Alan Simpson making a whole lotta fucking sense on Larry O' tonight!

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

Going after Grover Norquist

Talking about getting rid of tax loopholes that keeps the wealthy wealthy and not paying any taxes at all!!

[Firebrand Gary]

1. Can we dig into Grover now, PLEASE???

[girl gone mad]

2. Alan Simpson is an idiot.

He's spent much of his life on a campaign to cut funding to social programs based on his deeply flawed understanding of economics. He doesn't deserve any amount of approval or acknowledgement from progressives.

It's a real shame that Obama gave him a platform to spew his bullshit by appointing him co-chair of the deficit commission.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

4. I don't know much about Simpson. All I know is what I saw tonight on Larry O'.

And, he went after Norquist and the batshit crazy Rethugs.

[girl gone mad]

5. He's still wrong.

Revenues are not really the problem right now. We can cut every tax loophole known to man and raise taxes on the rich, but we're still going to have high unemployment and a crappy economy.

I'm all for limiting the purchasing power of the wealthy, but it's not a means to an end with respect to economic recovery for the middle class. It could contribute to deflation, which is great for wealthy bondholders like Simpson.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

7. No he's not. He didn't even talk about revenues connected to jobs

He talked about a fairer tax code, closing loopholes.

Did you even listen to what he said?

[girl gone mad]

9. Did you read what I wrote?

Fixing the tax code, while it may be marginally beneficial, is largely a distraction from our real problems.

We need to get people back to work and reign in the financial sector. Fiddling with tax loopholes doesn't do either of those things.

Unless he is for eliminating income taxes for the working class and implementing a Tobin tax on speculators, his fixes won't be helpful

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

12. I disagree with you that Simpson is wrong. That's all. I'm not disputing what you're

saying here. I just think that his points were well made.

Do I agree with him as a Republican? Hell no!

Did he make some good points *tonight*? Yes, in my opinion, he did!

[CTyankee]

30. Tobin tax? Is this in reference to the late economist James Tobin?

[ClarkUSA]

16. Dick Cheney is a sociopathic liar & worse yet I've seen him praised for his stance on gay marriage.

Alan Simpson made a lot of sense tonight. He's obviously changed his tune from his days in the Senate. You're trashing him unfairly.

[girl gone mad]

17. What was "unfair" about my comments?

The man does not deserve a platform. He's ignorant and incompetent. He pushes a destructive agenda, based on bunk economics. If he gets his way on cuts to social programs, millions of people will suffer needlessly.

I despise wealthy men like Simpson (whose wealth is the product of government largesse, btw) imposing their paternalistic morality on the masses, particularly when they cloak their dogma in the language of "fiscal responsibility". He wants to buttress his reputation as a financial expert when in reality his agenda, if implemented, would do catastrophic damage to our nation's economic stability.

[ClarkUSA]

18. Your absolutism re: Simpson is what's unfair. He clearly schooled Norquist, which you are ignoring.

[girl gone mad]

23. The man is pushing a regressive agenda.

His fixation on reducing government deficits is either cruel or naive.

He can argue for increased taxation after we've reached full employment. Now is not the time to be shrinking our deficit. If he wants the government to close tax loopholes, he' should also promote an equal (at least) amount of tax cuts to make up for the money the private sector will be losing. Unless he thinks deflation is good, that is, in which case he should be honest about his true intentions.

[Tennessee Gal]

24. There is something to be said for reducing government

deficits as it pertains to restoring consumer confidence, which plays a role in boosting the economy. I think there is a connection and I like the way Simpson spoke about Norquist being wrong and the impact that closing loopholes and eliminating subsidies would have on deficit reduction. I saw the segment and he was right on target.

Retailers noticed that the month of July was a fairly good one right up until the last week and a half of the month when the public became more and more worried about the possibility of default. That is how debt reduction plays a role in consumer confidence. Everything is intertwined.

[girl gone mad]

25. There is no correlation between high deficits and weak consumer confidence..

or vice versa.

The government deficit represents a private sector surplus. If we reduce the government deficit in an era of debt deflation and private debt deleveraging, we'll get economic contraction.

I'm not sure where you are getting your data which show that sales in the first part of July were good. If true, you might also say consumers shut their wallets once they realized spending cuts were inevitable.

[Tennessee Gal]

27. There is a correlation between a government default and

consumer confidence. That means if the deficit is reduced there should not be a need to raise the debt ceiling and give the right wing lunatics another chance to cause a false crisis. That pertains to consumer confidence in the economy.

[Bluebear]

20. +

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

3. If Democrats could open their eyes and understand who the real enemy is,

I think we can get some traction on this.

I'm happy to see that there are some Democrats who are coming around.

[stevedeshazer]

6. Gimme a fucking break.

Alan Fucking Simpson? Really?

You must know that your hero wants to kill Medicare and Social Security?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

8. Did you listen to what he said, or are you just going to attack me?

There was nothing that he said that was wrong.

Grover Norquist is wrong. That's what he said. Do you disagree?

Closing loopholes is NOT akin to raising taxes as the Rethugs claim. He called them a liar! That's what he said. Do you disagree?

Is the tax code unfair? He says yes! Do you disagree?

These are the three issues that he discussed.

If you disagree with any of these points, then I understand.

But if you're just going to try and insult me without even knowing what he said, then you are dishonest and there's nothing more to discuss with you.

[stevedeshazer]

11. I didn't intend to attack you.

.

I simply disagree with you.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

14. Fine, but I find it weird that you would. Simpson's arguments were...

that Norquist is undermining this country with his pledges; he is putting his philosophy above what's best for this country. You disagree with this?

Simpson said that the tax code is unfair, favoring the wealthy over the little guy. You disagree with this?

Closing loopholes would mean that businesses would be forced to pay taxes, much moreso than many of them do. They wouldn't get away with having offshore accounts to avoid paying taxes. You disagree with this?

Just because he's Alan Simpson doesn't mean that what he spoke about tonight on Larry O' has no merit.

I may not agree with 99% of Simpson's economic and political philosophy, but when good points are made, I'm not going to dismiss them just because he is who he is.

[Rhiannon12866]

22. I listened to him, as well.

I actually thought what he said made a lot of sense, which was a surprise, but I'll take what I can get, these days. And Lawrence seemed to agree with him, too. :hi:

[Samantha]

31. Well I do agree that Simpson is as idiot and I have spent a lot of time

simply being appalled at some of his ideas. However, I did see the Lawrence O'Donnell show last evening, which several people commenting here must have missed. If you formed your opinion of Simpson simply as a result of this single exposure, you sure did feel like cheering him on. But this did not seem like the Simpson of Late, but merely some miraculous conversion of that Simpson to a new Simpson.

He did ridicule the power Norquist has over the Republicans, and he humiliated those who bow down to it. I haven't heard this from anyone, the abject total condemnation of a Norquist sycophant. He asked the question why representatives and Senators are afraid of Norquist. He can't kill you, he can't really harm you, the only thing he might be able to do is to have you defeated in an election, Simpson said. He further asserted that anyone serving today who would put his own political future before the overall welfare of the Country was a coward who should not be in public service anyway. Pretty strong words.

But beyond that, Simpson railed against the budget deficit legislation recently enacted saying it would do absolutely nothing to help the economy recover. In fact, he deplored the lack of new revenue that would have been a shot in the arm to our struggling recovery. This was his main theme, and he absolutely crushed the Republicans in his commentary.

So you are in a difficult position on this thread, because this is the perhaps the ONLY TIME in his professional service Simpson has agreed with the mainstream reaction to a political event, and in a stunning performance on The Last Word actually went farther and was more pithy in his condemnation than some of our Democratic heroes.

No reasonable person I know would have expected Simpson to sound so rational, well, beyond rational but totally in a state of condemnation in how this all unfolded. He was incensed.

Good luck in surviving your flame fest; perhaps you should posted some of the details of his words in order to buttress your assertion.

Sam

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

10. Nobody's making Simpson out to be a hero.

What he did say was that Grover Norquist was doing terrible harm to the country and that Republicans who are letting him control the debate on taxes are basically stupid and crazy. And I agree with that. I think it's possible to agree with what Simpson said regarding Norquist without actually liking him or agreeing with him in general. Which I don't.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

13. Exactly. On the issues that he spoke about *tonight* ONLY, there was nothing

that he said with regard to Norquist, the unfair tax code, the lies of the Republicans who assert that taxes would be raised...all these things, I think Simpson made good points.

And, none of us should disagree with those points. He essentially is calling Norquist unpatriotic.

[bullwinkle428]

15. I still have a problem with him stating that NO rates should be raised

in any income bracket. He wants to raise revenue exclusively by eliminating loopholes, which seems pretty shaky to me.

[WinkyDink]

19. Republican Simpson hates Social Security and Medicare. IDGA rat's a** if he knows the time of day,

otherwise.
http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/270259/alan-simpson-strikes-back-andrew-stiles
Then there is the AARP, an organization Simpson slams for rigidly opposing necessary changes to entitlements. “All they do is slap us around with a stick in their magazine,” he says. “If you can’t raise the retirement age to 68 by 2050 — for crying out loud — who are you? You must be a boob if you can’t figure out that life expectancy is 78.”..........

Simpson argues, Ryan set himself apart as a man among children on the field of fiscal seriousness. “If you’re going to attack the mastodon in the kitchen, that’s Medicare,” he says. “That’s exactly what he did, and they served him a rich ration of hell. In the years that go by, we’ll look back and see the only guy who had the guts to nail the mastodon was Paul Ryan.”.........
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/06/alan-simpson-aarp-social-security-retirement-program_n_858738.html

Financial and investment interests have long been supportive of Simpson’s broad critique of Social Security, since privatizing the old-age and disability support program would be a tremendous boon for Wall Street’s financial managers. ICI represents mutual funds and other money managers who control more than $13 trillion in assets.

Simpson’s forceful gesture came after an extended diatribe against Social Security, which he said is a "Ponzi" scheme, "not a retirement program.”

Simpson argued that Social Security was originally intended more as a welfare program.

"It was never intended as a retirement program."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

29. See post #28

[Firebrand Gary]

21. Simpson makes a POWERFUL POINT. Anyone who wields the power that Grover does.

The American people have a right to know everything about.

[RainDog]

26. Is this his way of making himself palatable for when he goes after grandma's social security?

...since he attacked Grover?

yeah, I'm that cynical.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

28. I can't speak for anyone else, but not for me. I'm not trying to defend

him on his SS and Medicare stance. I'm not conflating the two.