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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
59. He didn't put down Planned Parenthood so much as disagree with its choice to intervene in the race
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 02:34 AM
Dec 2016

when there was no difference whatsoever between Bernie on Hillary on choice and contraception access.

And the repeated claim(a slur Bernie's repeated adjustment of his message should have put to rest)that Bernie cared ONLY about economic justice and was indifferent to the continued need to fight institutional bigotry was as bad as anything ever said about Hillary If some people didn't want to support the guy that was their call, but he clearly proved he was as antiracist as anybody and there was no reason to keep bashing him on that after Super Tuesday. Hillary probably would have taken the majority of the AA vote no matter simply because she had been planning to run a lot longer than he had, had spent eight years networking with that community-Bernie didn't know he would have to run until Elizabeth Warren ruled herself out. He never deserved to be accused of not trying to get AA votes or of running a whites-only campaign(or even of getting nothing BUT white votes-Bernie tied Hillary among AA voters 30 and under).

Had it not been for the relentlessness of the attacks on that, the angrier responses on the Sanders side, the worst of which I spent months condemning and alerting on, would never have happened.

But Bernie isn't going to run again...can't you just leave your anger aimed at him and let go of it regarding his supporters.

It would have been a tragedy if his campaign hadn't happened because nothing he fought for would ever have been addressed. And we would likely have lost the popular vote.

You can't expect all Sanders supporters to apologize for ever supporting the guy, expect them to agree the Sanders campaign should never have happened and that Hillary was entitled to nomination without any challenge, and treat them all as the enemy until they do. In the primary, there was no one else who spoke to what they cared about.

And the issues that stopped Hillary short of an Electoral College victory were not related to anything Bernie did or said. The emails would have had the exact same effect if Hillary had been nominated by acclimation, so would the language on trade(and in my attempts to persuade people to vote for her in the fall, trade was the issue raised to me more than anything else, with the view-a view I actually disagree with-that she was too confrontational with Russia being a close second.

My purpose in starting this thread was to find some common ground. We need all the Clinton supporters AND all the Sanders supporters uniting behind whoever we nominate next if we're to have any chance of improving things. I get it that you dislike me, but can you at least give me the benefit of the doubt that my intent here is positive?

I don't defend the 'bros.

What I want is to turn non-voters into voters and people who voted third-party this year into Dem presidential voters next time. NOT to refight the primaries. Neither Bernie nor Hillary is ever going to run for the presidency again. We all need to let the rivalry on that move into the past.

Perhaps, as you said, it requires abandoning attempts at blaming some Democrats, and candidates, guillaumeb Dec 2016 #1
Think carefully about who you want to target for votes bravenak Dec 2016 #2
I think this is absolutely correct. nt marybourg Dec 2016 #3
I think we need more outreach to those that did not vote... Raster Dec 2016 #4
Yep. We need to be smart, not sit around being sadface bravenak Dec 2016 #6
A combination of rage, defiant hope, and creativity would serve us well right now. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #18
I think tapping into the "rage" of new and uninformed voters backfired this time, and I'm not sure bettyellen Dec 2016 #37
We would have done worse running an "everything is fine" campaign. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #42
Hillary didn't lay a hand on Sanders. Some surrogate said he was "unfit" based on his limited bettyellen Dec 2016 #49
He didn't put down Planned Parenthood so much as disagree with its choice to intervene in the race Ken Burch Dec 2016 #59
He called PP a member of the establishment. boston bean Dec 2016 #61
He criticized PP in the heat of the campaign. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #62
He slimed PP, a nice dog whistle for the WWC voter I wonder? bettyellen Dec 2016 #92
No dog whistle at all. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #94
Insulting PP was a cheap shot at women's expense, period. Showed his commitment quite clearly. bettyellen Dec 2016 #96
The difference was Bernie's support was votes and Hillary's support was actions which PP articulated seaglass Dec 2016 #99
Yes NCTraveler Dec 2016 #24
Are you asking what would re-establish trust between DU members? n/t seaglass Dec 2016 #5
As a start, yes. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #7
I was mostly away from DU for a few months prior to the election. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #47
Yes, deviance from the approved narrative is being harshly punished. appal_jack Dec 2016 #50
Creative story, fella! LanternWaste Dec 2016 #69
I agree... Joe941 Dec 2016 #78
Me, too. mnhtnbb Dec 2016 #93
Stop thinking of the party as a club. It's not - it's a vehicle for imposing governance philosophy. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2016 #8
We don't actually bar gun owning white guys as it is. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #11
Stop bashing hillary. boston bean Dec 2016 #9
Is there any form of critique of Hillary's campaign you could accept as legitimate? Ken Burch Dec 2016 #12
Yes, cease saying she is corrupt wallstreet establishment candidate. boston bean Dec 2016 #15
OK. But would you at least agree that she probably shouldn't run again? Ken Burch Dec 2016 #16
She won't run again. boston bean Dec 2016 #20
Thanks for the response. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #22
Bernie for 2020! Joe941 Dec 2016 #79
There is no more value in bashing Hillary than there is Dukakis. And for the same reason. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2016 #31
Oh look, it's another jim jones radical. grossproffit Dec 2016 #34
Yup, that's me. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2016 #46
Well, the rules there prohibited supporting Hillary and the rules here require it. So who were you bettyellen Dec 2016 #51
You don't understand the rules of either place. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2016 #88
JPR let's you say c*nt and n@&$@r but not support the Dem candidate. bettyellen Dec 2016 #91
They are still fighting the primaries over there and screaming how they were rigged against Bernie. LonePirate Dec 2016 #57
Yup La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #71
Some real self-criticism. What do we get instead? Comey! Russia! Sexism! closeupready Dec 2016 #10
You can't dismiss those things.. JHan Dec 2016 #65
Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #82
I can't recall much dishonesty from her during campaigning.. JHan Dec 2016 #83
Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #85
You can't be for real. JHan Dec 2016 #86
Okay, done with you. Bye! closeupready Dec 2016 #87
"Bernie Bros"! "Bernie stayed in too long!" "He shouldn't've shown up her weaknesses!" JudyM Dec 2016 #100
PLAY IT FORWARD..nt asuhornets Dec 2016 #13
I couldn't agree more with you. One thing that might help mtnsnake Dec 2016 #14
A campaign that doesn't just talk about poverty(as this one did, to its credit)... Ken Burch Dec 2016 #17
Yeah, the sentence where you put the emphasis on the word "THEY" is vital mtnsnake Dec 2016 #28
Ultimately, it's about reconnecting the poor to those of us who AREN'T in the same condition. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #32
You betcha, and there is one word that pretty much sums up that emotion mtnsnake Dec 2016 #36
Thank you for this post ........ Yes there are some exceptions ( I think excptions can be Kathy M Dec 2016 #25
The point you touched upon concerning heroin is worth looking into mtnsnake Dec 2016 #27
Agree .... its the heroin.... Kathy M Dec 2016 #29
Yes and vice-versa. TrekLuver Dec 2016 #30
Remember It's The Economy, Stupid! Wolf Frankula Dec 2016 #19
I immediately heard these lines go through my head in response to your first paragraph: Ken Burch Dec 2016 #21
agree with the above Kathy M Dec 2016 #26
We promote the party platform. NCTraveler Dec 2016 #23
I was saying that throughout the fall campaign, and had been for years before that. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #33
Drain the swamp? NCTraveler Dec 2016 #35
Why are you equating what I posted there with Trumpism? Ken Burch Dec 2016 #44
I was going by your own words. NCTraveler Dec 2016 #67
I don't even THINK the DNC, the DSCC, or the DCCC are "swamps". Ken Burch Dec 2016 #97
Mostly agree. We also need to stop the BS rhetoric that our loss was Sanders/his supporters' fault. JudyM Dec 2016 #101
Agree. For most of them... NCTraveler Dec 2016 #104
Divisions in the party are good, if you want a big change. jake335544 Dec 2016 #38
We need to find a way to have debate without toxicity, though. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #45
We have a racial divide to heal within Democrats Dems to Win Dec 2016 #39
So the problem is black people were mean to Bernie BainsBane Dec 2016 #41
"Whats Millennials Support for Jill Stein and Gary Johnson All About?" BzaDem Dec 2016 #64
So true La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #74
Aww, black leaders and black activists were mean La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #73
If people stopped fighting the primary BainsBane Dec 2016 #40
That's not my goal at all. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #43
Sure seems like it has been your goal for days La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #75
Never has been. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #95
Many are. BainsBane Dec 2016 #102
You sound like you're much more interested in holding grudges than winning future elections. nt mtnsnake Dec 2016 #98
If winning elections is the goal BainsBane Dec 2016 #103
FFS DemonGoddess Dec 2016 #48
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #52
So did Bernie DemonGoddess Dec 2016 #53
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #56
So how is the Canadian PM doing? CajunBlazer Dec 2016 #54
Yep. I'm sick of this shit, it's a ploy. They never appreciated the fact she deserved their support bettyellen Dec 2016 #55
I wasn't saying it was all her fault. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #63
Please try. NCTraveler Dec 2016 #77
I have a few ideas lapfog_1 Dec 2016 #58
The whole country has turned into tribes marlakay Dec 2016 #60
More outreach to rural Dems in purple states (like Obama did), and engage the disengaged. Garrett78 Dec 2016 #66
A common enemy (Trump), time and and the awareness of what is coming. jalan48 Dec 2016 #68
Maybe if some people stopped using right wing La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #70
Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #72
... La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #76
Carefully worded LOL betsuni Dec 2016 #80
Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #81
Actually, there is almost no one on DU that I actually mistrust DFW Dec 2016 #84
I think that is one of the best posts on this thread mtnsnake Dec 2016 #89
I have no illusions DFW Dec 2016 #90
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