2016 Postmortem

George II

(67,782 posts)

19. Any payroll tax is regressive - it's a tax on a worker's paycheck, not overall "income" even if....

Mon Oct 19, 2015, 12:45 PM

Oct 2015

....if it's a graduated tax and not a flat tax.

Does Donald Trump draw a paycheck? I doubt it, but if he does (some business owners give themselves a nominal "salary&quot it's only a tiny fraction of what he has in "income". The bulk of the income of the rich comes in the form of structured bonuses, dividends, stock options, interest. NONE of those would be taxed under a payroll tax.

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The Revolution starts with a flat tax [View all] BainsBane Oct 2015 OP

We already use the FICA payroll tax to fund Social Security. The Velveteen Ocelot Oct 2015 #1

Social Security is a retirement program BainsBane Oct 2015 #3

The family leave plan, just like Social Security splits the payment between employee and employeer PoliticAverse Oct 2015 #55

How is Hillary proposing to fund her family leave plan? nt mhatrw Oct 2015 #131

I'd like to see more on his plan. Agschmid Oct 2015 #2

I don't object to the idea it involves a tax increase BainsBane Oct 2015 #4

What's bothersome is superficial resemblance to system-wide libertarian cprise Oct 2015 #40

No, it's a way to spin this as something it completely isn't. Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #73

I agree that this is not his tax plan. Agschmid Oct 2015 #95

Sanders apparently supports Senator Gillibrand's family leave plan which you can read about here... PoliticAverse Oct 2015 #53

If this is Senator Sanders idea of a revolution... zappaman Oct 2015 #5

.2% is shooting himself in the foot why exactly? TheKentuckian Oct 2015 #83

maybe he catches up to reality and finds that hill2016 Oct 2015 #6

Money grows on trees yeoman6987 Oct 2015 #58

Only if you are the military industrial complex AgingAmerican Oct 2015 #69

Well that's true. yeoman6987 Oct 2015 #74

SOAKING the rich? LOL! "Spoken" like a true merrily Oct 2015 #133

The Ron Paul Revolution is centered around a flat tax. NCTraveler Oct 2015 #7

Yet that is what he proposed yesterday. BainsBane Oct 2015 #8

I didn't see anything in that article saying this would be a flat tax. The Velveteen Ocelot Oct 2015 #9

It's .2 percent on everyone BainsBane Oct 2015 #10

A payroll tax is regressive - it's a tax on weekly or monthly paychecks, not on ALL income. George II Oct 2015 #16

Allow a 1%er to explain things to you... brooklynite Oct 2015 #37

Yes everyone rich or poor, pays income tax (except the very poor or low income)... George II Oct 2015 #39

As you suggest, Sanders is not in favor of replacing the progressive income tax with a flat tax karynnj Oct 2015 #12

Without even doing research, I wouldn't think Sanders is a "flat taxer." NCTraveler Oct 2015 #13

IMO He doesn't. Agschmid Oct 2015 #14

Then why did he propose it yesterday? BainsBane Oct 2015 #20

He didn't AgingAmerican Oct 2015 #71

The first article includes the video of his saying it BainsBane Oct 2015 #110

Combined with large progressive tax increases? cprise Oct 2015 #41

No, Ron does not want large progressive tax increases. Not sure where you got that from. nt. NCTraveler Oct 2015 #43

(sigh) Bernie wants large progressive increases cprise Oct 2015 #45

Ahhh. That's why I didn't get it. NCTraveler Oct 2015 #46

Significant difference... Scootaloo Oct 2015 #79

this is just like the other payroll taxes - SS and Medicare karynnj Oct 2015 #11

Not calling it an income tax BainsBane Oct 2015 #15

How does it "disproportionately" benefit the upper middle class? karynnj Oct 2015 #23

This is how it is regressive BainsBane Oct 2015 #27

That's simplistic rhetoric, and very wrong cprise Oct 2015 #49

Any payroll tax is regressive - it's a tax on a worker's paycheck, not overall "income" even if.... George II Oct 2015 #19

True - but it also is the strength of both SS and Medicare karynnj Oct 2015 #28

^^^ This is the right answer. cprise Oct 2015 #42

That is exactly what would happen. Republicans might pass the payroll tax after complaining about it stevenleser Oct 2015 #50

If you haven't noticed, the Republicans are in big trouble cprise Oct 2015 #52

Doesn't matter. With gerrymandered districts, they are going to control the House through Jan 2023 stevenleser Oct 2015 #57

People changing their minds is not pixie dust. cprise Oct 2015 #64

LMAO, yes, it absolutely is. nt stevenleser Oct 2015 #65

Pour on the cynicism. cprise Oct 2015 #66

No, it's not an income tax, it's worse. RandySF Oct 2015 #106

Where in the quote you cite does it say anything about a flat tax? stopbush Oct 2015 #17

Look at the CNN article BainsBane Oct 2015 #18

Nope. Still not a flat tax. stopbush Oct 2015 #21

Excuse me? BainsBane Oct 2015 #22

You are misusing the term "flat tax" as it is normally used in such a discussion. stopbush Oct 2015 #25

It is a "capped flat tax" BainsBane Oct 2015 #24

Not so. Nowhere in the CNN article you cite does it mention a cap. stopbush Oct 2015 #26

Payroll taxes are capped BainsBane Oct 2015 #35

You're mixing Clinton's opposition to raising caps with Bernie's cprise Oct 2015 #54

It's all they have AgingAmerican Oct 2015 #92

Only Social Security taxes are capped tammywammy Oct 2015 #81

Your horrid concern is noted. 99Forever Oct 2015 #29

Meanwhile, you justify the working poor BainsBane Oct 2015 #31

Oh please. 99Forever Oct 2015 #32

Oh, the irony BainsBane Oct 2015 #33

What irony. 99Forever Oct 2015 #36

Its not redistribution upward. There's no cap. cprise Oct 2015 #51

You still have not shown that this is income redistribution to the wealthy karynnj Oct 2015 #59

It isn't, the same way Social Security isn't "income redistribution to the wealthy". n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2015 #60

I agree completely -- it isn't karynnj Oct 2015 #61

Sanders apparently endorses Senator Gillibrand's plan, which you can read about here... PoliticAverse Oct 2015 #62

Thanks - that is a great write, well written write up karynnj Oct 2015 #63

So which candidate supports a nationwide $15 minimum wage? Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #75

If its a tax added to the payroll tax gwheezie Oct 2015 #30

Agreed BainsBane Oct 2015 #34

Even if so, the plan raises the cap. cprise Oct 2015 #56

Do you even know what a flat tax is???? kenfrequed Oct 2015 #38

But is that rate a percentage, or an amount? cprise Oct 2015 #44

Whatever, just make sure you get help when you file because you don't really understand taxation. Bluenorthwest Oct 2015 #47

How about paying for it with progressive taxation? BainsBane Oct 2015 #77

You need to take your disagreement to Senator Gillibrand and the other Democratic co-sponsors of her Bluenorthwest Oct 2015 #84

*crickets* beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #107

Oh lordy lu. hifiguy Oct 2015 #48

Wow portlander23 Oct 2015 #67

I understand your point zipplewrath Oct 2015 #68

If it is part of a reform of the system BainsBane Oct 2015 #70

I understand zipplewrath Oct 2015 #85

The GOP proposes replacing our current progressive tax scheme with a flat tax, which is different. Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #72

Paid family leave is now an evil right-wing scheme! DemocraticWing Oct 2015 #76

I support paid family leave BainsBane Oct 2015 #78

0.2% on 20,000 = $40 = The cost of dinner and a movie Bread and Circus Oct 2015 #80

The problem is that $40 is a hell of a lot of money for someone just getting by BainsBane Oct 2015 #82

Are you aware of the fact that this is not Bernie's platform but part of a current legislative Bluenorthwest Oct 2015 #86

b.s. $40 isnt very much at all over the course of a year its 3 dollars and change or so a month. Bread and Circus Oct 2015 #100

So you're working to eliminate the Social Security payroll tax, which is 37.5 times worse? PoliticAverse Oct 2015 #114

This message was self-deleted by its author ancianita Oct 2015 #87

You might want to take a look at this Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #88

Now I see what that was about. Autumn Oct 2015 #89

Looks like team H> is so careless smearing Bernie they are sabotaging the best work of Senate Dems. Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #90

Oh noes!!" It's a PAYROLL tax!! One of the worst forms of taxes for poor and middle class workers." Autumn Oct 2015 #93

They assume everyone operates on a totally superficial basis & can't digest more than a sound bite Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #99

I don't suppose it would enter your mind BainsBane Oct 2015 #116

As smear attempts go this was pretty weak Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #137

Sanders: Tax Rate on the wealthiest "will be a damned lot higher" Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #140

Well that's embarrassing, isn't it? beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #94

Embarrassing just a little. Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #97

I'm sure the op will edit the misinformation now, right? beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #98

Not in the least BainsBane Oct 2015 #121

And you're so concerned about the poor and middle class you're supporting Hillary. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #122

Additionally, the info about Gillibrand BainsBane Oct 2015 #126

Like you "theoretically" supported Bernie before you switched to Hillary how many times? beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #127

In the second thread you linked to, that poster provided this link: BeanMusical Oct 2015 #135

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service jeff47 Oct 2015 #138

Good jury! beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #139

Forget it, she's rolling. Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #141

LOL! beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #142

Sanders is the candidate of the elites, whereas Hillary represents the "subaltern". Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #143

White misogynists too. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #145

Rare footage of BB MannyGoldstein Oct 2015 #103

LOLOLOL!!! beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #109

Hardly BainsBane Oct 2015 #112

Two cents from every ten bucks. Oh the horror. MannyGoldstein Oct 2015 #132

I know that. It's in one of the friggin articles BainsBane Oct 2015 #111

Sure thanks for the libertarian flat tax nonsense, This Primary discussion site is full Todays_Illusion Oct 2015 #91

Yeah, what's libertarian is not my mentioning it BainsBane Oct 2015 #113

Hey, you're not supposed to eat the waxed fruit! ucrdem Oct 2015 #96

The last person I recall advocating a flat tax was Steve Forbes. RandySF Oct 2015 #101

... TDale313 Oct 2015 #102

This is not trashing the man. RandySF Oct 2015 #105

Yes, I know many find it unacceptable to discuss actual policy BainsBane Oct 2015 #117

people keep kicking your thread, so I'm not sure how that makes it "unacceptable". Warren DeMontague Oct 2015 #144

I need every dollar I can take home right now. RandySF Oct 2015 #104

This message was self-deleted by its author F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #108

how dare I question a regressive tax BainsBane Oct 2015 #118

This message was self-deleted by its author F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #120

Oh, wait. My fav from you BainsBane Oct 2015 #123

This message was self-deleted by its author F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #125

Ah, hell, Bains. This isn't worth the sniping. F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #128

Your last response was fine. BainsBane Oct 2015 #129

I was wrong. F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #134

I have lived in a flat tax economy. MADem Oct 2015 #115

Yes, and to be fair this does not propose substituting the income tax for a flat tax BainsBane Oct 2015 #119

It's a payroll tax to fund one thing: lovemydog Oct 2015 #124

How is Hillary proposing to fund her family leave plan? nt mhatrw Oct 2015 #130

With the Clinton Foundation™ of course. BeanMusical Oct 2015 #136