2016 Postmortem

pnwmom

(109,030 posts)

21. No. That's why I wouldn't vote for Fiorina. But I think it is fine for gender

Fri Dec 25, 2015, 11:50 PM

Dec 2015

to be one of a range of considerations.

And it would be great for a liberal female to be elected, just as it was for a liberal African American to be elected.

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DUers Overwhelmingly Believe that Oligarchs are our Biggest Threat [View all] demwing Dec 2015 OP

Rec'd farleftlib Dec 2015 #1

So very very true. Nt newfie11 Dec 2015 #52

Hillary Clinton is the ONLY candidate capable of defeating the GOP Teabagger mentality. FarPoint Dec 2015 #57

Not What The REAL Numbers Say! CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #74

WHO BTW IS OVERWHELMINGLY THE CANDIDATE OF THE OLIGARCHY? CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #75

Obviously Hillary. Fuddnik Dec 2015 #77

Hillary has never been coporation head: She has always worked for the middle class lewebley3 Dec 2015 #113

I guess she didn't kiss the Waltons' rear ends enough while on Walmart's board?... cascadiance Dec 2015 #115

Hillary has been working for the middle class: The Clinton's budgets were middle class lewebley3 Dec 2015 #196

How is supporting economic royalist interest serving H-1B indentured servant program doing that?... cascadiance Dec 2015 #197

Hillary is not an economic royalist:She is a Dem: the heir to FDR lewebley3 Dec 2015 #198

She certainly takes more money from them than Bernie. Why would they give to her... cascadiance Dec 2015 #199

You're either delusional or void of the facts. I will go with void of information. JRLeft Dec 2015 #138

Fact: is Hillary almost never worked in the private sector: she has been in public ser lewebley3 Dec 2015 #192

You tried to sell everyone on the fact that she isn't bought and paid for. JRLeft Dec 2015 #201

Walmart ring a bell? AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #180

She didnt own or run the company: she had curtsy position only lewebley3 Dec 2015 #191

The board of directors runs the company AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #193

The board doesn't run the company: The Family does and the profits go to the family lewebley3 Dec 2015 #195

So Wal-Mart paid her to do this on their board all of this time cascadiance Dec 2015 #200

That is right: board membership was curtsy position; The CEO' ran Walmart lewebley3 Dec 2015 #202

If there is ONLY ONE PERSON who can possibly defeat Cruz or Trump, we're truly fucked. n/t arcane1 Dec 2015 #112

Another DURec. bvar22 Dec 2015 #108

All I can say- ruffburr Dec 2015 #2

I thinks so too daybranch Dec 2015 #56

Agreed, but you forgot "BOO! Terrorists" on M$M to feed MIC <--supports Hillary 100% nt 99th_Monkey Dec 2015 #3

+ 1000 orpupilofnature57 Dec 2015 #5

Huge +1! Enthusiast Dec 2015 #64

Not the ones with the nifty H as their avatar . For the TPP, MIC " Partnering with corporations " if orpupilofnature57 Dec 2015 #4

K and effing R Scuba Dec 2015 #6

Jay Gould: I can pay half the working class to kill the other half leveymg Dec 2015 #7

And there you have why the country is in the state it's in Doctor_J Dec 2015 #8

They want nothing less then total hegemonic control ValasHune Dec 2015 #9

We can not afford Hillary Clinton. Cassiopeia Dec 2015 #10

Oh now you are stuck in fear base mode.... FarPoint Dec 2015 #58

As you preach fear. Cassiopeia Dec 2015 #67

I've heard this assertion chervilant Dec 2015 #71

Sanders is a good man with excellent goals for " We the People "... FarPoint Dec 2015 #85

#1) ALL the polls disagree with you. bvar22 Dec 2015 #110

Tell that chervilant Dec 2015 #119

You can wish and hope until your blue in the face... FarPoint Dec 2015 #131

Yeah, I believe that meme chervilant Dec 2015 #135

I reject the basis of your premise. eom MohRokTah Dec 2015 #133

We can't count on her or her supporters if someone else is the nominee? Scootaloo Dec 2015 #101

She'll need an army to win, as she is WORSE in the polls against the GOP than Bernie! cascadiance Dec 2015 #116

This is how Hillary would respond if she were honest... AZ Progressive Dec 2015 #11

More of the public now is "getting the glasses" needed to see through the DLC types now! cascadiance Dec 2015 #117

Feh! It's a boogy man. Over-used and dilluted to the point of being absolutely meaningless. NurseJackie Dec 2015 #12

No it's astroturfing..... Mbrow Dec 2015 #13

It's not used enough. Or well enough explained. And it certainly Isn't an exaggeration. cali Dec 2015 #60

#feh NurseJackie Dec 2015 #70

Your beads are showing. Fuddnik Dec 2015 #81

insightful as your average nurse Jackie post. cali Dec 2015 #84

Nurse Jackie the tv show Ichingcarpenter Dec 2015 #90

John Mitchell was right. Fuddnik Dec 2015 #80

We can still vote treestar Dec 2015 #103

Except to a small percentage... NCTraveler Dec 2015 #68

Yes. It's proven that we have no oligarchs treestar Dec 2015 #102

Thank You For Sharing These Truths cantbeserious Dec 2015 #14

But she has told me what I ejbr Dec 2015 #15

People who support the patriarchy, and accuse women of "playing the gender card" pnwmom Dec 2015 #16

Hillary is part of the problem, not part of the solution, pretty easy to see for most of us. dreamnightwind Dec 2015 #17

Fiorina and Hillary are night and day. No comparison at all. n/t pnwmom Dec 2015 #20

Yeah, so? dreamnightwind Dec 2015 #32

A progressive woman can vote for another progressive woman, like HRC, and be happy pnwmom Dec 2015 #35

Even Hillary is careful not to use Progressive too broadly daybranch Dec 2015 #55

Her record in the Senate made her one of the most progressive Senators there. pnwmom Dec 2015 #76

? Fuddnik Dec 2015 #83

Sorry, but many of us unemployed tech workers are insulted that someone supporting H-1B... cascadiance Dec 2015 #120

When has the last time she has supported increasing H-1b visas? pnwmom Dec 2015 #122

Umm. Now her NOT speaking to the current issues that almost every other candidate has... cascadiance Dec 2015 #125

You are mischaracterizing Bernie's position on h-1B visas. He isn't against h-1B visas. pnwmom Dec 2015 #130

Umm, what do YOUR words "And even Bernie supported them then." mean then? cascadiance Dec 2015 #136

Bernie has never stated that he would eliminate them, only that he wouldn't raise the cap. pnwmom Dec 2015 #137

If H-1B were true to the original intent of the program, I'd probably support it too... cascadiance Dec 2015 #146

I completely agree with you about the problems with the program pnwmom Dec 2015 #149

Bernie's been very specific about what he has problems with there... cascadiance Dec 2015 #169

I think "night and evening" is more like it. n/t Ron Green Dec 2015 #33

And you think the solution to the patriarchy is: evaluate candidates not based on issues but gender? JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #19

No. That's why I wouldn't vote for Fiorina. But I think it is fine for gender pnwmom Dec 2015 #21

Gender nor race are not qualifications. This is the shit we accuse Republicans of. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #22

I disagree. I watched African Americans rejoice in the streets when another African American pnwmom Dec 2015 #23

Well, if you can point out mention of such things like "inspiration" in Article II I'll concede JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #24

The people who wrote the Constitution purposely denied all women the vote. pnwmom Dec 2015 #25

Therefore, we must ignore the constitution's mandate for presidential duties. Got it. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #27

What "mandate for Presidential duties" are you talking about? pnwmom Dec 2015 #28

Fact: The President has certain duties and responsibilities JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #30

I already told you that Article 2 doesn't mandate that men must be President. pnwmom Dec 2015 #36

Sure, you can have your opinion. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #38

In the same way that Affirmative Action programs are racist, I suppose. pnwmom Dec 2015 #39

Well, the supreme court is hearing a case that will decide the future of Affirmative Action. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #42

The Supreme Court? The same one that wrote Citizens vs. United? pnwmom Dec 2015 #44

I did not say that.... JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #47

Look at the condescending replies you've received! betsuni Dec 2015 #29

You misunderstand me. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #31

Oh right. It's fine to pay lip service to the idea that women should be represented pnwmom Dec 2015 #37

I would vote for Liz Warren in a heartbeat. Hillary Clinton? Never in a million years. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #40

Is Affirmative Action racist? Affirmative action considers race as one of the factors, pnwmom Dec 2015 #41

I answered your question above. How about you answer my question from post #40 in turn? JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #49

You're only interested in voting for the woman who's not interested in running pnwmom Dec 2015 #79

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #86

Nice backhanded way of calling Jon a sexist davidpdx Dec 2015 #139

It IS one of the criteria for many of us. DisgustipatedinCA Dec 2015 #53

Fiorina and Clinton aren't even close. But Clinton and Warren are. pnwmom Dec 2015 #54

Clinton & Warren are political OPPOSITES. senz Dec 2015 #158

Nonsense. If Warren thought that, she wouldn't have signed the letter pnwmom Dec 2015 #161

R U kidding? Every female Dem in the Senate signed it. senz Dec 2015 #162

No one forced Elizabeth to do the interview last year or say, "Hillary is terrific." pnwmom Dec 2015 #163

To refuse to say something positive would have been stupid. senz Dec 2015 #164

Oh, I see. Warren's dishonest. Just a typical politician then. pnwmom Dec 2015 #165

No. Polite. Plays by the rules. senz Dec 2015 #166

That's not what you'd be saying about Hillary if she called someone "terrific" pnwmom Dec 2015 #167

Uncalled-for accusation. senz Dec 2015 #168

Some inconsistencies just can't be Skidmore Dec 2015 #173

Um, "Margaret Thatcher". That is all. truebluegreen Dec 2015 #78

Adolph Hitler was a man. Does that rule out all men? nt pnwmom Dec 2015 #184

Nope. Doesn't rule them in either. truebluegreen Dec 2015 #186

I don't think her gender is sufficient reason to vote for her, which is why I pnwmom Dec 2015 #188

Rec Lil Missy Dec 2015 #178

Agree, K & R dreamnightwind Dec 2015 #18

Someone here told me that this was the core thought... NCTraveler Dec 2015 #26

You should count President Carter in there too. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #34

Stawman argument. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #61

Nope not a strawman. You were characterizing this as a belief common to many Sanders supporters, JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #88

Yes, we have many problems, but this one is the most fundamental. senz Dec 2015 #43

"Hillary supporters, try to understand this. Think about it." Condescending much? pnwmom Dec 2015 #45

Not in the least. I see a refusal, not inability, to think about it. senz Dec 2015 #46

I think it is important for you to realize that a President Sanders pnwmom Dec 2015 #48

Wow! a 100% deflection and failure to apologize misplaced accusations of condescension. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #89

We Hillary supporters are redstateblues Dec 2015 #96

The truth hurts doesn't it? davidpdx Dec 2015 #141

Your wasting your breath on deaf ears davidpdx Dec 2015 #140

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Dec 2015 #50

DU is no longer even remotely reflective ... NanceGreggs Dec 2015 #51

DU is a near perfect real world cross section of America. Enthusiast Dec 2015 #63

Hardly. DU is a bubble dominated by Bernie supporters redstateblues Dec 2015 #97

I have yet to meet a real world person treestar Dec 2015 #105

Same here. NanceGreggs Dec 2015 #118

Remember when DU was convinced that President Obama ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2015 #132

Who is this Mr. or Ms. DUers of whom you speak. I keep seeing his/her opinions referenced here. randome Dec 2015 #59

Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Dec 2015 #62

Way to talk about your abuela!! FlatBaroque Dec 2015 #65

Not MY abuela! demwing Dec 2015 #95

I reject the notion that "Oligarchs" exist in out nation. eom MohRokTah Dec 2015 #66

Did you not learn ANYTHING from The Hunger Games???? randome Dec 2015 #72

I am supposed to learn something from very poorly written speculative fiction????? eom MohRokTah Dec 2015 #73

No doubt other oligarchs would agree with that analysis of this POPULAR work of fiction... cascadiance Dec 2015 #123

. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #124

So what is YOUR basis that these were "poorly written" pieces of fiction other than your OPINION!! cascadiance Dec 2015 #126

Okay, I did learn one thing from these poorly written pieces of speculative fiction. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #128

President Carter disagrees. Perhaps become acquainted with the arguments and facts and make an OP? JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #91

I am familiar with the arguments MohRokTah Dec 2015 #92

Ok, enjoy your oligarchy. Some of us realize that Congress is bought & paid for by special interests JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #93

No thank you, I'll enjoy my more than two century old Democratic-Republic, thankyouverymuch. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #99

I see you think Carter is using "wild rhetorical devices" when opining on American Democracy. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #100

He's a politician. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #104

He is retired. He has no need to be elected again, so he is free to speak his mind freely. JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #107

Leopards do not change spots. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #109

So Hillary is still for Invading Iraq, and in support of NAFTA? demwing Dec 2015 #185

that's just overcynical treestar Dec 2015 #147

You don't make the "rules". Suggesting he/she needs reasons to disagree with you is BS. Lil Missy Dec 2015 #179

I thought it was the corporatists, Neo Libs, Third wayers, DINOs redstateblues Dec 2015 #98

It's great that you can be so blind to what is happening in our country davidpdx Dec 2015 #142

Claiming Oligarchs control this nation is akin to moon landing denial. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #143

Wow, so Robert Reich is a conspiracy theorist davidpdx Dec 2015 #145

Let's be realistic, please answer the following demwing Dec 2015 #189

Your questions are meaningless signifying nothing. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #190

wonder if you could explain how a "Oligarch Clinton" can "control" an entire country? Sunlei Dec 2015 #69

Wonder if you could explain why I should explain your made up quote? demwing Dec 2015 #82

you made-up "Oligarch Clinton"? how is she a Oligarch? Sunlei Dec 2015 #87

Sunlei, you've been active on DU for 4 years, with over 12k posts demwing Dec 2015 #94

We still have a Republic not an Oligarchy treestar Dec 2015 #129

There is evidence of oligarch, it is by a those who wants to rule the DNC, it will not happen. Thinkingabout Dec 2015 #106

THIS DUer believes that Global Climate Change is our biggest threat, bvar22 Dec 2015 #111

If you replace the word "oligarch" with "big government" Bleacher Creature Dec 2015 #114

Right - Racists, Theocrats, and Oligarchs don't pose a threat demwing Dec 2015 #127

I guess I must be underwhelmed, then DFW Dec 2015 #121

You are one of the few on DU who is level-headed these days davidpdx Dec 2015 #144

Money does need to vanish from electoral funding DFW Dec 2015 #148

I agree with you on the last paragraph davidpdx Dec 2015 #159

Now THERE's an interesting constitutional question. DFW Dec 2015 #171

Yep, it's a far fetched scenario, but it would be fun to see it play out davidpdx Dec 2015 #172

Unless one of the evil ones dies or retires DFW Dec 2015 #174

I doubt it would happen while he's in office davidpdx Dec 2015 #187

Reason #764,976,925 that DU does not represent even a signficant minority of Americans Number23 Dec 2015 #134

I've heard people say that DU is not the general public. Maybe so. I don't know. liberal_at_heart Dec 2015 #150

I think we need to create a knowledge center on this site. underthematrix Dec 2015 #151

Because if people were only informed better then everybody would think the liberal_at_heart Dec 2015 #152

No. I think they would be better able to make a more cogent argument. underthematrix Dec 2015 #153

And the arguments that Hillary is the only electable candidate and that liberal_at_heart Dec 2015 #154

HRC is the most qualified 2016 presidential candidate running underthematrix Dec 2015 #155

Her being the most qualified candidate is your opinion. liberal_at_heart Dec 2015 #156

of course it's my opinion based on her education, underthematrix Dec 2015 #157

Held one (1) elected position based on her famous name senz Dec 2015 #160

Most recent presidents were either govs or US senators underthematrix Dec 2015 #170

demwing, this thread shows how uninterested some DUers are in the subject. senz Dec 2015 #175

" I think our best bet is to set them aside and move onward." Lil Missy Dec 2015 #177

"set them aside..." demwing Dec 2015 #181

Well I am sorry to have subjected you to their nonsense. senz Dec 2015 #182

No apology required! demwing Dec 2015 #183

And DU doesn't reflect reality, or "the REAL world". Lil Missy Dec 2015 #176

You have to fight oligarchs to be able to do anything about institutional racism. Ken Burch Dec 2015 #194