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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:50 AM
Original message
Obama's detestable dirty tricks
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/alice_miles/article3192712.ece


Obama's detestable dirty tricks

Alice Miles

What a shame that a contest that has the world gripped, that is transforming international opinion of the United States, that has shown America in its best and most brilliant light, threatens to descend into a pathetic slanging match over race. What a shame for the centre Left, which had everything to cheer about in the stunning choice between, potentially, the first female and the first black president, that they are allowing the contest to slip into an idiotic series of unproven claims about racial bias.

On Monday Hillary Clinton called for a truce reminding everyone that “Senator Obama and I are on the same side”. Hear hear. But how did it come to this?

The thin catalogue of complaints against the Clinton campaign from the Obama campaign were unfounded, manipulative and self-indulgent. At best they called into question the oversensitivity of Mr Obama, at worst they showed him willing to play a divisive race card that is damaging the entire Democratic Party and tarnishing a great and historic electoral contest for the centre Left. The whole episode has convinced me he isn't tough enough for the White House........
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Kittycat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
1. Oh please.
BTW - Did you hear who Kennedy is endorsing and why? :)
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. Love the headline
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #9
27. Of course you do.
makes clear what you are. disgusting sentiment. not even a little bit surprising.
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #27
30. YOU should be called out for DU rules against calling out another
DU'er! Disgusting!!!!!!!
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. Is Ignored misbehaving again? n/t
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #32
45. Don't ask me... I can't see him either.
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elixir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #30
38. Don't worry Little Star, this is just Cali voicing angst. Everything is "disgusting" to them.
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Labors of Hercules Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #30
74. Actually, she called the sentiment disgusting.
And you know something? It is.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #27
52. I would hate to surprize you and upset you in any manner.

Of course you do.

makes clear what you are. disgusting sentiment. not even a little bit surprising.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #27
68. Pot calling kettle black.
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Andromeda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #27
71. You are the one who is disgusting.
Typical Obama supporter gibberish. Hard to get down to your level.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
12. btw...Rezko taken into custody this morning!
Rezko/Davis/Rita/Michelle(Landmark Commissions)/Obama/Wright!!!!! :)
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #12
36. Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater,
Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater, Whitewater.

I can do it too, with just as much substance.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #36
39. More like, Clinton Library Slush Fund
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #36
44. lol! Nothing THERE! THERE!
get real! Obama...REZMAR...aka REZKO/Davis/ BIG TROUBLE...NOW! 2008!
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. I agree. There's nothing there, there.
And shouting about it now, when it is just in its inception (and the prosecutors STILL maintain there is no connection with Obama) is just like the repukes shouting about Whitewater.

The only reason this is getting ANY notice is because of a tenuous connection to Obama which you are trying to spin into a derailment of his primary campaign.

What YOU are doing to Obama is EXACTLY what was done to the Clintons with Whitewater.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #50
55. Hardly!
I'm not doing ANYTHING to Obama! He is the one making FALSE statements about his relationship with REZKO/REZMAR and the rest!Therefore inviting such inquiry..!

REZKO For Dummies - Questions and Answers.



Question: What is a REZKO? “Rezko” refers to Antoin “Tony” Rezko. Rezko is an Obama friend of 17 years, a slumlord, and an indicted Chicago “Fixer“. The New

York Times described Rezko this way: “Antoin Rezko, an entrepreneur of considerable charm who found riches in fast food and real estate, is known around Chicago

as a collector of politicians.” “Mr. Obama has portrayed Mr. Rezko as a one-time fund-raiser whom he had occasionally seen socially. But interviews with more than a

dozen political and business associates suggest that the two men were closer than the senator has indicated.”

Question: Isn’t this an “old” story? Most reporters and Democrats are unaware of the Rezko Obama wheeling and dealing. ABC News certainly does not think this is

an old story. The Rezko trial for Bribes, Kickbacks and Extortion begins on February 25, 2008. The unvetted Obama is running for president in 2008. There has been

zero investigation of this story. Obama has repeatedly been caught not telling the truth about his transactions with Rezko. Republicans are aware of Rezko and will

use this story against Obama if he ever became the Democratic nominee.
Obama/Rezko house deal.]

Question: Does this story really matter? This story goes right to the question of Obama’s experience and judgment. Obama’s Chicago constituents were abandoned

by Obama in unheated tenements while Obama relaxed in his big heated house counting the money slumlord Rezko donated to Obama. Rezko did not have money to

pay for heating oil for his tenements but he did have money to donate to Obama. Obama represented his small state senate district badly. At best Obama can say he

was incompetent and did not know African-Americans in his district were living in “buildings riddled with problems — including squalid living conditions, vacant

apartments, lack of heat, squatters and drug dealers.”

Question: Who says the Obama house and the Rezko purchased yard were once part of the same property AND that both were purchased on the same day? In the

words of the Chicago Tribune, “The same day the Obamas closed on the house, the Rezkos closed on the purchase of the adjoining vacant lot, which once was the

estate’s lush side yard.”

Question: Any proof that Obama did “favors” for Rezko while Obama was a state senator? The Chicago Tribune: “On June 13, the Chicago Sun-Times reported that as

a state senator, Obama wrote letters to city and state officials supporting Rezko’s successful bid to get more than $14 million from taxpayers to build apartments for

senior citizens. The Sun-Times said the deal included $855,000 in development fees for Rezko and his partner, Allison S. Davis, Obama’s former boss, according to

records from the project, which was four blocks outside Obama’s state Senate district.

Question: Is there more to come on this Rezko story? Stay tuned to the Rezko trial. As reported immediately above, Allison S. Davis, Obama’s former boss at the

politically connected Chicago law firm was an investor in some of Rezko’s deals. Michelle Obama and the medical community in Chicago continue to swirl around this

story. As trial approaches Rezko might decide to try to get a deal. Usually, prosecutors will only work a deal if someone else is “offered up”.

Question: What about Hillary - what about Whitewater? Hillary has been fully vetted. The Clintons lost $50,000 in the media trumped up land deal known as

Whitewater. Every single little thing that the Republicans can throw at Hillary during an election has already been thrown at her to no avail. Few people know about

Rezko. Few reporters know the full Rezko/Obama story. With a Rezko trial starting on February 25, 2008 the Rezko tales will finally be told. At the very first glance it

looks like Obama made a $925,000 “profit” on the purchase of his house. Clinton’s lost $50,000; Obama gained $925,000.

Question: Maybe Obama didn’t know what he was doing - Is Obama a real estate lawyer? Obama was a real estate lawyer. Obama tried to hide that fact but the Sun

-Times exposed the truth:

Davis said he didn’t remember Obama working on the Rezmar projects. “I don’t recall Barack having any involvement in real estate transactions,” Davis said.

“Barack was a litigator. His area of focus was litigation, class-action suits.”

But Obama did legal work on real estate deals while at Davis’ firm, according to biographical information he submitted to the Sun-Times in 1998. Obama specialized

“in civil rights litigation, real estate financing, acquisition, construction and/or redevelopment of low-and moderate income housing,” according to his “biographical

sketch.” And he did legal work on Rezko’s deals, according to an e-mail his presidential campaign staff sent the Sun-Times on Feb. 16, in response to earlier

inquiries. The staff didn’t specify which Rezmar projects Obama worked on, or his role. But it drew a distinction between working for Rezko and working on projects

involving his company.”

Also, Lynn Sweet, of the Chicago Sun-Times caught Obama in another discrepancy between what Obama is currently saying and his record. “Well said, except that

this was not the first time Obama went through the process of buying a residence. Obama and his wife bought a condominium in Hyde Park before purchasing their

mansion in Kenwood. Perhaps Obama was making a distinction between buying a condo and a stand-alone home. But Obama was not the first-time residential

purchaser he portrayed in the interview.”

Michelle Obama served for 7 years on the Landmark Commission (1998-2005). Michelle Obama used those Landmark Commission contacts to navigate through

Chicago law when the Obamas decided to build a fence for, as Lynn Sweet calls it, their Kenwood mansion.

Question: Did Obama know Rezko was about to be indicted when he made the last of the Obama/Rezko real estate deals? Obama changes his story with regularity.

ABC News appears to have the evidence that Obama knew or should have known.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #55
58. Got any links to show where those unfounded accusations are
coming from?

How did Obama make a $950,000 profit in buying his home? The property was listed at $2mil. He paid $1,650,00. That's $350,000 saved - 15% of the list price, and list prices are always inflated to give the seller room to bargain. If listed to $2mil, it's actual value would probably be more like $1.75mil.

Where do you find $950,000 profit in that?

Did Obama know about the coming indictment? Possibly, but what's the problem? He was conducting a perfectly legitimate purchase from the owner of the lot next to his, expanding his own lot. If someone else owned that vacant lot, he would have purchased from THAT person.

What is the problem with Obama having owned a condo?

Obama did 5 hours work for Rezko over a 6 year period. That's 45 minutes a year. Get real.

Obama used his pull as a state senator to get a low-income housing project funded. Was Rezko known as a slum lord when he wrote those letters? No. It was the first time that he'd ventured into that area, so there was no way that Obama could know that it would end up that way. Kind of like the Clintons not knowing that the Whitewater investment was going to go south. The difference here is that the Clintons lost money while Obama lost political capital, both of them due to other peoples' handing of what they invested in.

There's no there, there.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #58
59. AND Michelle Obama worked for Landmark Commissions in these areas..helping..navigate the law they sa


Will find link to REZKO for Dummies!
Connecting the dots...

Michelle Obama served for 7 years on the Landmark Commission (1998-2005). Michelle Obama used those Landmark Commission contacts to navigate through

Chicago law when the Obamas decided to build a fence for, as Lynn Sweet calls it, their Kenwood mansion.

Question: Did Obama know Rezko was about to be indicted when he made the last of the Obama/Rezko real estate deals? Obama changes his story with regularity.

ABC News appears to have the evidence that Obama knew or should have known.

April 23, 2007
BY TIM NOVAK Staff Reporter/[email protected]
For more than five weeks during the brutal winter of 1997, tenants shivered without heat in a government-subsidized apartment building on Chicago's South Side.

It was just four years after the landlords -- Antoin "Tony'' Rezko and his partner Daniel Mahru -- had rehabbed the 31-unit building in Englewood with a loan from

Chicago taxpayers.

It was just four years after the landlords -- Antoin "Tony'' Rezko and his partner Daniel Mahru -- had rehabbed the 31-unit building in Englewood with a loan from

Chicago taxpayers.

Rezko and Mahru couldn't find money to get the heat back on.

» Click to enlarge image

"Senator Obama does not remember having conversations with Tony Rezko (inset) about properties that he owned" — Obama’s campaign staff on Sunday.
(Sun-Times/AP)

RELATED STORIES
Sun-Times' questions: Obama campaign's answers

Map: Rezmar Corp.'s low-income projects

Top recipients of campaign cash

Obama's ex-boss a Rezko partner

Troutman dad got rehab deal

Rezmar deals involving Davis Miner law firm

Staff reporter Tim Novak examines previously unreported government-funded, low-income housing deals involving Antoin "Tony" Rezko, the indicted political fund-raiser.
TODAY | Rezmar kept getting city and state funding, even as earlier projects fell into disrepair and financial troubles.
Rezko and Mahru couldn't find money to get the heat back on.

But their company, Rezmar Corp., did come up with $1,000 to give to the political campaign fund of Barack Obama, the newly elected state senator whose district

included the unheated building.

Obama has been friends with Rezko for 17 years. Rezko has been a political patron to Obama and many others, helping to raise millions of dollars for them through

his own contributions and by hosting fund-raisers in his home.

Obama, who has worked as a lawyer and a legislator to improve living conditions for the poor, took campaign donations from Rezko even as Rezko's low-income

housing empire was collapsing, leaving many African-American families in buildings riddled with problems -- including squalid living conditions, vacant apartments, lack

of heat, squatters and drug dealers.

The building in Englewood was one of 30 Rezmar rehabbed in a series of troubled deals largely financed by taxpayers. Every project ran into financial difficulty. More

than half went into foreclosure, a Chicago Sun-Times investigation has found.

"Their buildings were falling apart,'' said a former city official. "They just didn't pay attention to the condition of these buildings.''

Eleven of Rezko's buildings were in Obama's state Senate district.

Obama, now a U.S. senator running for president, has come under fire over his friendship with Rezko, who was charged last fall with demanding kickbacks on state

business deals under Gov. Blagojevich.

Much of the criticism has centered on two real estate deals involving Obama's South Side mansion. In the first, Obama paid $300,000 less than the asking price for a

doctor's home, while Rezko's wife paid the doctor full price for the vacant lot next door. Then -- a few months before Rezko was indicted -- Obama bought part of that

lot from Rezko's wife.

But Obama's ties with Rezko go beyond those two real estate sales and the political support, the Sun-Times found. Obama was an attorney with a small Chicago law

firm -- Davis Miner Barnhill & Galland -- that helped Rezmar get more than $43 million in government funding to rehab 15 of their 30 apartment buildings for the poor.

Obama role unclear
Just what legal work -- and how much -- Obama did on those deals is unknown. His campaign staff acknowledges he worked on some of them. But the Rezmar-related

work amounted to just five hours over the six years it said Obama was affiliated with the law firm, the staff said in an e-mail in February.
Obama, however, was associated with the firm for more than nine years, his staff acknowledged Sunday in an e-mail response to questions submitted March 14 by the

Sun-Times. They didn't say what deals he worked on -- or how much work he did.

"The senator, relatively inexperienced in this kind of work, was assigned to tasks appropriate for a junior lawyer,'' according to an e-mail from Obama spokesman

Robert Gibbs. "These tasks would have included reviewing documents, collecting corporate organizational documents, and drafting corporate resolutions.''

In fact, Gibbs wrote, "Senator Obama does not remember having conversations with Tony Rezko about properties that he owned or any specific issues related to those

properties.''

Rezko and Mahru had no construction experience when they created Rezmar in 1989 to rehabilitate apartments for the poor under the Daley administration. Between

1989 and 1998, Rezmar made deals to rehab 30 buildings, a total of 1,025 apartments. The last 15 buildings involved Davis Miner Barnhill & Galland during Obama's

time with the firm.

Rezko and Mahru also managed the buildings, which were supposed to provide homes for poor people for 30 years. Every one of the projects ran into trouble:

• Seventeen buildings -- many beset with code violations, including a lack of heat -- ended up in foreclosure.

• Six buildings are currently boarded up.

• Hundreds of the apartments are vacant, in need of major repairs.

• Taxpayers have been stuck with millions in unpaid loans.

• At least a dozen times, the city of Chicago sued Rezmar for failure to heat buildings.

For five weeks, the Sun-Times sought to interview Obama about Rezko and the housing deals. His staff wanted written questions. It responded Sunday but left many

questions unanswered. Other answers didn't directly address the question.

Among these: When did Obama learn of Rezmar's financial problems? "The senator had no special knowledge of any financial problems,'' Gibbs wrote.

Did the senator ever complain to anyone -- government officials, Rezmar or Rezko -- about the conditions of Rezmar's buildings? "Senator Obama did follow up on

constituency complaints about housing as matter of routine,'' Gibbs wrote.

Did the senator ever discuss Rezmar's financial problems with anyone at his law firm? "The firm advises us that it unaware of any such conversations,'' Gibbs

wrote.

Turns down Rezmar job
Obama's friendship with Rezko began with a telephone call.
It was 17 years ago. Obama had just become the first black president of the Harvard Law Review. Newspapers wrote about him. One story caught the eye of David

Brint, a vice president of Rezmar, a new company that had become the Daley administration's favored developer of low-income housing.

"I just cold-called him," Brint said in an interview.

Brint said he wanted to know if Obama would come work for Rezmar, developing housing for the poor -- something Obama had expressed interest in, according to the

story Brint had read. Brint arranged for Obama to meet Rezko, but Obama didn't take the job.

Obama, who has a law degree from Harvard, subsequently returned to Chicago to lead a voter-registration drive in 1992.

The next year, Obama joined Davis Miner Barnhill & Galland, a 12-lawyer firm that specialized in helping develop low-income housing. The firm's top partner, Allison S.

Davis, was, and is, a member of the Chicago Plan Commission, appointed by Mayor Daley. Davis was also a friend of Rezko. Davis and Rezko would eventually go

into business together, developing homes.

Another firm partner, Judson Miner, ran the city Law Department under Mayor Harold Washington, one of Obama's political idols.

Asked what Rezko cases Obama worked on, Miner told the Sun-Times, "We'll put together a list of the cases he worked on involving Rezko/Rezmar in the next day or

two.''

That was March 13. He never provided the information.

While at the law firm, Obama spent much of his time working on issues that would help improve conditions in poor neighborhoods, according to his first book, Dreams

from My Father, published in 1996.

"In my legal practice, I work mostly with churches and community groups, men and women who quietly build grocery stores and health clinics in the inner city, and

housing for the poor,'' Obama wrote in the book.

Three community groups represented by Davis Miner Barnhill & Galland were partners with Rezmar in the troubled housing deals.

Rezko offers Obama support
Obama had been at the firm for two years when he began his political career, running to replace state Sen. Alice Palmer.
Rezko became Obama's political patron. Obama got his first campaign contributions on July 31, 1995: $300 from a Loop lawyer, a $5,000 loan from a car dealer, and

$2,000 from two food companies owned by Rezko.

Around that time, Rezmar began developing low-income apartments in partnerships with the Chicago Urban League and two other not-for-profit community groups, both

founded and run by Bishop Arthur Brazier, pastor of the Apostolic Church of God and a powerful ally of the mayor -- the Woodlawn Preservation and Investment Corp.,

known as WPIC, and the Fund for Community Redevelopment and Revitalization.

All three community groups were clients of the Davis law firm. Davis himself was treasurer of WPIC when it went into business with Rezmar.

Why go into business with Rezmar? "We thought they were successful,'' Davis said, noting that little development was taking place in Woodlawn.

At the time, Rezmar had been in business for six years and had become one of City Hall's favored developers of low-income housing, managing 600 apartments in 15

buildings it rehabbed with government funding. Teaming now with community development groups, Rezmar rehabbed another 15 buildings, with 400 apartments,

between 1995 and 1998. Each deal involved a mix of public and private financing -- loans from the city or state, federal low-income-housing tax credits and bank loans.

By the time Rezmar started working with those community groups, at least two of its earlier buildings were falling into disrepair -- including the Englewood apartment

building at 7000 S. Sangamon where the tenants were without heat for five weeks.

The tenants there had no heat from Dec. 27, 1996, until at least Feb. 3, 1997, when the city of Chicago sued to turn the heat on. The case was settled later that month

with a $100 fine.

It was during that time that the area's new state senator, Barack Obama, got a $1,000 campaign donation from Rezmar. The date: Jan. 14, 1997.

Obama works on Rezmar deals
Obama spent the next eight years serving in the Illinois Senate and continued to work for the Davis law firm.
Through its partnerships, Rezmar remained a client of the firm, according to ethics statements Obama filed while a state senator.

Davis said he didn't remember Obama working on the Rezmar projects.

"I don't recall Barack having any involvement in real estate transactions,'' Davis said. "Barack was a litigator. His area of focus was litigation, class-action suits.''

But Obama did legal work on real estate deals while at Davis' firm, according to biographical information he submitted to the Sun-Times in 1998. Obama specialized

"in civil rights litigation, real estate financing, acquisition, construction and/or redevelopment of low-and moderate income housing,'' according to his "biographical

sketch."

And he did legal work on Rezko's deals, according to an e-mail his presidential campaign staff sent the Sun-Times on Feb. 16, in response to earlier inquiries. The

staff didn't specify which Rezmar projects Obama worked on, or his role. But it drew a distinction between working for Rezko and working on projects involving his

company.

"Senator Obama did not directly represent Mr. Rezko or his firms. He did represent on a very limited basis ventures in which Mr. Rezko's entities participated along

with others,'' according to the e-mail from Obama's staff.

Obama buys Rezko land
Over the years, Rezko, Mahru, their wives and businesses have given more than $50,000 to Obama's campaign funds, records show. And Rezko has helped raise

millions more.
Rezko was among the people Obama appointed to serve on his U.S. Senate campaign finance committee, the Sun-Times reported in 2003. The committee raised

more than $14 million, according to Federal Election Commission records, helping send Obama to Washington in 2004.

As a U.S. senator, Obama grew closer to Rezko.

Two years ago, Obama bought a mansion on the South Side, in the Kenwood neighborhood, from a doctor. On the same day, Rezko's wife, Rita Rezko, bought the

vacant lot next door from the same seller. The doctor had listed the properties for sale together. He sold the house to Obama for $300,000 below the asking price. The

doctor got his asking price on the lot from Rezko's wife.

Last year, Rita Rezko sold a strip of that vacant lot to Obama for $104,500 -- a deal Obama later apologized for, acknowledging that people might think he got a favor

from Rezko. Obama called the episode "boneheaded'' and a "mistake.''

At the time Obama bought that strip of land, it had been reported that Rezko was under federal investigation for influence-peddling involving the administration of

Blagojevich, whose campaign also received Rezko's financial support.

Rezko has since been indicted for allegedly demanding kickbacks from companies seeking state business under Blagojevich. Rezko's trial has been postponed while

investigators sort through his finances.

'Disenchanted with Rezmar'
Rezmar's final low-income housing deals involving the Davis law firm went bad quickly.
Those deals were supposed to provide affordable housing for at least 25 years. But the first deal Rezmar struck with the Woodlawn Preservation and Investment Corp.

collapsed in just six and a half years, when the state sued for foreclosure. WPIC and its sister agency, the Fund for Community Redevelopment and Revitalization,

ultimately forced Rezmar to give up control of all 12 buildings they rehabbed together, citing financial troubles and deteriorating conditions of the buildings.

The state foreclosure suit came because Rezmar had stopped making monthly mortgage payments in March 2001 on a state loan to help turn an old nursing home

into low-income apartments at 6140 S. Drexel, in Obama's state Senate district.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #59
60. This, my friends, is called an information bomb. It is not meant to
Edited on Mon Jan-28-08 02:15 PM by NCevilDUer
inform, but through massive cut-and-paste to overwhelm any argument, because trying to take on the arguments one by one is such a massive operation that it borders on the impossible.

I tried to answer the specific points in the previous post, and was replied to not with responses to my replies but a bigger and better cut/past information bomb.

The salient point is, it is all BULLSHIT.

What, exactly, is the problem with Michelle Obama working for the Landmark Commission?

All the slumlord stuff is nonsense. Obama had no oversight of how the project which he helped fundraise for was conducted. His involvement ended with the fundraising.

There is no there, there.

ON EDIT: Again, where are the links. You know you have them because such cut/paste jobs are not possible without links. Are you afraid to reveal that the links are coming from RW sites? From Hillary's campaign?
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #60
61. truthfully..I'm tired of doing Obamam's peep's home work!
I have been posting tid bits for weeks with link..not one soul interested..I do apologize for the Massive attack thing...thought I'd make it easier on you..sorry.. still quite new at this whole thing. Michelle Obama is using her position in various HIGHLY held offices, to navigate and push things through for the said companies involved..as I read..If you do your own resaerch you will/may read as well.

This is the begining ...
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #61
64. The way it works around here is the person making the accusations
provides the links.

Common courtesy.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. here you go...there is a ton of info here with other links attached...
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #66
72. As I thought. Straight from Hillary-is-44.
Now THERE'S an unbiased source.
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sfam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
2. Pot calls Kettle "Black" and then asks for a truce...OK...
No, Hillary would never have stooped to causing the racial issue, even though it leaves her with the majority of the white vote. This is all Obama's doing because he always wanted to be known as the "black" candidate. Um, yeah. OK...

Kennedy has it all wrong - the MSM has it all wrong. Thank God we have the Times in London to get it right.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
3. Thank goodness SOME people actually realize what he is doing
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. I know, it's pretty obvious...and it works. :(
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. obama has this what I cal the :Glitter effect" and many are dazzled by it and do not
look for any substance.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #8
21. Bill Clinton has been used by the Clinton campaign for

his "glitter effect" that is why they have put him front and center.

And IMO,all that glitters is not gold with the future Co- President.

I'm just not sure now who is running for President in that family.

I also can't believe that I am even writing this because I was always a Clinton fan.

However ~ as an African American woman I am proud that I am not alone in knowing that there are millions of others that are learning to understand the WORTH of Obama.

Hope he keeps his sparkle, new ideas, appeal to the youth as well as the elders ~ his "glitter" is OK in my book. :bounce:
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ClericJohnPreston Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #21
46. "New Ideas"
PLease share...WITHOUT LINKING, his best five "NEW IDEAS". Hmmmm?

Shouldn't be hard, right, with all those "NEW IDEAS" to choose from.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #21
53. Keep in mind that Obama is the candidate. I wonder how long Obama's glitter will glitter? maybe
for a long time considering how the press has a double standard with it comes to Obama vs Sen. Clinton
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geiger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
4. you have got it backwards, unfortunately
it's clear who's put the dirty tricks into play, and it's not Obama. It's also why Kerry and Kennedy are waiting no longer to start work on his behalf. They've been through a couple rounds with the smarty pants of the world who care nothing for the integrity of the system. Unfortunately, the tactics are approved and generated from the highest levels.
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realFedUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. It's good political positioning on Kerry and Kennedy's parts
You can't lose by backing Obama...keeps the young and
new voters in, African Americans working within the
party and energized to vote and money coming in.
Also Obama, if elected, will need a lot of new
positions filled and I'm sure K and K would love
to advise.

Checkmate.
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geiger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. It goes deeper than that.
These people have been around for a long time. They are not only practitioners; they know their history. They have core beliefs they hold dear.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #15
37. I agree - read Kerry's emails on lies and on the real NV attempt on voter suppression
Kerry is extremely honest and repeatedly said in 2004 that truth was important. He ended by saying that he would work to insure that another campaign is not lost to lies - he was speaking of the general election - but I'm sure it likely hurts more to see Democrats doing it. His outrage on the Clinton allies' lawsuit to close the strip caucuses was something I would suspect of Blackwell, not Democrats.

Kerry's gracious endorsement stated his main reasons for backing Obama - but I'm sure these actions have likely really angered him. There is no other way to read those words.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #10
40. Isn't that the point?
That Hillary will LOSE the young and new voters, African Americans will leave the party, and the voters that Hillary will energize to vote and donate will be republicans voting for and donating to her opponant.

These long experienced progressive Democrats do not endorse someone because they like his smile - there are very sound reasons, among which is the need to eliminate the corrupt influence of the DLC on the Democratic party.
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realFedUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #40
76. Kennedy and Kerry are DLC...
I stand by my theory that they are motivated
by the reasons I gave. Obama's a pretty speechmaker
but as he's said he doesn't handle details well
so he'll need a lot of help and K & K would love
to advise him.

Politics is about moving people and Obama gets
credit for a lot of hopeful language but the
real politics of getting things done goes
beyond speeches. Look beyond his color and his
pretty words to what he's really all about.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-29-08 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #76
78. Kennedy is NOT DLC. Kerry broke his ties with the DLC after
2004 when they let him lose so as to pave the way for Hillary in 08 (speculation, as to the 'why' but reality on the 'what'). In fact, I think that is why he folded so quickly - he was told by the DLC that they were NOT going to back his challange of Ohio - again, speculation, but the one theory that makes sense. Seen in that light, his endorsement of Obama - who also spurned the DLC despite a similarity of positions - makes a lot of sense.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #10
65. "Also Obama, if elected, will need a lot of new positions filled"
Imagine that, new positions filled WITHIN *our* Executive Branch that are not under the full GRIP of Bill Clinton ... since when Jimmy Carter? Wow, The first time in decades that Bill Clinton will not be staffing A DEMOCRATIC Executive Branch. Now that's an EXCELLENT CHANGE, i.e., the corporate cronies of the DLC won't have a stranglehold over BOTH our Democratic Party nor The Executive Branch. :thumbsup:
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realFedUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #65
77. Clinton advisors are already advising Obama....
Who else would he hire? He seems bent on hiring
Republicans like the one he's already mentioned:
The Gropinator of CA.

Dream on coz the reality is he wants to be
President and he's going to say anything to get
there.

Mark my words...I'm rarely wrong. Obama isn't
up to this job and people should figure that out
now.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
5. Interesting perspective from the UK. I am not sure who's fuelling the "race card" fire, but it does
have to stop as it will damage EITHER nominee.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. lots of foreign papers are/were ablaze with this issue.
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #7
20. Especially the Murdoch-owned ones, such as the Times?
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. Makes sense. Murcoch loves ratings/publicity.
As does the MSM. The "race/gender" divide in the Democratic Party will be milked for months. I wish we'd stop feeding it?
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #5
42. A hint as to who is feuling it might be found in the fact that
Obama's strategy from the very beginning has been to show himself to be open and inclusive, to appeal across the whole spectrum of the Democratic polity, and to NOT be the 'black candidate'.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
70. I've been saying that all along!
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
11. Thanks rodeodance..:)
is a shame...
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
13. All the bullshit started after Bill Clinton's wife lost Iowa, a steady stream of subtle comments
from the two Clinton candidates, and less subtly from their surrogates who had been given the signal that now it was o.k. to make it a black/white race. None of these comments would have happened if Bill Clinton's wife had won Iowa and coasted to the nomination.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #13
48. Can anyone actually cite and quote a "racist" remark made in the past month
by either of the Clintons?

All I've seen is a bunch of asshole bobbleheads on TV making it all up.
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Clinton Crusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #48
54. ding! ding! ding! THANK YOU Seabiscuit!!
I heard Craig Crawford going off alarming on MSNBC Sat. morning begging Scarboro, Mika Obama Brzezinski, Buchanan, Mike Barnacle, and a few others for ONE example of this so called rabid racism, and they couldnt quote or produce ONE. Dont give me this Jackson crap either. Give me one example of why Bill Clinton is now a full fledged card carrying member of the Klan. Ive searched the airwaves and ALL I hear on these 24 hour cable news shriekfests where obnoxious, opinionated pundits gab incessantly for hours to fill the time about racism, racism, racism, but never ever, ever give you examples, never play any sound bytes, never show you any tape. Are they just taking Obama and his campaign's WORD for it??

The Obama campaign has played the victim card down to a science.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #54
57. Indeed, the TV bobbleheads are doing Obama's dirty work for him.
All I've seen is yammering about "racism", "race", "playing the race card" followed immediately by the name "Clinton" followed by "dirty" "nasty" "mean" followed by "campaign tactics", etc., etc. ad nauseum, while the bottom of the screen shows words like "Clintons playing race card?".

It's the same tactic the MSM and Buscho used to sell the Iraq war. "9/11" + "Saddam" + "Iraq" + "Al Queda" all smeared into one with words, with absolutely no factual or causal connections whatsoever.

Of course, the MSM is doing this to bolster Obama and take down the Clintons, but is this the way Obama wants to win?
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Maribelle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #48
56. Even Jessie Jackson said:
“Bill has done so much for race relations and inclusion, I would tend not to read a negative scenario into his comments.”

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/28/jackson-not-upset-by-clinton-remarks/?hp

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #56
69. *Even* Jesse (not Jessie) Jackson can be gracious - doesn't detract from the racism of Bill's ...
Edited on Mon Jan-28-08 02:27 PM by ShortnFiery
recent behavior. Why do you think that your heroine TANKED with the African Americans in SC?
- and - odds are, The Clintons will not ever recover their "once" Star Status. :thumbsdown:
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
14. Lol. Those brits and their drunken journalism...
:toast:
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #14
26. alice is a real winner or should i saw whiner?
i`ve read everything on google i could find -even a post from our du friends in england...
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:10 AM
Response to Original message
16. Got to disagree here, rodeodance.
But here's an interesting note: if true, the fact that Obama has out-Clintoned the Clintons gives me hope for his chances in the general. The thing I admire most about Hillary is her evident willingness to jab an icepick into McCain's eyesocket if that's what she has to do to get elected. If Obama shares her ability to get down and dirty (while calling for an end to the "old politics"!), so much the better.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
17. Please translate...from SC speech!
When he took the stage he said, “At some point in the evening, a light is going to shine down and you will have an epiphany and you’ll say, ‘I have to vote for Barack.’”
What?? EPIPHANY??? Clarify!!!
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BenDavid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
18. since when has referring to somebody’s past admitted drug use
been a racial slur? More racist,I would say, to equate drugs with blacks, and that’s what the Obama campaign is doing, not the Clinton one.

As for Mrs Clinton’s statement that Martin Luther King’s dream of racial equality was realised only when President Johnson managed to get the 1964 Civil Rights Act through Congress? No more than fact, surely; an attack on Mr Obama’s lack of experience, certainly, but hardly a slur upon King. Mr Obama’s campaign is twisting things so that a comment about any black man is a comment about him, just as any attack on him is an attack on all black people. I ask again: who is playing the race card here?

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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
19. Hm. South Carolina didn't believe Clinton's bullshit. Neither did Teddy Kennedy.
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
22. Thanks rodeo,
K&R
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
23. this is getting tired
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
24. alice, alice, alice, your insights into american politics
are well just what i would expect from a conservative who works for the times.maybe you should worry about your own country`s problems with racial issues instead of lecturing us on ours.

another hit piece from murdoch`s uk times
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
28. Yeah, that's why Bill Clinton compared Obama to Jesse Jackson after his SC win.
He was just honoring that truce. :eyes:
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ginnyinWI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
29. she's saying that if you defend yourself, you are "oversensitive"?
We know so well from the last election what happens if you don't immediately and forcefully defend yourself against smear attacks. How does defending himself from smears make Obama not "tough enough for the White House"? On the contrary, it shows he's ready for it. If he just sat around and allowed the Clintons to spear him, pretty soon he'd be called a wimp. So what should he be, "oversensitive" or a wimp?
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
31. So, a foreign newspaper is telling us what is valid and real in the race
Apparently, many top Democrats happen to agree with Obama and have blasted Bill Clinton's antics. Clinton herself may have called for a truce - but has she reined in the attack dog?
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
33. Good article and amazing how you have to go to the UK to get the truth, compared to the lying US MSM
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #33
35. Yep
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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
34. **Breaking News**
Unknown woman in England prefers Clinton to Obama.
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allinktup Donating Member (318 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
41. Hillary Reminds me of my Repug friends
My repug friends love to take shots at dems for bing "limp wristed" or say they won't do a good job keeping the country safe... You know how they (repugs) can be. But as soon as you come back at them, they suddenly don't want to talk about it, and act like they never said anything.

Hillary & Bill injected race and sex into this campaign.

PLAIN AND SIMPLE

They inject it, and then ask for a truce.

Then, as soon as Obama cools it, they do it again. And then ask for a truce.

They just keep repeating the same freaking cycle.

I'll say it again... you CANNOT be an agent for change playing the same old dirty politics.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #41
49. Hillary reminds me of my Democratic friends. That's why I hang around with them.
Edited on Mon Jan-28-08 12:08 PM by mtnsnake
You remind me of my Republican "friends".
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Clintonite Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
43. Most people with an IQ over 70 understand this! Obama's campaign
is smart and effectivly putting this on the Clintons with the media in lock step as usual!Most of the people running Obama's campaign are the same people that helped to get Bill elected in 92 & 96. I mean the whole hope & change message? Already been done by Bill CLinton in 92!
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zanne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #43
51. Cynicism doesn't win this time! nt
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
47. Too many fish and chips in your eyeballs, Alice
What an inane column. Maybe she's pissed that Bill doesn't want to...yunno...

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
62. You never quit! You take your oponent's STRENGTH (his open and honest nature) and project against
him. Lee Atwater's ghost is giving you a big "thumbsup" from the grave. :eyes:
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ErnestoG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #62
75. KARL ROVE's favorite tactic, I might add!
Yech.
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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
63. Spot on.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
67. Oh my God! I couldn't have said that better myself!
She must be psychic...just like so many Obama supporters mind read Hillary and what she is thinking. It's funny how Obama supporters imagine Hillary thinking something and then proceeding to attack her viciously and repeatedly for her audacity to do/plan/think such a thing. Now that's weird!
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-28-08 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
73. You should send this to Ted Kennedy, maybe he'll withdraw his endorsement--he was wrong and a
Edited on Mon Jan-28-08 03:06 PM by milkyway
British journalist taking dictation from Clinton staffers knows what's really going on.
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Political Heretic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-29-08 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
79. Well, that's not what it looked like to me.
Sorry, but as an outside observer it sure as hell didn't look like it was Obama who was playing the race card.

It's funny how when someone doesn't fight back (Kerry) we lambast him, but when someone DOES fight back, we call him oversensitive and full of "dirty tricks."

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