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Everything the EPA Never Wanted You to Know About the Toxins in Coal Ash*

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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:36 AM
Original message
Everything the EPA Never Wanted You to Know About the Toxins in Coal Ash*
*And you hoped you would never have to ask.

Intro.

First things, first. The EPA knew . Even before the crappy earthen retaining wall spilled its toxic load of chemicals into a waterway in Tennessee, the federal government understood that so called “clean coal” was nothing but a conjurer’s trick. The process creates vast swamps of toxic chemicals that seep and pollute nearby farmland and water supplies with poisonous, carcinogenic chemicals.

The risk assessment examined 181 coal combustion waste disposal sites throughout the country and found that unlined coal ash waste ponds pose a cancer risk 900 times above what the government considers "acceptable." The report also found that coal ash disposal sites release toxic chemicals and metals such as arsenic, lead, boron, selenium, cadmium, thallium, and other pollutants at levels that endanger human health and the environment.


If the industry was required to use composite liner in their storage facilities, the risk of slow leeching and of sudden spills—like the one last week and the one in 2000 in Martin County—would be greatly reduced. But apparently the EPA exists only to service the utility industries, and so they get to store a bunch of wet sludge in dirt bunkers that leak and break.

http://www.hometownhazards.com/2007/09/epa-invites-comments-on-coal-ash-waste.html

I. Thallium Can Kill You

The Tennessee Valley Authority will not tell you that thallium is so toxic it is a poison of choice for villains in mysteries and that it was banned as a rat poison and insecticide years ago. Nor will they let you know that it is a major public relations nightmare. When companies have an environmental spill of the stuff , attorneys recommend starting the good neighbor advertising campaign even before you start the clean up.

http://books.google.com/books?id=VADqISBHttMC&pg=PA2879&lpg=PA2879&dq=thallium+spill&source=web&ots=45CFDwIiLq&sig=Iy8gIuj9FRs8rf6HqI_2PDzR7jY&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result#PPA2879,M1

However, the TVA will lie to you and say

(P)reliminary TVA tests suggest the millions of people who get their drinking water from the 652-mile Tennessee River shouldn't worry.

"We have no reason so far to know that is unsafe," he told a news conference, noting TVA is working closely with the Tennessee Department of Environmental and Conservation and the federal Environmental Protection Agency. The water intake for the town of Kingston is about six miles downstream of the power plant.

"It is possible it is going to have some metals in there," said Laura Niles, regional spokeswoman for the EPA in Atlanta.


http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2008/12/24/ap5858629.html

That’s the monetary risk management I was telling you about.

Now, here is everything you should know about thallium in light of this fact that came out a couple of days later.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20081227/GREEN02/812270345/1001/RSS6001

Elevated levels of lead and thallium have been found in test samples from river water taken near the ash slide at TVA's Kingston Fossil Plant in Harriman, Tenn., a TVA official said Friday evening.


The rest of the article is full of fun, feel good facts about how the thallium will not harm you. Ignore that part. Go back to the textbook. Note that thallium can be absorbed through the skin, inhaled through the lungs or it can be ingested (eaten)—or all three at once. Thallium in the water can dry and get into the air where the dust can coat things that are then touched. Or, you can breathe it. Some plants concentrate it, so you may be eating it later for supper. It will show up in fish later, too, assuming they ever come back.

Acute thallium poisoning is primarily characterized by gastrointestinal symptoms, while neurologic findings predominate with chronic exposure. The neurologic manifestations tend to progress, even despite decreasing blood thallium levels. Thallium toxicity is characterized by a painful ascending peripheral neuropathy and alopecia; this clinical manifestation presents 2-3 weeks after an acute poisoning.


In other words, you get the stomach flu at first. Later, you start to get numb, beginning with your legs, and your hair falls out, and you may have trouble breathing. Severe symptoms include seizures, coma and death. The effects are cumulative (they add up) and will continue even after the exposure stops.

Thallium is lethal to humans. The lethal dose for humans is 15-20 mg/kg (around 1 g for a 70-kg person). Nonfatal effects occur below this dose. However, it is conceivable that even smaller doses can still cause fatality (minimal reported dose was 8 mg/kg). In addition, some treated patients have survived exposure up to 28 mg/kg.


http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/821465-overview

One gram is not much. Makes you wish that the EPA would tell us exactly how high the thallium levels are in the coal ash and in the water around the spill site.

Here is a document put out by the WHO in 1996 about thallium.

http://www.inchem.org/documents/hsg/hsg/hsg102.htm

Pertinent points:

The thallium from coal plants is primarily soluble thallium chloride. It dissolves in water. That means that Terry Johnson of the TVA was either lying or making things up when he claimed that the thallium in the water would settle to the bottom of the river in this news report.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20081227/GREEN02/812270345/1001/RSS6001

Like potassium chloride, it will dissolve. Fun, fun. Don’t even look at that water until the EPA tells you what the thallium concentration is. “Elevated” just does not cut it in my book. “Elevated” can kill you.

Here is what farmers can expect according to the WHO document.

The fate of thallium added to soil (in deposited fly ash, for
example) depends largely on soil type. Retention will be greatest in
soils that contain large amounts of clay, organic matter and
iron/manganese oxides. Incorporation into stable complexes causes
enhanced thallium concentrations only in the upper levels of soils.
The uptake of thallium by vegetation increases as soil pH decreases.
In some strongly acid soils significant amounts of thallium can be
leached to local ground and surface water.


In most parts of the South, the soil is strongly acidic. River beds tend to have lots of organic matter. My guess is that there is the potential for thallium to settle in for a long stay unless it is cleaned up out of the water now.

Thallium can affect plants ability to grow by interfering with the nitrogen fixing process.

It is also toxic to aquatic plants and fish.

If anyone tells you that thallium does not cause cancer, that is because no one has studied to see if it causes cancer.

Urine tests are available to measure human exposure and may be the easiest way to monitor the health of people in the affected area who are at risk from multiple sources---air, water, skin.

II. So Can Lead

Most people are familiar with lead poisoning, so I will not go into great detail.

http://www.bookrags.com/research/urban-contamination-enve-02/

Lead is a trace metal of particular concern, and two predominant pathways for the uptake of lead have been identified in humans: soil and dust ingestion, and consumption of home grown foods. Depending on the extent of exposure, individuals may develop symptoms of acute or chronic lead poisoning. Symptoms or results of exposure include severe anemia, acute nervousness, kidney damage, irreversible brain damage, or death. Preschool children and women of child-bearing age are especially at risk. It has also been reported that people exposed to lead and cadmium in drinking water suffered from increased chronic kidney disease, skin cancer, heart disease, and anemia.


At this point, I would start wondering if anyone has done studies on the additive effects of two or more different neurotoxic metals on the same test animal….

http://books.google.com/books?id=qyoNMmh77PAC&pg=PA44&lpg=PA44&dq=%22additive+effects%22+neurotoxic+metals&source=bl&ots=3F68Iu_7y1&sig=09BIP772kFVaYTzD7UqH34orf40&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=2&ct=result

Yep. Just as I suspected. Different poisons that affect the body’s nervous system can be more dangerous if you are exposed to them together. For instance, two heavy metals can act in similar ways. Or, the body may use the same method to clear them, so exposure to one may reduce your ability to get rid of another. That means that an alphabet soup of poisons may be worse than exposure to each toxin separately.

III. Don't Drink the Arsenic

Everyone knows that arsenic is bad for you. You are allowed to have up to 10 micrograms/liter of arsenic in your water, and many wells are naturally contaminated the stuff which can leach in from the surrounding rocks.

http://water.usgs.gov/nawqa/trace/arsenic/

Bangladesh has a severe problem with arsenic in its water.

Arsenic is associated with bladder and skin cancer. There is a blood test to determine if you have been exposed. Arsenic is ingested, either through water or food. There is both acute, fatal poisoning and a chronic poisoning syndrome.

And this just in….

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hCuUPH4bNcOtq-0PajMZoG1IbExwD95CKMC00

Some water samples near a massive spill of coal ash in eastern Tennessee are showing high levels of arsenic, and state and federal officials on Monday cautioned residents who use private wells or springs to stop drinking the water.

Samples taken near the spill slightly exceed drinking water standards for toxic substances, and arsenic in one sample was higher than the maximum level allowed for drinking water, according to a news release from the Tennessee Valley Authority, which operates the power plant where the spill occurred, the Environmental Protection Agency and other officials.

TVA spokesman Jim Allen said there are four private drinking water wells in the area affected by the spill and the agency should have tests from them this week.

"I think they were beyond the actual slide point of the material," EPA spokeswoman Laura Niles said of the wells. "There shouldn't be direct impact, but that's why they are sampling."


How does she know the slide point? The EPA did not even know how much material was in the spill at first. Do you think she is getting her answers from the owners of the utility plant who continue to move more aggressively in their public relations containment disaster plan than they do in their coal ash spill containment disaster plan? Will Bush write these people a pardon and hand them a superfund check on his way out the door? Has the EPA checked to see if wells at a distance have arsenic? I.e. if it occurs naturally in the area? For all we know, chemicals have been leaching through the dirt that surrounds the toxic coal ash for years, contaminating the local ground water. If you go back to the federal government's own arsenic in groundwater mapping site and click on the map

http://water.usgs.gov/nawqa/trace/pubs/geo_v46n11/fig3.html

you will see that Tennessee and the South have low levels of arsenic in groundwater. The chemical is a problem in the west, particularly in mountain areas. It seems to me that the most likely source of arsenic in wells in Tennessee would be the nearby toxic waste dump. I am not a lawyer, but if I had a well that I could not drink from, I would seriously consider consulting an attorney right now.

IV. Manganese, Chromium, Barium Set Out to Sea

From the New York Times today:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/30/us/30sludge.html?_r=1

The inventory, disclosed by the Tennessee Valley Authority on Monday at the request of The New York Times, showed that in just one year, the plant’s byproducts included 45,000 pounds of arsenic, 49,000 pounds of lead, 1.4 million pounds of barium, 91,000 pounds of chromium and 140,000 pounds of manganese. Those metals can cause cancer, liver damage and neurological complications, among other health problems.
And the holding pond, at the Kingston Fossil Plant, a T.V.A. plant 40 miles west of Knoxville, contained many decades’ worth of these deposits.


Manganese :
Manganese is an essential trace element in the body, but you can have too much of a good thing.
Manganese effects occur mainly in the respiratory tract and in the brains. Symptoms of manganese poisoning are hallucinations, forgetfulness and nerve damage. Manganese can also cause Parkinson, lung embolism and bronchitis. When men are exposed to manganese for a longer period of time they may become impotent.
A syndrome that is caused by manganese has symptoms such as schizophrenia, dullness, weak muscles, headaches and insomnia.

Because manganese is an essential element for human health shortages of manganese can also cause health effects. These are the following effects:

- Fatness
- Glucose intolerance
- Blood clotting
- Skin problems
- Lowered cholesterol levels
- Skeleton disorders
- Birth defects
- Changes of hair colour
- Neurological symptoms
Chronic Manganese poisoning may result from prolonged inhalation of dust and fume. The central nervous system is the chief site of damage from the disease, which may result in permanent disability. Symptoms include languor, sleepiness, weakness, emotional disturbances, spastic gait, recurring leg cramps, and paralysis. A high incidence of pneumonia and other upper respiratory infections has been found in workers exposed to dust or fume of Manganese compounds. Manganese compounds are experimental equivocal tumorigenic agents.

http://www.lenntech.com/periodic-chart-elements/Mn-en.htm

Manganese can also cause animal and plant toxicity.

Chromium
Like manganese, chromium is an essential trace element, but if you breathe it you can get sick. It can cause rashes and lung problems. Breathing chromium over the course of several years can increase your risk of lung cancer. Usually, this is part of an occupational disease. There is a blood and urine test.

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/csem/chromium/treatment_management.html

Barium
It’s used to make rat poison. It has a water soluble, toxic form.
At low doses, barium acts as a muscle stimulant, while higher doses affect the nervous system, causing cardiac irregularities, tremors, weakness, anxiety, dyspnea and paralysis. This may be due to its ability to block potassium ion channels which are critical to the proper function of the nervous system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barium

With proper medical care, the people who live in the affected area may do alright. The river itself may be a long time coming back. Eight years later, Coldwater still has not recovered from its toxic coal sludge spill.

http://www.ohvec.org/links/news/archive/2004/fair_use/10_11.html

Environmentalists continue to push for improved regulation of mammoth slurry dams, hundreds of which dot the nation. "There are 223 more of these in Appalachia ," Spadaro said. "There are better, alternative methods of disposal of the waste, but that would cost the coal industry $1 more per ton. So it won’t happen."

Massey says the area has healed and been "reclaimed." But Chapman says he’s still waiting and watching for fish — wildlife officials say the slurry killed an estimated 1.6 million in more than 70 miles of stream — to return to his stretch of Coldwater. He used to see mink and muskrat, too.

"I am not against coal mining, and neither are most people here," he said. "I don’t even know that we need new laws. How ’bout we use the ones we have?"

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bahrbearian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:55 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm waiting for Cali's editorial review of this Post.
Just kidding, excellent work.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:04 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Orwell was not a public health physician
Edited on Tue Dec-30-08 04:08 AM by McCamy Taylor
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democrank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:06 AM
Response to Original message
3. Thank you for your effort.
I have a lot to learn about "clean" coal.
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bahrbearian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:14 AM
Response to Original message
4. My drinking water is high in Manganese :
I worry about Manganese poisoning.
Now just to make sure, these is your list of Manganese Shortages?

- Fatness
- Glucose intolerance
- Blood clotting
- Skin problems
- Lowered cholesterol levels
- Skeleton disorders
- Birth defects
- Changes of hair colour
- Neurological symptoms

B
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Damned if you do, damned if you don't, Like the fat soluble vitamins.
Manganese in food in small amounts, good. More on the central nervous system effects and the Parkinson's type problems chronic exposure can cause.

http://hazmap.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/hazmap_generic?tbl=TblDiseases&id=239

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manganism

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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:25 AM
Response to Original message
6. Great stuff! Thank you for posting.
I should add it to the Truthiness page ... http://www.wikiality.com/Clean_Coal

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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:39 AM
Response to Original message
7. Don't forget beryllium
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:51 AM
Response to Original message
8. Uranium and Thorium. Mercury. Cadmium.
Here's the ironic part -- U and Th are less toxic than Hg and Cd. Neither their chemical toxicity nor their radioactivity cause as much damage as Mercury and Cadmium cause, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mole_(unit)">mole for mole.

Cadmium and Mercury are two of the most lethal elemental substances known. The Japanese have a great deal of sad experience with them. They call cadmium poisoning "Itai-Itai" or "Ouch Ouch" sickness.

--p!
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 05:05 AM
Response to Original message
9. Well composed.
Thanks.
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quaker bill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
10. It comes down to a question
Edited on Tue Dec-30-08 07:10 AM by quaker bill
of concentrations. Experience would suggest that natural background concentrations of many of these metals in the environment is below the detection limit (BDL). For most, analysis by ion coupled plasma or graphite furnace atomic absorption spec. the detection limit would fall in the range of 0.2 to 0.02 micrograms per liter, or 2 to 20 parts per billion. "Elevated levels" is a term generally applied when the concentration of the metal of concern is above the detection limit, in short, measurable at all. In the lower ranges of detection, truly massive consumption of the contaminated water would be required to see toxic effects.

However, in industrial accidents, like this case, some of the concentrations may be quite a bit higher. The purpose of the fly ash lagoons are to store concentrated pollutants and to prevent their dispersal into the environment. Much of the fly ash being stored at many coal plants is the product of electrostatic precipitators, which are used to keep this stuff from going up the stack and being distributed to the environment by wind.

The quantities of this stuff generated by a coal plant are amazingly massive. You can keep the operating costs of a coal plant down by avoiding the additional cost of proper capture, storage, stablization, and disposal of the pollutants. While properly dealing with any pound of these pollutants is fairly cheap, doing so with millions of tons adds up to a pretty big ticket, and would raise the cost per kilowatt hour considerably.

True environmental justice requires the generator to deal with the full cost of their pollutant disposal. Sound ecological economics does not allow this cost to be transferred off-site. When a power generator profits by using less expensive and effective technology, their savings are often passed on to the downstream community in adverse health effects and cleanup costs. Further, the development of cleaner technologies are disadvantaged in the marketplace because coal generation is not required to pay its full cost and charge rates high enough to cover them.

Part of the change we need is a true ecological accounting that requires users to bear the full cost of their activities. Greener technologies are always cheaper than cleaning up the Tennessee River. Once entropy is allowed to reign supreme, such as with this spill, the costs skyrocket. A basic principle of thermodynamics is that once released, it is really tough and very expensive to shove this sort of genie back into the bottle.
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oldshoe Donating Member (127 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 07:16 AM
Response to Original message
11. Excellent Interview on the HORN
"Very good Interview on the HORN, Bob Kincaid show, with John Wathan, from Hurricane Creek Keepers, just returning from several days of relief work at the Harriman / Kingston ash pond dam break disaster. Best eye-witness and knowledgeable interview on the subject. Bob Kincaid is a West Virginia activist with good connections with other Appalachian activities. Must hear interview.

How to listen:
Go to
1) http://www.whiterosesociety.org
2) Bob Kincaid Show
3) Monday December 29th show.
4) Minutes 0:02 through 1:33

Long interview, but very informative. Contains concrete info for taking action.
Get involved!
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nc4bo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
12. What an informative post and it sounds more and more like the residents need
to get the hell out of there NOW. The land and water are dead, dying or severely poisoned and anything dependent on land or water for sustainance will also be dead or dying or poisoned.

This is an environmental nightmare and I have my doubts that this area will ever be returned to its previous state.

There was a video up in the Political Video section of a man in Harlan County whose fish pond was destroyed by strip mining. Nasty business but ties in nicely with the power plant disaster, I thought.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x250847

Anyway - bookmarking this very informative post and thanks for putting it all together.





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ScaryBob Donating Member (36 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
13. And you thought that Homer Simpson only worked at the nuclear power plant...
DOH!
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
14. You left out mercury - that sludge should be plum loaded with it.
Of course a lot of the mercury finds its way back to us as air polution from when the coal is burned but the sludge should be just loaded with it too.
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Good Point - McCamy?
Edited on Tue Dec-30-08 10:23 AM by Phred42
:shrug:
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. self delete
Edited on Tue Dec-30-08 10:24 AM by Phred42
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
17. Another excellent well documented and well researched post McCamy
...except for the mercury ommission

:evilgrin:

:toast:

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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. So far the EPA is not admitting a mercury contamination problem, presumably
because the public relations impact of that is even worse than for the thallium contamination problem they have already admitted. Here is what I have found that they have admitted.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/27/us/27sludge.html?_r=1&bl&ex=1230613200&en=dca39d677a5bac74&ei=5087%0A

Mercury and arsenic, he said, were “barely detectable” in the samples.


Knowing the EPA, it would be nice to know what samples we are talking about and what he means by "barely detectable". Because we could be talking a crude screen done on water that should not be contaminated. In which case, I would worry. Or we could be talking a sensitive test of the sludge itself. The EPA is being deliberately obtuse.

Mercury

I think we all know what mercury does from seeing the photos from Japan. Limbless babies. Also once it gets into the water, fish will become toxic. It affects the brains of developing fetuses. It can causes acute skin and renal problems and long term nerve and brain damage from chronic exposure. Here is a link.

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/819872-overview

Cadmium is another toxin typically found in coal ash

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/12/26/ST2008122601713.html

that the EPA is keeping mum about, presumably because it is also a public relations nightmare. Wikipedia takes a special interest in cadmium for some reason. Here is a link to their site about cadmium toxicity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium_poisoning

You can be exposed to cadmium simply be inhaling the dust (good thing the EPA plans to keep that sludge watered down until the end of time---gonna make the clean up kind of hard, though). It causes a flu like illness, can cause kidney failure, lung and liver problems, including lung cancer.

Note that cadmium is involved in worker's comp claims, which means that plaintiff's attorneys are tuned into it. This may be why we are not hearing anything about it on the news. Mercury is also likely to catch the attention of attorneys. Seems to me that all the effort is being spent on cover up rather than clean up.

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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #20
28. Ah- the republican EPA.
Ok - i get it - Tx
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quidam56 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
18. Bush/Cheney are TOXIC TERRORISTS to Appalachia
They can say all they want about Presidebt Bush keeping America safe from terrorism, Hell ! He's a toxic terrorist, Appalachia can't stand anymore of THE COAL INDUSTRIES prosperity. http://www.wisecountyissues.com Hannity's America sure ain't My America.
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Hanse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
19. Are you theorizing the EPA is conspiring to harm or kill citizens?
"However, the TVA will lie to you and say:


(P)reliminary TVA tests suggest the millions of people who get their drinking water from the 652-mile Tennessee River shouldn't worry.

"We have no reason so far to know that is unsafe," he told a news conference, noting TVA is working closely with the Tennessee Department of Environmental and Conservation and the federal Environmental Protection Agency. The water intake for the town of Kingston is about six miles downstream of the power plant.

"It is possible it is going to have some metals in there," said Laura Niles, regional spokeswoman for the EPA in Atlanta."

I don't see how that's a lie. Authorities are constantly monitoring the water supply for metals and other pollutants. If it's reaches an unsafe level, it'll be shut down.

"“Elevated” just does not cut it in my book. “Elevated” can kill you."

Elevated means that the amout of pollutant is higher than the normal background trace amount of the pollutant. That does not mean it is at a dangerous concentration.

"Yep. Just as I suspected. Different poisons that affect the body’s nervous system can be more dangerous if you are exposed to them together. For instance, two heavy metals can act in similar ways. Or, the body may use the same method to clear them, so exposure to one may reduce your ability to get rid of another. That means that an alphabet soup of poisons may be worse than exposure to each toxin separately."

That's just conjecture. No help to nobody.

"Some water samples near a massive spill of coal ash in eastern Tennessee are showing high levels of arsenic, and state and federal officials on Monday cautioned residents who use private wells or springs to stop drinking the water.

Samples taken near the spill slightly exceed drinking water standards for toxic substances, and arsenic in one sample was higher than the maximum level allowed for drinking water, according to a news release from the Tennessee Valley Authority, which operates the power plant where the spill occurred, the Environmental Protection Agency and other officials.

TVA spokesman Jim Allen said there are four private drinking water wells in the area affected by the spill and the agency should have tests from them this week.

"I think they were beyond the actual slide point of the material," EPA spokeswoman Laura Niles said of the wells. "There shouldn't be direct impact, but that's why they are sampling.""

That shows to me the system is working.

"How does she know the slide point?"

I didn't think that was a question.

"The EPA did not even know how much material was in the spill at first."

Hence the constant monitoring of water.

"Do you think she is getting her answers from the owners of the utility plant who continue to move more aggressively in their public relations containment disaster plan than they do in their coal ash spill containment disaster plan?"

I don't see any evidence of that.

"Will Bush write these people a pardon and hand them a superfund check on his way out the door?"

No.

"Has the EPA checked to see if wells at a distance have arsenic? I.e. if it occurs naturally in the area?"

If arsenic occured naturally in the area it would have shown up in previous tests

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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. I believe the EPA is conspiring to protect industry from responsibility for its actions
Edited on Tue Dec-30-08 03:21 PM by McCamy Taylor
even if it means harm or death to United States citizens, yes. That is what the EPA (and FDA and Mine Safety and all the others) under Bush have been doing all along. Haven't you been paying attention? If there is some way that Bush can give the utility company immunity from having to pay for the clean up and having to pay any damages to anyone who develops a health problem from this spill before he leaves office, he will do so. I do not know the TVA well enough to guess whether they will continue the Bush EPA's work after W. is gone.

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Hanse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Based on what evidence?
What has the EPA done wrong with response to this spill?
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Ichingcarpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. EPA corruption from the Bush regime
Shades Of U.S. Attorney Scandal: Top EPA Official Forced Out By Political Appointees

The Chicago Tribune reports:


The Bush administration forced its top environmental regulator in the Midwest to quit Thursday after months of internal bickering about dioxin contamination downstream from Dow Chemical’s world headquarters in Michigan.

In an interview with the Tribune, Mary Gade said two top political appointees at the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency headquarters in Washington stripped her of her powers as regional administrator and told her to quit or be fired by June 1.

As a congressional investigation revealed this week, the EPA’s regulation of toxic chemicals like dioxin has been corrupted by interference by the White House. But this case is even more egregious:

For the past year, Gade has been locked in a heated dispute with Dow about long-delayed plans to clean up dioxin-saturated soil and sediment that extends 50 miles beyond its Midland, Mich., plant into Saginaw Bay and Lake Huron. <. . .> http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2008/05/01/mary-gade-firing/

The White House’s Agents Of Environmental Corruption

»
The White House Office of Management and Budget (OMB) is an obscure Cabinet-level office that oversees the activities of all the federal agencies of the Executive Branch. Under President Bush, the OMB has become administration’s primary mechanism for politicizing the work of the Environmental Protection Agency, as congressional investigations have discovered.

Bush’s political appointees to the OMB and EPA share personal ties and a common right-wing ideology of defending corporate polluters against environmental regulation. The individuals listed below joined the administration directly from anti-regulatory think tanks or from the staff of Republican congressmen.

Yesterday, Rep. Henry Waxman (D-CA) held an oversight hearing into OMB interference with EPA decisions on ozone and greenhouse gases, at which EPA Administrator Stephen Johnson yet again put in a performance that “rivals Alberto Gonzales” and failed to turn over subpoenaed documents. Today, Rep. Brad Miller (D-NC) held an oversight hearing into OMB interference with the EPA risk assessment process for toxic chemicals. Tomorrow, the House Global Warming Committee will hold a vote to recommend that Johnson be found in contempt of Congress for refusing to comply with their subpoena.

Here are a few of the major figures linking the OMB to the EPA:

http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2008/05/21/omb-epa-corruption/


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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:24 PM
Response to Original message
22. Kicked and recommended.
Thanks for the thread, McCamy Taylor.:thumbsup:
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Ichingcarpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
24. Good Report thanks for the environmental impact of these elements and compounds
The associated health effects and costs of burning coal are not included in the cost of electricity. In the Southeast, where coal accounts for over 65% of electricity generation, asthma rates among children are abnormally high. The cause is clear. The heavy amounts of particulate matter including mercury produced at coal burning plants and emitted from the smoke stacks are directly linked to this growing health problem. This is particularly damaging to children’s developing lungs which are more susceptible to long term damage by breathing tiny particulates. Children are not the only victims, though. Thousands of adults die each year from complications associated with breathing byproducts of burning coal. Heart attacks, strokes, deadly asthma attacks and mercury poisoning have all been directly linked to coal plant emissions.

We must make strategic changes in America’s energy policy to avoid these unnecessary health and environmental risks.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. See my old journals for links about air pollution's association with infant mortality, too.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-30-08 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
25. K&R
Very thorough and informative. Thanks.
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