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Moonwalk

(2,322 posts)
30. I think you were too harsh. I don't know how these two came across to you....
Mon Aug 29, 2016, 05:29 PM
Aug 2016

...maybe they were noses in the air, demeaning and frivolous. But as you describe them, it doesn't sound like they needed to be publicly shamed and silenced. It sounds like they needed to be educated. I know that's a hard thing to do in this climate. Especially when your hear such casual, ignorant bigotry and it like this and it feels like the last straw. But compare this to Lobo27's "Unexpected Racism" thread. There, a woman was being an out-and-out racist, and needed to be shut down firmly and unequivocally.

Going from your description, these people weren't attacking anyone. Which means there probably wasn't any reason to put them on the spot. You could have said, "Excuse me, I couldn't help overhearing. Exactly what do you mean by "African Americans have come so far?" Then you'd listen, and say, "I don' think you're seeing how that view comes across...." And gone on about slavery, segregation and how important it was for them to recognize their privilege, and to understand the arrogance and inherent racism in wha they were thinking and saying.

Shaming and embarrassing people silences them. And I don't think that's best if their hearts and minds can be put into the right place. That they were even having a conversation about it was, in fact, a step in the right direction, because that means the talk could be shifted. That their narrow field of vision could be expanded. It's like paying it forward. You do this for them, and the next time they're with friends and those friends say something similar, they can expand that conversation and educate their friends. But if you shut them down, shame and embarrass them, then all they'll say to their friends is "better not talk like that out loud. We did in this restaurant and this stranger came down on us like a ton of bricks!"

I say all this because it's so easy to let the Trolls, Trump supporters, racists and republicans make us think that attacking is the only way to react in such situations. But shooting to kill isn't always necessary, and usually just leaves people on the defensive. Listening and discussing, instead, can open them up and change them. Robert Byrd, who was a member of the Klan, transformed and apologized. If he could do that, then I think people like this couple could do it as well, given the chance. They certainly haven't nearly as far to go as Byrd did. So why not give them an opportunity to understand themselves, and so be better and do better?

I would like to share this ebbie15644 Aug 2016 #1
Years and years of programming by media and even schools, some of it subtle and some not so subtle, brush Aug 2016 #7
Me too OneGrassRoot Sep 2016 #46
Me too mitch96 Sep 2016 #53
things are improving, but is there time? pretzel4gore Aug 2016 #2
we as human beings heaven05 Aug 2016 #5
Intra-tribal warfare should never be an excuse awoke_in_2003 Aug 2016 #3
true heaven05 Aug 2016 #4
Full disclosure awoke_in_2003 Aug 2016 #6
Well, if they were old, cut them a little slack Warpy Aug 2016 #8
The OP is your JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #14
As a "victim" of the things you mention, I agree that things HAVE jaysunb Aug 2016 #15
Understood Warpy Aug 2016 #18
I attended BU in the early 70's heaven05 Aug 2016 #40
Southie was truly horrible Warpy Aug 2016 #43
maybe we did cross paths heaven05 Aug 2016 #44
FYI, "persons of non-color" is probably more appropriate. MadDAsHell Aug 2016 #9
so a racist is a "person of non-color" heaven05 Aug 2016 #10
He's a disruptor JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #13
Just because I don't accept your labels of people doesn't make me a disruptor. MadDAsHell Aug 2016 #21
Nothing wrong with being called a "black person". brush Aug 2016 #27
++1000 heaven05 Aug 2016 #32
This was posted to you... sheshe2 Nov 2016 #60
I saw that heaven05 Nov 2016 #61
She is filled with awesome! JustAnotherGen Nov 2016 #62
"Person of non-color" is a label as well. LanternWaste Aug 2016 #28
Where did I write any of that? JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #29
you can reject until the cows come home heaven05 Aug 2016 #31
tee hee JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #45
If you can't be respectful Coolest Ranger Sep 2016 #59
yeah, I see heaven05 Aug 2016 #42
... sheshe2 Aug 2016 #11
*sigh* JustAnotherGen Aug 2016 #12
What specifically leads you to allege "persons of non-color" is more appropriate? LanternWaste Aug 2016 #17
My coworker asked me to stop calling him white. He's right, it's an unecessary label. MadDAsHell Aug 2016 #20
Do you habitually reach conclusions based wholly on one subjective anecdote? LanternWaste Aug 2016 #23
So you want to call me "black." I get it. nt MadDAsHell Aug 2016 #25
Your may make as many conveniently inaccurate inference as you desire. LanternWaste Aug 2016 #26
No, it's not. But you can call me Ray... fleabiscuit Sep 2016 #48
Great post heaven05 lovemydog Aug 2016 #16
thank you heaven05 Aug 2016 #33
It is inbred just look at the picture and tell me if their kids are not now racists. vinny9698 Aug 2016 #19
ummmmm +1000 and heaven05 Aug 2016 #34
I've only been assaulted once in my life. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #35
They don't want to give up their place in line! They think they're going to be first MADem Aug 2016 #22
I'm sorry for your anxiety. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #24
in my experience with racist immigrants heaven05 Aug 2016 #36
I don't know about that. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #37
I think you were too harsh. I don't know how these two came across to you.... Moonwalk Aug 2016 #30
it is possible what you feel about my response heaven05 Aug 2016 #38
I didn't say that your anger was misplaced. In fact, I believe I said that it made perfect sense.... Moonwalk Aug 2016 #39
didn't mean for you to try to 'mindread' me heaven05 Aug 2016 #41
Saying that heaven05 was harsh, to me, is another form of promoting fragility/comfort Kind of Blue Sep 2016 #47
Very well said JustAnotherGen Sep 2016 #49
Thanks, JAG. Kind of Blue Sep 2016 #55
thank you heaven05 Sep 2016 #56
Aww, man. It is my pleasure and honor to support your courage! Kind of Blue Sep 2016 #57
White people need to educate themselves, at least in my opinion ismnotwasm Sep 2016 #52
K&R ismnotwasm Sep 2016 #50
Recommended and well written. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #51
fear. fear of change. fear of other WhiteTara Sep 2016 #54
thank you so much for Coolest Ranger Sep 2016 #58
What a foreshadowing post heaven05... Nt Quayblue Nov 2016 #63
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