2016 Postmortem

oberliner

(58,724 posts)

58. Thanks

Fri Aug 5, 2016, 06:56 AM

Aug 2016

Honesty, I just posted the OP since I had been watching so much of Trump and seeing how awful he is. It got me wondering if we would be doing as well with some "normal" Republican. On the one hand, there wouldn't be all this hand-wringing on their side, but on the other hand, would the crazy Trump-ians get behind a Kasich type?

Are we in a situation, as some have proposed, where we as Democrats have such a favorable Electoral Map that we are positioned to win regardless of who the candidates are?

I just thought it was something interesting to discuss.

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What do you think the race would look like right now if it wasn't Trump? [View all] oberliner Aug 2016 OP

With the beating that Hillary's taking, I suspect Kasich could wipe the floor with her. TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #1

Yes, he'd likely be the toughest against her. elleng Aug 2016 #2

I'm crossing my fingers and saying little prayers that... TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #7

Interesting trixie Aug 2016 #27

This was mentioned on Charlie Rose last night, but all moonscape Aug 2016 #40

Trump supporters aren't voting FOR something... LAS14 Aug 2016 #98

Hard to believe they passed on a Ohio Gov. as a nominee but #Awesome. TeamPooka Aug 2016 #178

He wasn't the most inspiring campaigner oberliner Aug 2016 #4

True, but they are less keen on Hillary, and don't fear him. TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #10

True - they sure do hate Hillary oberliner Aug 2016 #15

Kasich came in 4th place. KMOD Aug 2016 #9

If he sneaks in, I hope you're right. TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #12

He's not sneaking in. KMOD Aug 2016 #17

This JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #101

Perhaps - but let's not forget that the all-Trump all-the-time primary coverage left the other EffieBlack Aug 2016 #22

Yes. Unvetted candidates often seem better than vetted candidates. Till the covers come off. Squinch Aug 2016 #70

"The Trump Effect"... TeeYiYi Aug 2016 #161

And the media air brushed some pants onto him. Squinch Aug 2016 #175

Virtual chameleon pants... TeeYiYi Aug 2016 #179

On another note: Squinch Aug 2016 #182

. TeeYiYi Aug 2016 #188

What beating is that? She's ahead 15 points nationally and ahead in most states. What are you Squinch Aug 2016 #59

Now that my post has been unhidden, I can say that I did not mean an electoral beating... TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #190

Hillary is taking a beating? Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #62

Reality is hard for some people. Squinch Aug 2016 #63

Right. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #74

It screws with their plans for that "I told you so" moment. Which was never in the cards anyway. Squinch Aug 2016 #75

Exactly right Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #79

There needs to be a new term for the vetting she has gone through. Not only Squinch Aug 2016 #82

What else can they say? Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #85

All the super mega vetting might have innoculated her against that. Which is interesting. And Squinch Aug 2016 #86

They will no doubt. nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #95

That is a good point. This hypothetical nonesense serves no pupose except to perhaps still_one Aug 2016 #154

Now that my post has been unhidded, I can reply that I did not mean an electoral beating... TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #191

Fair enough. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #196

What universe are you living in? Hillary is way ahead. redstateblues Aug 2016 #89

Now that my post has been unhidden, I can reply that I did not mean an electoral beating... TreasonousBastard Aug 2016 #192

Really? citood Aug 2016 #207

Yes. KMOD Aug 2016 #3

I'm not sure the Trump people would've gotten behind a "normal" Republican oberliner Aug 2016 #5

The majority of that party has turned batshit crazy. KMOD Aug 2016 #14

Narco Rubio would be an easy target due to the sleaze factor; Kasich would be difficult. forest444 Aug 2016 #6

Kasich was such a dud in the primaries though oberliner Aug 2016 #11

Good point. forest444 Aug 2016 #18

I live in Ohio Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #67

honestly, i think obama won this for hillary a long time ago. unblock Aug 2016 #8

Obama's popularity is a huge plus for Hillary oberliner Aug 2016 #13

Hillary Clinton has high unfavorable ratings for the simple fact that she is a woman. KMOD Aug 2016 #20

I respectfully disagree oberliner Aug 2016 #29

Of course there is some of that. KMOD Aug 2016 #36

Absolutely oberliner Aug 2016 #55

... runaway hero Aug 2016 #108

Not difficult. Some people do not like women. Hillary would still win either way. Maru Kitteh Aug 2016 #143

The whole country is not sexist. runaway hero Aug 2016 #147

I would argue that it's for the simple fact that she's a Clinton Blasphemer Aug 2016 #177

^^^This!!! DemonGoddess Aug 2016 #180

I always thought Kasich would be their strongest candidate esp. with his Ohio support. George Eliot Aug 2016 #16

I don't know where you've heard that. KMOD Aug 2016 #21

Thank you EffieBlack Aug 2016 #24

Why so quick to take offense? I agree but most people just see the public persona. That's my point. George Eliot Aug 2016 #123

He came in 4th place behind Rubio who had dropped out. KMOD Aug 2016 #124

Of course. Look at the # of candidates. He was establishment. Both JK & HRC are establishment. George Eliot Aug 2016 #145

Who freaking cares about your hypothetical race between KMOD Aug 2016 #158

Hey, you didn't have to join the conversation. I opined to OP and you interjected so get over it. George Eliot Aug 2016 #173

thank you! nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #125

He's a extreme conservative pretending to be a moderate. emulatorloo Aug 2016 #38

The trust worthy thing goes away As soon as the mud gets flung, sanders and kasock were never vetted bettyellen Aug 2016 #144

He was the only one who I thought could beat Hillary had he won... cynatnite Aug 2016 #151

Shit no! cheapdate Aug 2016 #19

Only Kasich could, maybe would, beat her GulfCoast66 Aug 2016 #23

His record is not all that impressive EffieBlack Aug 2016 #25

but people don't look at records and he comes off a lot better and likable than Trump JI7 Aug 2016 #28

That's because he's not running and hasn't gotten any scrutiny EffieBlack Aug 2016 #34

i don't trust the media . i remember how it was with W Bush . even now it's not the media JI7 Aug 2016 #35

If he was the presidential candidate Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #76

yet he was reelected in ohio. And trumps or Bush's record are not bEing examined JI7 Aug 2016 #142

Do you know anything about the Ohio election? Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #146

people don't care about issues and media dOesn't report in issues JI7 Aug 2016 #157

People do care about certain issues. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #163

those people already know who they will vote for JI7 Aug 2016 #164

Most years. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #166

I think there are conflicted people on the right and the left. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #189

I do not like the SOB GulfCoast66 Aug 2016 #30

I wouldn't be surprised if Kasich was leading her. Both Rubio and Jeb are Overrated so i think she JI7 Aug 2016 #26

Did you know that Kasich Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #78

^^^This!!! DemonGoddess Aug 2016 #181

Pence is less sneaky and has destroyed the economy for sure. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #183

Kasich is really really bad on planned parenthood and abortion rights. He defunded PP Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #204

Within a couple points.. MFM008 Aug 2016 #31

I say it's moot. rusty quoin Aug 2016 #32

Hillary would turn Kasich into another Rick Lasio. grossproffit Aug 2016 #33

A smaller version of the same thing. sofa king Aug 2016 #37

Kasich or Rubio would be winning. runaway hero Aug 2016 #39

Oh, bullshit. KMOD Aug 2016 #41

How is it Bullshit? lancer78 Aug 2016 #44

You had a woman boss, so sexism is not really a factor. Kay. Squinch Aug 2016 #83

Her negatives are improving...doesn't that make you happy? I know great news!!! Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #87

It actually does because i really think HRC would be a good POTUS n/t lancer78 Aug 2016 #150

We can agree to agree. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #167

Exactly. runaway hero Aug 2016 #105

And it has not worked Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #126

Yep, just like this OP. The primaries are over and these "what ifs" are bullshit. grossproffit Aug 2016 #45

Upthread they threw out the statement "Hillary is taking a beating" when she is miles Squinch Aug 2016 #61

LOL, being ahead by 15 points is taking a beating! FSogol Aug 2016 #71

Well... it's Hillary. 15 points ahead is just not good enough! She has to do better if she is Squinch Aug 2016 #73

I saw that ...very very annoying. nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #88

Nonsense Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #80

The GOP did not have a candidate Expecting Rain Aug 2016 #42

The mood of the Republican electorate was to find a Red Meat Candidate. Cruz would mount a better Agnosticsherbet Aug 2016 #43

This message was self-deleted by its author auntpurl Aug 2016 #46

Huh? oberliner Aug 2016 #50

Well, I apologise if that was not your intention. auntpurl Aug 2016 #57

Thanks oberliner Aug 2016 #58

I agree with you...sneaky attack. nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #81

Thank you RandiFan1290 Aug 2016 #54

Seriously? oberliner Aug 2016 #56

A little tighter. Bored Rs would show up to vote, where bored Ds would not show. Festivito Aug 2016 #47

But the Trump-ians might not rally behind a boring Republican oberliner Aug 2016 #53

Right, Trumpians would not, but regular Rs would still vote. Festivito Aug 2016 #132

That is not true and an attack on Democrats. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #127

It's an opinion. And, no it's not an attack on Democrats. Festivito Aug 2016 #134

Saying Democrats get bored and don't vote is unfair and untrue in my opinion. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #149

Why is it then that Ds do not come out to vote in non-presidential elections? Festivito Aug 2016 #176

I think much of that has to do with the fringe Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #184

Not calling something what it is might lead to ignoring a problem that could be solved. Festivito Aug 2016 #185

I am referring to those on the left who trashed Obama in 12 and 14 Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #187

No Republican could beat a Dem on the presidential level as of now... Cali_Democrat Aug 2016 #48

That is a pretty good place to be oberliner Aug 2016 #52

All of them would be losing but not as bad as Trump LostOne4Ever Aug 2016 #49

This may be true oberliner Aug 2016 #51

Why does it matter? Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #60

I just thought it was an interesting question to contemplate oberliner Aug 2016 #65

After this election it will be that way for a long time. I think people are so horrified by Trump Squinch Aug 2016 #68

Romneyshambles 2.0 eShirl Aug 2016 #64

Against a normal Repub, two man race - Hillary 51 Normal Repub 49 DemocratSinceBirth Aug 2016 #66

I absolutely do not agree with this statement. nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #90

OMFG... LenaBaby61 Aug 2016 #69

This thread: FSogol Aug 2016 #72

You dropped in just to post that? oberliner Aug 2016 #77

Now that is true. We have an advantage built in Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #91

Agreed oberliner Aug 2016 #117

It would be a LOT closer... TeeYiYi Aug 2016 #162

One would be winning... Mike Nelson Aug 2016 #84

Total nonsense. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #93

I was just giving my... Mike Nelson Aug 2016 #97

thanks...I may be a bit touchy Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #100

Clinton would be beating Jeb, would be neck and neck with Little Marco geek tragedy Aug 2016 #92

Kasich would not win a general... he is way to extreme. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #94

if George W Bush could pull off being a fake moderate, anyone can geek tragedy Aug 2016 #96

That is not true. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #99

Ohio elected kasich many times. JI7 Aug 2016 #102

Twice Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #110

he still won including the pres primary in his state which rubio did not do JI7 Aug 2016 #140

Hillary did well too. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #148

i said Hillary is dOing better than Sanders would. you are arguing things which i have not said JI7 Aug 2016 #156

I am not talking about Sanders. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #165

I'm not disagreeing with you on how terrible Kasich is. Not disputing any of that. geek tragedy Aug 2016 #104

yup. i also think Sanders would not be doing nearly as well as Clinton JI7 Aug 2016 #106

it's very hard to say, Republicans never geek tragedy Aug 2016 #107

The OP did not mean this to bash Clinton oberliner Aug 2016 #114

Funny stuff...and I do think that is exactly what the OP meant too. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #128

In a primary...they would not care. In fact it might help him. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #111

Sounds like the topic of a recent GOP mastabatory fantasy ... JoePhilly Aug 2016 #103

Not sure about that oberliner Aug 2016 #116

It's a way from some to claim that ... JoePhilly Aug 2016 #118

Trump is invigorating the "base" (such as it is) moreso than Kasich or Jeb would've oberliner Aug 2016 #121

True that. nt Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #129

Jeb was probably their best candidate, but the country has had enough of the Bush family. B Calm Aug 2016 #109

And I hate to agree with Trump PatSeg Aug 2016 #112

Jeb ss a horrible candidate. he always liked like he hated being there JI7 Aug 2016 #160

Jeb was a big disappointment as a candidate for the GOP. Chemisse Aug 2016 #172

The Trump or Busters would fracture support for any replacement GOP candidate going forward Haveadream Aug 2016 #113

Agreed oberliner Aug 2016 #115

Kasich or Jebby workinclasszero Aug 2016 #119

People on DU runaway hero Aug 2016 #120

Intensity of hate does not equal the number of people who feel that way Haveadream Aug 2016 #122

Well what an interesting opinion. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #130

Which is why she lost the nomination. Oh wait...she won. grossproffit Aug 2016 #138

People who talk about how much Hillary is disliked don't seem to get that the polls and Squinch Aug 2016 #139

Thanks for your concern! wildeyed Aug 2016 #168

I don't think Hillary would be doing nearly as well democrattotheend Aug 2016 #131

Kasich would have been harder to beat. wildeyed Aug 2016 #133

Cruz would be the nominee. bananakabob Aug 2016 #135

Speculative. nt Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #136

I think Kasich could beat her because he does not helpisontheway Aug 2016 #137

Kasich would be vetted. He has real problems with the abortion issue and deffunded Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #205

It probably would be a much closer race just because no other candidate Vinca Aug 2016 #141

The email (non)scandal hurt her badly. Chemisse Aug 2016 #152

I don't think so. The email was rightie bullshit. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #169

Yes it was indeed right-wing bullshit - from start to finish (if that ever happens). Chemisse Aug 2016 #171

Not really she is doing well Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #202

I think the media has it in for Trump except of course for faux randr Aug 2016 #153

You don't think perhaps that Trump's screwy comments is why he is in the news? Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #200

You are right and he keeps upping the ante to guarantee coverage randr Aug 2016 #208

The men behind the curtain would acknowledge... Brother Buzz Aug 2016 #155

Exactly the same! Uben Aug 2016 #159

She would crush them. ithinkmyliverhurts Aug 2016 #170

With Kasich, he may have started ahead mvd Aug 2016 #174

It would definitely be closer. I don't know how anyone could think otherwise. Curtland1015 Aug 2016 #186

Because we like Hillary and think she is a good candidate...those Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #198

I like Hillary too. It's the reason I'll be voting for her. That said... Curtland1015 Aug 2016 #201

47% Republican minus those whose lives improved... sofa king Aug 2016 #193

On the day Hillary is sworn in, we'll STILL have Sanders people here saying alcibiades_mystery Aug 2016 #194

I have 2 answers. Exilednight Aug 2016 #195

This back again I see. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #197

Why respond again? oberliner Aug 2016 #199

Yes, my comment was reasonable too. Demsrule86 Aug 2016 #206

Probably closer bigwillq Aug 2016 #203