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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:20 PM
Original message
Americablog: Breaking, Obama staff secretly trying to "grassroots" pressure HRC not to criticize him

An openly gay minister will open Barack Obama's gospel concerts this weekend in South Carolina, two of his advisers told gay supporters on a conference call this afternoon.

Obama aide Steve Hildebrand, and a prominent gay adviser, Tobias Wolff, conceded that the campaign had failed to "vet" gospel singer Donnie McClurkin for his view that homosexuality is a "curse", one person on the call said. But they said he would still perform at Obama's concerts, which are aimed at tightening his bond to that state's African-American community.

"They recognized that there was a mistake here," the source said. They also stressed Obama's "unequivocal" commitment to gay rights, and defended McClurkin's presence at the performance, he said.

"The perspective is that he can bring in different elements of the Democratic Party and American society," the Obama supporter said.

Wolff and Hildebrand also asked supporters to contact the Human Rights Campaign, a leading gay group, and press them not to publicly criticize Obama. A Human Rights Campaign spokesman, Trevor Thomas, said this afternoon however that a statement on McClurkin will be out "shortly."

Obama's advisers didn't name the gay minister, my source said, and an Obama spokesman didn't immediately respond to a request for the name.

http://www.americablog.com/
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1007/Gay_minister_to_open_Obama_gospel_show.html
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. Obama has shot himself in both feet
And still he just keeps on digging that hole even bigger for himself.
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
136. He should fire his "slower than cold molasses" response team.
Lack of experience by Barack, once again.
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bicentennial_baby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. Nice damage control there...
not.

:eyes:
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. But he can bring "different elements of American society" together!
Today, ex-gay preachers and gays. Tomorrow, neo-nazi skinheads and the NAACP!
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bicentennial_baby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. yes, I can't wait...
:rofl:

:hi:
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #5
41. Yes, let's see that happen.
After all, that's not bigoted, is it? :sarcasm:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. You have to talk to people to change minds
That's what is wrong with the Obama campaign, they're too easily intimidated by everybody. There's nothing more wrong with this McClurkin than there is with Hillary having prayer meetings with homophobic senators, but the campaign doesn't have the balls to say so.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. Please read this and see if you feel the same way:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #11
24. Let me be clear - I don't give a shit
There is no way to change minds if you don't talk to people. We've spent the last 8 years whining about all sorts of wacky ideas on the right, and nothing has changed. Because nobody will talk to them. Obama is. That's the only thing that will work in the long run. If the gay rights groups don't get it, oh well. Let them support Hillary and get nothing. Maybe some day Democrats will figure it out.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. Let me be clear - you are an offensive bigot apologist
Since you're all about reaching out to hateful clods, see if you can change some of the minds on my ignore list. There are several to be found there.

Tell them how the queers are making trouble for your dream of progress through dialog with cynical Republican hate-mongering.

If you cannot figure out that embracing the dehumanization of gay Americans is not a path to progress, I don't give a shit.

*ignored*
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #32
53. Gays can be hypocrites too
Obviously, since none of them give one whit about Hillary and her group of right wing fundy Senators. But one no-name singer, well that's major hysteria.

I call bullshit. It's manufactured outrage being perpetuated by opposition campaigns.
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #53
195. "hypocrites" come in every gender, sexual identity, religion...
and race. Why make bullshit excuses for Obama's gross negligence? The manufactured outrage is coming from the PFOX (Parents and Friends of ex-Gays). Not from the GLBT community. I think their problem with this issue is justified.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #24
46. What's NEXT from Senator Obama and his campaign then?
"We've spent the last 8 years whining about all sorts of wacky ideas on the right, and nothing has changed. Because nobody will talk to them. Obama is."


What's next from Senator Obama and his campaign? Going on the road with the Aryan Nation....because HEY, nobody from the Democratic Party has EVER talked to or hung out with the Aryan Nation....so Obama is going to BREAK TRADITION and you know, take to the road with them:

BARACK OBAMA/ARYAN NATION STATEWIDE TOUR 2007!
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #46
59. White racist males?
Yeah, it would be nice if somebody confronted them too.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #59
62. You'd have no problem with
Senator Obama appearing on stage with the Aryan Nation?

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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #62
68. One Person - this is ONE PERSON
Are you aware that something like 75% of South Carolina's African American population disapproves of homosexuality?

Should Democrats stop appearing with all of them?

This is manufactured outrage, it's purely political bullshit, and I'm not going to pretend otherwise.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:45 PM
Original message
Obama is going ON THE ROAD with an ACKNOWLEDGED Homophobe
Yeah, it's ONE person, BUT Obama has hitched HIS caboose to this POS....so WHAT does that say about Barack Obama?

It says that he'd whore himself out to ANYONE to try and get votes....EVEN if those votes come from a bunch of idiots who are happy to discriminate against gay people and are happy to think of gay people as Second Class citizens and think that they're the "Spawn of the Devil"

Disgusting....and you Obama Cultists are getting scarier by the day.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
88. How many more are in the south???
Do you even know how many times Democrats have appeared at religious events with homophobes?? Undoubtedly more than this ONE person at ONE event.

This is pure bullshit.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #88
92. Are they supposedly running for President though? n/t
.
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alteredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
160. Obam is not "going on the road" with McClurkin
Obama will not be in attendance at the concerts. McClurkin is scheduled to perform at one concert.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #160
169. One is ONE TOO MANY n/t
.
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #160
194. The concert will benefit whom?
Could it be: OBAMA???

It may be "one" concert but his appearance speaks volumes to those who are on the side of civil rights for all (yes, even the GLBT community).
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #68
99. Not just ONE PERSON. All of them.
Among the other “talented, spirit-filled supporters” slated to appear are gospel duo Mary Mary, a.k.a. Erica and Tina Atkins. In a 2006 interview with Clay Cane, the pair makes their homophobia crystal clear, likening gay people to murderers and prostitutes:


<snip>

Erica: We are aware. Ummm… how do I feel about homosexuality? I feel how God feels about it, but I still love them. I don’t agree with the lifestyle, but I love them. They can come to the concert; I’m going to hug them just like I hug everybody else. They have issues and need someone to encourage them like everybody else — just like the murderer, just like the one full of pride, just like the prostitute — everybody needs God. What your struggle is may not be what my struggle is, but we all need Him. So, that’s what our music is about giving and God, not to condone the lifestyle or to say, Oh it’s okay, but not to bash — but just to give them God. I mean, I’m appreciative of all of our supporters and fans. Hopefully what their hearing in our music is my love for God.

Tina: You know, I think the fact that our music is very upbeat and works well in clubs — you know, I think that’s something that makes more people gravitate to it. Like Erica said, we don’t necessarily agree with the lifestyle, but we don’t pride ourselves on bashing. Everyone has things in their life that they need to correct, everybody has struggles, everybody has things that, maybe I should’ve done it this way, maybe I should’ve made this choice, you know, or whatever. Even though that’s the way we feel, we don’t bash, we don’t do that kind of thing and we embrace everybody who enjoys our music. Hopefully our music is impacting them in a way that if they see there’s some things in their life that’s not quite right and doesn’t align themselves with what the Bible says — hopefully our music impacts them in a way that makes them want to change it.

<snip>



Also onboard for Obama’s Homophobe Gospel Tour: Hezekiah Walker, gospel singer and virulently anti-gay pastor of Brooklyn megachurch Love Fellowship Tabernacle

<snip>


http://news.lavenderliberal.com/2007/10/23/whats-the-matter-with-obama-this-is-not-a-question-part-1/



It's not manufactured outrage when you're the target of the hate. But then you aren't the target so you don't give a shit, do you?

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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #99
101. Remember though, we can "come to the concert". isn't that nice?
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:09 PM
Original message
Yes, because we might be learned and decide to change
The power of Christ compells you--to turn straight!
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
111. I want to give it to you right now baby!
You're so hot, my newly hetero loins want to start thrusting right now, yes indeed.

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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #111
122. Um, ok
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:59 AM
Response to Reply #111
184. Don't forget to film the encounter....so I can watch it....I'm pervy that way!
:evilgrin: :spank:
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:59 AM
Response to Reply #111
185. Don't forget to film the encounter....so I can watch it....I'm pervy that way!
:evilgrin: :spank:
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #101
196. You're forgetting the "hug"...
she said she would "hug them just like I hug everybody else". How Christian of her.:eyes:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #99
106. 75% of southern blacks
Why haven't you criticized anybody for appearing with southern blacks before?? Most of them disapprove of homosexuals. I disapprove of hypocrites.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #106
112. WHY has Barack Obama decided to OPEN this wound?
WHY is Barack Obama DIVIDING people? WHY is Barack Obama pitting one section of society against the other?

Hasn't George W. Bush done ENOUGH of that crap since 2001? WHY is Barack Obama going down the SAME divisive road?
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #112
114. Vote whoring
What else?
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #114
121. Yeah, I already called Obama a vote whore up thread, of course
The Obama Cultists failed to respond....or DID they respond by blaming EVERYTHING on Hillary Clinton for about the TWENTIETH time in this thread already, I can't remember!

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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #121
129. I didn't coin the term actually
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #129
137. Yep, he's a vote whore
Dunno what happened to the Cult of Obama in that thread of yours, they must have had the day off....because usually they're all over the place Preaching The Gospel of The New Messiah Obama!

You got lucky ;)
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #137
149. You're funny.
Accusing Obama of being a "vote whore" whilst you proudly trumpet the triangulating DLC doctrine is ... well ... :rofl:

That's all.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #149
156. Yeah
Viva Triangulation! I'm NOT ashamed....as people know I'm a proud DLCer....so there :P
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #156
161. No problem.
I'm no DLC-hater. Personally, I don't give a fuck about that whole DLCers vs Non-DLCers tribal conflict. However, I do understand what the DLC represents and "strategic political positioning" is fundamental. *Some* may say that's akin to "vote-whoring."
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #161
165. That's
Okay, I respect the right that you have your own opinion.

Considering though, that DLCer's cannot go a day without someone from the actual DLC-hating crowd bashing away....I think we take it astonishingly well and respond with politeness and humor....we'd don't throw hissy fits.

The DLC is a very misunderstood organization, I'd like it if people read more about the DLC and I'd like it if people checked the Progressive Policy Institute homepage and read some of the articles there, that way people would see that us DLCer's are actually quite normal and aren't the "Big Evil" that we're held up to be.

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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #112
117. Ooooh, he should be a hypocrite like Hillary
Pander pander pander and sweep the rest under the rug. What a bunch of crap. Like I've said all along, you don't give a shit about talking about homosexuality at all. You're just throwing mud to make political points. It's disgusting.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #117
132. WHAT?
"Like I've said all along, you don't give a shit about talking about homosexuality at all."

Huh?

You want to talk about homosexuality, okay....I'm for civil unions, but I'd really like to see gay people being allowed to get married and for them to have ALL the benefits that go along with that....why shouldn't gay couples be afforded the SAME rights as hetereosexual couples, including being allowed to adopt children.

IF Hillary Clinton went on the road with an acknowledged Homophobe, I can categorically state, that I'd STOP supporting her, she would no longer be my candidate for 2008, and it's as simple as that.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #117
135. He is
"I claim GLBTs should have equal rights, but I'm going to have a mega-tour with people who think just the opposite to appeal to people who think they should all be repressed back into the dark ages. "

Yep, that's hypocrisy.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #106
113. Bully on people who disapprove of gays
I disapprove of bigots. I don't give a flying rip what their reasons are.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #113
119. You think Edwards hasn't appeared with any????
Why didn't you care enough to vet every person he ever appeared with? Oooh, he had no chance of getting the black vote. But Hillary does.

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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #119
123. Hooray for Edwards.
:woohoo:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #123
128. For appearing with homophobes? n/t
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #119
125. Obama is aiming for the Homophobic vote
This has NOTHING to do with the "black vote"

Obama's going for the anti-gay rights votes....he's a hypocrite and the WORST sort of political opportunist....in a desparate attempt to get votes, he's happily making a pitch to the bigots, and not only that, he's happily going on the road with an acknowledged bigot.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #119
143. When did John Edwards go on the road with an acknowledged Homophobe? n/t
.
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #119
198. But...but..."they do it too".
:eyes:
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nosmokes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #106
159. Where does that number come from? is that urbanand rural southern blacks?
I'd like to see a source please.
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #106
197. Oh, so it's the "HYPOCRITES" you have a problem with???
Bigots and homophobes are fine, as long as they are honest and up-front about it?:eyes:
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rdmb57 Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #99
173. This really cuts to the quick
<snip>

Erica: We are aware. Ummm… how do I feel about homosexuality? I feel how God feels about it, but I still love them. I don’t agree with the lifestyle, but I love them. They can come to the concert; I’m going to hug them just like I hug everybody else. They have issues and need someone to encourage them like everybody else — just like the murderer, just like the one full of pride, just like the prostitute — everybody needs God. What your struggle is may not be what my struggle is, but we all need Him. So, that’s what our music is about giving and God, not to condone the lifestyle or to say, Oh it’s okay, but not to bash — but just to give them God. I mean, I’m appreciative of all of our supporters and fans. Hopefully what their hearing in our music is my love for God.

Tina: You know, I think the fact that our music is very upbeat and works well in clubs — you know, I think that’s something that makes more people gravitate to it. Like Erica said, we don’t necessarily agree with the lifestyle, but we don’t pride ourselves on bashing. Everyone has things in their life that they need to correct, everybody has struggles, everybody has things that, maybe I should’ve done it this way, maybe I should’ve made this choice, you know, or whatever. Even though that’s the way we feel, we don’t bash, we don’t do that kind of thing and we embrace everybody who enjoys our music. Hopefully our music is impacting them in a way that if they see there’s some things in their life that’s not quite right and doesn’t align themselves with what the Bible says — hopefully our music impacts them in a way that makes them want to change it.

<snip>

I've been out of the closet for going on 27 years now and generally get along pretty well with everyone I know. But when I read quotes like these it gives me a huge pit in my stomach. I guess that I'm just fooling myself by telling myself that beliefs like these are going the way of the dodo. Looks like bigotry is alive and well. And to think that one of our front running candidates is actively aligning himself with these haters can make one lose hope. I keep an open mind because I know there is no candidate that is going to match my beliefs 100% of the time. But I'm sorry, this is a dealbreaker.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 08:12 AM
Response to Reply #173
189. Indeed
Congratulations on being out for 27 years, and Welcome to DU. :hi:

Many have claimed that this concert tour is an attempt to unite people with different views and "bridge the gap". How do you bridge the gap with people who think you are no better than murderers and thieves--people who think you are inherently vile, evil and perverted--and that the only good thing you can do is change what you are at your very core? There is no common ground to be reached with people like that. Unless they are willing to give up their bigotry there is nothing to do but stay away from them.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #173
191. Equating gay people with murderers
and claiming to know how God feels about it.

Those are the words of a bigot. How would Erica feel is someone repeated her statement but replaced the word "homosexuality" with "black people?"

"Ummmm.... how do I feel about black people? I feel how God feels about it, but I still love them....they have issues and need someone to encourage them like everybody else - just like the murderer, just like the one full of pride, just like the prostitute - everybody needs God."
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #68
170. Yes. Anyone serious about getting the Democratic Party nomination for president should know better.
I'm not going to excuse this. Currying favor among homophobes loses my support. Period.
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niceypoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #68
190. I have to agree there
Guilt by osmosis just doesnt fly
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. This isn't about Senator Clinton
It's about Senator Obama and it's another example of how the man and his campaign, obviously don't have a clue as to what the heck they're even doing.

What's wrong with the Obama campaign? They and he are novices and they're totally naive.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. Of course it is
Where do you think these attacks come from?
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. When Obama takes a Homophobe on the road with him and refuses
To drop said Homophobe....then yes, he needs slapping upside the head.

This is totally unacceptable taking to the road with some Homophobic nutter.

That Obama is now whining and telling people not to criticise him, is pretty pathetic as well, how old is Obama? Is he a 4 year-old, because he's acting like a 4 year-old....he needs to grow up and take criticism like an ADULT, stop the whining and dump the Homophobe from the road trip.

It's quite simple to do really.
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alteredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #30
158. The performer isn't "on the road" with Obama
and Obama never planned to attend any of the concerts.
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #25
34. You're truly amazing
the you can turn anything back on a Clinton, any Clinton. I give you an 11 score for mental gymnastics.
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ronnykmarshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:19 PM
Original message
A regular Olga Korbut!
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 05:21 PM by ronnykmarshall
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
48. Lol!
:rofl:
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #34
47. Yep, amazing
I give her an 11 as well for mental gymnastics.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #25
43. You are asserting that us queers can't think for ourselves.
Congrats - you clearly think we are stupid in addition to being gay.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #43
51. WHY do you want to THINK for yourselves, when Obama can THINK for YOU?
Dammit, just join the Cult of Obama already....:sarcasm:

Remember NOT to criticise him or he'll throw his toys out of his playpen.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #51
75. oh dear
A Hillary backer accusing a Obama supporter of not thinking for themselves?

Oh the painfully delicious Irony of it all.

Seriously though, what kind of argument is it that Hillary IS the candidate, and that more people polled by the mainstream media (which oddly has a lot of trouble polling the vast majority of Americans) support her?

That is not a reason to back Hillary at all. In fact I have not heard one substantive policy or position based argument that makes Hillary better than any of the other candidates running (hell even Biden/Gravel is looking better).

In terms of mental gymnastics Hillary supporters are the masters. Somehow convincing themselves that the most conservative and corporate friendly democratic candidate running is the best person for the job.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #75
85. Hillary ISN'T going on the road with an acknowleged Homophobe though is she?
Again, this ISN'T about Hillary Clinton....this is about Barack Obama and the Cult of Obama that's perfectly happy with him going on the road with an acknowledged Homophobe, to the point where some of the Cult of Obama have ACTUALLY blamed the gay community for the controversy regarding this....WOW! Talk about being in denial!

Just so you know, I'm a straight female.

Barack Obama is DONE, his campaign is effectively finito....he'll drop out late February-early March.

Hillary Clinton WILL get our party's nomination....and she'll win the Presidency as well.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #85
102. So you ARE A CLINTON SUPPORTER
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #102
108. 'Um, yeah....I THOUGHT my Hillary 2008 avatar might make that obvious n/t
.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #85
110. She just has prayer meetings wtih HOMOPHOBIC SENATORS
on a regular basis, and none of you Clinton supporters ever said a damned word.

Bunch of lying fucking hypocrites, ALL OF YOU.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #110
116. Hillary Clinton IS a Senator, Senators meet each other at social gatherings
Doesn't MEAN that they ALL agree with each other 100% of the time though does it?

I repeat, Hillary Clinton isn't going on the road with an acknowledged Homophobe and having some big shindig with him, is she?

No she isn't.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #116
131. It's a regular prayer meeting she chooses to attend
Not just some random social gathering. But that's no big deal to you - because this isn't about religion or homophobia - it's about manufactured outrage to attack another candidate.

Sick fucking clintononian bullshit that you are foisting on the country - if she wins which she probably won't for this exact reason.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #131
138. Yeah, sorry, were you saying something?
:eyes:
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #116
203. Does any supporter of any candidate agree...
Does any supporter of any candidate agree with that candidate 100% of the time?
If so, I'd love to see that person, 'cause I've never seen a party-hack before. Neither on DU, nor in the real world.

As an aside: You keep repeating the implication that Obama is going on the road with this guy, yet there seems to be a consensus that he's not-- that he's not even going to be in attendance at the concert. If that is indeed the case, isn't it a bit disingenuous to keep repeating he actually is?

I've really got no dog in this hunt as I've neither chosen nor ruled out a candidate yet, but I can't really see any moral difference between praying with homophobic senators and failing to vet a homophobic singer...
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #85
115. Ah
The 'inevitability argument'

Probably the worst argument you could possibly make. A lot of front runners are 'inevitable' before the primaries. They don't have a good track record.

What I was taking issue with was the 'mental gymnastics' thing.

But again, Hillary is a corporate candidate and Obama is only slightly better in most regards. (except for the traveling around with a homophobe thing)
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #43
55. I think anybody can be a hypocrite, gays included
It's quite clear to me. Although it would be easier for me if I were politically correct and jumped every time the gay DUers ordered it.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #55
64. Isn't it Obama who's the hypocrite here?
Yes it is.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #64
69. He is now
Either kick the guy out or explain your purpose in keeping communication open. Don't kick somebody behind their back.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #69
77. Huh?
How are people kicking Obama from behind his back?

He brought THIS on HIMSELF, by being such a dumbass that he openly allows a Homophobe to take the stage with him....the BLAME lays SQUARELY with Barack Obama, he's shot himself in both feet.

Actually I'm going to make a prediction RIGHT NOW:

Barack Obama is done, stick a fork in him....his campaign is as dead as the Dodo, he ain't going to recover from HIS mistake....he's making it even worse for himself, by whining and telling people to stop criticising him....NOBODY likes an adult that acts like a whiney little baby.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #55
70. Huh? Your response is off topic.
Again: You made the assertion that the Obama stories are caused by or coming from the Clinton campaign. That suggests we (gay folks) don't have the ability to sort through issues, the right to our own anger and the personal capacity to respond to bigotry.

Goodbye - :hi:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #70
71. I suggest political opportunists lie
and I suggest that gays are not immune from being political opportunists and lying to support their candidate, as is so fucking clear by who is perpetuating all these Obama threads. It's obvious.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #55
126. Will you stop fucking generalizing about "gays" and "gay DUers"
as if we were some monolithic robot.

You write as if you are a monstrous bigot.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #126
186. maybe because she is?
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #43
65. (who am I ignoring here? lol)
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. I've lost half this thread, and I only have 5 people on ignore
guess I chose well!
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #66
89. I hope I'm not one of the 5? I'm actually rather charming :)
Yes I am!
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #89
91. I'll vouch for that :)
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #91
95. Aw
I think you're charming too Mr. Bluebear :toast:
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #89
96. No, you're good
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #96
105. Oh, shucks
Thanks :)

You're good too :)
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #65
73. sandnsea eom
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cuke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #73
86. I think I'll join you
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #73
93. Ah gracias.
Phew.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #65
146. Nobody important
But PM me if you really want to know.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #25
52. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ronnykmarshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #25
54. Yeah that's it.
Hillary did it!




Try the balance beam next, Olga!
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MODemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #25
61. Blame a Clinton for everything that goes wrong
Obama needs to take his own responsibility..He's a grown up for crying out loud. Sure these intitials were probably ment to draw attentionn to Hillary Rodham Cinton. That was the only reason
I read the post myself.:eyes:
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calteacherguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
98. Agreed. nt
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alteredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
157. Human Rights Campaign Statement on Sen. Obama’s South Carolina Gospel Tour
Human Rights Campaign Statement on Sen. Obama’s South Carolina Gospel Tour

WASHINGTON — Joe Solmonese, president of the Human Rights Campaign, the nation’s largest gay civil rights organization, released the following statement in response to Sen. Barack Obama’s South Carolina Gospel Tour featuring anti-gay gospel singer, Rev. Donnie McClurkin:

“I spoke with Sen. Barack Obama today and expressed to him our community’s disappointment for his decision to continue to remain associated with Rev. McClurkin, an anti-gay preacher who states the need to ‘break the curse of homosexuality.’ There is no gospel in Donnie McClurkin’s message for gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people and their allies. That’s a message that certainly doesn’t belong on any Presidential candidate’s stage.”

“I did thank him for announcing he would be adding an openly gay minister as part of the tour and for his willingness to call on religious leaders to open a dialogue about homophobia. We hope that Sen. Obama will move forward and facilitate face to face meetings with religious leaders, like Rev. McClurkin, and the GLBT community to confront the issue of homophobia.”

“We also call on all of the Presidential campaigns to look within their ranks of supporters and make the same commitment to engage in a dialogue among differing views around issues of equality and fairness for our community.”

Rev. McClurkin, an “ex-gay” gospel singer and minister who has called homosexuality a “curse”, has repeatedly stated his opposition to homosexuality as being against “the intention of God.”

On August 9, Sen. Obama joined the leading Democratic presidential candidates in addressing issues important to the GLBT community at the Logo/HRC Foundation presidential forum in Los Angeles. During his interview with panelists Joe Solmonese, singer/activist Melissa Etheridge, and journalists Margaret Carlson and Jonathan Capehart, Sen. Obama addressed the issue of homophobia in the black church.

The Human Rights Campaign is America’s largest civil rights organization working to achieve gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender equality. By inspiring and engaging all Americans, HRC strives to end discrimination against GLBT citizens and realize a nation that achieves fundamental fairness and equality for all


http://www.hrc.org/news/7949.htm
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
4. HRC = Human Rights Campaign
I thought the title meant Hillary until I read further, of course.

I'm never sure what to make of blog entries particularly when they attribute quotes (without actually posting documentation of these quotes). This isn't a particularly well-sourced piece.

That said, there is no question Obama now knows the score. It is his move.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Ooooh the HRC was a bonus LOL . . .
Nobody has been in the forefront here more than you asking your candidate to do the right thing, AK. Bravo.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. *
:spank:

Cheers! :beer:
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
9. WTF? If this is the decision, then why not just get the hell out of the race.
This has gone from a campaign slip-up to intentional, knowing embrace of homophobia by the candidate on the theory that black folks hate the gay... it's like an avalanche of bad decisions.

The easiest way to prevent the Human Rights Campaign from criticizing Obama was to cancel the event, not try to pressure them.

How complicated is that?

He has ripped the scab off a gay/religious-black rift in the party for no reason. UNITY!!! Politics of hope my ass.


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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. The Homophobic MoFo should be DROPPED and PRONTO
Democrats in general do NOT embrace any sort of Homophobia nor do they take the stage with an ACKNOWLEDGED Homophobe.

Homophobia and Homophobes are NOT WELCOME ANYWHERE near the Democratic Party....Obama needs to dump this asshat from the roadtrip.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. How ironic -
The finest bit of triangulation I have ever seen and it involves a group that uses a triangle as a unity symbol.
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William769 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
14. Well bigots do like to intimidate.
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
15. I don't know what the hell Obama's thinking,
but it's way past time to jettison this creep. No matter how many SC votes he picks up, he's damaging his credibility IMO.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
16. Yeah he can bring in homophobic ones
(in reference "The perspective is that he can bring in different elements of the Democratic Party and American society," the Obama supporter said.)


And I don't want that in my party. But if that's how he wants to win. :eyes:
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. "See? I can bring in the gays AND the ones who hate them!"
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 04:44 PM by Bluebear
:silly:
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. You never know.
It's easy to hate the unknown. There are a lot of bisexuals or closeted gays in the black community who are in a relationship with women and who cheat on those women. If your experience of gays is of people who are self-hating, in self denial and/or cheating on their significant other, you aren't going to have a good opinion of gays. Seeing a strong, proud person who is openly gay may be a wake-up call for a lot of people.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. So McClurkin will see this "unnamed" gay preacher & have an epiphany?
"Hey I *CAN* be myself!"

Don't hold your breath, it's part of his ex-gay schtick now :)
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. I wasn't referring to McClurkin.I was referring to the people who come to hear
him sing and get exposed to the gay preacher. I don't expect any epiphanies, just one step at a time.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Then the shame is that the 'ex-gay' is being presented at all.
I would agree and embrace your scenario if Obama presented this yet-to-be-named openly gay preacher without the counterpoint of the ex-gay homophobe. If The gay preacher was opening the show and people could see the proud black gay minister as an ambassador, it would be wonderful. As it stands, he is only being recruited for damage control :(
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. I don't think Obama set out to hire an "ex-gay" I think he set
out to hire a popular Gospel singer.

One thought that no one has raised; does anyone think that McClurkin would have been hired if he was known by everyone to be "ex-gay". The fact that he was hired suggests to me that for a lot of people he is only a good Gos[el singer.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
37. please read this link and see if it changes your mind:
This guy isn't just some gospel singer.

If Bush should have dissociated himself from McClurkin, how can Obama be held to a different standard?

http://www.hrc.org/issues/2031.htm
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #18
45. Right. Let's beef up the party with bigots.
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 05:21 PM by seasonedblue
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #45
49. yes and then lets get all mad when people point out "Hey you have bigots in your party"
lets put them up on stage and have them perform!
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #49
109. Then let's call everyone who mentions it "bashers"!
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #109
118. not question and don't forget to try and divert attention to the other candidates
flaws.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
17. Oh my God. I'm at a loss.
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SaveElmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
21. If McClurkin was at all concerned about Obama's campaign...
He would drop himself out of the event...
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #21
26. you're correct.
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 05:05 PM by chimpsrsmarter
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. Excellent point. nt
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #21
31. Agreed
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #21
33. That's right,
and Obama probably should approach him to do it, if he doesn't budge himself.
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bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #21
152. McClurkin and Obama are very clearly using each other - those who
fail to recognize that obviously don't want to take their partisan blinders off!
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
28. If this had happened to my candidate, I would want him to come out and say
Look, we didn't vet this guy and it was our fault. We honestly didn't have any idea of his views on GLBT issues, and we've asked him to not participate in the event. We apologize for not being aware and hope our record on GLBT issues will speak to our support. Or something along those lines.

The way this was handled is painful and embarrassing to watch - and the recruiting of a gay minister is transparent and pitiable. It hasn't been addressed honestly and openly.

I understand Obama hasn't been through the campaign wringer before, but his large war chest should have been able to pay for the top campaign advisors available.

I'm sorry this has happened to him.


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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #28
38. Yes, there is nothing happy about it
But he could have ended this days ago.

His clinging to this guy demonstrates that this wasn't a campaign oversight. I assumed it was, but I was wrong.

The Obama campaign is FIGHTING to keep this guy on the bill. Why? It looks more and more like a strategy, not a vetting error.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #28
57. He has deounced the views of this singer dude
It's not enough and nothing he says will be enough because this is politically motivated, period.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #57
60. so denounce his views but have him perform anyway? That makes zero sense at all.
there was no other popular gospel singer that he could have gotten?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #60
83. Reject 75% of SC blacks????
That's what you're suggesting he do. Most religious people, especially southern religious people, disapprove of homosexuals. Why aren't other Democrats being called on to reject all these voters? Why don't we have a questionnaire for every southerner before they get on stage with a Democrat?

This whole thing is the biggest load of bullshit the Clinton and Edwards people have concocted yet. We're going to lose next year, and after this primary, we deserve to.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #83
90. We're going to lose because Obama had poor judgment? SC people need to have
their negative views of homosexuality confirmed by a gospel singer?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #90
124. No, because Democrats don't get it
Because the mudslinging has continued, because no one wants Hillary but we can't hear it because nobody is listening to voters we lost in the 90's. Voters who don't care about what some gospel singer thinks about gays.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #124
127. really? Maybe the sc voters that need their antigay views reinforced "don't get it"
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #127
139. That WAS addressed, I already said that
Since it WAS, and IS, the singer isn't relevant. Nobody is going to have a perfect set of beliefs on every issue.

The people making a hoopla over this are doing it for political purposes, this thread makes that crystal clear. In my book, they are as flawed as this singer who doesn't understand homosexuality. I can't fucking stand hypocritical liars who are actually exploiting the people they pretend to care about; all for a political agenda. It's putrid.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #57
76. Yep. And it's painful to watch. nt
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
35. What was the problem of simply dropping McClurkin?
Jesus Christ, the guy isn't running for Illinois State Senate...he's running for President of the United States. This seriously is amateur hour.

This whole thing is turning into a colossal fuckup. Now, you've got this situation where they've got some delusional idea that the GLBT grassroots supporters are supposed to bombard the HRC into not criticizing this whole thing. As if that's going to happen. I'm a HRC member and I'm sure as hell not going to email Joe Solomose(sp) and tell him not to criticize Obama. That's naivete taken to a whole new level.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. i wish i knew, i'm starting to think Obama thinks he can pretty much do whatever
he wants to with no repercussions. It's not like he doesn't know about this fools statements and i don't care that he's only singing, he stills represents as a friend of the Senators.
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MalloyLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #36
134. Sounds familiar
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
39. I doubt they want to hear a Big Dog quote at this moment in time, but..
"When you find yourself in a hole, quit digging."
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FlaxieB Donating Member (359 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
40. Come on people. This is politics and all candidates supports the gay community.
Obama is not doing anything that Hillary, Edwards or any of the other Dem candidates has already or will do to support their campaigns. One religious american has a viewpoint on gay america, whether that person claims to be gay or not. What's the big deal? To keep discussing this "Donnie McClurkin" thing is total nonsense and total waste of computer time. Please, just move on.

Gay people make up a portion of the population of the U.S. and they are not going anywhere, along with illegals and other groups. Complain all you want and criticize Obama's decision but guess what, The next Prez has to govern the gay community's concerns also, along with yours and mine, and any other group's affiliation, despite his personal beliefs. Everyone looking at his personal stance. A Prez leadership is strictly professional and unlike Bush, he will do the right and proper thing when he obtains office. Everyone is in a continuous loop over McClurkin. Just deal with it.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. Recommend. Brilliant satire of these "Just deal with it." clowns
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. no. Deal with it.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #40
50. Obama is actually telling supporters to tell HRC NOT TO CRITICISE HIM
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 05:25 PM by Lirwin2
When have Hillary, Edwards, or any of the other Dem candidates done that?
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #40
56. I'm convinced that heteros just don't get this.
Seriously. I'm sorry I'm generalizing, but that's the only explanation I can think of. A serious Democratic (hey, we're not talking Mitt Romney here) candidate for President of the United States is featuring a disgusting bigot who talking of homosexuality as a "curse" and is a proponent of the "ex-gay" movement, which I can guarantee you GLBT people see as loathsome, sickening, shameful bigotry. And we're supposed to just "get over this"? It's just "politics as usual"?

FUCK THAT.

I'm sorry if I insulted our hetero friends who DO understand our anger. But I'm getting very, very tired of reading these "what is your problem?" posts about this.
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cuke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #56
94. No insult taken here
though it's been so long, I may not qualify as a heterosexual anymore
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denem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #56
104. Some of us get if only too well
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bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #56
154. Not all heteros - I'm straight, and I've been appalled by it ever since
I heard about it (this past Sunday, I think)...

I don't want the GLBT community to feel they're alone in the wilderness on this!
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #40
58. He'll do the right thing once he gets in office?
Like he's doing the right thing now?

Yeah yeah, I know. STFU and get under the bus you uppity gays. :eyes:
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #40
63. Thats why he will not be elected
The next Prez has to govern the gay community's concerns


He's not dealing with them now... so I don't see how magically he will start dealing with them if he is elected.

There is a huge difference in reaching out and making a buck on someone who's a bigot. That is not leadership - that's selling out.
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FlaxieB Donating Member (359 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #63
72. He is not selling out. He is reaching out to others. in the Democratic community
We all may not agree of all things. However, we are all democrats. The next Prez has to govern ALL citizens of America concerns. Not just Gay, Not just African Americans, Not just Whites, Not just Hispanics. All of the American people.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #72
74. He is "reaching out" to homophobes. What's next, neonazis?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #74
79. Hey now, those poor guys are just "different elements".
Why do you hate America?
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #72
78. So what's next reaching out to men who "circumcise" women ?
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 05:51 PM by FreeState
So what's next reaching out to men who "circumcise" women by having them stand on stage with you to raise awareness to the democratic vision?

Give me break.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #78
80. Wife beaters:
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #80
84. OMG, I had no idea... wow, doesn't he vet anyone? N/T
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #72
82. What about child molesters, tax cheats, wife beaters...
America is full of all those folks.

Political compromise can be a good thing.

Compromise of basic moral positions is not.

If this was about race it would be so obvious... you would never be saying this stuff about a singer who said "the blacks are trying to kill our children"

What gay people are saying is, our human rights are no different from the rights of black people, hispanics, women, or any other group whose humanity is being challenged and denied.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
67. "Please, just move on." "Just deal with it" - you forgot "Lighten up"
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #67
81. thicker skin. nt.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #81
87. Yeah, I see you had quiche for lunch . . .
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #87
97. ?. nt.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #97
100. ---> :)
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #100
103. I've really held back....I don't see how you can be so patient. nt.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #103
107. It must be the Paxil LOLOL!
Edited on Wed Oct-24-07 06:09 PM by Bluebear
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #107
120. give 'em hell bro. nt.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #40
140. I like how you graciously pair gay people with "illegals", too.
:eyes:
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FlaxieB Donating Member (359 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #140
142. There are residents of the U.S. and the next Prez will govern them.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #142
172. Why did you choose to pair gay people with illegal immigrants?
What led to that odd comparison?
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FlaxieB Donating Member (359 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #172
193. Each social, political and religious group has their own set of issues
and concerns and each group wants this voices heard and their issues resolved. We all belong to some group or way of thinking. The next Prez will have to address those issues along with all issues of the american government. The Prez's personal views are not relevant in matter affecting this country, it his job to do what's best and just. Unlike Bush,I hope that clarity will prevail. That's the comparison.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #193
201. Okay
I just thought it was a rather curious comparison is all.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #40
167. What do gay people have to do with illegal immigrants exactly?
A pretty bizarre comparison there from you....care to elaborate on your thinking?

Re. Criticize Obama....haven't you heard, Obama The Thin Skinned has issued a statement that NOBODY is allowed to criticise him anymore.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #40
178. What do gay people have to do with "illegal" immigrants?
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #178
183. Do we hear the sound of cricket's chirping? Yep, we do n/t
.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
130. I'm surprised no one has brought up "the children"
n/t
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #130
171. Yeah.....WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?!!!! There I brought it up for you
:P
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MalloyLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
133. Yeah the homophobic Dems...no thanks.
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Baby Snooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:43 PM
Response to Original message
141. What a vision
An openly gay minister and an openly anti-gay minister. Something for everyone? Obama should just start sending the checks back.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #141
145. Is that kind of like matter and anti-matter colliding, you think they'll...
annihilate each other?
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:55 PM
Response to Original message
144. I Have Some Questions
I have scrupulously avoided the bashathon because I don't want to see my candidate bashed...

1) Where did the figure that seventy five percent of African American folks in the south hate gays? I have seen that figure tossed around in this thread...

2) I don't see a nexus between praying with a senator who might or not be a homophobe and taking one one on tour... Can someone show me that nexus...
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denem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #144
147. The 75% figure first appeared
in a thread by a poster who apparently has inside ties with the Obama campaign:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3635763&mesg_id=3635893
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #147
148. Interesting. I wonder what percentage of whites find same-sex sex "somewhat unacceptable"
That seems like an odd view for a serious homophobe... why not go with very unacceptable?

I'm not sure that figure is wildly out of line with other constituencies. (I don't know)
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denem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #148
155. Obama's campaign only had to google McClurkin and Republican to rule him out
It's such basic stuff. I've been very angry, now I am sad. The "you're either with us or against us" meme stirs dark, hurtful passions. It was all so unnecessary, but a salutary reminder why we need a totally professional campaign.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #144
150. Google it
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=poll+blacks+homosexuality

As if people don't know this. :eyes:

And if I had to choose between weekly religious meetings with the homophobic senators who actually write the laws - and a gospel singer - well it would be obvious to anybody who is being honest with themselves. But there's no such thing in this country anymore, it's all people who will say any damn thing to support their candidate or political agenda.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #150
151. "people who will say any damn thing to support their candidate "
Ah, sweet irony.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #151
153. I'm not happy with any of them
Obama is being way too timid with Hillary, he isn't being bold enough about the kind of change this country needs. He is too timid on issues of foreign policy and poverty and racism and even this particular issue. Either get bold or go home. Stand up and tell everybody what you're doing and if you can't make it clear to everybody, then that's no kind of change I want.

But supporters of other candidates manipulated what he is trying to accomplish and I'm not going to be quiet about that either. I'm sick of this phony political bullshit.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #144
162. My response to # 2
Admittedly, it's a pretty tenuous analogy, but it could be argued that a gospel concert is nothing more than communal prayer put to music. Thus, it could be said that Obama is simply praying with McClurkin as Clinton was with Santorum. The main difference that could be argued is that the concert is public while the prayer group is private.

On the other hand, consider that a regular prayer group of powerful United States Senators is a a far different animal than the one at your local church. I submit that Clinton's participation in that prayer circle may have far deeper ramifications than the Obama campaign having a homophobic closet case sing for a few thousand people at a concert in SC. Especially since it's highly doubtful he was going to use that particular platform to advance his views on the subject. Then again, I'm pretty sure homosexuality didn't come up much in the prayer group either. So who knows? :shrug:

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alteredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
163. What's so "secret" about It?
I'd swear I'm reading a Freeper thread.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #163
164. teLL me about it
i can't beLieve sandnsea is aLLowed to post this shit. :puke:
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alteredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #164
166. It ain't sandnsea...
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:08 PM
Response to Reply #166
168. no, i speLLed it right
do you have her on ignore maybe? those posts are reaLLy quite awfuL.

i'm gLad she doesn't support DK as it wouLd make him, and possibLy his supporters Look reaLLy fucking bad.
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #168
174. Those posts are some of the ugliest I've ever seen here.
I alerted and I'm glad to see some of them have been deleted.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #168
176. Sorry I might be dim, but, can you tell me why you've
Got those capital L's like that?
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JackBeck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 12:27 AM
Response to Reply #176
179. It's included in the LGBT agenda initiation package.
Membership has its privileges.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:54 AM
Response to Reply #179
181. Hot Damn!
"It's included in the LGBT agenda initiation package. Membership has its privileges."


I'm a straight female....are you trying to entice me to turn gay or something?!

Do I have to turn gay to FIND out about the capital "L's", is that what you're saying?



:sarcasm: :P
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #179
188. who/what am i missing?
ooh, ooh, don't teLL me.

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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #188
202. MORE IMPORTANTLY....
Who/What AM I missing?

:popcorn:
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #163
177. I agree, the McClurkin apologists are disgusting.
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...of J.Temperance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:56 AM
Response to Reply #177
182. It's totally mind-boggling is what it is
Why would anyone want to be a McClurkin apologist for heck's sake?
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 09:54 PM
Response to Original message
175. There is absolutely no way that I can support Obama if McCloset is on the program.
Homophobia is not something that Obama should be courting. By allowing him to perform for his campaign he is giving McCloset a platform. McCloset is a known homophobe. I cannot believe that Obama will not tell McCloset to take a hike.
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 12:30 AM
Response to Original message
180. Geez, I'm thick
I thought they were trying to get Hillary Rodham Clinton to stop criticize him. Fat chance I thought.

Oh THAT HRC. That's very different.

Nevermind.
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Mass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #180
187. Yes, I made the same error. I also did not read the thread throrougly.
Hypocrisy makes me mad. If it was Clinton (or Edwards) having McClurkin singing for them, 3/4 of the posters posting in this thread would be posting the other way around. And some people do not seem to care about the hypocrisy.

Obama and his supporters have made the bad call by not making clear inviting McClurkin was an error, but some of the calls on the other side are just not credible at all.
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 10:32 AM
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192. Not much of a secret. nt
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DemFemme Donating Member (315 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
199. We're supposed to believe an unnamed "source" of John "I Love Hillary" Aravosis?
There is NO PROOF of this rumor at all.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:17 PM
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200. there remains ZERO evidence that Obama told supporters to call the HRC
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