My friend has officially drunk the kool aid

[WildEyedLiberal]

This depresses me greatly. Her parents are moderate Republicans who supported McCain in 2000. She and I have had arguments in the past, and she's always known that I am a die-hard Democrat. We've been in college for two years now, and I finally thought she was coming around. She's very pro-gay rights, and tells me she considers herself "socially liberal." She agrees with me when I talk to her about politics, usually. She actually BOUGHT the swift boat shit back over the summer, but after a stern talking-to from me, she acknowledged that Kerry did "earn his medals" and that he did have a "right" to speak out about the war. (As if his freedom of speech depended upon anyone's permission, but I digress.) The last time I saw her, I enumerated several of Bush's failings, and she told me she thinks he's a "bad leader." So, I think I've won. She's still basically Republican, yes, but she at least has enough common sense to vote against the fascist bush junta.

Yeah, well, apparently she just tells me what I want to her. She stood me up for lunch earlier this week, so I went to send her a message on AIM, and after doing so, I randomly clicked on her user profile and scrolled down past her sorority letters and song lyrics to find, hidden at the bottom : "W'04"

WTF?? Why, why didn't she just come out and tell me, "hey, I'm a moron freeper and I support BUSH!!!" She agreed with all my talking points, even has agreed that Bush is a dire threat to the foundation of this nation. Obviously, she was just giving me lip service. I don't know if she was afraid I would go off on her if she admitted to supporting Bush wholeheartedly, but I wonder if she realizes how much her dishonesty has damaged my opinion of her, let alone her support of fascism. And she must think I'm stupid if she thinks I would never notice her AIM profile. It's all very, very discouraging. Also, this girl isn't stupid in the traditional sense, either; she goes to the same university I do and gets decent grades, and I can have suitably intellectual conversations with her. I have no explanation for her support of Bush, I really don't, other than maybe willful ignorance.

The fact that she ditched me on our lunch date Tuesday is a separate issue, but she has yet to get ahold of me and apologize to me, which is exceedingly rude. I am tempted to just say fuck it, at this point. She's been a bit of a fairweather friend in the past, but I'm the kind of person who doesn't hold grudges, and it would take an awful lot for me to throw away a 5 year friendship. But this just might be the lotion in the basket, folks. I'm seriously considering whether to go out of my way to contact her again. If she calls me, I think I'm going to tell her how I feel, both about being ditched and about her lying to me about supporting bush. Fuck it all, I'm so angry right now. I'm going to go get tacos.

[Shoeempress]

1. In my experience sorority girls are generally right wing airheads, who

grow up to be right wing airhead moms. Not all of them, but many.

[WildEyedLiberal]

6. Sorority girls aren't as bad as frat boys in my experience

But I would have to say that, generally speaking, the mindless conformity of the Greek system does fit in with the mindless conformity of the Repuglican mindset, so there you go.

[shance]

11. My college roomate and I were sorority sisters, and both

pretty active Republicans at the time (because of our families).

I was in campus Repubs for two years. (another gal from my sorority was president and talked me into it)

Now my roomate from college and I both are active libs.

It happens.

:)

[aePrime]

16. Dammit

I hate this stereotype. I'm a fraternity member, my wife is a sorority member (technically a women's fraternity, but since everybody just dismisses Greeks anyway, why bother to argue?). We're both graduate students, we're both liberal Democrats. Sure, there are some stupid people in my fraternity, but I'd guess that nearly half of the guys in my house end up at graduate school. Most of us are computer scientists or electrical engineers. I've met some of the smartest people I know in my fraternity. We drink occasionally, but we're actually a dry house.

When I first came to university, I moved into the dorms, even though the Greek system on this campus is very strong. I had the same stereotypes as most people. Drunk, hazing, stupid jocks. But as I got to know the guys, I realized that they were great people, and I moved in because of that.

Fraternities and sororities on my campus (probably nationally as well) get a higher GPA than the dorms and the all-campus average.

Every year each fraternity (23) and sorority (9) do at least one philanthropy event and give the money to a good cause.

Every year we raise hundreds of dollars to send to Paul Newman's Hole in the Wall Gang Camps for terminally ill children. Paul Newman is an alumnus of my fraternity.

[WildEyedLiberal]

22. No offense meant

My best guy friend last year was in a fraternity. I know plenty of very nice people in both fraternities and sororities. However, lots of Greeks (including my friend to some extent) look down on you if you aren't a fellow Greek. Maybe that's why she blows me off so easily now; because her Greek friends are way cooler than me. Whatever. Like I said, obviously not every Greek is like that, but she fits the stereotype pretty well, I'd say.

[aePrime]

26. I do not know how you can say

"no offense meant" when it is obvious that you where putting down an entire community; a community to which I have donated much of my time and effort. I do not say, "I hate your family, no offense."

So your sample size of two allows you to make inferences about the entire Greek community?

How is this any different than saying, "I hate white people, but a couple of them are OK."?

[WildEyedLiberal]

27. Sorry I bothered to apologize to you

In my experience on this campus, most Greeks are elitist when it comes to who they deem cool enough to hang out with. I already said that not all are like that, but many are. That's my experience. My friend is like that quite a bit. You don't like that generalization, then fine. I'm glad none of your fraternity brothers were assholes about it. I know plenty of frat guys who are. I know plenty of George Bush style frat guys, too, who think they're the kings of the campus parading around in their letters and expecting girls to fall at their feet because they're in Skulls or Pikes. I think the secret handshakes and initiation rites are lame. Sorry. Just because I only have two Greek friends, that doesn't mean I don't have them in all my classes and live next to them in my dorm. I like some individuals who are Greek, but I don't like the system. That should clarify things sufficiently for you.

[Cozmosis]

17. Most sorority girls I know are Bush supporters

Weird.

[Anakin Skywalker]

23. What about dumbass frat boys?

The term frat boy has to me, become synomymous with juvenile behavior and not employing intelligence and critical thinking. Bush solidified the association for me.

[lakemonster11]

28. Yeah,

I always think of Bush as an arrogant frat boy.

[The_Casual_Observer]

2. Oh fuck it, I hope it really had poison in it then

Who cares about what some stupid freeper does.

[WildEyedLiberal]

5. I care because she's been my friend longer than anyone else

I am very shy and don't make friends easily, and to have her be so duplicitious and insulting my intelligence so really bothers me. I'm sure I could act like it doens't matter, but the truth is that it does. I don't see how I can ever respect her again. She moved to my town my freshman year of high school, and became the best friend I had then. SHe's not my *best* friend any more, but it still upsets me that obviously my friendship doesn't matter to her very much.

[The_Casual_Observer]

7. I dumped a lifelong friend because he became a rw nut

And I haven't regretted it. Life is way too short for that kind of needless aggravation.

[mcerise]

14. I'm sorry to hear that

If you really felt that she has been a good friend to you, then please don't lose her friendship over the * administration. It's really not worth it. Go over to her and tell her that you know she still supports W, and you wish that she would have been honest with you. Let her know that you're willing to accept her for who she is (as long as you really do) and that you hope she will tell you the truth from now on in return.

[progressivebydesign]

18. Maybe the W' 04 was old.. from before... n/t

[GreenPartyVoter]

3. Administer ipecac syrup immediately

[Career Prole]

4. We'll be your friend.

We're more fun anyway. :)
I've lost a lot of friends over the shrub, but I've gained more (and better) friends through the travails.

[legally blonde]

8. Sorry to hear that, WildEyedLiberal

It's hard to loose friends, especially during college (I lost my share). I know how you feel. :hug: But, before you do anything, make sure you think things through. You've been friends for a long time. Yeah, she's a freeper and didn't come clean with you. But that doesn't necessarily mean that you should throw in the towel yet. In the end, it's your decision--only you can decide what's best for you.

[Sarrek420]

9. Lysergic

A long time ago I drank some electric kool aid.. :)

[mediaman007]

10. Its good that she stood you up, its good that she's voting for *

You could have married her! Thank goodness you won't be living with a shrew the rest of your life.

There are many fine progressive women. Head down to the Kerry/Edwards office and volunteer this weekend. Meet someone new. Someone who shares your values.

Hope you saved yourself for marriage!

[WildEyedLiberal]

21. Oh, no, we're both straight girls! LOL

:D

Sorry, by lunch date, I just meant, lunch commitment. LOL! Thanks for the concern, though, you're sweet! No, no romantic feelings involved here!

I DO need to find a nice, sexy, progressive MAN, though.

[jaysunb]

12. About that taco....

I think I'd skip it. It's never a good idea to eat or drink to soothe frustration. :hug:

[Barney Rocks]

13. could you tell how recently her

profile had been updated? Because it is very possible that when she filled it out, she felt that way--and has changed her mind. Don't cut her off without finding out where she stands--it may be that you have influenced her for the good. She may be leaning toward Kerry--and just has not updated or looked at her profile for a long time. People do change their minds. Make sure before you cut her off.

[NuttyFluffers]

19. ding, ding, ding! the voice of reason! take heed!

honestly, of the people that i know i cannot think of even a handful who pay attention to their AIM profile, let alone update it regularly, especially of something you said was deep within her profile.

now being a flake myself... we'll... we flakes are excellent company, when we show up. don't give up on us just yet. trust us, we've got an excuse. we always have an excuse. part of what makes being a flake easier.

[Jimmy D]

15. Dont hang around with Bush women

You could end up married to her.Would make ofr bad children.

Best regards
Jim

[Anakin Skywalker]

24. Why Not?

Bush women? Don't they run around naked? I saw them in National Geographic when I was a kid. :)

[IdaBriggs]

20. One of the hardest things to realize about friends...

is that they don't always think the same way you do. Sometimes you are going to have to let loose of people who mattered to you because you choose different paths for the rest of your life; its not always easy to respect people for the life choices they make at all times. This is just the way of the world.

One of the most interesting things about being in your teens and early twenties is how much you discover about yourself. Sometimes people try on different identities before finding the one that "fits" for a long time. You can be grateful for the experience when you have a friend who goes through difficult times with you, honor them for who they were THEN, and let them go when they don't "fit" anymore. It happens a lot when you end up at different life stages as you get older.

One of my husband's oldest friends was THE guy who did everything "first" -- he was the first one to get a "real" job, get an apartment, get married, have kids -- the guys always hung out at his place because of the "no parents around" thing, and the aura hung around for a long time. Then it turned out the guy was also the "first one" to end up a total loser: "first" to be unable to hold a job, cheat on his spouse, leave his family, get a divorce, have child protective services called repeatedly, be unable to pay his bills, always have an excuse why he can't "better" his life, etc. He's a nice guy except he's also a total and complete LOSER. He's still "fun" to be around if all you are looking for is entertainment, but he's NOT someone you want your kids hanging with as a role model, if you know what I mean. There is only so much you can do, then you simply have to accept the person for who and what they are, and make up your mind about the type of person YOU want to be. "Lie down with dogs; get up with fleas" is a very true statement, and thank heavens my husband doesn't spend a lot of time with this guy anymore.

That doesn't mean he wasn't a good friend "back in the day." It simply means they are at different stages of life now, and its okay.

You may wish to give your friend the benefit of the doubt, and have the conversation about "why don't you tell me the truth?" or you may decide to avoid an unnecessary confrontation, and write her off. Its easy enough to concentrate on your own life, and honestly, you probably won't miss her that much in a few weeks. She's voting for Bush; if you can still "like her" despite her lack of candor, then be friends. If this is just the latest in a string of "growing apart" stuff, then let her go and be grateful for who she was when you needed her before she became the person she is today. Who knows -- she may just be going through a temporary stage?

Best, Ida

[WildEyedLiberal]

25. Thanks for the advice, everybody

I wasn't sure whether to post this or not, or if I was jumping the gun. Several of you have made a valid point about the AIM profile, but another thing that worries me is that her best guy friend is the president of the College Republicans, and he's also in her sorority's partner fraternity, so she sees him a lot more than she ever bothers to see me. This kid writes the most inane and idiotic letters to the campus newspaper, and, well, if indeed she has finally drunk the koolaid, he's the one who gave it to her, most likely. I think it's sad that she appears to give this bonehead freeper's rantings more credence than my logical, well-reasoned arguments (God that sounded arrogant), but seems to me like she has. I'm not sure how long the W'04 thing has been there, or whether or not she is planning on voting for him, but the fact that she blows me off repeatedly kind of diminishes my concern. I live in Illinois, and so if she wants to be stupid enough to be a freeper, she can be my guest. Bush is never going to win this state anyways.

I think I'm more pissed that she's blown me off, like I don't even matter. Finding the fascist endorsement in her profile was just icing. I think that I'll try to have a talk with her if she ever bothers to contact me, which is unlikely, since she very rarely talks to me unless I call her or im her first. I've just decided that I'm not going to take the initiative this time. If she gives a damn about our friendship, then she'll apologize to me for standing me up. She's the one who's been neglecting it, not me.

Also, no danger of my marrying or having babies with her. We're both straight girls. But thanks for your concern, you guys all rock. I love DU! You guys are the best! :grouphug: