistence that in order to deal with the nation’s debt and deficit, additional revenue should come from tax increases and cuts to entitlement programs, such as Medicare, instead of the reducing military spending. TPM notes that Obama gave his answer in an speech today in which he backed Panetta. Obama said there isn’t much more to cut from defense and domestic spending that was part of the debt ceiling deal last week. “What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

Read more: http://thinkprogress.org/security/2011/08/08/291030/obama-panetta-medicare-cuts/

[meegbear]

1. What. The. Fuck.

[indepat]

33. Drip! Drip! Drip!

We've now progressed from evisceration to savage evisceration. Luckily, when the repugs regain the White House, maybe this nonsense will stop, eh?

[Blue_In_AK]

78. You know, I thought that very same thing.

I was thinking that if we had elected a Republican president in 2008, he wouldn't have even attempted these things because Bush did and got nowhere. One would hope that the Democrats in Congress would have fought back hard against a Republican president proposing these cuts.

Before anyone jumps all over me, I would never vote for any of the current crop of Republican candidates, but it is kind of interesting to speculate how things might have been different.

Right now, it is what it is, and we just have to figure out how we're going to deal with it.

[indepat]

99. No Republican president could imo, eviscerate the big three for the Senate would have filibustered

whereas with a president with a (d) by his name, we were treated with a debt-ceiling law which opens the doors wide open to slash away big-time. Certainly the repugs don't want taxes and the president agrees with the SOD that the MIC cannot bear any more cuts, else we'll compromise national security, i.e., lose a tad of our nearly unlimited ability to exert global hegemony. :patriot:

[robinlynne]

122. who the hell wants global hegemony?

[indepat]

215. The powers to be that assure the MIC budget will be sufficient to exert global

hegemony. i.e., with 5% of the population, borrow enough money to be able to spend as much as the other 95% who, in large part, at least in the western world, try to provide a decent quality of life for their populace. :patriot:

[Fantastic Anarchist]

253. A bigger national security threat ...

... is if entitlements are cut, and people have nothing to lose, then there could be havoc in the streets.

Not that I'm advocating such. :evilgrin:

[jwirr]

255. We are already losing the ability to exert global hegemony and it

is not lack of money that is the cause. It is lack of respect after starting 2 useless wars for whatever the reason, after we set up torture camps and most important after the kinds of governments we have propped up in the past. They are also rapidly losing respect for the kind of life we have over here. The fact that we do not have health care for all as other nations do, etc. No one ever respects the bully of the world - they just hate them behind their backs.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

252. I thought the same thing.

The only way any of the shit passed would have gotten through is by a Democratic president. No Republican would dare tread this far (Bush tried and lost big with his SS gig).

[GreenPartyVoter]

198. Or we'll just be used to it by then.

[defendandprotect]

202. While we prayed for peace, could we have imagined many prayed for perpetual war -- ????

[Name removed]

68. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Blue_In_AK]

82. Right there with you, my friend. :)

[Pedalpower]

201. Y'all are freaking out...

OK, what are these 'adjustments"? If these adjustments are means-testing, then that's a good adjustment. If the adjustments are a lifting of the cap on the tax, then that's a good adjustment. If we finally do something to limit the insane demands of doctors, who seem to think they're oppressed even though they're rich and only work 4 days a week, then that's yet another good thing. You guys seem to think that any change has to be a bad change. I'm a total pessimist, but I'm gonna wait until I see some facts before I lose my shit.

The budget compromise trigger dictates defense cuts. Hopefully, the trigger is pulled.

Yes, folks, I get it that you felt dumped on during the 8 years of Bush. I get it that you wanted a Shaft-like President who would prosecute the previous administration, would withdraw our armed forces, create economic equality, and would generally kick Conservatives in the teeth. Sorry, but that was never going to happen. We deserved a few kick-ass, no-compromise, liberal victories, but those weren't to be. If you think that assuming the worst about Obama is going to improve morale, then ready yourself for President Perry. Seriously.

President Pretty Puppet Perry.

All I've heard from the Left pundits is total doom and gloom, and the funny thing I've noticed is that we sound like the Right: no specifics and a lot of scarey talk about what 'might' and 'could' happen. We're supposed to be the ones who deal in fact. Yes, we're emotional about the lack of progress, but our emotion must not cloud our judgement. If we don't get it together and work our asses off for Obama and the democratic candidates in 2012, there will be no progressive legislation that makes its way to the President's desk. There will be even more corrupt Cons on the Supreme Court, and there will be absolutely nothing standing in their way.

Snap the fuck out of it and get to work.

[newspeak]

211. social security and medicare should never, ever be means tested

we all pay into it and we all are entitled to it. Some who make a considerable amount of money, don't even file for it; however, they have the right to file. Once you means test it, then the wealthy will no longer contributing. It will be considered welfare. I hope you don't want to go down that road. For once, social security is seen as welfare and not deserved, the repugs will go after it.

When you have esteemed economists at the very beginning stating that this administration needs a broad jobs creation program like FDR and they are dismissed, while repugs only goal is to get elected, to get the power back. They could give a damn about this country or the people in it, as long as they get back the power. They could care less about anyone suffering as long as it isn't them. What this budget plan does is decrease jobs with no job creation. Who is going to suffer? Not those on the hill-just about every damn american not on the hill!!!! Oh, and those war profiteering greedy corporations who scalp the taxpayer every time they submit the bill.

These whole fekkin wars from the start was to catapult the PNAC agenda for the global corporations. If they wanted to fight terrorism, they would have done strategic strikes, not destroying mass infrastructure and killing civilians. It's all for the corporations, mainly to plunder on our dime and with our lives. Until they bankrupt us.

[Pedalpower]

242. points...

If you want taxes to be progressive, then it's hard to argue against means testing Medicare and Social Security. I'm for both. Can't be much more progressive than that.

Republicans control all legislation, at the moment. forget about any grand jobs bill. Yes, we need it badly because it's the only way to create jobs in the US. Republicans have done a fantastic job of creating jobs, overseas.

Prior to the 'Cons taking over the House, they had the power to fillibuster anything beneficial in the Senate... still do, so forget about government doing anything substantial until they are neutralized.

Agreed that money controls everything. The system is designed to give wealth an unnatural and overwhelming 'voice'.

[HERVEPA]

223. Exactly what are you drinking or smoking?

[grahamhgreen]

231. Heres a specific. No cuts to social Programs. Cut the war dept budget. Re-tax the rich.

[animato]

236. +1

[RaleighNCDUer]

240. And you are in the wrong place. This forum is for Democrats and progressives.

When you address this forum saying "you felt" and "you wanted" you make it clear you are not one of US.

[Pedalpower]

244. Crush me with facts, then...

Dish out some FACTS as to why the compromise is such a disaster to (us)progressives.

Rush thinks it's a disaster, too.

[RaleighNCDUer]

260. Simple math. If you compromise between the right and the middle

you move to the right.

There's no way to spin that simple geometry.

Obama is taking us to the right.

[Cronus Protagonist]

241. *yawn*

Where were you when we were fighting the Bush bastards?

[jwirr]

257. There is one small problem - you want us to wait for the details in

the plans - well so far our dear president has not been willing to give us those facts until HE gets the deal done. If we do not speak out before he signs on the line we have no say. And from our viewpoint almost alway it is us who loose.

[PonyJon]

256. For a serious (viable) third party alternative check out

http://www.americanselect.org/about This is for real folks, it's your best chance to be heard.

[Pab Sungenis]

2. ..

[Laf.La.Dem.]

15. Close this park!!!!

Parks are a waste of tax money (signed Tea Party):nuke:

[Bluebear]

136. ....

[spooked911]

175. I see what you did there. :)

However, not sure this is even a cave. Obama hasn't exactly made it a secret that he wants to cut medicare and SS.

[Marcel]

210. Yeah.

I'm not buying this caving in myth anymore. :(

[daa]

3. Fuck them the war machine never stops never gets cut nt

[spooked911]

177. we need to make it stop for any kind of future

protest October 6, 2011

http://october2011.org/welcome

[RT Atlanta]

4. Seriously ?!?

What the fuck.

I'me done with O and his "leadership."

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Betty Karlson]

152. It's not leadership.

He's appointed himself the referee over a game where Team Rich has 20 times more men in the field than Team Middle Class To Poor, and 100 of the GOP-ers believe that destroying the goal posts makes for a good strategy. In order to be a "fair referee", he tries to see everyone's point of view.

[demwing]

168. If Obama is the referee, then the teams on court must be

The Washington Generals vs the Harlem Globetrotters.

We're the Generals.

[geardaddy]

209. If it weren't so sad and true, I'd laugh.

[dbt]

5. Where the FUCK is the guy I voted for?

This constant beeping sound is driving me nuts!

:grr:

[villager]

never made it past the inauguration. If indeed he made it that far.

n/t

[atreides1]

26. It was all a con

He knew what to say and how to say it...that man we all saw was playing a role, and he did it well. He should gotten the Oscar, not the Nobel!!!

[im1013]

150. +1,000,000,000!!!

:puke:

[SammyWinstonJack]

204. Simply doing what Edwards warned against.

Give Corporations, in this case the MIC, a seat at the table and they'll eat all the food.

But Edwards is smarmy, where Obama isn't, in this all out support of the corps and the ultra wealthy. :eyes:

[newspeak]

213. yeah, and Eisenhower warned us about the MIC

and look where we are today. Oh, and so did General Smedley Butler. Top of my hero list.:loveya:

[Jester Messiah]

220. Aye. He suckered us but good. [nt]

[in_cog_ni_to]

52. THIS IS the guy you voted for. Some people knew what he was BEFORE

the election. He BAMBOOZLED most of the country...most, not all.

[emilyg]

66. Not all - I wrote in

Clinton's name.

[kenfrequed]

205. err...

Her stated positions and policies were to the right of President Obama's. In what manner do you actually see her as being better? She was more conservative than her husband and more conservative than Obama. Please, if your going to suggest a candidate would have been better, than at least point to one of those that was actually to the LEFT of Obama. There actually were a few of them.

[swilton]

246. Clinton was an AIPAC product and to the right of Obama

But at least she was honest about who she was.

[Maven]

71. Exactly.

He was never the person a shocking number of Dems thought he was. And many saw this coming a mile away.

[MissDeeds]

111. Yes, some of us saw the writing on the wall

early on. Others saw what they wanted and hoped to see.

[theHandpuppet]

167. Yep.

And some of those who didn't recognize their great and wonderful wizard for that charlatan behind the curtain spent that election cycle viciously attacking those who did. I remember it well.

[chervilant]

176. Yep,

I was one of the viciously attacked, and I stopped visiting DU for a long time because of it.

[kath]

243. "that charlatan behind the curtain"

Yep - a good way of putting it.
We was had. :banghead:

[joshcryer]

149. You got the guy you voted for.

[newspeak]

214. we got the guy the corporate media

wanted. Those that actually would fight for the people are discarded quickly by repeating over and over again outright lies or making something small into a big issue. How did you think we got Little Boots? One would think that his military record, his sealed driving record, his alleged insider trading (his own company) and his drug use would be a problem. All he had to do is hire a PR firm, buy the pig farm before the election and act like a good old boy for the cameras. It helps if you got the corporate media on your side repeating over and over again what a great guy you are and everyone just wants to have a beer with you. Then there is Kerry, he's so stiff, he's too intelligent--and Dean, why he's a screamer, he might have mental problems. Even though the media toned down the cheering crowd.

Let's face it, unless we have a massive grassroots movement, the corporations will be choosing our candidates for their interests not ours.

[KoKo]

228. I had hoped Obama's FCC would be more agressive with the Media...but alas..

the Comcast deal with GE for MSNBC/NBC/CNBC and Universal showed that we would have less media diversity than more.

Any watchers of the Weather Channel will see what Comcast's buying of that did for that channel. Try to find weather anytime during the day? You get infomercials for camping equipment, chatty weather talk and endless "Severe Weather Segments" featuring all the great storms, hurricanes, floods of the past.

[MsPithy]

188. Well said!

"constant beeping," Great imagery.

[AllyCat]

206. Unfortunately, this is the guy we voted for, donated to, and knocked-and-dragged for

This was what he was in the primaries, and was my second to last choice of all the candidates. But this is who we got, we got behind him like the corporations wanted, and now we have him. We hoped. They did not. Now we have to fight.

[Blue Owl]

6. Boooooooo Hissssssss

Fuck that shit.

[Supersedeas]

182. oh.

[Autumn]

7. And that's that.

:wtf:

[ProSense]

8. Fortunately,

that's not what the President said:

<...>

Last week, we reached an agreement that will make historic cuts to defense and domestic spending. But there’s not much further we can cut in either of those categories. What we need to do now is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.

<...>

[MouseFitzgerald]

12. Thats exactly what ThinkProgress said

[ProSense]

20. And it doesn't say anything about preferring Medicare cuts to defense.

Think Progress:

"there isn’t much more to cut from defense and domestic spending"

“What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

Where does that say no more cuts to defense and cuts to Medicare?

The point of the statement was tax increase.

[Inuca]

32. Thank you

I listened to the statement. I paid attention. What I understood adn was verified by reading what you quoted above, is that there isn't much more to cut in ADDITION to the cuts already made (and possibly to be made in the future if the 12 do not reach an agreement) as part of the recent agreement.

I'll go now to the link in the OP and see what I find, but I think that this place and Kos, the only other place I spend some time on, are getting completely HYSTERICAL. Sorry, not nice, I know, but that's what I think, and I am very sorry this is the case...

[seeker4ever]

39. modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare

[Inuca]

54. Yes, he said that? so? n/t

[thereismore]

I have the same feeling. We need to collectively chill the hell out. nt

[PatSeg]

193. I agree, it is a bit hysterical

and I can't help but picture all the right-wing trolls coming here and laughing at some major "breakdown of the left" and "rebellion against Obama".

I am not happy with all that has transpired recently and I think it is important that people express their disagreements, but I think we need to express them reasonably and keep our expectations realistic once we do. I didn't buy into a lot of the political rhetoric back in 2008, understanding that is what it was, so I am inclined to be less disappointed than some. That's not to say I am not disappointed, but I guess its a matter of degrees. Maybe we should be putting some of this energy into electing more Democrats to congress and in state elections.

[former9thward]

98. "The point of the statement was tax increase."

Did Obama supply the bold type or did you? You apparently want to emphasis the first half while ignoring the second half.

[Hawkowl]

146. You really are WAY overpaid .nt.

[chervilant]

191. AND, relentless... n/t

.

[blank space]

153. He doesnt say tax increase

he says tax reform - which using your typical logic means taxes reduced even further on the rich and going up on the middle class and poor.

Further the entire point of his statement is to prevent any further cuts to the military, as I have been pointing out for several days now a cut to the military is a direct threat to the them and national security - Tanks in Washington. Wont happen.


The point he is trying to make, without a shred of doubt, is that it is time to cut medicare - f*&kng deal with the fact you have been desperately wrong all along and now it is there in cold hard red ink.

FFS - seriously, your refusal to accept reality is like some sort of mental disease.

[demwing]

170. He says "Tax Reform" because saying "Tax Increase" will be cut, and looped in a GOP commercial

what he REALLY says is "tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share"

I'm not a fan of the President anymore, but let's not pretend that he's only interested in pursuing the part of the quote that pisses us off

[Enrique]

18. yes it is

"But there’s not much further we can cut in either of those categories."

[roguevalley]

70. fuck modest cuts. there is a tax cut for zillionaires in place, unfunded.

he has NOTHING to say to ANYONE about ANYTHING because he allowed that and cut WIC. Modest cuts my ass. No cuts if he had been a dem. NONE. He wants to be the next Ronny Reagan. Another fatherless child hugging up to the universal daddy. That's a HUGE pug meme and he's bitten it hard. Fuck him.

[PufPuf23]

93. You always make the assumption that people POTUS Obama has hired --

in this case Secretary of Defense Panetta -- provide plausible deniability.

Isn't it odd that Leo Panetta can be head of CIA and then Secretary of Defense given his history?

Look at the wiki on Leon Panetta:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leon_Panetta

Santa Clara is a private Catholic University and his California public education ties are with the 2nd level system of California States Universities and Colleges that do not offer PhD Degrees and are teaching rather than research and teaching institutions and colleges eg they are not campuses of the University of California that are research Universities that offer PhDs etc etc etc

[Major Hogwash]

108. You weren't supposed to be listening to Obama!!! Knotty, knotty!!

You're just supposed to get your rage on after reading some crappy website's bs take on what Obama said.

You know, like filtered coffee, don't drink it straight out of the pot!

Ha ha ha ha!!!

[cui bono]

128. Think Progress is a crappy website??? Is that the new talking point to be spread on DU?

[Major Hogwash]

140. Where are all the watchdogs when a site like that spews garbage?

Who guards the guards?

[KoKo]

229. Center for American Progress guided Obama into his transition to the White House

and was a supporter of his. Think Progress is their blog which was highly supportive of Obama.

Obviously you don't know what the heck you are talking about..

[chervilant]

254. And then,

there's the presumption that anyone smart enough to use a computer has anything relevant to say...

(eg, I'll take Think Progress over an anonymous negative naybob pretty much every day of the week.)

[Angry Dragon]

124. Does medicare need modest adjustments??

[madrchsod]

192. yes it does....it needs to be free.

[cui bono]

130. So you agree that there's no more to be cut in defense spending? n/t

[PuraVidaDreamin]

164. It better only mean

Means Testing. For the obscenely rich.

[newspeak]

216. read above

you don't want it to be means tested. Once it is means tested, the wealthy won't want to pay and it will be considered welfare. You go down the slippery slope-it's one way for them to get rid of it.

In places like France, there is no means testing, everyone pays in for day care, medical and everyone receives it. That's why it works. You don't have one segment of society thinking they're putting money into helping the plebes without any benefit. They all benefit.

[no limit]

185. Oh ProSense. When reality bites you in the ass simply pretend reality doesn't exist

you quoted the exact same fucking thing the article in the OP did while claiming the article in the OP somehow misquoted what was said.

It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic at this point.

[Marcel]

217. +1000

Reminds me of a dog chasing its tail for some reason.

[chervilant]

221. How ironic...

Arguing about what Mr. Obama 'said' as a way to assert what YOU think he 'meant.'

Recently, Obama admiringly quoted St. Ronnie, during whose administration this nation's massive economic train wreck first occurred. Ronald Reagan spent more than EVERY other president before him COMBINED. Our country saw its first trade deficit EVER. Does anyone else remember how the intractable Ronnie Reagan irrevocably damaged unions when he fired the air traffic controllers, OR how he embraced Uncle Miltie's economic creed? And, the uber wealthy, who installed Reagan in office for their express purposes, grew ever MORE wealthy and powerful. So, WHAT is it that Mr. Obama admires about Mr. Reagan?!

How about this patronizing little sound bite from Obama during the Debt Ceiling Kabuki Theater:

Now, every family knows that a little credit card debt is manageable. But if we stay on the current path, our growing debt could cost us jobs and do serious damage to the economy.

Hmph! Mr. Obama needs to use the correct tense when discussing job losses and serious damage to our economy--especially NOW that the wrecked engine of our economy is FINALLY grinding to a halt. We are already witness to the relentless crumbling of this global economy, quite the logical outcome of decades of unfettered hedonism--topped with a dollop of disaster capitalism.

What say you about this, from our Patronizing, Paternalistic POTUS:

"We must eat our peas."

Really, Mr. President? How presumptuous to use peas (a most delicious vegetable) as an analogy for the austerity measures shit sandwich we're expected to swallow.

Actually, Mr. Obama pegged the meter on condescension when he asserted that "YOU progressives" view the glass as "half empty," rather than half full. (Cenk provided a great commentary on this stark glimpse of Obama's apparent disdain for progressives.) Like SO many other jobless, soon-to-be-homeless citizens in our beleaguered nation, I DON'T need Mr. Obama's condescension; I need a JOB!!!

Which brings me to this final observation:

Obama's appointment of Arne Duncan as SecEd, ALONE, put a huge question mark in my mind about Obama's integrity. His condescending comments about the brave teachers fighting his destructive education policies--dismissing them as being 'resistant to change'--tore a BIG hole in his 'sheep's clothing.' How many teachers (firefighters, union workers) support him now?

Mr. Obama (and his sycophants) can ignore our anger, or he can hear our concerns. Dismissing us as whiners, malcontents, or pathetically misinformed is both disingenuous and disrespectful, and it will NOT help us save this nation.

[Laf.La.Dem.]

9. WOW

A compromise before the negotiations begin!!!!:wow:

[cui bono]

129. Gee... that's never happened before.

:sarcasm:

[Bluebear]

141. :)

[tpsbmam]

173. Correction:

A capitulation before negotiations begin!!!

:wtf:

[MouseFitzgerald]

10. Cant wait to see what the spin on this is

"Obama said there isn’t much more to cut from defense and domestic spending that was part of the debt ceiling deal last week."

Insanity. This loser has to go.

[we can do it]

65. PRIMARY

[midnight]

11. I wonder why Defense that has been sucking this country dry of our children and our treasury should

not be told to eat peas?

[L0oniX]

49. Defense? Nope ...it's offense.

[socialshockwave]

13. The President at the meeting:

[polichick]

27. That's painful but accurate. :(

[leftstreet]

58. ouch

LOL

[The_Casual_Observer]

14. Perhaps they are planning to use the military to protect themselves

from the middle class.

[FiveGoodMen]

19. All joking aside, perhaps they are.

[CoffeeCat]

25. They don't need the military...

They've got the lovely Patriot Act.

Want to protest against your government? Well guess what, you can easily be
defined as an "enemy combatant" and detained indefinitely without just cause
or an attorney. You can also be tortured.

Why fire a gun or drop a daisy cutter on a protest. Just use the laws of the
land to make it all go away.

[The_Casual_Observer]

29. Things didn't get subdued in LA in 92 until the military was brought in.

It went on for days, the cops were helpless.

[vi5]

16. Damn obstructionist Republicans...

Making Obama say things like that.

[EFerrari]

43. Damn tea party speech writers!

[vi5]

60. DAAAAMN THEM!!!

THEY'VE TAKEN OBAMA'S SPEECHWRITERS HOSTAGE!!! JUST LIKE THEY DID WITH THE ECONOMY!!!

KAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHNNNNN!!!!

[gratuitous]

17. Obama said there isn't much "more" to cut from defense . . .

Uh, what have we cut from defense so far? I realize I'm being impertinent and totally unsensible even for thinking of this question, but it sort of begs to be asked.

[FiveGoodMen]

21. He's so busy, he's probably forgotten about the wars that he's continued/started

[Recursion]

23. A little more than a trillion over the next decade

Like all discretionary future "cuts" a future Congress has to actually do it, of course, but saying we're going to cut discretionary spending in the future is all we can actually do about it now.

[Inuca]

56. In addition to the cuts

already part of the deal and I would guess the ones that may be enacted if the 12 do not reach and agreement.

[madrchsod]

195. we could cut the budget in half and...

still pay more than the rest of the world combined.

we are a hired police state for the world`s corporations.

[GreenPartyVoter]

199. Ummm, howzabout those 3 wars? If I was prez, I would cut those for sure!

[BeyondGeography]

22. More to it than meets the eye, IMO

Defense is the last form of acceptable pork. Turning soldiers and defense contractor employees loose into this economy isn't desirable. Until I see what the "adjustments" are, I'm holding fire.

[MannyGoldstein]

24. "Make no mistake: time for old folks to eat their peas and

catfood."

[Fuddnik]

31. I like peas.

But, could I have mashed potatoes instead of catfood?

[Autumn]

34. Sorry, no substitutions.

You get what you get.

[bullwinkle428]

51. More complaints? NO PEAS FOR YOU!!!

[Autumn]

61. Peas Nazi !!!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[roguevalley]

72. BWAHAHA! You are so adorable. :-D

[fascisthunter]

28. he is destroying our Commons... what a catastrophe he has been

money goes to the death machine, but saving lives here at home? Nope...

[mzmolly]

30. Defense cuts are a part of the no deal commission,

remember?

[timtom]

35. No surprise there...(n/t)

[timtom]

36. Self-delete

[City Lights]

37. ARGH!

:thumbsdown:

[a simple pattern]

38. Chill the fuck out, everybody!

He's got this!

[seeker4ever]

41. LOL! Yer Killin' Me!

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[roguevalley]

73. I think he was joking, sweetie. I hope.

[a simple pattern]

95. Oh sorry

Damn you Poe's Law!

[gratuitous]

46. And based on the record of accomplishment so far . . .

We should all wait patiently for the details of the deal to come out, then be smilingly told that it's too late to do anything, this was the best deal that could have been worked out, and really the time for constructive input was . . . ooh, yesterday. So close, but the deal's been done. Better luck next time.

[a simple pattern]

69. Too true.

And then it gets added to "the list."

[Vanje]

133. The list!

[liberation]

101. Don't forget, the "deal" will be added to the "list" of accomplishments

which will be used by the sycophants to let us know how much he has done in order to squash any sort of debate when the next "deal" comes up.

Talk about double dipping...

[Horse with no Name]

126. That's not double dipping...that is sloppy seconds. n/t

[amborin]

40. kr

[Inuca]

44. CORRECT YOUR OP, PLEASE

And yes, I am SHOUTING!! Below is the exact quote from Think Progress http://thinkprogress.org/security/2011/08/08/291030/obama-panetta-medicare-cuts/

Obama said there isn’t much more to cut

BEYOND

the defense and domestic spending reductions that were part of the debt ceiling deal last week

Not FROM, BEYOND. Big difference. I don't know if you edited the text ot Think Progress edited their page, but that's how it reads now, and that's what the President said.

[vi5]

62. I'm not sure how that makes it better....

What he's saying is that what was cut last from last weeks deal is it. That's it. That whole deal cut every bit of waste from defense spending? Nothing more to see there?

Even with that clarification the message is the same. Beyond what was past last week, we're done. That is it.

So how is that better?

[SidDithers]

64. +1...

accuracy is important. Thanks for providing the actual quote.

Sid

[Obamanaut]

47. Whoever would have thought of "BOHICA" being part of "Hope and Change.

Bend Over Here It Comes Again.

[Donnachaidh]

97. so the only dinner we get before BOHICA is peas and catfood?

Oh joy oh bliss :sarcasm:

[Obamanaut]

106. And it will be the cheap peas and cat food, not the 'top of the line' nt

[cui bono]

132. And don't even think of asking for a cigarette afterwards. n/t

[chervilant]

179. OR, a kiss before... n/t

[SidDithers]

48. And the perpetual outrage machine keeps on turning...nt

Sid

[Rex]

86. So does that broken record.

Just says the same thing over and over and over... :eyes:

[no limit]

187. Says the guy that doesn't know where he stands on Medicare/Social Security cuts

until Obama tells him where to stand on the issue.

[Dappleganger]

50. What kind of FU chess is this?

Explain it, cheerleaders. This statement is NOT upholding longstanding democratic platform policies.

[DFab420]

53. I"M MISQUOTING BUT IT'S IN CAPS SO IT MUST BE TRUE!!

“What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

“What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

“What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

“What we need to do now,” Obama said, “is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.”

[Major Hogwash]

109. OMG!! THAT IS SO TRUE!!! GET YOUR RAGE ON!!!! FEED THE ANGER!!! FEEL THE RAGE!!!

as it pulsates out of every pore of your being, and then sweating like a hog, look up and say, "all better now".

LoL

[me b zola]

116. 'Scuse me, but i had a belly full of "the big 3 are off the table"

from his loyalists just a few weeks ago. Now its ok with you that Obama has said it out loud? Where are all the retractions and apologies from his loyalists? Can you stop kissing his ass long enough to see what is going on?

[Major Hogwash]

123. What is it about his black ass that you don't like?

Since you seem to be the one upset about anyone kissing it.

[me b zola]

135. Wow Major

That was an interesting response from you.

But tell me, how does it set with you, Obama saying that he supports Medicare cuts in lew of the huge battles that we (DU) had here where there were a handful of people telling us that it was all jujitsu, that he would never let them be cut, that we (critics/people with open eyes) were hysterical? Remember all those plates of crow that kept being shoved in our faces as though we were wrong? Remember?

Remember? I do.

[Major Hogwash]

145. It isn't all that bad. We have to do something to fix that program.

The fact is, Obama didn't say that he supported hugh cuts in Medicare.
So let's not cast asparagus until he does something that is "asparagus worthy".

However, we have known since 2004 that Medicare is not a healthy program, finanically.
So it has to be adjusted somehow, because the funds for it dry up by 2017, or somewhere in that ballpark. Directing more money to it now would solve the financial problem in the short-term, but the real problem is the fast rising healthcare costs that is systemic, and leads to the root of the problem itself.

Frankly, I'd like to see Medicare be swallowed by up the national healthcare plan, if I had my druthers.
But, nobody ever asks me what my druthers are, so I just sit here and quietly munch on my crow samwish and hope that nobody gets too upset about all of it, that they go flying off of the handle.

Hell, I'd even like to see the VA program be swallowed up by the national healthcare plan, too, but nobody wants my opinionion.
I've had enough peas.

The truth is, I wonder why we have 3 different healthcare plans to begin with, 1 for the old folk with Medicare, 1 for the poor folk with Medicaid, and another 1 just for veterans.
Why don't we forget all that crap, and just join them all together under 1 big umbrella, the national healthcare plan.
That way we don't care if you're old, you get healthcare.
That way we don't care if you're poor, you get healthcare.
That way we don't care if you're a veteran, you get healthcare.
That way we don't care if you're too young to work, you get healthcare.
That way we don't care if you're rich enough to get your own doctor, you get healthcare.
Young or old, rich or poor, we shouldn't be looking at qualifiers like that to decide to give healthcare to people in the greatest country in the entire world!
Healthcare should be free for all citizens.

Medicare for everyone, regardless of their age, size, race, color, creed, sex, national origin, sexual orientation, transgenderification, political party, or even if they are born a Siamese twin, still connected to their twin -- healthcare for everyone, regardless.
No exceptions!

That's the platform I am going to run on next year.
If I decide to run for Congress, that is.

I'm tired of all of this half-assed crap that says some people get healthcare and others don't get any healthcare.
That's like "spin the wheel, mayby you'll get lucky, maybe you won't, take your chances on the wheel of chance".
That's bullshit, we're all Americans, and we all deserve to have healthcare.

If Obama cuts ANY benefits from Medicare, I will definitely run for Congress next year to see that they are restored fully to the level that they were at in 2009 when he took office!
I will not accept any President cutting benefits to Medicare in my lifetime, especially if he calls himself a Democrat.

I have worked for many years with elderly people, I have lived with elderly people for many years, and they have my utmost respect to the furthest reaches of my personality.
They deserve to have their healthcare benefits provided under Medicare to be left fully intact from year to year, and it our responsibilty to ensure that is the case.
The elderly in this country saved this country by hard work, blood, sweat, and tears and I will not sit idly by and watch their healthcare rights be lessened by President Obama or any other President, the Tea Party faction of the GOP, or any other group that Grover Norquist may think he has mind control over.

[OhioChick]

55. WTF?

:wtf:

[Downwinder]

57. Demonize Seniors. This economic situation is all their fault.

Their Social Security and Medicare is busting the budget. :sarcasm:

[roguevalley]

74. I know. Please believe me, youngin's, I'm dying as fast as I can. :-D

[Downwinder]

96. I tell them that if they really want to save money, send me a euthanasia pill.

I get referred to the Suicide hot line.

[roguevalley]

120. I told the white house that if anything happens to take my house

away I will take pills and burn myself inside it.

:)

[Chimichurri]

59. He's playing chess...

against the middle class.

[JI7]

63. "TAX REFORM THAT WILL ASK THOSE WHO CAN AFFORD IT TO PAY THEIR FAIR SHARE"

WONDER WHY THAT WAS LEFT OUT

[Chimichurri]

67. Those Bush tax cuts should have expired a long time ago. The fact he mentions that now is an

insult and nothing to be proud of.

[roguevalley]

75. don't 'ask'. Make. How can he be president of the same party as

harry truman?!?!?!

[roguevalley]

76. make, don't 'ask' how can he -be the president of the same party

as harry truman and FDR?!?!?!

[frylock]

104. how about FORCING those who can afford it to pay their fair share..

asking pretty please isn't going to cut it any longer.

[Shandris]

110. As the cave-defenders like to point out...

...he won't be able to get everything he wants, so he'll need to compromise. Those will disappear in the compromise (cave).

[laruemtt]

77. I could not be more done with him. n/t

[Enthusiast]

79. ...

[Vinca]

80. Why is this guy fucking us over????? Why?????????

[Lorien]

239. Do you really need to ask?

He works for the Money.

[Rosco T.]

81. Of course 'Adjustments' could mean...

.. raising the cap, re-negoiation the Part-D deal...


nice you wait to know some facts.

[Rex]

89. And they could mean 'cuts' when they say adjustments

right? That is possible...but yeah why not wait and see, unlike so many others.

[polmaven]

94. We don't need

no fu***in FACTS!!! It is just WAY too hard to get the proper amount of outrage if we gotta deal with FACTS! Waddya think, anyway?

[eilen]

165. He is historically famous for being fuzzy on details

and speaking in broad code.

[eridani]

119. True, but if he meant that, why didn't he say it? n/t

[Bluebear]

127. Lol

[cui bono]

134. Every time we're told to wait and see the facts are fucked. And so are we. n/t

[CleanGreenFuture]

83. I refer you to a very recent Vinnie from Indy thread on this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1671452&mesg_id=1671452

And my response...

hhttp://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1671452&mesg_id=1671888

[countingbluecars]

84. I listened to the president's comments

today. That is not what he said.

[Rosco T.]

88. Of course that's not what he said... pesky facts. n/m

[Name removed]

103. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[spooked911]

180. are you saying he was misquoted or that they emphasized something different from what

Obama emphasized?

[Bonhomme Richard]

85. To be fair.....

Naw! I'm done trying to be fair.

[marlakay]

87. medicare already doesn't pay enough for people

I guess they just want old people to die faster.

[Capn Sunshine]

90. and he's doing this all by himself

because he's so confident in your support.

Also, we don't need to eliminate any waste or fraud in Medicare , do we.

[Rex]

91. Tax reform that 'asks' the wealthy to pay their fair share? ASKS!?

Are you fucking KIDDING ME!? What a load of corporate garbage. Yes you ASK the wealthy if it would be okay to take a few pennies away from them (and of course when they say NO you beg forgiveness) and you DEMAND the poor accept cuts (why not, they have no way to stop you legally). Just once I wish Corporate Suit would step outside into the sunshine and act like a DFH. He needs it BAD.

[Buns_of_Fire]

196. But Please Please Please Please Pretty Please With Whipped Cream And A Cherry On Top?

No. And don't bother us again.
Okay. Please don't hurt me.

The tone doesn't have to be belligerent -- just matter-of-fact would do fine. Just as matter-as-factly as their asses would be thrown in jail if they violate the tax laws. Think Bernie Madoff and snap out of it! Dammit, you were elected by a majority of the American People! You're El Presidente. The Big Cheese. The Head Dude. Numero Uno. Act like it!

[Rex]

234. You know...that is what pisses me off the most about Obama.

He is the Head Cheese, but he acts like headcheese. I KNOW he could be El Pesidente, I see that fire in his belly. And like you said, think Bernie Big! It can be done! Obama is a first for a lot of things...it would be GREAT is he was the first to put a record number white collar criminals behind bars. Maybe even write policy to (gasp) make it a capital offense to steal money from The People?

YES YOU CAN OBAMA! YES YOU CAN!

[Name removed]

92. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[roamer65]

100. We need another Gene McCarthy.

[uponit7771]

102. *******ANOTHER HALF TRUTH OBAMA BASHING POST************

that's not what the President said:

<...>

Last week, we reached an agreement that will make historic cuts to defense and domestic spending. But there’s not much further we can cut in either of those categories. What we need to do now is combine those spending cuts with two additional steps: tax reform that will ask those who can afford it to pay their fair share and modest adjustments to health care programs like Medicare.

<...>

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/08/08/remarks-president

[GoCubsGo]

105. If "adjustments" means jettisoning Medicare Part D, I'm all for it.

What a steaming pile of crap that monstrosity is. Get rid of it, and let seniors negotiate drug prices. It would save billions of dollars.

[Obamanaut]

107. . nt

[Paper Roses]

112. I am on SS and Medicare. PAID FOR!! Would I be Be better off

in the Army? Hey, all you military big whigs, want an old lady on your staff? Only 69 but still plenty of spunk. Just don't pay attention to my bad back. bunions, hammer toe, Morton's Neuroma and a few other things that go wrong in old age.

Shoot, I bet my "entitlements" have paid for your wars.
Oh yea, never mind, I forgot, my vision is not 20/20.

You know what, Mr Panetta and Mr President? I have adjusted about as much as I can without living on the streets in order to protect your precious wars.

My next move will be as part of a march. Will you pay attention then?
We want out of the all the wars, we want to protect our own. To the devil with the military, you guys have messed up the country. We need it back. To heck with the fact that you two agree.

[crunchie]

162. I'm a spunky old 69 y/o too, I'll go with you and

and we can kick some butt! Ya better watch out when you see a bunch of estrogen starved old ladies coming at you. A formidable bunch we are, especially cause were spitting mad!

[Number23]

113. I'm really not sure what's going on with your OPs today

You used to not do stuff like this.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

114. "...there isn’t much more to cut from defense.." Really? Really??

http://costofwar.com/en/




http://www.warresisters.org/pages/piechart.htm

[me b zola]

115. Didn't the loyalists here all say that the big 3 were off the table

...that their "compromise" took the big 3 off the table? Weren't we lectured and spoken down to incessantly about how we were just making things up? Plates of crow, remember that shit? :grr: :nuke: :grr: :argh:

[Bluebear]

117. Chill the fuck out, he's got this motherfucker!

[TK421]

138. He's a lot smarter than you or I...in fact, he makes us all look fucking retarded n/t

[Bluebear]

139. .

[TK421]

144. you or me, then

I'm not sure what you meant by your question, but I was thinking of Rahms famous statement and attached that to Obama being smarter than us

[Bluebear]

148. Never mind, it must have been the Chupacabra

:toast:

[Javaman]

172. Thank you, Rahm.

:eyes:

[TK421]

219. You're fucking welcome!

[Javaman]

225. ...

:spray:

[Little Star]

118. We stand no chance if we don't primary his ass!!!

[and-justice-for-all]

121. End the fucking occupations and cut the pentagons budget!!! nt

[Angry Dragon]

125. Extending the 2% payroll tax break is a stupid idea

The money is replaced by dipping into the general fund .........
How does that save people money??

[midnight armadillo]

131. "Obama said there isn’t much more to cut from defense"

What. The. Fuck. Almost $1 trillion annually with rampant corruption and incompetence in defense acquisitions and program management and no cuts can be found?
http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2011/03/gao_report_waste.html
The bulk of spending in areas GAO identifies as overlapping falls in defense programs. CAP has suggested several ways the United States can save money on defense spending. We spend close to $250 billion annually on Department of Defense programs that GAO believes could be streamlined.

[spooked911]

178. Indeed, he's just another fucked up warmonger

really really depressing

[swilton]

245. Add chickenhawk to that - he never served and has no clue

[Babel_17]

137. Even TPM recoils from Obama's statement

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/obama-sides-with-panetta-on-need-to-cut-medicare-over-defense.php

[chill_wind]

151. They're looking at it. That's for sure.

Obama also vowed to send the Super Committee his own deficit reduction recommendations. But Republicans are already locking themselves into against any plan that increases tax revenues. If they remain locked in, the question is whether Obama and Democrats would be willing to pull the trigger on the penalty or whether they'll cave to GOP demands again.

What he said Monday suggests he doesn't think the penalty is a viable option.

[Citizen Worker]

142. The cost of empire is infinite, resources are finite.

[Oilwellian]

143. There were cuts to Medicare in the HCR Bill

Wasn't it something like $500 billion over 10 years? Odd how he can find MORE to cut with Medicare but not the bloated Pentagon.

My prediction: You won't be eligible for Medicare til you're 67, hence the majority won't retire and collect SS til that age as well. Voila! SS AND Medicare cuts in one grand swoop.

[Name removed]

147. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[obxhead]

154. That's RIGHT!!!

The 50K troops and the bases we have in Germany alone can not be cut in any way!!11!!! The EVIL red COMMIES are "coming right for us!"

[think]

155. We need real DEMOCRATS not fake ones! SOMEONE please primary this guy! nt

[Kablooie]

156. Damned republican... What? He's not? But...but...geez.

[woo me with science]

169. Third Way Democrat. - Their economic and war goals

are essentially the same as those of the Republicans.

[Lorien]

237. Third way "Democrat"= a repug who knows that he won't win by running as a

repug.

[Dragonfli]

263. Third way "Democrat" = false flag enemy operative

[Lorien]

238. Dupe. nt

[on point]

157. The public wants MASSIVE cuts to Military - 400 Billion / yr at least

Which is of course 4 trillion over 10 yrs!

That would still leave the military with more budget than the REST OF THE WORLD COMBINED!!

OR

If you want that size military to support the empire, then I suggest you raise taxes on the wealthy to 90% to pay for it, since they are the people who benefit the most from it!

You wage imperialism with the budget you have, not the budget you want - to paraphrase some inane former military fool

[pokerfan]

158. Can't cut the military

No siree, Bob... errr.. Barack. :sarcasm:



http://www.economist.com/blogs/dailychart/2011/06/military-spending

[Jim_Shorts]

181. We should put that chart right next to the debt clock

Our government is all about taking our tax dollars and giving it to their corporate buddies, not making the lives of our citizens better. Do any of us really want to spend this much on defense?

another look:

[crunchie]

159. More adjustments for Seniors!

George Carlin was spot on with his video "The American Dream" They want it all

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JChUO4TLjnY

[crunchie]

160. Hey Hillary, it takes more than a villiage, it takes

an EGYPT! :grr:

[divvy]

161. Will an 8-dimensional chess theorist chime in please ..... ANYONE?

I need a good laugh ....

[Marcel]

226. Sorry...

I only know about Quantum Checkers. :)

[woo me with science]

163. Of course he does.

He is not weak. He is not outmaneuvered.

He is a Third Way Democrat, and his economic goals are virtually the same as those of the Republicans.

[florida08]

212. and Clinton's

:thumbsup:

[hay rick]

166. Everybody who's surprised please raise their hands...

That's what I thought.

[blindpig]

171. The priorities are clear. n/t

[RedCloud]

174. Check Obama's back for a harness. The skitters have him.

[meow mix]

183. well he's a fierce advocate... of republican values

:banghead:

[elocs]

184. There is my line in the sand: mess with Medicare & give defense a break and I'm done.

That's it. I will support Democratic candidates from my state and locally, but that's it.

[Name removed]

186. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SaveAmerica]

189. Cut out the no bid contracts and their spending free-for-all!! How is Panetta connected to BushCo?

I don't recall at this moment but I bet there is some connection because most of Obama's attempts to compromise with the Republicans equals those R's in his administration keeping the money flowing to Bush, Cheney, etc.

[avebury]

190. Obama needs to be a one term President.

I would rather have a Republican President at this point if I could have a Democratic House & Senate to check the power of the President's Office. I am so done over Obama giveing away the farm. I wish we could have a no confidence vote on the Presidency like the Brits have on the Prime Minster.

[DollyM]

194. I am afraid I am with you on this one . . .

I never wanted to admit it, but I do think he needs to be a one term president. He has made a further mess of things and has not fullfilled his promises to the people who believed in him and voted for him. I wish we could get Hillary in there, somehow I don't think these things would have happened with her. She has twice the balls that Obama has . . .

[florida08]

197. I thought there was

a 350 billion defense spending cut in the debt ceiling deal?

The debt ceiling deal as best we can tell, calls for $350 billion in base budget defense cuts over 10 years as part of tranche 1 starting in FY 2013...

However, a Capitol Hill aide says the $350 billion in cuts over the next decade comes not just from the defense budget. It will be pulled from foreign operations, the Department of Homeland Security,, the Veterans Administration and the Pentagon.

The article says "in order to deal with the nation’s debt and deficit, additional revenue should come from tax increases and cuts to entitlement programs"

There are no tax revenues or cuts to our safety nets yet, so does this mean after this defense cuts are put into place?

Bolles/Simpson recommended 1.2 trillion in defense spending..and I know Obama is not going to do that so it seems like this is about after the initial deals of the debt ceiling agreement are put into play..

[AlbertCat]

200. 1/2

Obama always only goes 1/2 way. He only gets things 1/2 right and 1/2 done.

[florida08]

208. yeah

spouse calls him half :dem:

[AllyCat]

203. I hate to see what the wealthy entitlement class thinks a "modest" cut would be.

And that class includes most of the players mentioned in this article. Including President Obama. Because you know we NEED endless war.

[Freddie Stubbs]

207. I am shocked, shocked to find that President Obama and one of his appointees agree on an issue

[Riverman]

218. Unfortunately, war is THE jobs program! It is the Stimulus. Ending

the wars, cutting the war machine will increase unemployment as soldiers come (not just from wars, but from the hundreds of US military bases around the planet)to no jobs and defense contractors layoff workers. The US spends more on the military than ALL other nations on Earth, combined! The War Bubble is the one that when it does burst, and it will - this is unsustainable, the re-adjustment of the economy, the setting of budget priorities will be wrenching, maybe leaving the country in as bad or worse conditions than how the Civil War left the country in shambles. The hoousing bubble took almost forty years to finally burst. The War machine bubble has been expanding since WWII. As a nation it has kept the floor under an inherantly weak economic model, leaving us dependent on, and addicted to, it fearing its demise, not knowing how to get to or imagine an alernative model, one that is not labelled "socialism" or "communism."

A start is to take care of one's health, family, friends, neighborhoods, communities, etc.

[Pooka Fey]

222. Well SURPRISE surprise....

[davidwparker]

224. Wow. I voted for O in the primaries because 1) I didn't

thing Hillary could have won and 2) Hillary was too far to the right for me.

I can now see that #1 was probably a mistake, given the Dem turnout on election day and #2 was likewise incorrect. It looks like O is to the right Hillary.

[abelenkpe]

227. Was disappointed Pres said we couldn't afford more cuts to defense

and that we need to make cuts to entitlements. There are several articles floating around this morning talking about the gang of six and Simpson-Bowles as a starting point for the new Super Congress. Not exactly the progressive budget or even a remotely liberal position to start from. Simpson-Bowles had tax reform in there where taxes were lowered for top earners and corporations didn't it?

Anyway, I got a baaaaaad feeling about this.

[valerief]

230. Just think. If we didn't have electronic voting, we could have voted in a non-DLC Dem prez. nt

[a2liberal]

232. I wonder what roundabout explanation of how this is a good thing

talk show hosts and certain groups of people here are going to come up with this time (like with the debt ceiling "deal")

[dbonds]

233. This is what we have just been saying...

Maybe more will see how he rolls.

[EndElectoral]

235. Nothing he does lately surprises me anymore. He will not get my vote.

[ArcticFox]

247. The tax reform he speaks of will go by the wayside

By the time this idea gets anywhere, it will be 100% cuts to "entitlements." I understand the last minute edit to the speech was to remove ", corporations and wealthy Americans" from just after "those who can afford to pay their fair share."

To all those who still think Obama's a Democrat: Please wake up. Eisenhower was more of a Democrat.

[Initech]

248. There you have it. We officially live in the Matrix.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

249. Good-bye Mr. President!

[jwirr]

250. IF we were in a war for survival I, as one of the poor, might agree but

the wars we are in now are not even for any good reason let alone survival. So they are selling us down the river for these illegal wars?

[Fantastic Anarchist]

251. I'm getting sick of this bullshit.

Obama is NOT a progressive.

[orbitalman]

258. Obama is derailing. n/t

[w4rma]

259. 1 termer. Primary the SOB before he allows a Republican to replace him. (nt)

[mochajava666]

261. Guns over butter. Sounds very Republican.

[oldbitty]

262. The part of his statement that concerns me is

cuts to entitlement programs, "like Medicare." Which means to me that he doesn't necessarily expect cuts to Medicare, but possibly other programs that are just as vital to protect the welfare of kids, the disabled and seniors.