HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » 5 Signs the United States... » Reply #33
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Response to bbgrunt (Reply #31)

Mon Jun 25, 2012, 01:33 AM

33. And that's why a great deal of liberals cut their noses off to spite their face...

Was Clinton perfect? Absolutely not. But when you're coming out of essentially 30 years of Republican dominance, as was the case in 1992, you're not going to be able to lurch the country in a dramatically new direction. Clinton had his faults, but I think even most liberals would agree he was infinitely better than what we got from 2001-'09. The problem with that thinking, that you'll be apathetic, is that you continually lose ground. Bush was able to claim a mandate out of a narrow victory because Republicans, at the time, the Democrats had held the White House for all of twelve years between '69-'01. That stretch is unrivaled in modern American politics and ALLOWED the Republicans to tear everything Teddy Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Kennedy & LBJ built down.

The problem is that to build it back up, you need far more than eight years. Had liberals, and Americans, gone out and supported Gore in '00, instead of just sitting home and letting Bush win, liberalism would be so far more advanced today than it currently is. But because we regressed to pre-Clinton levels after such a short amount of time, we're at a point where every major policy has been, in some ways, shaped by the Reagan era - from trade agreements, to labor unions, to welfare.

What liberals need to understand is that it takes time to build that ideal society. Do you think the Republicans overturned the Progressive Era in one or two election cycles? Of course not. Eisenhower was far more moderate than Nixon and Nixon was more moderate than Reagan and Reagan was more moderate, in some ways, than Bush and Bush, fuck me sideways, is more moderate than these assholes running now. It took time. It took sucking it up and getting moderate politicians in there just to gain power. The only reason the Republicans went with Eisenhower in the 50s is because they knew he was their only chance to win. Without Eisenhower, the party doesn't see the White House again for at least another four years, maybe more. There is no Nixon run eight years later. There is no right-ward lurch because the party is so marginalized that it wouldn't exist anymore.

Politics is about adaption. The Republicans have been adapting and evolving and laying their foundation for the past 40 years. Democrats? It took them a while to figure it out. Prior to that, they were still nominating the same template of candidates that failed election after election - McGovern, Mondale, Dukakis. Clinton, warts and all, was the first Democrat to break through nationally and he did it because he was different than those three. Yes, he was more conservative. Yes, he did things that should make liberals squirm, but without him, we would have probably had Republican control for a generation and Lord knows where this country would be with an even longer extension of Reagan economics.

We're facing a similar situation in this election. Become apathetic because Obama isn't good enough and then you're going to watch the Republicans walk into the White House and absolutely destroy everything we've worked for and they'll do it with ease because Democrats can't hold on to power long enough to undo their whole fucking foundation, so it's far easier to build on that shit. When Democrats get in, they've got to not only fix the shit left by Republicans, but then turn around and pass their own agenda.

It's not easy.

Finally, if you're not voting, if you're voting third party, if you're sitting home on that first Tuesday in November, no matter what year, you shouldn't be considered a member of the party. It sounds harsh, but if you're not going to support the Democratic presidential candidate, whether it was Clinton, Gore, Kerry or Obama, you're not really a Democrat then in my book.

Reply to this post

Back to OP Alert abuse Link to post in-thread

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 136 replies Author Time Post
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 OP
nadinbrzezinski Jun 2012 #1
OverseaVisitor Jun 2012 #63
Canuckistanian Jun 2012 #113
OverseaVisitor Jun 2012 #117
Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #66
upi402 Jun 2012 #127
joycejnr Jun 2012 #100
villager Jun 2012 #110
cantbeserious Jun 2012 #2
PDJane Jun 2012 #3
ldf Jun 2012 #10
Raster Jun 2012 #11
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #17
JHB Jun 2012 #48
Skittles Jun 2012 #12
agent46 Jun 2012 #16
TeamPooka Jun 2012 #4
freshwest Jun 2012 #83
Karen Ellis Jun 2012 #5
OnyxCollie Jun 2012 #6
CrispyQ Jun 2012 #65
clang1 Jun 2012 #85
Octafish Jun 2012 #99
Javaman Jun 2012 #7
JDPriestly Jun 2012 #8
clang1 Jun 2012 #43
JDPriestly Jun 2012 #46
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #9
Raster Jun 2012 #14
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #15
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #22
ancianita Jun 2012 #28
bbgrunt Jun 2012 #31
LineLineLineLineLineReply And that's why a great deal of liberals cut their noses off to spite their face...
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #33
bbgrunt Jun 2012 #38
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #39
dotymed Jun 2012 #77
coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #53
AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2012 #64
LongTomH Jun 2012 #82
clang1 Jun 2012 #90
frylock Jun 2012 #89
clang1 Jun 2012 #92
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #94
frylock Jun 2012 #95
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #98
clang1 Jun 2012 #104
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #105
clang1 Jun 2012 #106
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #108
clang1 Jun 2012 #109
Drunken Irishman Jun 2012 #111
frylock Jun 2012 #136
frylock Jun 2012 #135
clang1 Jun 2012 #103
Bandit Jun 2012 #75
CRH Jun 2012 #107
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #55
Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #114
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #115
Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #116
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #122
Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #129
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #131
Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #133
libinnyandia Jun 2012 #134
clang1 Jun 2012 #132
bvar22 Jun 2012 #80
Comrade_McKenzie Jun 2012 #13
loudsue Jun 2012 #18
TheDebbieDee Jun 2012 #19
eztalker2 Jun 2012 #20
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #21
eztalker2 Jun 2012 #29
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #58
kdmorris Jun 2012 #49
Quantess Jun 2012 #59
Tumbulu Jun 2012 #119
blm Jun 2012 #23
rhett o rick Jun 2012 #24
blm Jun 2012 #60
rhett o rick Jun 2012 #81
Dustlawyer Jun 2012 #25
Blanks Jun 2012 #56
Samantha Jun 2012 #26
davidwparker Jun 2012 #27
clang1 Jun 2012 #79
pa28 Jun 2012 #30
AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2012 #32
clang1 Jun 2012 #40
AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2012 #42
clang1 Jun 2012 #45
Quantess Jun 2012 #61
clang1 Jun 2012 #97
donheld Jun 2012 #34
clang1 Jun 2012 #41
pa28 Jun 2012 #44
clang1 Jun 2012 #128
clang1 Jun 2012 #35
Initech Jun 2012 #36
clang1 Jun 2012 #37
Initech Jun 2012 #73
cantbeserious Jun 2012 #102
dflprincess Jun 2012 #118
Dan Jun 2012 #124
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #125
DLevine Jun 2012 #47
bupkus Jun 2012 #50
sulphurdunn Jun 2012 #51
coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #52
raouldukelives Jun 2012 #54
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #57
clang1 Jun 2012 #67
moondust Jun 2012 #62
clang1 Jun 2012 #71
Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #68
clang1 Jun 2012 #87
lunatica Jun 2012 #69
Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #70
lunatica Jun 2012 #72
Doctor_J Jun 2012 #74
valerief Jun 2012 #76
mother earth Jun 2012 #78
RainDog Jun 2012 #84
southernyankeebelle Jun 2012 #86
tpsbmam Jun 2012 #88
RoccoR5955 Jun 2012 #91
Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #93
Adenoid_Hynkel Jun 2012 #112
47of74 Jun 2012 #96
WillyT Jun 2012 #101
joycejnr Jun 2012 #120
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2012 #121
Quantess Jun 2012 #130
Tsiyu Jun 2012 #123
upi402 Jun 2012 #126
Please login to view edit histories.