2016 Postmortem

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)

194. No its not confusing at all

Mon Nov 2, 2015, 04:07 PM

Nov 2015

Socialists DO NOT like Capitalism at all
Democratic Socialists are Socialists but that want elections for governance
Socialist Democrats want a balance between Labor and Capital.

Its just that simple...

Europe and the Netherlands are ALL Social Democracies....

If Bernie wanted to win.....he should have said he is now a Socialist Democrat. But he didn't do that....thus that proves...he never expected to win!

Here is the definition of Socialist Democracy

: a political movement advocating a gradual and peaceful transition from capitalism to socialism by democratic means
2
: a democratic welfare state that incorporates both capitalist and socialist practices
— social democrat noun

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20democracy

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Denmark's prime minister says Bernie Sanders is wrong to call his country socialist//// [View all] Historic NY Nov 2015 OP

Yup. Denmark is just a well functioning western democracy. SunSeeker Nov 2015 #1

A "socialist economy" is not what Sanders aims for cprise Nov 2015 #2

Sanders has yet to explain his idea of socialism. SunSeeker Nov 2015 #3

He puts it *very* simply here cprise Nov 2015 #6

No, he still does not define it. SunSeeker Nov 2015 #83

In political science, a true democracy means cprise Nov 2015 #170

There are several Nordic countries, and they are each unique Recursion Nov 2015 #8

He specifically said Denmark in the debate. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #10

Denmark. Specifically. eom BlueCaliDem Nov 2015 #152

I agree, Sunseeker. I was surprised he didn't have a coherent answer for Maher's setup question. Hoyt Nov 2015 #61

The term "welfare state" is a no-no in the US. msrizzo Nov 2015 #65

Yup. Welfare may be a dirtier word than socialism in the US. nt SunSeeker Nov 2015 #131

Then why does he keep calling himself a socialist? nt SunSeeker Nov 2015 #148

Why do Democrats call themselves that if cprise Nov 2015 #172

Socialism actually destroyed their economy. JaneyVee Nov 2015 #17

Busted! A couple of clicks would have led you to Margaret Thatcher on that Armstead Nov 2015 #22

What? It was written by an economist. JaneyVee Nov 2015 #28

In a publication promoting Thatcherite right wing conservatism Armstead Nov 2015 #36

But it contains actual economic data. JaneyVee Nov 2015 #45

Denmark's economy is successful pinebox Nov 2015 #122

Paul Ryan is an economist AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #102

Interesting article, JaneyVee. SunSeeker Nov 2015 #125

He's not an economist. PotatoChip Nov 2015 #128

Thank you, Historic NY! Cha Nov 2015 #4

Bernie Sanders knows that Denmark has a market economy. Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #5

To me, Bernie's version means cprise Nov 2015 #7

Roosevelt was a Keynesian. Neither President Roosevelt nor Keynes were socialists. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #11

You should read more FDR then cprise Nov 2015 #18

I read Arthur Schlesinger's work on the great man... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #21

Bernie's not going to give a dissertation on it cprise Nov 2015 #25

No it isnt.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #14

There are multiple definitions of socialism. Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #69

There is only one they maintain on wikipedia...... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #70

Sanders could call himself a Social Democrat Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #78

But he doesnt does he? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #81

I assume that people have talked to him Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #109

Ergo.....he is a Socialist VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #113

Marxism opposes all capitalism. Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #119

I didnt say a marxist and niether did he... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #120

Socialism as a rule opposes all Capitalism VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #123

Clement Attlee was a socialist. Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #146

Was he wver elected President of the United States? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #151

What a crock Trajan Nov 2015 #86

Amen. The definition of socialism is all over the map. Stardust Nov 2015 #159

A debate between Prime Minister Rasmussen and Senator Sanders would be illuminating. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #9

since he is a member of the center-right party, it would be virtualobserver Nov 2015 #29

Does/does not the Prime Minister of a nation know what type of economic system his nation has? DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #31

the right wing has a different perspective (spin) virtualobserver Nov 2015 #32

I am a socialist-capitalist. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #38

Bernie would agree with you....as would I virtualobserver Nov 2015 #41

My only point is that words have meanings... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #47

Bernie makes his intention very clear virtualobserver Nov 2015 #58

I'm certain there are plenty of Democrats who won't vote for a Socialist, BlueCaliDem Nov 2015 #164

you are all knowing. you know what we think. you know what "plenty of Democrats think" virtualobserver Nov 2015 #175

Just going by what the polls are telling us. No mind reading skills required. eom BlueCaliDem Nov 2015 #185

Bingo. The PM is parsing his words for spin. Eric J in MN Nov 2015 #74

Maybe we all need to go back and read Marx's Socialism-Utopian and Scientific DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #145

This PM's main rival Party is called Socialist Democrats. So his spin on the word is all about Bluenorthwest Nov 2015 #126

Precisely DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #134

The center right there would be to the left of the center right here treestar Nov 2015 #176

that doesn't cut it......center left just lost control two months ago after many years in power virtualobserver Nov 2015 #179

I'm not bickering, only suggesting treestar Nov 2015 #181

labels have no objective meaning virtualobserver Nov 2015 #182

then there is no use in the label then treestar Nov 2015 #183

exactly, no use. virtualobserver Nov 2015 #184

Don't be silly Prime Minister Lars Løkke Rasmussen! BS is never wrong.. take that back! Cha Nov 2015 #12

I suppose that not every post can have some sort of worth. DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2015 #44

Rasmussen is a member of the right leaning Party Venstre, which retook office by defeating their Bluenorthwest Nov 2015 #116

Its what has been my mission lately VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #13

Yes he wants to wipe out Ma and Pa's hardware store down the street.... Armstead Nov 2015 #24

Welcome back, VR. Scootaloo Nov 2015 #30

I am....would you like me to prove it? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #33

Believe me I don't VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #40

Sanders is not a Socialist either Hydra Nov 2015 #15

Then why does he call himself that VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #52

I dunno, probably has something to do with the rightward drift in the US Hydra Nov 2015 #75

It probably has to do with... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #87

*lmao* Hydra Nov 2015 #100

Are you a Socialist? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #103

I am a straight socialist myself Hydra Nov 2015 #112

Opposed to all Capitalism then... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #115

You're just being deberately obtuse now Hydra Nov 2015 #130

No I am not......its the very definitiom..... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #133

If you think Sanders is offering that, cool Hydra Nov 2015 #143

The only evidence I am using is Sanders own VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #149

Yup, I think we are at some point Hydra Nov 2015 #154

They are not feeling like Socialists though VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #155

Uh huh...and everything is just peachy keen right? Hydra Nov 2015 #160

You "job" if you want to call it that.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #168

Those Poll numbers from that Socialist Democrat Hillary Clinton has VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #169

Yes Bernie should stop calling himself a socialist unless he really is one. Bread and Circus Nov 2015 #16

Bernie Sanders is a Democratic Socialist. Denmark is Democratic Socialist riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #19

^^^THIS!^^^ 99Forever Nov 2015 #20

I'm kicking this again just for the incredulity factor riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #23

That's the problem with being tone deaf. 99Forever Nov 2015 #46

It's something new everyday. in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #64

Denmark has a market economy: DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #26

You're digging your own grave here by confusing socialism riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #35

Democratic socialism DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #42

I'm sorry you're such a literalist. riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #49

Social Democrat is not the same thing asa Democratic VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #56

Are Democratic socialism and Social democracy two individual ways of organizing an economy ... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #57

One accepts a balnce between Labor and Capitalism VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #71

Too many rabbit holes DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #73

No holes at all... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #77

So what do you think Bernie is? I think he's a traditional liberal. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #80

I take his word...I think he knows the difference VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #82

Whoa DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #89

HE uses that as a self description... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #91

I hope he is confused DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #94

On multiple occasions... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #97

I'm shocked! Shocked! Armstead Nov 2015 #39

Of course they do because they are social democracies and not democratic socialist states. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #51

He clarifies his points quite clearly. Armstead Nov 2015 #54

Is he a Social democrat or a Democratic socialist? DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #59

I'd call him a capital L liberal Armstead Nov 2015 #63

As would I...I have no idea why we are going down these rabbit holes. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #66

That is my major issue with Sanders. I wish he's just describe himself as that. Armstead Nov 2015 #68

We're not just talking about the economy of a country but its governance too... cascadiance Nov 2015 #105

We are talking about whethrmer or not they accept some VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #110

Are/are not Social democracy and Democratic socialism mutually exclusive ways of organizing ... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #121

They are two very different things... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #135

Precisely... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #138

He calls himself a Democratic Socialist... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #140

No no no you are wrong VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #53

I'll take the Scandinavian countries' own definition riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #62

The fly DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #72

Why doesnt Bernie call himself that VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #79

I have no idea. DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2015 #85

I do......he calls himself one and not the other VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #88

Yet Sanders calls himself a Democratic Socialist VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #76

This message was self-deleted by its author BlueCaliDem Nov 2015 #161

thank you!!! eom Karma13612 Nov 2015 #174

I don't recall Sanders ever claiming Denmark had a planned economy. Scootaloo Nov 2015 #27

Of course Denmark has a market economy... coyote Nov 2015 #34

RUH roh!!!!!!!!!!!! MADem Nov 2015 #37

Denmark's governance system is also a Parliamentary system... Spazito Nov 2015 #43

Niether are Democratic Socialist countries VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #95

My point was to point out the differences in the governance systems... Spazito Nov 2015 #104

I am pointing out the political difference VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #107

Denmark accepts capitalism as does the US... Spazito Nov 2015 #111

Right and Denmark is A Social Democracy VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #114

The greater issue is whether, as Senator Sanders has posited, the US should be like Denmark... Spazito Nov 2015 #118

NO the greater question is VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #132

It is not going to happen n/t Spazito Nov 2015 #144

Qe are no going to elect Socialist Democrats.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #150

Huh? I don't think Senator Sanders will be the Democratic Presidential candidate... Spazito Nov 2015 #163

I misunderstood you then..... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #165

Some links CentralMass Nov 2015 #48

Whatever labels people prefer whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #50

Bernie chose the label of Democratic Socialist VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #84

The labels don't matter whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #92

Yes they do matter VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #93

Lol whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #96

It would likely get you a bop on the snout... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #99

Delusional beef whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #101

I guess the Prime Minister of Denmark is just VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #106

Did he seem pissed to you? whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #108

He seems to not approve.....doesnt he? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #117

Ok, you win whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #124

The argument now VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #127

In both cases, you win whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #129

I just got off one VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #136

Fresh maybe whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #137

I won this argument.....per you VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #139

I'm just trying to make the pathetic thing end whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #141

Because you lost its "pathetic" VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #142

What does the PM of Denmark know about his own nation's politics? Fred Sanders Nov 2015 #55

Did you even read it? He said it's a "welfare state" tularetom Nov 2015 #60

Exactly. A Welfare state doesnt exist in a Socialist one VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #90

DSA -- Democratic Socialists of America Koinos Nov 2015 #67

This message was self-deleted by its author Cali_Democrat Nov 2015 #98

Rasmussen is right, and wrong HassleCat Nov 2015 #147

Baloney VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #153

Go to the linked article HassleCat Nov 2015 #156

No I wont.....those are Socialist Democracies VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #158

Yes, and Sanders describes himself as a Democratic Socialist HassleCat Nov 2015 #162

NOOOOO Democratic Socialists are NOT the same as VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #166

You might want to verify that HassleCat Nov 2015 #187

Yes I can...you might want to check YOURS... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #189

That's one definition HassleCat Nov 2015 #191

That is THE definition.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #192

Furthermore... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #190

It is confusing and hard to follow HassleCat Nov 2015 #193

No its not confusing at all VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #194

OK, I give up HassleCat Nov 2015 #196

You should give up...because you are wrong. VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #197

Yes, I am wrong HassleCat Nov 2015 #198

My "inferior" evidence is a dictionary.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #199

Nothing, nothing, nothing. I thank you. HassleCat Nov 2015 #200

You could be a member of the Girl Scouts for all I care... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #201

Heavily regulated market driven by consumers. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #157

In Socialism....there are no consumers.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #167

I'm not talking about socialism... NCTraveler Nov 2015 #177

but what you described was NOT Socialism.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #178

The new right-wing Danish PM? The anti-immigrant Danish PM? truebrit71 Nov 2015 #171

Even the Prime Minister of Denmark is not listening clearly. Karma13612 Nov 2015 #173

Sanders will deliver a speech to define "democratic socialism" before the next Democratic presidenti riversedge Nov 2015 #180

He should then explain why he is NOT a Socialist Democrat. VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #195

So Mr. Sanders is in favour of a strong market economy with security for its citizens and Betty Karlson Nov 2015 #186

Well, that should settle that! ... or, not. Hekate Nov 2015 #188

There was a time Euros poroudly called themselves Socialist DonCoquixote Nov 2015 #202

KICK Cha Nov 2015 #203