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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:10 AM
Original message
Thoughts on Sibel Edmonds' 'Hijacking' article
I wanted to make a few comments about Sibel Edmond's White Paper Hijacking of a Nation. Part 1: The Foreign Agent Factor" from last week before Part 2 of her White Paper is published (I'll publish it on Wednesday)

1. Sibel described how Saudi Arabia was able to whitewash their involvement in 9/11 in the original congressional inquiry report. What isn't widely known is that Pakistan reportedly whitewashed their own involvement in the 911 Commission Report.

2. Sibel notes that both the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) and the Lobbying Disclosure Act (LDA) are inadequate. Scott Ritter recently had some choice words to say about Israel & AIPAC on that front.

3. We'll take a closer look at some of the 'lobbying' efforts by Turkey involving Dennis Hastert and Bob Livingston as they pertain to Sibel's case

As a refresher, here's the nub of Sibel's paper:
"Foreign governments and foreign-owned private interests have long sought to influence U.S. public policy. Several have accomplished this goal; those who are able and willing to pay what it takes. Those who buy themselves a few strategic middlemen, commonly known as pimps, while in DC circles referred to as foreign registered agents and lobbyists, who facilitate and bring about desired transactions. These successful foreign entities have mastered the art of ‘covering all the bases’ when it comes to buying influence in Washington DC. They have the required recipe down pat: get yourself a few ‘Dime a Dozen Generals,’ bid high in the ‘former statesmen lobby auction’, and put in your pocket one or two ‘ex-congressmen turned lobbyists’ who know the ropes when it comes to pocketing a few dozen who still serve.

The most important facet of this influence to consider is what happens when the active and powerful foreign entities’ objectives are in direct conflict with our nation’s objectives and its interests and security; and when this is the case, who pays the ultimate price and how. There is no need for assumptions of hypothetical situations to answer these questions, since throughout recent history we have repeatedly faced the dire consequences of the highjacking of our foreign and domestic policies by these so-called foreign agents of foreign influence."
In Sibel's paper, she used the example of the Saudis whitewashing-via-redaction of the initial inquiry into 9/11, quoting Senator Bob Graham: “It was as if the President’s loyalty lay more with Saudi Arabia than with America’s safety.”

Sibel then notes that "While Saudi Arabia has been specifically pointed to by Graham, other countries involved have yet to be identified." It appears that one of those countries is Pakistan which was apparently able to whitewash the 911 Commission report with some last minute 'lobbying':
Pakistan gave tens of thousands of dollars through its lobbyists in the United States to members of the 9/11 inquiry commission to 'convince' them to drop some anti-Pakistan findings in the report.

<...>
According to the FO (Foreign Office) official, 'dramatic changes' were made in the final draft of the inquiry commission report after Pakistani lobbyists arranged meetings with members of the Commission and convinced them to remove anti-Pakistan findings. This information is also given in the PAC records available with TFT and reveals that Pakistan won over the sympathies of 75 US Congressmen as part of its strategy to guard the interests of Pakistan in the United States.
<...>
According to Sadiq, a few days before the completion of the inquiry report, US lobbyists told embassy officials that they had inside information that the inquiry commission had damaging findings on Pakistan`s role in 9/11. Meetings were hence arranged with commission members who were convinced to drop this information."
For the record, I can't prove that this is true. However, it was reported both in Pakistan and India and the reports claim that the expenditure is documented in offical records in Pakistan. I've detailed Pakistan's (registered) lobbying firms from the relevant timeframe here.

We don't know whether Pakistan was using any unregistered lobbying firms which brings me to my second issue - the inadequacies of the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) and the Lobbying Disclosure Act (LDA).

As Sibel notes in her piece:
There are a number of exemptions (for FARA) . For example, persons whose activities are of a purely commercial nature or of a religious, academic, and charitable nature are exempt. Any agent who is engaged in lobbying activities and is registered under the Lobbying Disclosure Act (LDA) is exempt.


AIPAC, for example, is not registered under FARA.

In a speech last month ( youtube, transcript), Scott Ritter explained why this might be a problem:
"One of the big problems - and here comes the grenade - is Israel. The second you mention the word 'Israel', the nation of Israel, the concept of Israel, many in the American press become very defensive. We're not allowed to be highly critical of the state of Israel.

The other thing we're not allowed to do is discuss the notion that Israel, and the notion of Israeli interests, may in fact be dictating what America is doing. That what we're doing in the Midle East may not be to the benefit of America's National Security, but to Israel's National Security.
But we don't want to talk about that - because one of the great success stories out there is the pro-Israel Lobby which has successfully enabled themselves to blend the two together - so that when we speak of Israeli interests, they say 'No - we're speaking of American interests'

It's interesting that AIPAC and other elements of the Israeli Lobby don't have to register as agents of a foreign government. It'd be nice if they did, because then we'd know when they're advocating on behalf of Israel, and when they're advocating on behalf of the USA.

I'd challenge the New York Times to sit down and do a critical story on Israel, on the role that Israel plays in influencing American foreign policy. There's nothing wrong with Israel trying to influence American foreign policy - let me make that clear. The British seek to influence our foreign policy. The French seek to influence our foreign policy. The Saudis seek to influence our foreign policy. The difference is that when they do it, and they bring American citizens into play, these Americans, once they take the money of a foreign government, and they advocate on behalf of a foreign government, they register themselves as an agent of that govt so we know where they're coming from. That's all I'm asking the Israelis to do - let us know where you're coming from. Stop confusing the American public that Israel's interests are necessarily America's interests."

Another major 'lobbying' group which is not registered under FARA is the American Turkish Council (ATC) - an organization which is at the heart of Sibel's case.

Sibel briefly described Turkey's centrality to her case in her White Paper:
I won’t get into the details and history of my own case, where the government invoked the state secrets privilege to gag my case and the congress in order to ‘protect certain sensitive diplomatic relations.’ The country, the foreign influence, in this case was the Republic of Turkey. The U.S. government did so despite the far reaching consequences of burying the facts involved, and disregarded the interests and security of the nation; all to protect a quasi ally engaged in numerous illegitimate activities within the global terrorist networks, nuclear black-market and narcotics activities; an ally who happens to be another compulsive and loyal buyer of the Military Industrial Complex; an ally who happens to be another savvy player in recruiting top U.S. players as its foreign agents and spending million of dollars per year to the lobbying groups headed by many ‘formers.’ Turkey’s agent list includes generals such as Joseph Ralston and Brent Scowcroft, former statesmen such as William Cohen and Marc Grossman, and of course famous ex-congressmen such as Bob Livingston and Stephen Solarz. Turkey too seems to have all its bases covered.
All of the people that Sibel mention here in relation to her case, a case about Turkey's foreign influence, are active in the ATC - yet the ATC isn't registered as an agent of foreign influence.

The ATC features in Sibel's case in a number of (apparently) different ways:
1. The FBI's Counter-Intelligence unit was actively monitoring the ATC (perhaps going back to 1996) because the ATC 'was engaged in illegal activities and illegal campaign donations.'

2. The FBI translator who tried to 'recruit' Sibel previously worked at the ATC, lied about it on her job application form, and rearranged the internal FBI work processes so that she alone translated all of the ATC wiretaps.

3. It appears that at least some of the bribes that Dennis Hastert received were handled by the ATC (or it's sub-organizations) and/or were discussed on ATC wiretaps.

4. Sibel says that Bob Livingston's multi-million-dollar contract from 'Turkey' is not actually with the Republic of Turkey, despite his FARA filings. Is the ATC paying Livingston?

Let's take a closer look at Hastert.

The Vanity Fair article details 3 different types of bribes, as detailed on the wiretaps (Sibel isn't the source for these claims) : a) illegal campaign donations b) 'tens of thousands of dollars... for political favors and information' c) $500,000 for withdrawing a bill. Many of these wiretapped phone conversations were between officials at the Turkish embassy and the ATC.

The ATC is regarded as one of the most powerful lobbies in DC - yet when Hastert was asked by Vanity Fair about the A.T.C. and other groups mentioned in the wiretaps, his spokesman replied: “(Hastert) does not know these organizations.”

Sibel wasn't impressed with Hastert's claims that he doesn't know these organtizations - she wrote:
a. Please refer to Mr. Hastert’s trips to Turkey (all trips that took place- 1996- 2002); its sponsors…they are self evident. Now how can he claim not knowing these entities (very intimately)?

b. Also, should we refer to Mr. Hastert’s dealing with the named foreign organization via Bob Livingston’s lobbying firm (Livingston Group)?
She's basically calling Hastert a liar - and threatening him with more revelations regarding Hastert, Livingston, and the ATC

Let's take a closer look at Bob Livingston.

Public Citizen did a report in June 05 called "Congressional Revolving Doors: The Journey from Congress to K Street" and they took a close look at Bob Livingston, particularly his relationship with Turkey:
Since 2000, Livingston has taken in more than $11 million from foreign governments and the vast majority of that money, $9 million, has come from Turkey, with $1 million more each from Morocco and the Cayman Islands.
Livingston actually registers his work with FARA, as required - identifying the client as "Republic of Turkey, Embassy" - however in an interview in January, Sibel said:
"(Livingston) is charging $1.2m - He's charging Turkey - and this is not the government of Turkish Republic, this is ummm... Who are these people who are paying him $1.2m per year? To do what? That is the question."
I don't know who is paying Livingston, or why, but violating FARA is a criminal offence - so if Livingston says that the Republic of Turkey is the client, and Sibel says the client is someone or something else, then Livingston might be in trouble (I suspect that FARA is the least of his problems)

On a final note, this is from an interview Sibel gave in May 04.
Jim Hogue: Here's a question that you might be able to answer: What is al-Qaeda?

Sibel Edmonds: This is a very interesting and complex question. When you think of al-Qaeda, you are not thinking of al-Qaeda in terms of one particular country, or one particular organization. You are looking at this massive movement that stretches to tens and tens of countries. And it involves a lot of sub-organizations and sub-sub-organizations and branches and it's extremely complicated. So to just narrow it down and say al-Qaeda and the Saudis, or to say it's what they had at the camp in Afghanistan, is extremely misleading. And we don't hear the extent of the penetration that this organization and the sub-organizations have throughout the world, throughout their networks and throughout their various activities. It's extremely sophisticated. And then you involve a significant amount of money into this equation. Then things start getting a lot of overlap-- money laundering, and drugs and terrorist activities and their support networks converging in several points. That's what I'm trying to convey without being too specific. And this money travels. And you start trying to go to the root of it and it's getting into somebody's political campaign, and somebody's lobbying.
Curiously, I suspect that if Hogue had asked Sibel "What is the American Turkish Council?" - her answer might have been quite similar.

Sibel has put out a challenge:
"Put out those tapes. Put out those wiretaps. Put out those documents. Put out the truth. The truth is going to hurt them. The truth is going to set me free."
I agree. Release the tapes.

If you agree, please sign her petition.

(and drop by on Wednesday for Part 2 of Sibel's "Hijacking of a Nation" which will focus on Turkey and the ATC)
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randyconspiracybuff Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
1. An "Off The Shelf" Bribery Operation
"4. Sibel says that Bob Livingston's multi-million-dollar contract from 'Turkey' is not actually with the Republic of Turkey, despite his FARA filings. Is the ATC paying Livingston?"

OK, I'm guessing, but I think what Sibel meant to say in that offhand comment was that bribes to people like Hastert are not coming from the Republic of Turkey- the money is coming, as Phillip Giraldi said, from an "off the shelf" operation that would give the Turkish government some distance and deniability.

Sibel might have been speaking off the cuff- of course, I'm speculating here- and lumped in people like Livingston with people like Hastert.

It might be a good idea to get clarification on this. Because I don't see a need to hide the source of the funds for the formally retained lobbyist for Turkey- but I see a BIG need to hide the source of illicit bribes.

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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. VF response
In sibel's response to Hastert's LTE to VF, she specifically hinted at ATC/Livington/Hastert - so there's something odd going on there.

"should we refer to Mr. Hastert’s dealing with the named foreign organization via Bob Livingston’s lobbying firm (Livingston Group)?"
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
2. crossposted in orange
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
3. Who are the Senators that
Sibol told her full story to? Which were Dems? And, does she feel that now that we are the Majority that those Senators will finally reveal what she told them by investigation?

I seem to recall Leahy as being one...but it's been so long ago that I read Sibol's original work that I've forgotten the list of names.
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randyconspiracybuff Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Yes, Leahy and Grassley
and probably several others. She's also told her story to Henry Waxman. I don't know specifically who else she's talked to but I believe there are several.

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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. leahy & grassley
leahy & grassley are the major ones - but i think there are others too.

she's not particularly confident that things will be much different now that the Dems are the majority. fingers crossed.

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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. I'm afraid I'm not "particularly confident", either. :(
I have so much respect and admiration for that woman.

If only she could be *really heard* by the citizens of this country, that they would *LISTEN*, and actually be concerned.

Alas, I fear we don't have enough of a nation left for that to be the case.

I hope I end up wrong on that score.
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. I wish the media
I wish the media was a little more helpful in getting the case *really heard*

calling all journalists...
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I'm afraid we are the only media...
ANd, I believe this crisis has made us more aware that it's our duty to be the media.

However, when it comes to something like Sibel Edmonds and what she has to say, I haven't a clue what we can do about that.

Not unless there were crowds of thousands outside media outlets, DEMANDING coverage.

Even then.....

:(
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thingfisher Donating Member (445 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. This is one area of investigation
that the Democrats MUST open if they want to retain any credibility as champions for transparency in government! Giving Sibel Edmonds the opportunity to tell all that she knows would be an excellent place to begin the "investigations" that DUers are so eager to see get under way.
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. part two
check back in on wednesday for Sibel's Part Two - and make sure everyone you know reads it.

the Dems can use it as a roadmap.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. I'm afraid to hope for some REAL ACCOUNTING
I"m disappointed in Conyers, but I do trust him.

I trust Waxman (!) and Leahy.

I just don't trust what some of the DLC DINOs will try to do to cover the corporate ass.

I just don't trust them.

Our big fight is with the corporations, and I haven't a clue how to drain their tanks.
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. scariest guy in town
i share all of yuor concerns - and have hope in the same congressmen.

didja see this article in Time?
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1562974,00.html

"And the funny thing is, Waxman can thank the Republicans for the unique set of levers he will hold. Under a rules change they put through in the days when they used the panel to make Bill Clinton's life miserable, the leader of Government Reform is the only chairman who can issue subpoenas without a committee vote. "

It seems he doesnt need the DINOs :-)
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Call Waxman--thank him and his staff!! They're going to be getting TONS
of hate mail, and while he's dedicated, we need to let him and his staff know we appreciate all their efforts!

1 877 851 - 6437

1 877 762 8762

1 800 828 0498


Toll-free Capitol Hill Switchboard numbers... USE 'EM! :hi:

I'm getting such a good laugh at the REpublican's "weapon" now being in the hands of the Great Henry. :) Happy Witchhunt, Henry! :hi:

Except I don't like misusing the word "witch" in that way. Evil time, evil murders. We need a better term!

Thanks for the article. I love seeing his picture, and knowing he's at the helm! :applause:
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. sibel has got letters
Sibel said on the radio the other day that she has letters from COngressmen who have promised to look into some (?) cases.

I'm not sure if it was hers specifically, or to her as President of NSWBC - on behalf of other cases.

let the games begin :-)
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. GREAT NEWS! REally, that is the best news I've heard yet!
I've been afraid for her, and discouraged about her testimony ever getting out.

I just can't imagine the RW letting this all come out, so...

:scared:
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Still, call the numbers and thank them!
1 877-851 - 6437

1 877-762-8762

1 800-828-0498
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 02:52 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. call, call call, n/t
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. you can sign the petition
that's a start.

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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 07:02 AM
Response to Reply #5
35. For what it's worth: Indira Singh also talked to Grassley
When i went to Senator Grassley's office, i said to them, "Am i a citizen of the United States or the United Saudi States of America?"
And i said, "I am from ground zero, and if you don't like the way i'm going to be speaking, you can leave."
And two people got up and left.
I said that my trip, my Ptech journey, was a journey from the Whitey Bulger(** tent in Colorado to the White Tent in DC...
Somebody else left.

But, i believe that unless you throw this right in their face and speak very honestly, they will not get it that you know what is going on".

-- Indira Singh, at 9-11 Citizens Commission.
http://911busters.com/911-Commission.html

**)
Whitey Bulger, a mobster and longtime FBI informant who disappeared from Boston 8 years ago.
http://www.boston.com/news/packages/whitey


also see
Sibel Edmonds and other Whistleblowers Group
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=344
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #3
20. judiciary committee
The entire judiciary committee has been briefed too.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
7. 5th rec. As always, important info about the Sibel case
Thanks.
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StateSecrets Donating Member (394 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
8. Grossman
Omar Sheik is the man who, on the instructions of General Mahmoud Ahmed, the then head of Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), wired $100,000 before the 9/11 attacks to Mohammed Atta, the lead hijacker.Neither Ahmed nor Sheikh have been charged and brought to trial on this count. Why not? According to an article in Guardian UK published in July 2004, Ahmed, the paymaster for the hijackers, was actually in Washington on 9/11, and had a series of pre-9/11 top-level meetings in the White House, the Pentagon, the national security council,and Marc Grossman, the under-secretary of state for political affairs. The article then poses a logical question: ‘When Ahmed was exposed by the Wall Street Journal as having sent the money to the hijackers, he was forced to "retire" by President Pervez Musharraf. Why hasn't the US demanded that he be questioned and tried in court?

A Pakistani article published on Sept. 10, 2001, claimed that Ahmed's “most important meeting was with Mark Grossman, U.S. undersecretary of state for political affairs. U.S. sources would not furnish any details beyond saying that the two discussed 'matters of mutual interests.'
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Guardian 911 article
Thanks statesecrets.

the Guardian article is http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1266520,00.html

"The Pakistan connection - There is evidence of foreign intelligence backing for the 9/11 hijackers. Why is the US government so keen to cover it up?"

The author is Michael Meacher - a Brit politician.

From the article: "(Sibel) tried to blow the whistle on the cover-up of intelligence that names some of the culprits who orchestrated the 9/11 attacks, but is now under two gagging orders that forbid her from testifying in court or mentioning the names of the people or the countries involved. She has been quoted as saying: "My translations of the 9/11 intercepts included money laundering, detailed and date-specific information ... if they were to do real investigations, we would see several significant high-level criminal prosecutions in this country ... and believe me, they will do everything to cover this up"."
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Did Grossman know ?
Edited on Mon Nov-27-06 12:52 PM by lukery
Sibel has previously pointed to those meetings between Mahmoud & Grossman

According to this article http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/0304/032404c1.htm

Edmonds said she was hired to retranslate material that was collected prior to Sept. 11 to determine if anything was missed in the translations that related to the plot. In her review, Edmonds said the documents clearly showed that the Sept. 11 hijackers were in the country and plotting to use airplanes as missiles. The documents also included information relating to their financial activities.


Did Grossman know about the payments to Atta prior to 911?


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StateSecrets Donating Member (394 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Another Unanswered Question
...and why don't we know after 5+ years.

We know that 'Pakistan' is one of the 3-4 countries mentioned in Graham's statements/book.

We know that we've been protecting Pakistan from any scrutiny.

We know from John M. Cole (FBI WB; in charge of Counterintelligence for Pakistan, Afghanistan India): Suspocious activities by ISI agents in US being coverre up in 9/11 Commission Report & other quasi inquiries.

We know that Grossman is extremely close to Pakistan; he served over there...

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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Do we know the other countries
from Graham?

Pakistan, Saudi and ???
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randyconspiracybuff Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. The Question Becomes...
If Pakistani ISI did wire money to Atta, did the ISI actively encourage the attack on America? If so, why?
From one standpoint, it would seem foolish to attack a much more powerful country like the U.S.

On the other hand, we could be talking about 'rogue' elements in Pakistan.
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. a multinational gig
it's interesting - you've got the ISI supporting (at least) one hijacker, and the saudis supporting (at least) two other hijackers - and apparently another 2 countries involved as well.

who was the lead? and why?
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #11
21. john cole link?
statesecrets - do you have a link to Cole's ISI claims please?
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
13. K&R
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
18. Sibel Edmonds and other Whistleblowers Group
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mhatrw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
23. Thanks for the great post on Sibel. n/t
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bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-27-06 10:24 PM
Response to Original message
28. thanks for putting this together. nt
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 12:06 AM
Response to Original message
33. Come on Conyers! Please don't fail me!
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DemonFighterLives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
36. I don't see how this story can stay plugged up
Our country was sold down the river. The cover up that is taking place leaves little doubt that BFEE had it's hands involved in this "New Pearl Harbor". There is no other reason to not get to the truth.

Has anyone besides Sibel put the pieces together? I mean someone has to just blurt it all out, gag orders be damned. I don't want to see this go on for 40+ years like the Kennedy Assassination.

Thank you lukery and statesecrets for the information provided.

:dem:
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
37. Sibel talks a lot, and I'm glad of it
Edited on Tue Nov-28-06 09:32 AM by tavalon
but I'm wondering what specifically her gag order doesn't allow her to talk about. Will she be able to talk to the new Congress?

Edited to add: I just looked at and signed the petition and got my question above answered.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. Great hook for getting others to sign...
:evilgrin:

:hi:
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. And here's another little kick
for the night crowd.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. one kick deserves another...
OUCH!

:hi:
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Jcrowley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
41. Excellent thread everyone
top rate
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. Oh my...yes...
Top rate is top understatement of the evening!!!
Oh my god...
this is a riveting thread.
BHN
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. Damn! I hate this 24 hour "recommend it" deal...
I just tried to recommend it and got the message that I could not!
This thread needs to be front page and center spot light!
BHN
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lukery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. part 2 is here
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. Just got back from dinner- will do. THNX!
BHN
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. Oh dear God, just read it...you are correct: DEVASTATING
We are so beyond fucked.
BHN
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Gwerlain Donating Member (516 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 03:02 AM
Response to Original message
47. Well done. I'll be interested in the next installment.
This is good stuff, well researched, well written, well sourced. Good editorial tone- if you don't know, you say you don't know. Again, well done.
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