I just found out my 20x50 shed on my prop was a meth lab in 2000

[fed-up]

I was just informed yesterday by a neighbor that there was a meth lab in the very large (20'x50') tin shed on my property in 2000. Apparentley the chemical residue from cooking meth has a long shelf life and once it penetrates wood it is impossible to remove. Lord only knows what chemicals were dumped into the soil on my property. Yes, I cleaned, and swept out the cobwebs and dust when I first moved in and have filled the shed with hundreds of boxes of books and bookshelves. (I don't know if the residue will heat up in the summer and penatrate the books). Heck I don't even know if there is residue... We did throw out the carpet and furniture that had been in the shed. The shed is one of the corrugated tin sheds with a wood dividing wall and some wood reenforcement (1'x12's) along bottom 5 feet.

I bought my house without a realtor last Nov. and the seller DID NOT disclose the fact that his nephew or whatever relation he was, was busted by BINTF for manufactoring methamphetamine in the shed at the back of my lot in 2000.

The neighbors delayed telling me as they were afraid I was a relative of the seller and did not want to be sued for libel or slander.

I did find my address on the list of houses that were meth labs. Unfortunately when I had googled my address when I bought the house that website did not show up...Nor did it show up in a title search (apparently the law recently passed about meth labs and liens is not retroactive)

I spent 6 hours on the phone yesterday trying to get a copy of the police report to find out exactly what transpired (quantity-length of time that lab operated, type of meth manufactured). I called the sheriff, the police, the Butte Interagency Narcotics Task Force, and EPA. They don't want to help me.

Apparently police records are only available to the public for 7 days...which is when the local paper hand copies their info for the police report in the paper.

I spent 3 hours at the library last night searching through microfilm for a police report in the local paper about the arrest with no luck.

Public Health will try to pry info from BINTF about type of meth and quantity found. They may or may not release that info to me if BINTF decides to release it to Public Health. They said they can release it to a professional clean-up company (but not me) so they know what to test for. WTF????? I am the homeowner!!!!!

I am expecting a call back later today from Public Health.

I am hoping my county supervisor goes into her office today so she can help me collect basic info. Then I guess it will be time to find a lawyer.

My property is now almost valueless as once a house is "methlisted" it can never be removed from the 2stopmeth website sponsored by the sheriff's department. I can have it professionally cleaned and get a "certificate" from the county, but currentlly there are no standards for cleanliness.



I am on the verge of having a complete total breakdown as this is the last thing that I need to deal with...as I was starting the process of applying for disability...





edited to add some local stories that I found yesterday

http://www.newsreview.com/chico/Content?oid=43470

It's been said that no good deed goes unpunished. Timothe Keyser, a Chico resident whose home was placed on the county's permanent online list of meth lab sites, learned that lesson the hard way.

snip
Although there was no evidence that any meth was ever made on the property, (Keyser's ex stated in a deposition that he never used the lab kit while he was on the property because he couldn't find the right chemicals) BINTF forwarded Keyser's address to the Sheriff's Department, which compiles a list of properties where meth labs have been discovered in Butte County. The list, which is viewable at www.2stopmeth.org, is supposed to help neighbors and potential new occupants identify such labs, which can remain contaminated with hazardous chemicals for years.

Keyser said she supports the program and is anti-drug all the way, but she feels her property was unfairly placed on the list. Not only is she humiliated at the thought of her neighbors seeing her property branded a meth lab, she is worried that, should she ever try to sell the house, the listing could cost her thousands of dollars.

Unfortunately, said Butte County Sheriff's Office crime prevention officer Cheryl Kyle, there is no way to have a property removed from the list.

"We don't take them off the Web site," Kyle said. "The chemicals used to make meth are highly toxic, highly carcinogenic and even deadly. If she moves out and somebody else moves in, have a right to know there was dangerous material there."




and

http://abclocal.go.com/kfsn/story?section=local&id=3625011

Moving Nightmare for California Family
November 9, 2005 - It was supposed to be a good investment, but a house one California family bought turned out to be their worst nightmare.

snip

After moving into the house in 2002, Kent starting feeling ill and broke out into a rash, "The whole time I was having problems. I was at the doctor's twice. The first time, I had a rash from head to toe and the second time I was losing the skin on my hands and my arms. Both times, the doctor didn't know what was going on."

The joke was no longer a laughing matter when Cindy happened to run into a neighbor one afternoon. That's when the Needhams learned the house was a former meth lab and they were living in toxic waste.

..snip

The ingredients to the highly addictive drug had seeped into the walls and the carpeting — ingredients like pseudoephedrine, hydrochloric acid and household cleaning products.

In California, realtors are required to tell potential buyers if an illegal drugs were manufactured on the property.
The seller's realtor never told the Needham's what happened behind the doors before they moved in.

The Needham's immediately moved out and were eventually compensated for their losses. The previous owner was sentenced to jail time, but the Needhams were determined to prevent the same thing from happening anyone else.


...snip

[xultar]

1. Oh dear. Don't have a breakdown. Can you sue the realtor?

[fed-up]

9. there was no realtor-house was for sale by owner-neighbor says they told

owner that he would have to disclose that property had a meth lab on it to a realtor

Owner said he would send neigbor a letter from his lawyer. (I guess to try and shut them up) He never did.

When I bought the house the seller told me the neighbors were weird and that they found it best if they stayed away from them (hmm, ya think they were trying to keep me from talking to them???)

Neighbor does not want to sign an affadavit for me...

I will spend the day trying to dig up my escow papers, as I did have the seller fill out a disclosure form. Seller was executor of estate. Seller did not live in the house (his mother did), but he did live less than a mile away, and the person busted was a relative of his wife, so I am sure he cannot claim ignorance.

I am trying to find out full name of nephew, any court case number, any family that may have testifed at his trial (and therefore can't plead ignorace about the meth lab).

[LoZoccolo]

16. You should let a sex offender live at your house until the neighbor signs the affadavit.

Rent one of your rooms out and let the neighbors' property value go down until it's their best interest to help you out. Let them know you can play hardball too. You could look up the sex offender names in the registry and call them and offer them really cheap rent.

[fed-up]

20. sorry my niece was molested-that's not a funny or practical solution nt

[meldroc]

28. The OP did not have a realtor, but can sue the seller.

Seriously, the seller's required to disclose things like that, so you can take him to the cleaners in court.

[flyarm]

2. check with your state and see if they have disclosure laws when buying a house!

many states now have full disclosure laws..if the seeler does not disclose problems with the house..you can make them take thw house back..

fly

[snappyturtle]

3. Buying from the owner rather than through a realtor can

obviously, bring problems. I know when I sold real estate in MN, an owner selling his property did not have to disclose facts about the property that a realtor does. This may have happened in your case. I wouldn't be happy about this but you were not the owner when it was listed as a meth house. I am sorry this has happened to you.

[fed-up]

11. owner in CA is still obligated to disclose according to law passed 2005 nt

[snappyturtle]

26. Glad to hear that! nt

[scrinmaster]

4. Wear a respirator and gloves the next time you go in there.

You don't want to breathe any of that shit in, and it can be absorbed through your skin if you touch anything.

[wtmusic]

5. Hang tough

If the house really has lost value you've got a solid case against the seller. And although they're not cheap, you can always pay for a toxicology test. You may find out it's relatively clean.

I had a similar situation a few years back with a house that I bought and nondisclosure of a neighborhood nuisance. It's very easy to get panicky with the stress of buying a home to feel like you've made a huge mistake. I have a feeling things will sort themselves out if you're patient with this.

Good luck.

[fed-up]

13. stone broke, did find a kit online for $100 and may just borrow more to ease

my mind

The problem is that even though I may eventually get it cleaned up, the property will forever be on the list and will forever have diminsihed value.

[pitohui]

27. find an attorney/litigator NOW who will take the case on a contigency basis

you will always be broke if your most important asset is without resale value, considering that you have limited time to file a civil lawsuit against the seller who cheated you, you need to be talking to attorneys to get that case filed now

an attorney who thinks you have a good case for recovery against the seller will represent you for a fraction of the percentage (1/3 to 40 percent usually) and not ask for money upfront

start calling attorneys NOW

i wouldn't waste money on more home test kits, what's important is public documents showing the house on the list and the fact that the seller, as a relative (in law, was it?) of the meth producer knew about it, hell, he was probably taking a kickback for it, but that part can't be proved, the fact that the seller knew of the meth lab and the bust because it was 1) on his property, and 2) his in-law doing the meth cooking, that seems good enough to me to put in front of any jury with a logical brain

don't screw around, get an attorney working for you, self help is just wasting more time at this point, there is a limited time period under which you are allowed to file civil lawsuits

[fed-up]

30. I will get whatever paperwork I can today & start calling lawyers Mon-thanks for time clock info nt

[pitohui]

32. great, and good luck to you, i'm glad to hear you're on top of it

it varies so much in jurisdictions it's hard to say how long you have, i guess that's what keeps lawyers employed, for example i was involved in a civil lawsuit where i had only a year to file my claim

[wtmusic]

34. Whoa -- calm down

Two points:

1) CA statute of limitations for fraud is 3 years:

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/limitations_by_state/California.html

2) Real estate always has resale value, whether it was a meth lab or mass grave. If real estate prices continue like they have been here, and the contamination is not severe, the property in question will appreciate quickly. The meth lab issue could be a blip on the radar.

See below

DEAR BOB: Almost four years ago, we bought our home. The seller gave us a seller's disclosure, which didn't reveal anything we couldn't accept. But about two years ago, the roof began to leak into the master bedroom and living room. We made repairs. Then the situation got worse so we recently spent about $12,000 for a new roof. What is the statute of limitations for suing our seller for fraudulent failure to disclose the roof leaks? – Rolf R.

DEAR ROLF: The statute of limitations for fraud, in most states, is very interesting. It usually starts to run on the date the fraud (which means deceit) is discovered.

That means if you didn't discover fraudulent concealment of the roof leaks until two years after your home purchase, in most states that is the date the statute of limitations for fraud began to run. But if the roof just started to leak, and there was no fraud, that's called "wear and tear" so the seller has no liability. For full details, please consult a real estate attorney in your state.

http://www.rehablist.com/hard_money_loans.aspx?story_id=120&real_estate_investment_news

[snappyturtle]

6. Just another thought: Did you have the house inspected by

a licensed inspector? If so, you might have some recourse there.

[fed-up]

15. no, anyway I don't think chemical residue is listed as things to check for nt

[Warpy]

7. First, get the disability sorted out

Then find somebody who does air quality testing and have the place tested at the height of the summer, just to put your mind at rest. Get it in writing.

Then make sure the meth listing isn't just for your address, that it specifies the outbuilding. Raise hell to get that corrected.

If the air quality in the shed is poor, you can sue the sellers for non disclosure and the value of a huge outbuilding on the property. If you can't get the meth listing changed, you'll need to sue, period. With poor air quality, you'll need to tear down the shed.

My best guess is that all the volatile chemicals are long gone. They've had to have hazmat teams here in this town cleaning motel rooms used by meth cookers. They have managed to clean these rooms well enough to get them recertified for occupation.

Getting rid of the carpet and furnishings most likely removed the bulk of the residue if those things were in place while the meth was being cooked.

[pitohui]

24. NO, this poster must get a lawyer on this NOW, the clock is ticking

you have a limited time in which to file a civil lawsuit in most times and places in the usa -- sometimes as little as a year

too often bad guys walk because people are dealing w. multiple issues, especially health or another family crisis, the trouble is, if the poster waits to get the disability payments sorted out (a process that has taken several years in some cases i'm personally aware of) they will have lost the right to sue for being cheated on the sale of the home

and make no mistake, this is serious, to be cheated when purchasing what is likely to be your largest financial asset is serious, if the home turns out to have little or no resale value (i certainly wouldn't buy it and what good risk would if it stays on "da list" forever?) then the poster needs to be able to recover financial damages from the previous owner

the seller was a deliberate cheat and a fraud, too bad there are not criminal consequences for this behavior when a disabled or elder is targeted for this kind of fraud, i think such people are often deliberately targeted because the seller KNOWS that people w. serious health issues have significantly less time to deal w. other problems that can arise

it would be wonderful if shit happened only one at a time, but it happens all at once, and unfortunately we have to play the game as it is rather than how we wish it was

so i'm strongly urging this poster to IMMEDIATELY seek an attorney who can get the case filed and the litigation rolling, the financial consequences of waiting until life is calm and on an even keel could be disastrous and affect this person for the rest of a lifetime

for most people a home is the most important financial asset and they should not turn the other cheek when they are cheated

[Jim Warren]

8. So, get cookin'!

OK, bad joke, I'll go away now.

[guitar man]

10. damn

Is there any left?? :evilgrin:








Seriously though, I'd be on my realtor about that, there's some nasty shit goes into making that stuff.

[SoCalDem]

17. We had friend who got a real "deal" on a house.. had it inspected & everything.

Aftre they moved in they found out from neighbors that the house had been the site of a triple suicide-homicide (hence the new paint & carpet..:scared:

I know they hired a lawyer, but I lost track of them and never found out what the outcome was...

The child who was murdered was in the bedroom they had designated for their own daughter, and after they found out, they turned that room into an office & put the daughter in a different room .

[MrPrax]

12. It's Kafkaesque! I'm Speechless? K&R'ed n/t

[MLFerrell]

14. I wouldn't worry too much...

Despite the hype, the chemicals used in cooking methamphetamine (usually, depending on the specific synthesis) aren't all that toxic, especially after seven years. The property value concern is a different story, however...

[lumberjack_jeff]

18. Personally, I wouldn't worry too much.

The state of Wisconsin has a reasonably good page on the topic.
http://www.dhfs.state.wi.us/eh/ChemFS/fs/MethClnUp.htm#Chemicals

Once all the shed's contents had been disposed of and after 7 years, I wouldn't lose much sleep over it - especially if the shed has a concrete floor.

I'd be pissed with the seller though for forcing you to clean up the shed without informing you of its history.

FWIW, if I were a potential buyer of your property, once I knew for certain that your house was not used as the lab, and the well tests safe, the shed's history a decade or so ago wouldn't be a major consideration.

I would not plant a garden near the septic drainfield without testing the nearby soil though.

[On the Road]

19. You Might Ask an Appraiser What the Difference in Selling Price Would Be

I would imagine some buyers would care more than others.

One way to moderate the effects might be to haul the building away. That would put the issue in the past for a lot of people. It's extreme, but it's something to consider if the hit is too large.

[fed-up]

22. cost could run up to $50-100K for removal/storage my stuff-disposal of toxic building/soil

and testing by company

then add in loss of propety value

it ain't gonna be cheap no matter what I do

[Dogmudgeon]

21. As they say in that sci-fi story: Don't Panic!

Sounds like you may have grounds for a big ol' honkin' lawsuit. Lawyers, guns, and money. Repeat as necessary.

I'd advise you to talk to your local congressbeing, though Wally Herger is a Nazi. Still, it's a property-rights issue, and he might be bent to do your will.

When some petty bureaucrat stiff-arms you, don't take "no" for an answer. Politely and firmly work your way up the food chain, collecting names as you go. Keep chanting "property rights". You will prevail.

Good luck with the disability claim, too. I'm in that process too. It's a pain in the ass, but stick to it!

Best of luck!

--p!
Who once lived in scenic Chico, CA

[fed-up]

23. Keane (R) is the one that passed disclosure law-do I have strength for a lawsuit??? nt

[pitohui]

31. see an attorney, in fact, interview several attorneys

you must have attorneys in your area who are good litigators, start making appointments (it's free) and talk to these folks so you can quickly select someone who can file your case

do you have the strength? well, that's up to you, but consider this, will you have more strength if you are bitter and cheated for the rest of your life because of the loss of value of your home? will you have, in the end, more or less, financial resources available to use as you get older if you refuse to litigate and just eat a loss that could be well over $100,000?

it is right to hold people accountable for cheating disabled people or for cheating any home buyer if you ask me! you are doing the right thing if you sue this person, their action was dishonorable, it was theft, and it should not go unpunished although it's clear the person has escaped any criminal penalty for allowing a meth lab on their land, they shouldn't skate totally free of any financial consequence for their actions

i hope you can be strong, because you should receive financial compensation for your loss and this cheater should be financially punished for scamming you, it's only justice

[LostinVA]

33. I'm betting you do

Call your area's Legal Aid or the State's AG's office and tell them your situation.

[Dogmudgeon]

35. If you have a complaint, you have a start

Lawsuits must be fought strategically, but once you have a complaint, a real-world loss, then you have the ability to bring a suit.

If your property has been rendered less valuable, you have "damages". The actual suit itself should, of course, be drawn up and fought by an attorney. And you may not even have to take it that far. In the real world, there are lots of loopholes, and one could open up in YOUR behalf.

Here is a way to view it that could help you maintain you sanity: somebody hurt you, and when you discover all the details, you will extract just compensation. Perhaps your fight will result in bringing some speck of sanity to a small bailiwick in the drug war.

In other words, you now have the right to cry 'foul' and to kick ass.

Today it may be a toothless dog, but you can happily watch that puppy grow. The law may be a huge and absurd beast in its own way, but it doesn't take a lawyer to understand the most basic legal principle -- you got hurt and deserve to seek that things be put right.

All I can do is to give you encouragement, and I apologize if I have spoken incorrectly. But it's always a good policy to assume that you're not as bad off as you think.

(Now, if I could only convince myself of that!)

--p!

[donsu]

25. kick

nt

[zanne]

29. Maybe you can get a historical plaque? nt

[fed-up]

36. update-just found court report-the guy got 199 days for METH MANUFACTURING

reduced from a 5 year prison sentence and a few of the charges dismissed, and yes he was right back in in 2004 for a violation of probabtion, and won't even mention the petty theft charge right before the lab bust that also got dismissed

I am dealing with what may be hundreds of thousands of dollars in damages to what is now my property and this guy got off with a slap on the wrist......

11379.6(a) H&S MANUFACT. CONT. SUBSTANCE OTHER THAN PCP

Disposition:
CONVICTED ON PLEA OF NOLO
Sentence:
STATE PRISON, TFT 5 YRS; EXEC SUSP;
COMMITTED TO CRC; 199 DYS CTS

11377(a) H&S POSSESSION OF CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE

INF Felony 11377(a) H&S POSSESSION OF CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE
Plea: NG
Plea Date:
Disposition:
DISMISSED

148(a) PC RESIST, OBSTRUCT/DELAY PEACE OFFICER

COM Misdemeanor (A) 148(a) PC RESIST, OBSTRUCT/DELAY PEACE OFFICER
Plea: NG
Plea Date:
Disposition:
DISMISSED

[rasputin1952]

37. From what I see, there doesn't appear to be manufacturing

in that shed. Just how did the narc's come to the conclusion there was? They had to test, or catch him in the act, apparently, they didn't catch him in the act...so where are the test results, if they even did the testing?

You have to be persistent in this, and the more political people that are on your side the better. No information like that can be sonsidered "private" if they are going to publicly posts "results" on a specific website or in the media...x(

Seems to me, you have the right to look at any evidence against your property, after all, you now are in possession and are paying taxes on it.

Hang in there, don't piss 'em all off, and I would not worry too much unless you are allergic to some of the chemicals. I almost had to laught when I saw pseudephedrine in one of the above posts...as if it were some kind of "demon pill". Hell, you can't even get a 12 pack of sudafed here in Nebraska w/o all kinds of ID and signatures. Your screwed if you get a cold or the flu. But theyt seel the stuff OTC in SD, IA, MO, like it is real difficult to shuffle 10,000 little pills froma nother state. I don't think meth is good in any form, but I also think these "hard core cops" are going WAY OTT w/all of this.

[dailykoff]

38. LOL, don't let your new neighbors rattle you.

If you don't smell anything funny, there's nothing to worry about. There's probably more pseudoephedrine in your medicine chest than the walls or floor of this place and the other stuff is equally ordinary, if not harmless. It sounds about as "highly carcinogenic and even deadly" as housepaint.

So relax. This too shall pass and in a year or two that stupid website will be one more dead link.

:grouphug:

[MadHound]

39. First, I would take the books out of the shed if you want to keep them

Paper is pretty absorbent, and will take on any chemical residue in that shed. Second, I would contact a lawyer and bring a lawsuit against the seller for failing to fully disclose this piece of information. In fixing the damage amount, you will first have to hire a pro to come onto your property and look for where the waste was actually dumped and get an estimate for clean up costs. In addition, price a new shed, and the labor costs for tearing down the old one and putting up a new one. The there is going to be the other costs you are going to incur, include those, along with damages for your own mental and physical health. Last but not least include damages for the devaluation of the property

You should be able to get most, if not all of your purchase price back from the seller.

Frankly, if it were me, once I had the money from the lawsuit, I would sell the house and get the hell out.

[fed-up]

41. I found a lawyer and will go in Monday---thanks for all your tips-lots to think about nt

[Nick at Noon]

40. Let's hope you made a minimal down payment

That way you can let the bank have it and sue the former
owners for your equity.

[Lex]

42. The bank will only "have it" through foreclosure.

That may not be the best way to deal with it either.