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The Big DU "Blow Out"- Insanity? Full Moon?Exploding Gas?

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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:08 PM
Original message
The Big DU "Blow Out"- Insanity? Full Moon?Exploding Gas?
Edited on Thu May-12-05 08:25 PM by LibraLiz1973
Wow. Just wow. I hadn’t done a thorough reading of any DU threads in a few days, so coming back to find the lounge “walls” re-decorated with bloodstains instead of color by numbers paintings was a real surprise.

I read Skinner’s post from yesterday and I empathized. He made what I felt were some very salient points. It is a part of the human experience to come across cliques and feel unappreciated. How many of you have felt that you are on the outside of something trying to get in? I understood immediately that Skinner wasn’t really addressing his post to the Lounge as a whole; rather, to a certain element of the lounge that was getting out of hand. Reminding people to exercise humility and humanity isn’t wrong. I was shocked to see how many people responded negatively to Skinner’s post, particularly those who went out of their way to make it about THEM. I don’t think Skinner was trying to get personal with anyone. My interpretation of the post was that it was a call for decency, caring, understanding and inclusion.

When I look at DU I see a place for all Democrats interested in discussing, understanding & working to change the process. How disturbing must it be to be the creator/owner of something (that you started with the best intentions ) that is spiraling out of control? I can only imagine. I have not seen as much of a problem here at DU as many of you posted that you had. Of course I’ve been here for a considerably shorter period of time than most of you. But I was disturbed to see all the finger pointing that went on in that thread. While some of the responses were thoughtful, articulate & thought provoking, several were down right obnoxious. “You think the Lounge is bad? Head over to GD”. Was that supposed to make Skinner feel better? Because I can’t imagine that it would have. Instead of coming together (& pointing out that 98% of us are here because we believe in the party & the DU Community) it became a cesspool of anger and vitriolic spew.

I don’t know about you, but I’m not here to work toward becoming Miss DU 2005. I think most of us are here with the best of intentions and with a genuine interest in discussion and learning. Meeting quality people with similar interests is the cherry on top of the DU experience. In the short time that I have been here I have actually learned things that I would not otherwise have heard or read about. It’s amazing what a wonderful melting pot of passionate ideas DU is!

The final part of Skinner’s post really touched me. I had a similar experience growing up. I grew up poor & on food stamps, with a father in jail for rape. I was gawky and did not have self confidence. People made fun of my clothes, my house & the fact that my lunch tickets were a different color than theirs. As I grew older my mother got a better job and we were no longer on welfare. I fought to become popular & by the end of high school I was at the top of the popularity chain. Emotionally I paid a heavy price for that. I became a shallow, obnoxious person for about a year there as I struggled to “prove” myself to the “cool kids”. I did and said things during that time that humiliate me to this day. There is nothing to be proud of in preying on people in order to be the top dog.

For the most part DU is a great place to be. The thing to remember is that there will not be a vote on who gets which superlative. The prize is that we all have the ability to log in and talk to each other & learn about what’s going on outside our own little cities & towns. It’s natural to make friends, some closer than others. It’s unnatural to create an elite group that dominates the rest of the crowd.

I’m sending a big hearty wave & a firm handshake to all of you. New or old (to the DU environment) I hope to talk to all of you!

:dem:
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Bronco69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. What a great post!
Welcome to DU! :-) Personally, I've never been part of a clique and I never will. I'm just me, take it or leave it.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Thanks Bronco!
You sound like fun & I'll take you, not leave you!
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
3. A funny thing I just learned.
If my user name were different, there would have been more than 1 response to this thread!

lol
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Bronco69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. ROFL!
Get used to it. I can't tell you how many threads I haven't gotten a reply to. :-)
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. LOL.
Mayhap the lounge clique really DOES exist. Here I was thinking it was 88% urban legend
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. P.S>
On the upside, I am in good company!
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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
5. Thanks LL!
Very thoughtful and thought-provoking too!

:hi:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Thanks Zomby!
:patriot:
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morningglory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
7. You cool! Appreciate the thread! n/t
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Thanx MorningGlory!
:toast:
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Amaya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
10. Best post I've read in a very long time
Thank you :)
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Thank you Amaya.
I enjoy reading your posts too!
I especially love the pix of your cats. Huge but beautifuL!
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
13. Good post. I like the way you think.
I don't get too upset about the clique thing because I've noticed over time that it's usually DUers that have met in person at a meet-up and have a personal connection. I've never felt that it was meant to be exclusionary, they just don't know me.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. True. Some of the closeness
can definately be attributed to the personal meetings.


Perhaps we should push for a national meet up?
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Buns_of_Fire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #14
25. A National DU Meetup! Great idea!
In that spirit, I humbly nominate your place. :evilgrin: (Any beer will be okay, but I'm personally partial to Guinness. I don't eat much. Anything with pepperoni will be just fine, thanks.)

Excellent post, BTW. :hi: I don't worry. I wouldn't want to be part of any clique that would have me as a member, anyway. (Me and Groucho.)
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #25
56. Guinness & pepperoni?
That would explain the Buns of Fire, alright.
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wakemeupwhenitsover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
15. excellent points.
I rarely visit the lounge since I don't get the insider jokes & frankly, am bored by a lot of the juvenile behavior and cliques.

Unfortunately I see the same cliques forming in GD, GDP, etc., but there's so much good on DU & so many good DU'ers trying to make a difference.

best

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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. I think inside jokes are fine- as long as
Edited on Thu May-12-05 08:51 PM by LibraLiz1973
there is every effort for inclusion. If the inside jokes are for "insiders" only and can not be explained to the General Public that makes it PM material.. or material to be posted on the "Cool Clique Members Only " blog.
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In_The_Wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
16. Well done ~ LibraLiz1973
:hi:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Thanks Joan!
:toast:
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
19. A very good evening to you, LL!
I think your points are very well taken and put! We all have friends here, as do I, but I try to be friendly to all I come across...I always cringe whenever I read something unfriendly. I hope that you and I will have good things to talk about down the road. You sure have started off well...

WELCOME TO DU!


:hi:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Thank you CAPeggy
Sounds as if we have some things in common!

Thank you for the welcome, it is appreciated!
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
21. Beautifully put, LibraLiz1973
For some reason - "walls" re-decorated with bloodstains instead of color by numbers paintings - part made me laugh. I probably shouldn't have considering how accurate it was, but I did anyway. :)
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usedtobesick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
22. as a newbie also...
thanks, I've only been on a month or two and really haven't seen any of the flaming. Most people have been fun and helpful. It really has been pretty cool place to learn about the dark side just coming out of a 12 step program for recovering republicans. intheflow thought this might be a safe place for me to get acclimated. Turns out not all of you are as crazy as I was taught. Come on in the waters fine...
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Elidor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
23. Skinner means well
He has the unenviable position of having footsteps weighted with virtual godhood, and he doesn't understand sometimes just how much his footsteps reverberate. He's not used to being a god, and he doesn't want to be. But his words carry much more weight here than anyone else's. I've seen him cause several minor ruckuses with casually-chosen words. But he is a very benevolent person. And I think that shines through in most of what he says here.
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MajorFlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
24. Welcome to DU.
:applause:
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
26. LibraLiz, we're so glad you're here
Welcome to DU.

:hug:

Julie
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SarahB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
27. Here here!
:toast:
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RevCheesehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
28. anyone have a link?
Geez, ya miss three days, and it's like a whole new world.
WTF is going on here??
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Rev, I'll find the link, but all the worst posts were deleted.
The ones that inspired Skinner to get involved.
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. Here it is.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=3232597&mesg_id=3232597
I was reading it today, and someone posted a cartoon picture of someone riding a whale. Needless to say there were haha post right after.
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RevCheesehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:30 AM
Response to Reply #31
33. thanks for the links.
I know others have said this casually, but this IS the kind of stuff that makes the little baby Jesus cry.

And I am damned glad to see Skinner speak out. The guilty parties know who they are - and, IMO, are living on borrowed time. Why Skinner doesn't tombstone them is beyond me. :shrug:
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #33
34. I think there was a lot of hurt and anger involved.
I lurk a lot, and I don't see any victims here. At all.
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Technowitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-05 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
30. Reading stuff like this gives me hope for DU. Thank you.
I really appreciate the time you put into this... you certainly brightened my day.

best
-Technowitch
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #30
38. Thank you for your kind words Techno!!
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progmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
32. welcome to DU
and thanks for the great post!

:hi:
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:43 AM
Response to Original message
35. Thank you. We're definitely on the same page/wavelength.
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southlandshari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:59 AM
Response to Original message
36. Welcome to DU!
You are a wonderful addition to our community!

:hi:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. Thank you Southlandshari
I really appreciated your thoughts as well. Thank you for the terrific job that you & the rest of the moderator crew do here on DU.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 02:06 AM
Response to Original message
37. handshake and wave back at ya!
:hi:
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Bullwinkle925 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
40. Very eloquent! My sentiments as well.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
41. A heartfelt thank you to everyone who responded
It was really kind of so many of you to post in this thread or PM me. I am happy to be part of a community that makes people feel so welcome!
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FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
42. Thank you!
Funny, I missed much of the brou-ha-ha, but as for complaints that GD is a snake-pit while the Lounge is a friendly haven--I must have missed that too because I usually feel much more welcome in GD.

I caught your post just as I was feeling conspicuously left out of something else. Synchronicity?

:hi:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. I enjoy both GD and the Lounge.
I think there are great people in BOTH areas & I like reading/posting in each one. There is alot that can be learned around DU. I have not had a negative experience here yet since joining~ and it is my hope that I wont. But if I do I will only hold the person(s) responsible accountable.. Not an entire board.

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FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #43
50. Hope I didn't sound like I was critisizing an entire board....
I was just making a general comparison of my experiences in both.

And there are many marvelous people in all of the areas here. REally so many people whom I admire, for various reasons--beautiful writing, level=headedness, knowledge, humor. Many many cool people.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Thank you fizz fuzz!
Don't feel left out. It's an inclusive community!
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FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #44
54. aww gee, I feel a little silly now--was having a "moment"
But your post is still great! (I had a real hellish experience too, growing up as an outcast and with abuse so I do switch into victim mentality at times.)

:toast:
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Longgrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:28 PM
Response to Original message
45. Hi Liz don't let any of the trouble you've been hearing lately deter you.
Edited on Fri May-13-05 06:30 PM by Longgrain
Most of us here in the Lounge are just regular folks who just want to get to know each other better. We have fun, make jokes, sometimes tease each other, and sometimes even meet in the real world.

Get to know us, where a hell of a good group of folks.

On edit, regarding the paintings on the walls, I have some original art to sell. It's much nicer than blood.
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #45
46. Thats been my experience so far Longgrain!
I've talked to some really interesting people since my arrival- including you. I'm hoping to get to one of those real life meetings someday!
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Longgrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Thanks, I think I remember running into you a couple times...
Tho after this post, I'm sure it won't be the last.

:toast:
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LibraLiz1973 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. We will meet again
Young Skywalker...




:toast:
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Parche Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
49. blow out
I will drink to that!!!!
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TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
51. HI!
Sometimes I think there are two or three DUs here.

Like a lot of boards and froups, this one has gotten large and little subgroups have formed-- call them cliques if you want to.

Years ago I used to get into these little cliques and flamewars on Usenet, but what a waste of energy. Over what? Some electrons making words on a screen from someone I never met and probably never will?

I made the amazing discovery that it's actually easier to simply not reply. So what if a couple of people think I "lost" or chickened out?

Aside from the regular flareups here, most people here are like you. This place is a community that sometimes has its problems but the really good people are often the ones you don't hear from much. They don't respond to the trolls and flames, but just get down to business.

I've met a lot of DUers at various gatherings and parties, maybe a hundred or so, and I've got nothing but good to say about every one of them. The real people behind the electrons, not the trolls or psychopaths that some place this big will have its share of, are good people.

(Most of the time, it's simply best to stay out of the long threads, 'specially the long threads in the Lounge.)


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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
52. All families have arguments - and if they settle them wisely, they are
stronger and closer for it.

DU is a great place to be, I agree most heartily. And it is making a difference! See this post:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3651186
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Serial Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
53. Thank you for a really great post
It is something I would have liked to say, but couldn't without coming across as defensive for very specific reasons.

Anyway, I think too many view this as a "chat room" instead of a forum to discuss, not just pop one short answer after another.

But I do love the silliness that shows up in the Lounge.
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kikiek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
55. Very well put and thanks for saying it.
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
57. Take it from someone...
Edited on Fri May-13-05 08:16 PM by Hell Hath No Fury
who has been here a l-o-n-g time -- this is what happens on DU periodically. When I first came onboard it was the Green/DEM flame wars, then the invasion of the Deaniacs, then the madness that was the primaries, the invasion of the Clarkies -- and that's leaving out the 100 or so miniwars over particular issues.

Someone is always feeling hurt/ignored/insulted/flamed on DU -- always.

I have always said that this place is not a tea party -- it is a place for strong debate and the challenging of positions. And I promise you that a some point in your DU life you will feel hurt/ignored/insulted/flamed -- that is the nature of political debate and the nature of DU. And thank heavens for that. :)

Just keep riding the wars out, keep engaged, and keep your skin thick -- that's my attidtude about DU. Maybe it's from being raised in San Francisco, where the earth rips under my feet periodically and it feels like the end of the world, but at the end of the day, life goes on. And so do you.

And so does DU. :hi:

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concord Donating Member (296 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #57
64. Excellent advice
Edited on Sat May-14-05 07:43 PM by concord
and analysis. Thank you :)

I learned early that this was a hard-hitting forum, which is mainly why I lurk. But I appreciate it mostly because it IS a place for strong debate, where people insist on facts to back up arguments. It's those facts, arguments, debates which provide the information I so desperately lacked when I first showed up here.

Every community has growing pains, and a life span. As far as I can tell, DU will be around for a long time. That is, unless bushCo finds a way to shut it down.

Infiltration into organizations, especially churches is SOP for the bushCo machine today. It's very effective and worth being on the lookout for.

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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
58. Hey LibraLiz1973. Just saw your post and wanted to thank you and
compliment you on your eloquence and thoughtfulness.
I have been a "DUer" since October and in general I find it to be a great place. Like all families, there are moments when things get a bit rough, but the good outweighs the negative 1,000,000 to 1.
Welcome, and I do look forward to future conversations. :hi:
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Melynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
59. Great post
The problem right now for DU is that right wingers have infiltrated the forum and are trying to destroy the forum from within. This is a big problem.
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RagingInMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #59
63. I don't buy that
Sure there loads of trolls here who would love to think they have the capability of destroying DU, but it will never happen.

DU has the same issues that any organization with almost 70,000 members has: Disagreements, conflicts, jealousy, favoritism, cliques, outcasts, troublemakers and peacemakers.

Hopefully, most of us have the capability of learning tolerance through the smorgasbord of personalities we have here.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
60. Thanks For Sharing. And HEY! I Make It A Practise To Post On Threads
that aren't getting mucho attention. :)

Also do same on other forums I visit too.

Guess it's all a matter of how much time you want to invest in keeping up with the crowd. I found it exhausting in real life around 10 years ago.
:grouphug:
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RagingInMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
61. Hi LibraLiz1973
I've been seeing some of your post around and you strike me as a very straight from the heart person. I like that.
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TheProphetess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-14-05 06:40 PM
Response to Original message
62. You've hit the nail on the head
Thank you for doing it so eloquently. Nice job! :hug:
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