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Environment & Energy

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)

16. "This is an article of faith for you, but not necessarily true."

Reply to OKIsItJustMe (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:32 PM

Jan 2013

It is what is happening. In reality. Consumption and growth are ever increasing. Some people are trying to understand why. What rules of our "game" are making it so.

Faith is believing that we can do the same things (production) and the system will suddenly shift course. That is faith because it hasn't happened. Sure, yes, its counter-intuitive. Its a "paradox". Its something beyond illustrating with tidy equations. But its what is happening.

Its like you want to assure us to have faith in technological production to finally buck the system's trend. It could maybe. But we have less of a reason to believe it will than to think the past trends will continue to repeat.

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24 replies

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Highlight:

The 'rebound' effect of energy-efficient cars overplayed [View all] OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 OP

I guess we should try to make sure that any money savings from cheaper energy limpyhobbler Jan 2013 #1

True belivers in “Jevons’ Paradox” will tell you that such efforts would fail OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #2

It seems like more of an abstract philosophy question that a real world problem. limpyhobbler Jan 2013 #3

"It's not a natural law..." NoOneMan Jan 2013 #10

Preach it, brother! GliderGuider Jan 2013 #11

As long as there are people with unfulfilled needs and wants The2ndWheel Jan 2013 #4

And there we have it! (A true believer!) OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #6

Thanks for taking out my qualifying statements to make your point The2ndWheel Jan 2013 #24

No energy has yet been conserved. In this example we just have more consumption NoOneMan Jan 2013 #9

How about addressing the Nature article linked to by the OP? OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #12

I did. Its based on a false premise NoOneMan Jan 2013 #14

Did you actually read the Nature article? OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #17

This paper is akin to analyzing genetic drift in unicorn populations NoOneMan Jan 2013 #18

So, is that a yes? OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #19

I don't think you understand that I am not arguing about the red herring NoOneMan Jan 2013 #20

Once again, you need to start somewhere OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #21

"There is a large group of people who point to..." NoOneMan Jan 2013 #23

Invoking Jevons misses the point GliderGuider Jan 2013 #5

Except, that /it is all about Jevons…/ OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #7

I do things out of a wide variety of personal concerns GliderGuider Jan 2013 #8

“The point of making things more efficient is to allow the whole system to keep growing.” OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #13

It's not simply an article of faith. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #15

"This is an article of faith for you, but not necessarily true." NoOneMan Jan 2013 #16

At the age of 60 madokie Jan 2013 #22