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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:37 PM
Original message
Catholics "disciplined" by John Paul II
John Paul was no friend to the left:

Fr. Jacques Pohier: A French Dominican priest, he was the first theologian to be disciplined by Pope John Paul II. In 1979 Pohier, the dean of the theology faculty at the Dominican theological school near Paris, lost his license to teach theology, was banned from saying Mass or participating in any liturgical gatherings. The Vatican objected to his views on Christ’s resurrection. He left the Dominicans in 1984.

Fr. Hans Küng: A Vatican investigation into the writings of this Swiss-born theologian began in 1975. He lost his license to teach Catholic theology in 1979 after the Vatican found fault with his views on papal infallibility. He continued to teach at the University of Tübingen as a professor of ecumenical theology.

Fr. Edward Schillebeeckx: A Belgian Dominican, he was the theologian of the Dutch bishops at the Second Vatican Council (1962-65) and has endured several Vatican investigations. He was initially investigated in 1968 for questioning the virginity of Mary. The Dutch hierarchy, clergy and laity rallied to his defense, and Fr. Karl Rahner, who himself would be investigated, convinced the Vatican of Schillebeeckx’s orthodoxy. In 1979, a trial or “procedure” was convened to investigate his writings on Christology. In the face of an international campaign of protest against the trial, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith dropped the matter in 1980. He has since received several “notifications” from the congregation that his writings remain in conflict with church teaching.

Fr. Charles Curran: Once a professor of moral theology at the Catholic University of America, Curran lost his license to teach theology in 1986 because the Vatican did not approve of his views on sexuality and medical ethics. He currently teaches at Southern Methodist University. He is a member of the NCR board of the directors.

Leonardo Boff: A Brazilian Franciscan and one of the most famous proponents of liberation theology, Boff was investigated by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in 1981. The Vatican objected to his views on Christology and the structure of the church. Boff was silenced for a year in 1985. Boff enjoyed the support of his religious order and two of Brazil’s cardinals, Aloisio Lorscheider and Evaristo Arns, but he was silenced again in 1991. In 1992 Boff left the Franciscans and the priesthood.

Fr. Anthony Kosnik: A priest of the Detroit archdiocese, he was forced to leave his teaching position at Sts. Cyril and Methodius Seminary because he co-authored a Catholic Theological Society study called Human Sexuality. The Vatican disliked the study’s theology and Kosnik was pressured to resign in 1982. Seminarians and faculty threatened to boycott the school’s spring commencement if Kosnik was not reinstated. He got his job back, but was forced to resign the next year.

Fr. Gustavo Gutiérrez: Often called the “father of liberation theology,” Gutiérrez has had to face numerous investigations by the Vatican. In 1983, the Peruvian bishops received a notification from the Vatican containing 10 complaints about Gutiérrez’s writings. They declined the request to condemn them. The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued instructions in 1984 and 1986 that criticized certain aspects of liberation theology. In 1988, the congregation began another investigation of Gutiérrez. Nothing came of any of these investigations. In 2001 Gutiérrez joined the French province of the Dominicans in a move that was seen as an attempt to distance himself from the conservative Cardinal Juan Luis Cipriani Thorne, the conservative archbishop of Lima.

Fr. Karl Rahner: Considered one of the most influential theologians of the 20th century, Rahner spent much of his career under Vatican scrutiny. John XXIII had him silenced and was extremely critical of his writings. Under Paul VI, he was rehabilitated and his theology greatly influenced the Second Vatican Council, where he served as an expert for the German bishops. In his later years, he was very critical of the conservative direction the church had taken under John Paul II. The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith took issue with Rahner’s views about priestly ordination, contraception and his doctrine of the “anonymous Christian.” After his death in 1984, a gradual reassessment of Rahner’s theology took place, and by the time of his centenary in 2004, the secretary to the prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith declared Rahner to be “an orthodox theologian.”

Fr. Matthew Fox: A former Dominican priest, his views on sexuality, original sin, and pantheism attracted the notice of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in 1983. His work was reviewed by a panel of fellow Dominicans and cleared. However, he was silenced by his superiors after the congregation found fault with his views. In 1993 he was expelled from the Dominican order after refusing to return to his community in Chicago. He joined the Episcopal church in 1994.

Mary Agnes Mansour: A Sister of Mercy, she was forced to choose between her job as the director of Michigan’s Department of Social Services and her religious vows. In 1983 after 30 years of religious life, Mansour left her congregation.

Elizabeth Morancy and Arlene Violet: Both were Sisters of Mercy in Rhode Island. Morancy, a Rhode Island legislator, and Violet, Rhode Island’s attorney general, were forced by the Vatican to choose between keeping their jobs and remaining in religious life. They chose to keep their jobs and left religious life in 1983.

Archbishop Raymond Hunthausen: The former archbishop of Seattle found himself under investigation after the Vatican received letters complaining of liturgical abuses. In 1983, Archbishop James Hickey of Washington conducted a visitation of the Seattle archdiocese. His report to the Vatican resulted in the appointment of an auxiliary bishop in 1985, and Hunthausen was stripped of much of his authority. After a wave of complaints and protests from laity, clergy, religious and Hunthausen’s brother bishops, the Vatican restored Hunthausen’s authority and replaced his auxiliary bishop with a coadjutor in 1987. He retired in 1991.

Fr. Ernesto Cardenal: He was a member of the Sandinista party in Nicaragua. When the Sandinistas overthrew the Somoza regime in 1979, Cardenal became the Sandinista’s minister of culture. When John Paul II visited Nicaragua in 1983, he publicly chastised Cardenal for his participation in the Sandinista government. Cardenal and four other priests were ordered to quit their government posts by the Vatican. Cardenal refused and lost his priestly faculties. He remained in the government until 1988. In 1994 he resigned from the Sandinista party, accusing its leadership of corruption.

Fr. Robert Nugent and Sr. Jeannine Gramick: The two spent much of their religious careers working in ministry to homosexuals. In 1984 they were forced to leave their New Ways Ministry. In 1988, they were again investigated and in 1999 the Vatican sanctioned them for not representing authentic church teaching about homosexuality. They received sanctions from their religious congregations that essentially prohibited them from participating in public ministry to homosexuals. Nugent, a Salvatorian priest, accepted the sanctions. Gramick left the School Sisters of Notre Dame and joined the Loretto Sisters in 2004 ( see story).

Dr. John McNeill: The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith opened an inquiry in 1974 into the former Jesuit priest’s view about homosexuality. In 1977, church authorities in Rome officially silenced him. He was no longer allowed to speak about or minister to homosexuals. He disobeyed that order in 1986 and the Society of Jesus began formal procedures to expel McNeill. The expulsion became official in January 1987 and McNeill became a psychotherapist.

Barbara Ferraro and Patricia Hussey: Sisters of Notre Dame de Namour, they left their religious order 1988. They and 91 other nuns and priests signed an ad in a 1984 issue of The New York Times that proclaimed a “diversity of opinion regarding abortion” existed among Catholics. Ferraro and Hussey alone refused a Vatican order to retract their support for the ad. Although their religious congregation supported them throughout their investigation, the two left religious life, protesting the process used by the Vatican against them.

Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre: The leader of traditionalist Catholics was excommunicated in 1988 for ordaining four bishops. Lefebvre rejected the reforms of Vatican II, believing the council opened the church to the negative influences of communism and modernism. He also rejected the “new Mass.” During the reform council, he led a group of traditionalists who firmly opposed anything new or different. After the council, he established his own seminary in Econe, Switzerland. Paul VI suspended him for ordaining the graduates of this seminary. John Paul II made many attempts to reconcile Lefebvre to the post-Vatican II church, but the episcopal ordinations made Lefebvre’s excommunication automatic.

Fr. Tissa Belasuriya: A Sri Lankan Oblate of Mary, he attracted the negative attention of the Vatican with his writings on Mary, the divinity of Christ, and original sin. In 1994 he was notified that the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith had found errors in his writings. In 1995, he was ordered to sign a profession of faith or risk excommunication. He responded by signing a profession of faith written by Paul VI. He was formally excommunicated in 1997. One year later, after protests and negotiations, Belasuriya was “reconciled” to the church.

Fr. Eugen Drewermann: A German theologian, he was suspended from the priesthood in 1992. He questioned the virgin birth of Christ and the physical reality of his resurrection. He was later expelled from the priesthood.

Ivone Gebara: A Brazilian Sister of Notre Dame found herself under investigation in 1993 for publicly advocating legalized abortion. A yearlong investigation by the Brazilian bishops’ conference ended with Gebara reaffirming her defense of human life in all forms. Although the Brazilian bishops considered the matter closed, the Vatican did not. Citing problems with her theological writings, in 1995 the Vatican pressured her religious congregation to sanction her. The sanctions resulted in Gebara being silenced for two years.

Bishop Jacques Gaillot: He was removed from his position as bishop of Evreux, France, in 1995. The Vatican, and several of his brother bishops, saw his identification with the poor and advocacy of homosexuals and contraception as too unorthodox for a bishop.

More good reasons why I'm an ex-Catholic.
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Guckert Donating Member (946 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. I did not see any disciplinary action for Child Molestation? was that just
an oversight on the list creator or the Pope. or is he not the one who would do that??? I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt (albeit, small benefit).
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. He quickly gave Cardinal Law a Vatican Post. Law covered up Boston's
pedophilia scandal, and was dispatched to the Vatican instead of facing trial. Boston is a very Catholic city, and there is a LOT of anger here.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. No, Cardinal Law, who was instrumental in covering it up by
shifting child rapist priests from parish to parish, was promoted to a cushy administrative job within the Vatican.
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Rewarded for being a criminal basically
truly disgusting...
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. As Far the Political Left Goes,
I have heard that John Paul's experience with the Polish communist government poisoned him against all leftist governments, even those that had a lot more to offer.

For example, he was invited to Nicaragua under the Sandinistas and freaked out at the militarism on display. Too bad for all those liberation theologians.

Not agreeing with it, just putting it in context. Hope the next pope will show more discernment.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
5. Claude Bessy a.k.a. Kickboy Face died of lung cancer at 54
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ClintonTyree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
6. Business as usual within the Catholic Church..................
NO deviation from the official Church position is allowed. Ever. They've got their story and they're sticking to it.
I would like to have all of the information that the Catholic Church has suppressed over the centuries before me for 1 day. With that information in hand, I'm willing to bet I could change the course of the world.
But, since the Church is so chained to history and so secretive, we'll never know, will we?
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
7. Wow aren't they all lucky they weren't born in the 15th century
cuz for those offenses they would have been burned.

I am a Roman Catholic but over time I have grown more disillusioned.
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
8. Father Robert Drinan, Jesuit and Congressman, Massachusetts
Edited on Mon Apr-04-05 03:56 PM by Kathy in Cambridge
Father Drinan, an attorney-priest, served as a Democratic representative from Massachusetts in Congress from 1971 until 1981, when Pope John Paul II ordered him to choose between politics and the priesthood.

http://www.abanews.org/releases/news062804.html

http://www.cathfam.org/polrec/Fr.Drinan1.html

<snip>

In due course Drinan was re-elected and in l974 prepared to run for third term. In the meantime, however, the face of American politics had changed irrevocably by the sudden intrusion of the abortion issue into the national arena after a l973 Supreme Court decision finding a constitutional "right" to abortion. Drinan's position has always been that he fully accepted Catholic teaching on the subject. However, even before the Supreme Court decision he had supported, with increasing passionate intensity, every proposal to make the procedure legal and to fund it with tax money. Shortly after Roe v Wade, Drinan wrote a public defense of the decision, recognizing that it had flaws but finding it on the whole a beneficial judgment. He then proceeded, over the next several years, to compile an almost perfect pro-abortion voting record in Congress.

Early in the fall of l974, with another election a few weeks away, the question of Drinan's permission to run again became public, after Drinan told the press "I have permission in black and white." This time Bishop Flanagan stated publicly that he had not given permission, while Cardinal Medeiros merely stated that the issue was an internal one for the Jesuits. More here:

http://www.cathfam.org/polrec/Fr.Drinan1.html

It is a conservative Catholic news source, but it's a good synopsis of what happened.
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Fenris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. JPII forbade all priests from holding public office, did he not?
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. Yep-Father Drinan was a good Congressman too
He was reprimanded tons for his pro-choice views. He teaches at Georgetown Law now...
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Fenris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. Sad.
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 03:54 PM
Response to Original message
9. Inside baseball. Booorriiiinngg. To the religion section with you.
Just the sort of thing that belongs in the religion section. Who the fuck cares about whether the jebbies expel someone for a lack of orthodoxy.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. it sure beats those "I may disagree on this that and all the rest"
but he sure was great cause he said the war was bad.
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. If you like inside baseball. I mean, really, tenure for theologians?
Is this now a liberal democrat issue?
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. You think the Vatican has no influence on politics?
You should stick to the baseball cards.
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. In lots of ways, none of which have the slightest to do with the OP.
Yeah, I think I will stick to politics. You can go argue the equivalent of the DH rule among the catholic religious orders.
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Zynx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
11. A lot of these look like they should have been kicked
Questioning the virgin birth of Christ? Questioning the virginity of Mary? Making up your own teachings on certain issues? Etc, etc.

I'm not seeing how this was particularly anti-left.

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jonnyblitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. yeah. how outrageous questioning whether virgins can give birth
Edited on Mon Apr-04-05 04:10 PM by jonnyblitz
:eyes: just like that pesky dude back in the day that said the earth wasn't flat.
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WillowTree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. The virgin birth...
....and various of the other things ennumerated above are part of the basic dogma of the Catholic Church. If you don't accept those things, fine. You're free as a bird to beleive as you choose and no one is going to force you.

But those who are/were priests and nuns, representatives of the Church, and were publicly espousing and in many cases actively teachingtheir church and they get to run it as they choose and I don't get the criticism toward them deciding how their faith will be taught by their clergy.

Catholicism not a democracy and it is largely an all or nothing proposition. If you take issue with the dogma, you are free to go elsewhere. These people knew what the Church teaches and that they would be expected to accept and promote those teachings when they took their vows. If intrinsic portions of the dogma became unacceptible to them at some point down the road, they should have quit and moved on to something more in line with what they had come to believe. When they didn't, I don't have any problem at all with the Church giving a shove.
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #11
21. I think this has nothing to do with the left
There are many and various reasons these people were disciplined. The biggest reason seems to be questioning doctrine.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
16. Doctrinal matters
and he is a traditionalist. The office that handles that is not his but he makes the appointments. But you are confusing traditionalist vs nontraditionalist in matters of doctrine. Being for economic justice and against preemptive wars and imperialism is generally considered left but not pure political left. Personally, if I were a priest, I would be disciplined as well. I'm agnostic, still have some Catholic in me, but generally not religious. I go to Church mainly for my wife who is Catholic and extended family (of course, I don't think that any of them are traditionalists like JPII was).
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flamingyouth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
17. It's a shame about Archbishop Hunthausen
He is a great man, and many people here in Seattle still support him 100%.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
18. Marcel Lefevbre is to the right of Tim LaHaye. He led the fundamentalist
Edited on Mon Apr-04-05 04:37 PM by blm
movement amongst Catholics. He was a complete tool funded in part by RevMoon and the other "anti-communist" operatives of the 70s and 80s. They HATE the Pope and would claim he was a leftist communist plant.

These are the Catholic fundies who led the overall church further to the right through their influence spread with rightwing conservative money like Moon's.

You really have no clue what you are defending with this list. If Lefevbre is on it, I would bet this is more propaganda portrayed as being from the left to further hatred for the Pope and they mixed in some real lefties to confuse the reader.

Lefevbre was my mother's choice back in the early 70s. I know all about him. David Brock's father was also part of his following. These are the arch-conservative Catholics who are really manipulated by the rightwing fascist political operatives to work against the traditional liberal, charitable and peaceful aspects of Catholic teachings.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. This was from the National Catholic Reporter.
You should take note that the majority on the list could be described as "leftist" with a few extreme rightwingers thrown in.

I'm certainly not defending LeFevbre or his fascist ilk, nor is the NCR, which is from the left.
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MountainLaurel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
20. No Africans?
I was wondering about the issue of AIDS in Africa, and whether the Catholic leadership there ever tried to talk to the Pope about supporting the relaxation of "rules" against condom use.

'Cause frankly, PJP not doing so has helped condemn millions to their deaths.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
24. For those who think this is not true, here's the link to the NCR.
http://natcath.org/NCR_Online/archives2/2005a/022505/022505h.php

You might also check out their hompage to see where they, as Catholics, stand on the issues.
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-05 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
28. not a nice commentary for a man who cured cancer
beat lex luthor and destroyed communism side by side with st. ronald of raygun whilst wielding sledgehammers.
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